Mini 142: Guitarists Mafia- Game Over

[justinl]

guys (MOS, tick, Flay, anyone else i forgot) , the "yeah whatever" vote was because I agreed with IS's reasoning about why we should lynch randomly on the first day... but I guess if it's going to cause that much trouble,

unvote: Dourgrim

but that justinl thing is too suspicious to pass up

the way you worded that makes you look very scummy...

[Dourgrim]

I assume then, that you have first hand experience of Dourgrim's mafia style? How many games have you played with him?

OK, this seriously irritates me. Tally, you know that I'm quite fond of you, but

you

haven't played in enough games with me to "have first hand experience of" my "mafia style" in any real quantifiable sense, so don't start acting like you know my style of play sooo much better than anyone else possibly could. Matter of fact, Talitha, why don't

you

give the name of a game you and I played in that points to my "mafia style" and clearly shows how odd my behavior in this game has been, hmm? As most anyone who

has

played in more than one or two games can tell you, my style tends to vary depending on the other players in the game. When treated poorly by other players, for example, I tend to become hostile and aggressive...

All this amounts to is an attack on MoS by trying to use my length of membership to the site as "evidence", and that's just patently ridiculous. Either that, or it's a desperate attempt to deflect what seems (to me, at least) to be attention finally focusing on the proper place... Talitha.

[Talitha]

I'll thank you to not butt in when I'm asking someone a question, Dour.

I am actually interested in people's answers, unlike Dour who just wants to go on a rant.

[Dourgrim]

I'll thank you to not butt in when I'm asking someone a question, Dour.

I am actually interested in people's answers, unlike Dour who just wants to go on a rant.

Yes, yes, sorry, I completely forgot the Cardinal Rule of Mafia: no one should comment on Talitha (or anything she says or asks) until Talitha's gotten her answers...

... and certainly don't ask her to answer any questions directed at her until such time, either. Nice dodge, but it won't work.

[Cubsfan4life]

Vote Count

Dourgrim- 3 (Internet Stranger, Assasin, Talitha)
Talitha- 2 (Dourgrim, Mastermind of Sin)
justinl- 2 (tick, Mr. Flay)
Mastermind of Sin- 1 (KingEnigma)

Not Voting: nonny, Maverick, justinl

With 11 alive it is 6 to lynch.

[Talitha]

Tried to post 3 times but keep getting errors.. Bah.

[Talitha]

Oh sure. NOW the post goes through.

[Talitha]

Yes, yes, sorry, I completely forgot the Cardinal Rule of Mafia: no one should comment on Talitha (or anything she says or asks) until Talitha's gotten her answers...

No, that's not the rule at all. But I'm not going to let someone who I think is scum (that's you, Dour) jump in and distract from the issue at hand.

I never said that I am an expert on your style. Read my post again. I could and would go into details of the games I have been in with you, but I don't see any point in getting into a back-and-forth with you over how well I know your style, when it isn't really even an issue. The fact is that I'm more familiar with your play than MOS is, but even that's not a big issue.

And i still want MOS to answer my question.

[Maverick]

I can't recall ever playing a game with Dourgrim, and if I have, shows how much I remember about it.. I have yet to find anyone suspicious, I think justinl is my top suspect right now, but it's not a sure thing so all I will do is

FOS: Justinl

. Basically because of following IS's logic, when there is no logic, and IS himself said so, plus he hasn't been posting much. (Not that I have room to say anything). I still feel the need to wait things out, and see my options.

*Maverick*

[Mastermind of Sin]

i did read your posts, and I guess I just didn't feel you explained yourself adequetely...so let's just agree to disagree, unless you have a different explanation for me...in which case you'd be changing your story, and I wouln't suggest that...

Why wouldn't you want me to change my story huh? If you really thought I was scum, you'd be looking to trip me up.
And if you really cared whether I am innocent, you'd be asking me for further explanation.
You've jumped to 3rd on my list. (Flay & Dour are tied for 1st place).

i see his post differently than you, apparently, because it doesn't seem all that odd to me...

I assume then, that you have first hand experience of Dourgrim's mafia style? How many games have you played with him?

aww, I'm touched, Tally...thanks ....and no, I've haven't played a lot of games with Dourgrim either, but that doesn't mean I can't read his posts differently than you do...

[Maverick]

Talitha, quick quesiton, why do you find Mr. Flay suspicious again? I guess I missed that.. I'm just curious, I'm not attacking you in any way. heh.

