Mini 642: Bodyguard 7: (Game Over)

[BridgesAndBaloons]

What I really find disconcerting is that you were almost willing to let this day end before I even explained what those initials were or what my argument against Jonathan is.


Though yes, I do find Killa's play

very

unnerving. He's obv not acting pro-town at all. It's like he doesn't even care about this game. By "disconcerting" did you mean "scummy?"

[CallMeLiam]

No, I mean unsettling. It's pretty clearly very anti-town and while it does seem to be his playstyle from what TSPN and AJ have said, I think the fact that they're both voting him regardless of this is a little telling.
Are you ready to explain the initials yet?

[TDC]

However, I find TDC is starting to give me vibes. Bus perhaps? Eh, leave that for later.

Is CML giving you similar vibes?

[bird1111]

Vote Count:
killa seven (3): TDC, jonathantan86, Alabaska J
BridgesAndBaloons (1): TheSweatPantsNinja
TDC (1): killa seven
jonathantan86 (1): BridgesAndBaloons

Not voting (1): CallMeLiam

With 7 alive it is 4 to lynch.

[bird1111]

Prodding jonathantan86.


From now on, keeping track of how many times I prod you per game day. If I prod you while you are V/LA it does not count, and if you would be prodded a third time, you will instead be replaced. I will keep track of how many times each person has been prodded in the current game day in the first post. If anyone has 3 or more prods this game day already, they will instead be replaced the next time I have to prod someone. This is to try and keep the activity levels up, as some of the games I've run here have been far too lurky. Replacements start over in terms of number of prods.

[TDC]

No, I mean unsettling. It's pretty clearly very anti-town and while it does seem to be his playstyle from what TSPN and AJ have said, I think the fact that they're both voting him regardless of this is a little telling.

According to the above vote count TSPN isn't voting him.

[CallMeLiam]

No, I mean unsettling. It's pretty clearly very anti-town and while it does seem to be his playstyle from what TSPN and AJ have said, I think the fact that they're both voting him regardless of this is a little telling.

According to the above vote count TSPN isn't voting him.

Oops, my bad. My point remains though, although it's only half as valid. A player with past experience of K7's 'lurky' style has found reason to vote for him, and I'd like to know what it is.

[killa seven]

Can you humour me and explain the meta? I'm kinda tempted to hammer but I'd like to know more.

I have never seen killa lurk like this as town. Or be this way about defending himself. He is succinct and sarcastic; sort of like Simenon with bad spelling and punctuation.

I've never seen him like this and I've played multiple games with him as town.

However, I find TDC is starting to give me vibes. Bus perhaps? Eh, leave that for later.

its funny, im allways town and your allways scum.. every damn time!

[jonathantan86]

Jonathan: what do you think of Killa?

I think he's a lurker, and I think lurkers should generally be lynched (refer to my earlier post). And his current spate of posts shows that he's not really interested in contributing, so that gives me even more reason to vote him. My vote's currently on him, by the way.

I've been prodded twice in this game day, so I'll try to post more often.

[BridgesAndBaloons]

K, the reasons I voted for Jonathan (waited for him to come back) is that he's pretty much lurking in plain site with his posts. I mean this is a couple ways.

Looking at his posts in isolation, his begining posts really like talking about more disussion and what is good for the town, rather than actually doing anything. If feel like this doesn't make any sense, so here's some evidence to know what I'm talking about:

more discussion is good for the town. So I'm talking, trying to contribute. Slaine Hayes, TDC and hohum, what do you think?

He's going to contribute by asking

other

people to contribute? What?

Post 5 (I reccomend you read) really really seems like he's revealing his thought process as a townie (the two things I need to "straddle") so that other people will think he's a townie. Once again, these things are pretty obvious and he's not really adding to the discussion.

Post 8 is the first time he actually starts scum-hunting, but he didn't back it up with a vote. It seems he's again staying neutral and trying to test the waters with this suspicion.

Then from 8-12 he focuses on discussing scum's best strategy, which doesn't help town, but once again makes him look like he's contributing.

He is also really really careful in this game:

I will put a vote on killa seven to pressure him to speak.

I do not mean to lynch the lurker

just yet though.

the bolded is totally unnecesary. It's as if he reread what he wrote and tacked it on there to assure the town he was pro-town. It's just overly careful. However, if you see later, he is actually subtly pushing for this lynch.

He says on post 16

some people think it is good to generally lunch lurkers.


http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... c&&start=0

he backs this up with a thread so that the idea doesn't come from him.
He wants to fit in with everyone else, and if "some people" want to lynch lurkers, then I should do.
How does it help the town to be a sheep?

I don't push

very strongly

for a BaB lynch.

Carefullness is underlined.

Also, Jonathan: if you think "BaB is the best candidate because of my profile of scum" why are you voting for Killa?

So, I voted because Jonathan was acting overly careful, and he was attempting to look like he's contributing while avoiding scum-hunting.

There's one more reason, which I'm just hanging on a little longer to reveal.

[killa seven]

Jonathan: what do you think of Killa?

I think he's a lurker, and

I think lurkers should generally be lynched

(refer to my earlier post). And his current spate of posts shows that he's not really interested in contributing, so that gives me even more reason to vote him. My vote's currently on him, by the way.

I've been prodded twice in this game day, so I'll try to post more often

.

Contradiction.

Vote jonathatan86

[jonathantan86]

Then from 8-12 he focuses on discussing scum's best strategy, which doesn't help town, but once again makes him look like he's contributing.

Well...I gave my reasons for thinking that BaB was (at that time) my best scum candidate, and was waiting for other people to comment on it. So to me that does help town.

he backs this up with a thread so that the idea doesn't come from him.
He wants to fit in with everyone else, and if "some people" want to lynch lurkers, then I should do.
How does it help the town to be a sheep?

