Mini Normal 2268 Game Over

[DkKoba]

oh that

that doesnt exactly explain your progression to townreading GL unless I assume you just binned GL for being loud.

why did you find GL obvtown? Have you played against GL scum before, actually?

[DkKoba]

Like I myself binned GL for now and was only pressuring them bc of the reasons you stated there, but I have nowhere seen anything that makes me feel I should townread them here.

[ShadowGirl]

Whoops. Remembered that one wrongly. Sorry.
VOTE: Guilty Lion

What the reason for your preference for voting GL over Roden (who was your 2nd top scumread pick and then you temporarily changed your vote due to a post of theirs), and what is your take on my analysis about DkKoba's behaviour about not giving reads on Dwlee (up until a couple posts ago)?

[DkKoba]

tictac has massively gone under the radar to the point i forgot they were in the game


but also my genshin dailies call to me so that is all u get for now, i will make dwlee do my dirty work and reread them :^)

[Meuh]

meuh been cool during this l-1 thing.

VOTE: chaos
@dk feel free to use like arguments if u got something against this
@lion ur thing here boils down to "too scummy to be scum", which is not persuasive.

Baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
VOTE: chaos
Better spot for my vote than still randomly on tictac

Why do you agree with tictac?

When have I said this?

[GuiltyLion]

Of course any post can be made by someone of any alignment, but I feel like the ones Roden made line up with what town!Roden would logically do.
If there's a mostly undisturbed wagon on someone they don't think is scum with half the playerbase participating in it, why wouldn't they call it out and try to disturb it? The thought process behind contesting the wagon seems like one town!Roden would naturally come to.
If Roden is scum with GL, what do they really benefit from it? Why would Roden go against a solidified wagon on their partner? There's a slight chance they can shake things up, but it's unlikely.
If Roden is scum and GL is town, I also don't see why they'd be doing this? Towncred post-flip? It still draws a bunch of attention on them, so overall it doesn't seem like the option they'd choose?
When viewing the game from Roden's POV in different scenarios, to me it's more realistic for town!Roden to do what they have done.

I don't think anything in this post is egregiously wrong or anything but I still get the same vibes I've been getting from a lot of your posts that it's just careful measured takes trying to appear town rather than purposeful and organic reads

I also disagree that scum!Roden has no benefit if paired with scum!GL, like it did effectively derail the wagon, keeping a scummate alive D1 is inherently better than losing one, and capable scum could try to play off the hard defense as an antispew. It's because I know my own alignment that makes me see Roden's actions as fundamentally townie, I think if someone is suspicious of me it's not a huge leap to be suspicious of Roden, so reaching that conclusion doesn't feel totally natural to me from your slot here either

[Meuh]

Also where did Marci go I miss her

[ShadowGirl]

tictac has massively gone under the radar to the point i forgot they were in the game


but also my genshin dailies call to me so that is all u get for now, i will make dwlee do my dirty work and reread them :^)

i know what genshin is i'm not a boomer ):

i also agree that i would love those who have not posted much or lately to do so : tictac, chaos, marci, nk15
will go back to my boomer normal style of typing after this post

[GuiltyLion]

But I don't think that should be the first assumption, and even more I really don't think they should be today's priority.

why not? someone who's detached from a lot of the real meat/content in the game is usually where I want attention focused rather than the people duking it out

[Meuh]

Meuh

VOTE: chaos
Better spot for my vote than still randomly on tictac

Why the vote on Chaos, again, because Gamma was E-1?

I voted on Chaos because:
-I realized my vote was still on tictac and that’s not a place where I wanted it
-I feel pretty null about Chaos so I don’t mind voting for them
-I think tictac’s town so I wanted to amplify their thoughts
-The point made about Chaos’s entrance seemed fair to me (even though it also applies to me )
-It puts pressure on a less vocal slot

Gamma is someone I do want to look into some more, although iirc some of their posts earlier on actually seemed townie to me, so I’m not interested in voting for them before looking into them

[GuiltyLion]

This seems like contradictory thinking? That you wish to push people who are prone to tunnelling for seemingly no reason, rather than mounting pressure on those who are inactive and prodding them with questions? And as scum seems like easy pickings to target tunnel-vision prone people as they'll basically dig their own grave?

I'm not sure I understand this question/comment, I think there's some kind of miscommunication here.

