Raw, Unfiltered, UPICK Game Over !

[MathBlade]

I'm not even sure if you're voting him?

I dunno, I don't remember moving my vote, and it doesn't look like I changed my vote in my ISO, but we've gone quite a while since a VC

I just felt like my post was being misconstrued as waffling over 'oh idk if grendel is suspicious' when I was in fact trying to get the opposite across despite my maybe-waffly tone

Pedit: math, Grendel can't be SK if mistyx is town because mistyx town is oracle who got setup info that there are no 3rd parties.

Right I said that earlier just misread on my phone

[Titus]

KISS

Non loyal targeting
A counterclaim

Didnt you say you were Joat?

*confused*

Yes. Dann counterclaimed. You targeted Grendel.

[GreyICE]

Because like, here's the thing. I don't think Dannaflor is scum here in any universe.

[MathBlade]

KISS

Non loyal targeting
A counterclaim

Didnt you say you were Joat?

*confused*

Yes. Dann counterclaimed. You targeted Grendel.

Dann counter claimed “if I guess the elim right I get a vig shot”

Where does non loyal targeting come in?

[GreyICE]

I think she meant "you as a loyal role got blocked on a night you targeted him"

[Titus]

KISS

Non loyal targeting
A counterclaim

Didnt you say you were Joat?

*confused*

Yes. Dann counterclaimed. You targeted Grendel.

Dann counter claimed “if I guess the elim right I get a vig shot”

Where does non loyal targeting come in?

You. You targeted with a loyal ability and it failed.

[cassowary]

I think titus's point is basically, occam's razor -- when your non loyal target failed, and Grendel was counterclaimed, what's the most likely explanation here -- that you got roleblocked and that we have two town vigs, or that Grendel is just scum?

[MathBlade]

So to summarize:

Alignment Chart
	MistyX-Town	MistyX-Mafia	MistyX-3rd party
Grendel-Town	Multiple vigs	Mafia tried to save a townie?	????????
Grendel-Scum	Scum-Vig	Scum vig+Gambit?	????????
Grendel-SK	Impossible	Scum trying to save SK?!?	It's one of those games

Why are you stating Grendel SK impossible?

He's not. It just requires Mistyx scum of sometype.

If Grendel SK, Mistyx likely thought he was pocketing a town vig and would be surprised by an SK. That's my thought there. Mystyx 3p with Grendel SK is stupid levels of troll.

Misty SK and Grendel 3P = Go this game is bastard and do whatever

There’s a max of one 3P

[MathBlade]

I think titus's point is basically, occam's razor -- when your non loyal target failed, and Grendel was counterclaimed, what's the most likely explanation here -- that you got roleblocked and that we have two town vigs, or that Grendel is just scum?

I get that Occam’s razor and I was pushing him hard before the claim.

Mainly the people really pushing Occam’s razor are on one pool Titus + Cass
And the people pushing two town vigs GreyICE (and I think someone else it’s blurry)
Kinda fall right on tvs divisions

I wanna know the modifier and see if it could be two town vigs

[GreyICE]

And again, I have had this literal exact thing happen, I was a loyal role, I targeted a townie, I got randomly blocked. You can see the game here: viewtopic.php?f=53&t=72291

I got "no result" on Formerfish because scum randomly blocked me.

I dunno Math. I'm very reluctant to lynch a known vig.

I think titus's point is basically, occam's razor -- when your non loyal target failed, and Grendel was counterclaimed, what's the most likely explanation here -- that you got roleblocked and that we have two town vigs, or that Grendel is just scum?

And this is a legitimately bad point.

Cassowary, if Grendel is scum, how did Kop die?

[GreyICE]

Like, I basically have to ask "is there a universe where Gamma Emerald thinks scum-vig is something that's okay"?

[MathBlade]

That’s why I wanna know the modifier Grey.