I did specifically say that I agree with that position. How does backing up with a thread make the idea "not come from me", especially since I was the one who brought up that thread in the first place?

And I don't see anything wrong in being "overly carefull".

Contradiction.
Vote jonathatan86

So...he is astute enough to spot the "contradiction" but not to comment on other parts of the game. I'm happy with my vote on him.

[CallMeLiam]

OK.

Killa, you're still at L-1 and no closer to mountign a defense. Can I ask you why you've been lurking so hard?

Jonathantan: Do you think Killa's lurking is scummy or just not helpful? I'm wary of the size of the setup and I really don't want to mislynch today so I'd rather have a better reason to lynch someone than just inactivity.

BaB: I think I agree with Alabaska here re: Jon being noob town. All this looks more like carefulness than fence sitting.

[bird1111]

Prodded TheSweatpantsNinja

[BridgesAndBaloons]

Gotta pop in here just for a short time, but

BaB: I think I agree with Alabaska here re: Jon being noob town. All this looks more like carefulness than fence sitting.

I personally have never seen noobs being careful. I always seem to find noobs being super eager. Jon's carefulness, in my opinion, is not a lack of self-confidence, but is a product of him trying to look like a townie. It seems to me simply him as scum trying to look townie.

Either way, he's

trying too hard

.

Perhaps if you really would like to defend himself, you would send me games you have been in were town noobs behaved just like Jonathan did, CML? Surely you must have experience with that if you believe that's noobness.

Btw, I am fine with the votes on Killa, especially after the weird way his vote that followed me.

Also, I will be V/La from the 30th-5th. I'll repost this in bold as that date comes up.

[killa seven]

OK.

Killa, you're still at L-1 and no closer to mountign a defense. Can I ask you why you've been lurking so hard?

Jonathantan: Do you think Killa's lurking is scummy or just not helpful? I'm wary of the size of the setup and I really don't want to mislynch today so I'd rather have a better reason to lynch someone than just inactivity.

BaB: I think I agree with Alabaska here re: Jon being noob town. All this looks more like carefulness than fence sitting.

I generally lurk at the begining of games, and when i get wagoned for it i usually ignore it, what am i too defend? i havent done nothing scummy except not post.

[TDC]

killa seven: Can you point me to a past game where you've been lynched?
Also it is hypocritical of you to call jon out for a contradiction for wanting to lynch lurkers while lurking himself, when your own lurking is more severe.

BAB: As it is I don't find your case on jon particularly convincing, though I see where you're coming from regarding his carefulness. What's the other reason (I assume it's connected to your mystery sentence)?

[TheSweatpantsNinja]

Moar like, can killa seven point you to a past game where he

hasn't

been lynched, amirite?

However, he's just being himself, and I don't see any particular reason to lynch him.

I'd find bab's push on jt more scummy if I didn't mostly agree with it.

[TDC]

Moar like, can killa seven point you to a past game where he

hasn't

been lynched, amirite?

No, I meant what I wrote.

I suspect that he's an alt with the specific aim of building up an I-always-lurk meta that will win him every game he enters as scum. I might be wrong though, which is why I'm asking whether he was ever lynched (and if so, I could look into why he was lynched). I've looked through a few of his past games and he was either nightkilled or survived in all of them.

However, he's just being himself, and I don't see any particular reason to lynch him.

And what if he continues to be himself all game? How will you ever be able to judge him?
That said, this is an open setup, which makes things a bit easier.

---

AJ: You've mentioned that k7 plays different in this game than in other games you've been in with him. Can you elaborate? I don't really see a difference.

[Alabaska J]

Dear K7,
That vote was horrible. Also, please defend yourself.
Yours truly,

Alabaska J

[jonathantan86]

Jonathantan: Do you think Killa's lurking is scummy or just not helpful? I'm wary of the size of the setup and I really don't want to mislynch today so I'd rather have a better reason to lynch someone than just inactivity.

I definitely think that Killa's lurking is not helpful. So I think that's scummy, because not saying anything (including scum-hunting or defending yourself from accusations) can only favour the scum.

As for the size of the set up...yes I share your concerns. However if we just leave killa to lurk like this, there's no stopping him from doing so the entire game (and maybe in other games as well). So for meta-game reasons, I think we should lynch him. If we don't care about other games: If he's scum there's no way we can catch him (if we do not accept his lurking as a scum-tell) unless we use a cop investigation on him. If he's town, well...we would be wasting a cop investigation on him. So the penalty for not lynching a lurker is greater than zero.

Killa: You're at L-1 now. Are you town or scum? If you're town (as you would probably claim to be), please help by posting more and defending yourself.

[BridgesAndBaloons]

^lol at above.

seriously,

So for meta-game reasons, I think we should lynch him.

Wow. WOW.
Does anyone else see what's wrong with this?

Also, I will reveal those weird abbreviations (I've already written up the post) as soon as one thing happens.

KILLA:

if there are

ANY

other reasons you voted for Jon,

now

is the time to reveal them. If you don't reveal any more reasons now, I'm going to assume you didn't know about the one that I'm going to reveal.

As soon as he answers this question, I will post my things. Please note I only have access for about 2 more hours tonight and then I won't have access for another 18 hours about.

[Alabaska J]

I personally have never seen noobs being careful. I always seem to find noobs being super eager.

Interesting. That would explain it.

[Alabaska J]

HAPPY BIRTHDAY TDC!!!

[CallMeLiam]

BaB, I can't remember the number of the game in particular, but I have seen it.

K7, could you please go into your reasons for the vote if only to get BaB to explain his code.