I don't want to push people who are prone to tunneling, if anything I think most of the time tunnel-prone people are town, rather what I'm saying is that I think tunnel behavior usually leads to bad gamestates for town. The people I wish to push on D1 are the emptier slots who I don't feel are very invested nor taking real stances in the game. early game there's usually at least one scum who can't keep up with the tryhard townies, and scum's path to winning or gameplan isn't very clear to them yet, so I tend to find better odds of success just pushing/wagoning lurkscummy people who I don't have any real reason to townread rather than someone who I get into a big fight with, if that someone is otherwise a very vocal/engaged player then my guess is I'm more likely to just be clashing with them and finding reasons to SR them due to the sheer density of noise from their slot.

a lot of scum will definitely get by me on D1 if they have the WIM for it, but I think I have better odds of catching those players in the mid-late game once we have a much clearer picture of the gamestate via flips, associatives, voting record, etc

[Roden]

oh that

that doesnt exactly explain your progression to townreading GL unless I assume you just binned GL for being loud.

why did you find GL obvtown? Have you played against GL scum before, actually?

Nah I don't bin anyone for being loud, or at least not in a vacuum. You can be loud and still be scum; it's a collection of factors that matters to me.

I find GL obvtown because of the game state and the speed/randomness of his wagon. I've only played with him once though, and we were TvT there, so I'm not using meta here to read him. He does feel pretty much the same as that town game though.

[GuiltyLion]

i didn't scumread him for his scumread on me. i scumread him for his activity despite his scumread on me. see the difference?

scum would keep their vote on dwlee for multiple reasons. 1) it was safe 2) it doesn't have to build consensus from group up (by voting me) 3) it can still develop into a limmable wagon

I wish you had just explained your read like this instead of taking the approach of challenging me to vote you

[ShadowGirl]

This seems like contradictory thinking? That you wish to push people who are prone to tunnelling for seemingly no reason, rather than mounting pressure on those who are inactive and prodding them with questions? And as scum seems like easy pickings to target tunnel-vision prone people as they'll basically dig their own grave?

I'm not sure I understand this question/comment, I think there's some kind of miscommunication here.

I don't want to push people who are prone to tunneling, if anything I think most of the time tunnel-prone people are town, rather what I'm saying is that I think tunnel behavior usually leads to bad gamestates for town. The people I wish to push on D1 are the emptier slots who I don't feel are very invested nor taking real stances in the game. early game there's usually at least one scum who can't keep up with the tryhard townies, and scum's path to winning or gameplan isn't very clear to them yet, so I tend to find better odds of success just pushing/wagoning lurkscummy people who I don't have any real reason to townread rather than someone who I get into a big fight with, if that someone is otherwise a very vocal/engaged player then my guess is I'm more likely to just be clashing with them and finding reasons to SR them due to the sheer density of noise from their slot.

a lot of scum will definitely get by me on D1 if they have the WIM for it, but I think I have better odds of catching those players in the mid-late game once we have a much clearer picture of the gamestate via flips, associatives, voting record, etc

Yeah, I interpreted "I absolutely do start with easier to pressure/sort players on D1," as trying to pick a fight with players that you knew would get agitated, but I see that wasn't what you meant. I also think that the fight between the two of you isn't necessarily alignment indicative and could be just a personality clash between you.

I know this conversation got shut down but since I wasn't there for it, I just want to briefly bring it up: what is the general site meta for neighbourhoods for Normal games, about how many scum there may or may not be in the neighbourhoods? Again, not suggesting someone get eliminated solely due to math-ing on this aspect.

[Gamma Emerald]

Like I myself binned GL for now and was only pressuring them bc of the reasons you stated there, but I have nowhere seen anything that makes me feel I should townread them here.

this is a bit of a mood
it's rlly great when two read sources give v contrary ideas of a person's alignment. gamestate suggests GL is town but on vibes he's scummy

[GuiltyLion]

I'm always scummy on vibes

[Gamma Emerald]

that tracks
you just feel a bit like you were in the white flag game (I mentioned this earlier but I wanna mention it to you directly, see your input)

[GuiltyLion]

ok so here's a readslist with a small bit of explanation but I don't have a ton of energy for it

order within the groups does not matter at all, just tiers

town: {tictac, roden, marci}
probtown: {koba, dwlee, gamma}
fuck if I know: {HEM, chaos}
scummy: {NK15, shadowgirl}
scum: {meuh}

tictac feels like the most pure slot in the game, roden again just 0% chance of defending me like that as scum, marci's star maybe falling off a tiny bit as of late but I don't see her as aligned with Meuh and I still very much think Meuh is scum