*Maverick*

[Mastermind of Sin]

yes, Tally, you never really explained yourself well there...I got distracted, and you sorta skirted the issue...

[justinl]

Maverick, if you'd actually read my explanation, you would have seen what i meant by "logic"

[Internet Stranger]

I rather enjoy this petty bickering. As long as Dourgrim is the one lynched, of course. But please, carry on.

[Talitha]

I've haven't played a lot of games with Dourgrim either, but that doesn't mean I can't read his posts differently than you do...

That's fine, but it makes me wonder why you don't give any consideration to the opinion of a player who has played with Dourgrim before. (Before Dour blows up at me again, I'm not saying that I know him inside out or anything). But I do have some experience that I'm basing my judgements from, whereas you have none.

I'm not saying that I'm definitely right, and MOS is definitely wrong, just interested in the situation. Maybe Dour is innocent and MOS is the scum *shrug*.

[Talitha]

Talitha, quick quesiton, why do you find Mr. Flay suspicious again?

When I saw the way Assasin voted for Dourgrim, and then his assertion that he didn't need IS to tell him anything, the first thing that popped into my head was, "Wow, Assasin could be a cop".
Then Mr Flay FOSed Assasin and then voted for him after Dourgrim did, saying that Assasin 'mindlessly' fingered Dour.
THEN Assasin comes along and says that his Dourgrim vote was just a random vote.
So Mr Flay was RIGHT about Assasin's vote being mindless. But my question is, how did he know this?

[nonny]

i will be gone from the 17th to the 24th but will try and get something of value in before then. Sorry i havn't contributed much so far you may replace me if you wish.

[Mr. Flay]

guys (MOS, tick, Flay, anyone else i forgot) , the "yeah whatever" vote was because I agreed with IS's reasoning about why we should lynch randomly on the first day... but I guess if it's going to cause that much trouble, unvote: Dourgrim

but that justinl thing is too suspicious to pass up

the way you worded that makes you look very scummy...

So you believe Internet Stranger is right about choosing a name out of a hat, then unvote when it causes you any heat, and you say *I* look scummy? I'm glad you're posting more, but this confuses me.

I

don't

understand the desire to lynch someone by pulling their name out of a hat on Day 1. Shouldn't we be going after the person who seems scummiest? Talitha, at least, is giving reasons for her vote... even if I don't agree with most of them, she's participating in the game. IS and Justinl (and Assasin) seem to have thrown darts at a board and come up with Dourgrim. Was making an *informed* decision forbidden when I wasn't looking? Now I don't think they're all of our scum, certainly (that would beggar belief in its stupidity) but if Dourgrim *is* innocent I think we should take a longer look at that portion of the mob.

will be gone from the 17th to the 24th but will try and get something of value in before then. Sorry i havn't contributed much so far you may replace me if you wish.

Oh, please do post something of value. I hate replacements, although I realize they're a necessary evil, because they make you recalibrate your entire perception of the *role* a person might have, as opposed to the person playing it... and the replacement always gets a free pass for a while, which sets everything back. But nevermind: pretty please, with sugar on it, post your thoughts and stay in/come back to the game. Especially since you said you would back on the 12th (post 80).

When I saw the way Assasin voted for Dourgrim, and then his assertion that he didn't need IS to tell him anything, the first thing that popped into my head was, "Wow, Assasin could be a cop".
Then Mr Flay FOSed Assasin and then voted for him after Dourgrim did, saying that Assasin 'mindlessly' fingered Dour.
THEN Assasin comes along and says that his Dourgrim vote was just a random vote.
So Mr Flay was RIGHT about Assasin's vote being mindless. But my question is, how did he know this?

Okay, I'm going to try to do this with a minimum of sarcasm.

I FOS'ed and later voted for Assasin because he posted a vote in the first moments of the game that didn't *look* random, but also had no justification behind it. Much like I voted for justinl when he did the same thing (again, coincidentally, to Dourgrim). Am I being obtuse or inconsistent? He posted a vote (second vote, even) without a shred of explanation, and I questioned him about it. His reply (post 24) didn't assuage my concerns, so I voted for him. It was a second vote, true, but it was based on something that had actually been said/done in the thread, and it was better than my random vote at the time. What exactly are you wanting by way of explanation? A role claim?