If it’s viable and matches the ISO then we’re looking at likely a

Dann + Me + Misty + Grendel + maaaaybe you Town Block

But if it’s NOT viable then it’s
Grendel SK
Misty scum
Probably Titus scum with Pooky

So I am kinda really wanting to see the modifier.

[GreyICE]

Don't we auto-lynch mistyx over Grendel in that world?

[cassowary]

Like, I basically have to ask "is there a universe where Gamma Emerald thinks scum-vig is something that's okay"?

as I said, I don't think it would be that weird with heavy restrictions, but it might be really outside of the meta for Mafiascum, I don't know. I guess I should take everyone else's reaction to the idea as a sign that it's weirder than I think.

[cassowary]

Grendel also could be SK who killed Kop, that wouldn't be inconsistent with everything that's happened either and wouldn't require scum vig

[GreyICE]

Grendel also could be SK who killed Kop, that wouldn't be inconsistent with everything that's happened either and wouldn't require scum vig

...

That'd confirm MistyX is lying.

[cassowary]

ughh, maybe you're right, this is dumb

[GreyICE]

Again, if Grendel flips town, do we kill Danniflor tomorrow?

If Grendel and Danniflor are both town and we mislynch three days in a row is that a town loss?

Because I think the answer to the last question is "yes". And this is what has me actually worried.

[cassowary]

I've been at work for like 10 hours so forgive me my brain is slightly fried

I guess I'm now on the side of, I think we need to hear the modifier(s?) at this point to judge whether it makes sense to have the two town vigs or not

UNVOTE: grendel

[Dannflor]

I don't think we kill Grendel today

I've seen two gated vigs in like normals before

if Grendel is Macho or something it's not out of the realm of possibility we're just both town

I was more suspicious of him earlier when I thought it was possible he was an SK. But I don't think Misty randomly confirming the game as singleball happens if she's scum?

[MathBlade]

Don't we auto-lynch mistyx over Grendel in that world?

Nope.
We elim Grendel then and only if Grendel is SK do we elim misty.

[MathBlade]

Again, if Grendel flips town, do we kill Danniflor tomorrow?

If Grendel and Danniflor are both town and we mislynch three days in a row is that a town loss?

Because I think the answer to the last question is "yes". And this is what has me actually worried.

Agreed.

Grendel said his modifier makes it easier to kill at night.

That’s why I want to know it.

He really is sounding and playing like an SK vs Town vig

[Grendel]

my modifier is that if im unable to preform a kill two consecutive nights in a row then i die. That does include role blocking, protectives, or if I just don't submit a kill.

So its like compulsive, but the modifier's name is "Starving" which im guessing Gamma made up for this game, as my flavor describes me killing and eating other players for food.

I understand that i offered to holster earlier, which runs contrary to the modifer. I was doing that in the hopes that mafia would wifom and not use a rb/someother manipulative role on me tonight. I had always planned to shoot unless directly told not too by majority at EoD.

-/-//--/

Out of curiosity, are most players roles like that? where its a common role but has a flavor twist?

My full role is called "Starving beast"

It occuars to me that if so then we dont need to worry about soup kills in future.

-/-/-/-

pre-edit

If i was an SK i would have outted MistX when she said this was a 11v3 -.-

[Mistyx]

So to summarize:

Alignment Chart
	MistyX-Town	MistyX-Mafia	MistyX-3rd party
Grendel-Town	Multiple vigs	Mafia tried to save a townie?	????????
Grendel-Scum	Scum-Vig	Scum vig+Gambit?	????????
Grendel-SK	Impossible	Scum trying to save SK?!?	It's one of those games

Why are you stating Grendel SK impossible?

He's not. It just requires Mistyx scum of sometype.

If Grendel SK, Mistyx likely thought

he

was pocketing a town vig and would be surprised by an SK. That's my thought there. Mystyx 3p with Grendel SK is stupid levels of troll.

(she)

[Mistyx]

if it helps i could flavor claim?

probably wouldn't, but i feel like doing it anyway :P