I liked a lot of Dwlee's later posting the past few days and I'm also thinking I'd trust a town!Koba to sort them in the hood. Koba is only not highest town tier by virtue of general paranoia of their scumgame, they're easily the most take charge person in the game here and I don't really object to most of what they've said - they have the wrong conclusions on roden/GL dynamic but I don't fault them for how they reached those conclusions. gamma I am iffy on, I felt a more strong dislike of his posting around the time of E-1-gate but when I challenged myself today to evaluate their explanation/justifications in response to me and others I don't really see any scumtells there and I do think his vibes don't fit what I've felt from his scumgame vibewise

HEM, I see where Roden's coming from and it does feel like at times he's tweaked his story slightly to serve whatever his current agenda is, but it's not contradictory in a fully scummy way and his SR on me clicked a bit more when I understood that his real objections were to me parking a 'safe' vote on Dwlee, I don't think that's inherently wrong to be suspicious of. waiting on more from him though

Chaos I've liked what he's posted but he isn't posting enough of it for a real townread, and if I'm looking for scum on my wagon he's in the pool of potential candidates

NK15 I think has been pushing a lot of bullshit and doing it in this extremely obstinate/confident way that I think feels surface-level town in a "it seems like his beliefs are genuine!" sense but doesn't actually demonstrate an evolving/sorting mind. like his entire gamestate view has been oriented around me being scum from the very start and has not once significantly deviated nor reassessed (I know he very briefly voted Koba but I think that was for show), and I also think he's a smarter dude than to genuinely believe in assigning scumreads to everyone who townread me like he did in 586. no evidence in my mind of him not playing to suit an agenda. also I think the initial fixation on the traitor talk was odd and possibly informed of presence of a traitor in the game. would lim with no mercy

ShadowGirl is kind of a POE pick but I don't think she's actually done anything townie? like she's giving reasonable seeming Opinions on stuff but none of it has once struck me as something that would be out of range of being faked by a capable wolf. I'm least sure of this read but I got a lot of town vibes elsewhere and she hasn't felt townie enough herself to dislodge anyone else

Meuh just feels like scum to me. not all that engaged, surface level reads/analysis, 754 is a bizarre post like she's clearly sheeping tictac, why play the "I didn't

say

I agree with tictac!!" card in response to Koba's question??

[GuiltyLion]

that tracks
you just feel a bit like you were in the white flag game (I mentioned this earlier but I wanna mention it to you directly, see your input)

I mean I think there's a similarity in that I also got into an early fight in white flag (which was a bit more to a calculated end there, but would probably feel similar with me being Very Involved and Very Riled early), but other than that I'm not sure what else you could be picking up on. Keep in mind that when I play scum I am still the same person in terms of personality and I am consciously trying to play like I would as town, so like, there should be a baseline of some similarities between my town and scum game regardless of alignment

[Gamma Emerald]

okay that actually makes a ton of sense to why I thought this was similar

[GuiltyLion]

also as an addendum to my readslist, I don't believe the team is like {NK15, ShadowGirl, Meuh}, like it's more likely than not there's at least one scum if not more in the tiers above bc I'm not a god of mafia or anything, but rather think of it like just a descending list of my %confidence in those slots being town

[Meuh]

I can’t really fault ppl for scumreading me, haven’t gotten into this game like I have with others

[DkKoba]

VOTE: Meuh

[Meuh]

Meuh just feels like scum to me. not all that engaged, surface level reads/analysis, 754 is a bizarre post like she's clearly sheeping tictac, why play the "I didn't

say

I agree with tictac!!" card in response to Koba's question??

754 is just me being snarky
I basically answer what Dk asks like 5 posts later in response to ShadowGirl, I just felt like answering that way to Dk

[marcistar]

[3] ChaosOmega: tictac, Meuh, DkKoba
[2] GuiltyLion: humaneatingmonkey, Not Known 15
[2] Meuh: marcistar, GuiltyLion
[2] humaneatingmonkey: Dwlee99, Roden
[1] Roden: Gamma Emerald
[1] Gamma Emerald: ChaosOmega

[1] Not voting: ShadowGirl

With 12 players alive, 7 votes are needed for an elimination.

D1: deadline: (expired on 2022-03-29 21:32:48)

<<chaosomega, meuh, gamma emerald>> i dont mind voting those, but voting for chaosomega would make me feel weird a tiny bit.

that list prob doesn't make sense, but im not thinking of teams at all rn im just thinking of them individually.

Also where did Marci go I miss her

im so tired lately, yesterday i was planning to reread and such but then my boss asked if i could come in to work cuz someone called sick and that like totally messed up my schedule cuz im tired af now
not fair on the others here yeah cuz im just gonna sleep soon