You know what..I think we've got a lot to go on here at this point for Day 2. The only question is whether Talitha or Dourgrim would be the better 'proof' of what's been said so far, and since I believe Dourgrim more than Talitha,

Unvote: Junstinl, Vote: Talitha

to make things interesting. She's been extremely pushy on the Dourgrim thing on what looks like circumstantial evidence.

[Talitha]

What exactly are you wanting by way of explanation?

I just want to know why it never entered your head at any point that Assasin could be a cop.

You're right that we've got some good info already this day Mr Flay, but I don't want to lynch myself or Dourgrim at this point.

I've just realised we've got some major lurking going on, not the least is from the person who started all of this.

unvote: Dourgrim vote: Assasin

[justinl]

Mr. Flay, the whole reasoning is that mafia is less likely to look scummy on day 1 because they have more info than everyone, and arent feeling around in the dark. Also is that an experienced player is much better at avoiding lynch even if they are mafia, so it's better to lynch an experienced player so in subsequent rounds if a newbie is playing mafia it will be easier to tell. (verbatim what IS said earlier)

This logic had convinced me, but apparently everyone else doesn't agree..

and specifically what made you look scummy was saying "too suspicious to pass up" like you would miss a great opportunity if you "passed it up" (opportunity to lynch town).

[Maverick]

Talitha, I somewhat see your logic on the Mr. Flay thing.. somewhat. I don't agree with it entirely though, whenever I read the post about Assasin the first thing I thought was, oh he just made a mistake by saying that, not because I thought he was scum, nor cop, just becuase of the mere fact that I figured people would say something about it, when, it actually ment nothing. If I had to choose finding Mr. Flay suspicious or Assasin suspicious for that though, I would have to say Assasin. Mainly because he voted for no apparent reason, just to follow IS, then made a crappy, in my opinion, defense for it. I think that Mr. Flay found that suspicious, hence, voted for him.

I do, however, find it suspicious that after all that long push towards Dourgrim, and debating with fellow players, that you suddenly seem so interested in lynching lurkers. I don't disagree, but just find it wierd. Since this is the only thing that is remotely supicious to me this game, I'm going to have to

Vote: Talitha

. I'm not saying I have anything saying that your sure scum, but it's, like I said, the only thing thus far this game that I have found suspicious. I'm a bit hesitant on the vote because of you being a bad player to lynch if town, but it is far worth it if you are scum.

[Talitha]

Maverick - check out any of my other day 1s. I'm somewhat of a flip flopper and I change who I am suspicious of nearly as often as I change my undies. I often also get into heated debates with people and then back down. None of this is out of the ordinary for me.

I'm now on 4 votes out of 6, so if anyone else is intending on voting for me, I'd appreciate if you'd give me fair warning before doing so.

[KingEnigma]

Maverick you say that the only scummy thing that you have seen this game is how Talitha is acting, but you also said you agreed with her on Mr Flay and Assasin seeming a little off. Which in these games a little off can go a long ways towards being mafia.

So I'm kind of confused and wary. Are you jumping on her because shes close to a lynch or because its what everyone else is doing? (notice how i did not leave a good choice there? HA!)

I dont have enough info to make an educated guess towards anyting at the moment, but that struck me as an odd thing to say.

[Maverick]

Talitha, if someone can follow you up on that, then I'll consider taking my vote off of you, because the game(s) I have played with you have been to long ago to remember your Day 1 game style. I still find what your doing suspicious, but if that is your game style, I wouldn't want to risk voting off an experienced player that is innocent. But you could also be scum, and just be using that as defense. Anyone here that can confirm that this is how Tally always plays on Day 1?

KingEnigma: First off, where have you been? I forgot you were even in this game. Anyways, I can understand why you think that, but I guess I just didn't explain myself properly, I didn't really find the Assasin thing suspicious, all I was saying is that I do understand why Mr. Flay would have thought it suspicious, and I was just explaining what Mr. Flay might have been thinking voting for Assasin. I also said that if I were to choose between the two to think suspicious in that, I would pick Assasin, but I didn't find either of them suspicious, therefore, I didn't vote for them.

Right now, I am not certain in anyone, my vote is just my top suspect, I'm not even 50% sure about my vote, It's just all I have right now.

*Maverick*

[KingEnigma]

Not a good excuse but Ive been working 14 hour days with a 2 hour drive on top of that, a baby that keeps me up at night and 1 day off a week. that ends officially saturday, but to say the least ive been pretty busy.

Ive posted in a few games, but havent had a chance to do it in all. i'm trying to make up for that now.