Mini Normal 2275: Roguelikes - Day 3: Endgame!

[Fredrick A Campbell]

can be town. they're not here. Lowell more sus 2 me. Mooo.

There is currently more votes on kennyk, so you might as well put your vote there first

[FancyPants]

Very happy where my Kenny vote is parked.

[FancyPants]

Just to add too this all his posts reek of appeasement and trying not to offend anyone. His first post had a bit of this and his latest is worse.

[kennyk]

Just to add too this all his posts reek of appeasement and trying not to offend anyone. His first post had a bit of this and his latest is worse.

Yes, I do try not to offend anyone. If that's your tactic to get information out of people this early in the game, that's fine for you. But that's not how I play.

If you want to see me hanging, because I don't have an elaborated read about everyone, so be it. I posted what I think about the players that did something relevant in my eyes. It is by far not enough to get a read on them. But I am generally not the kind of person who gets to reads fast.

I can definitely not see how my very first post in this thread should reek of appeasement. To me this reeks of someone desperately trying to build a case on someone.

But as you do want me to step on someones toes so much, I will do you the favour:
VOTE: FancyPants

[BlueBloodedToffee]

But what you posted wasn't relevant. You posted a bunch of stuff but didn't actually give any reads, so the question is this; why post it at all?

[Shoshin]

Kenny is town.

More votes on Malcolm, please.

[Fredrick A Campbell]

VOTE: Lowell

Come, Shoshin, join us.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Fred, what happened?

[kennyk]

But what you posted wasn't relevant. You posted a bunch of stuff but didn't actually give any reads, so the question is this; why post it at all?

I never claimed it to be reads. Just my impressions about things that were relevant in my eyes. Like Irrelephant believing Shoshin is town without giving a reason why.

It was just things that I think are noteworthy. They were and are not enough to make it a read in my eyes.

And btw.: the quoted post doesn't contain a read either. Why did you post it at all?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

My post wasn't intended to look like I was doing stuff.

Your post is posted under the guise of actually contributing.

[kennyk]

Kenny is town.

More votes on Malcolm, please.

And here is another "X is town" post without any reason. This time it is Shoshin on the giving and not the receiving end.

Mind to share, why you think I am town?

And why voteing Malcolm (except maybe for not posting much)?

[kennyk]

My post wasn't intended to look like I was doing stuff.

Your post is posted under the guise of actually contributing.

No it was not. FancyPants asked me about my thoughts. And I did post those thoughts. They aren't much in regard of reads, but those were the thoughts I have about this game.

[Irrelephant11]

Shoshin why isn’t Kenny’s over-explaining-himself a scumread for you

[Irrelephant11]

I don’t see it but I’ll VOTE: Malcolm anyway

[MalcolmTucker]

Alright, busy weekend, just caught up with the game so far. I think the early back and forth's between Confidently Wrong and Toffee are probably TvT.

Confidently Wrong's approach early on seemed like a harmless comedy bit, and I don't think it's suspicious that they weren't particularly phased about the votes placed on them - not as if they were going to be in any danger of getting eliminated three or four pages into the game. The comedy approach could of course be a useful way to try and avoid suspicion but, of course, FancyPants correctly pointed out they already had the username before they started playing (simple but effective point), and it's likely they were going to do this anyway. Their responses under pressure felt reasonable.

I didn't like the aggressiveness of Toffee's push but said push and their later follow-up vote on CSF makes me feel like they're eager town at the moment trying to make things happen, their approach feels a bit bold for scum so far.

Based on the above FancyPants is my strongest TR so far, well-thought out posts that have been helpful to town.

[FancyPants]

Just to add too this all his posts reek of appeasement and trying not to offend anyone. His first post had a bit of this and his latest is worse.

Yes, I do try not to offend anyone. If that's your tactic to get information out of people this early in the game, that's fine for you. But that's not how I play.

If you want to see me hanging, because I don't have an elaborated read about everyone, so be it. I posted what I think about the players that did something relevant in my eyes. It is by far not enough to get a read on them. But I am generally not the kind of person who gets to reads fast.

I can definitely not see how my very first post in this thread should reek of appeasement. To me this reeks of someone desperately trying to build a case on someone.

But as you do want me to step on someones toes so much, I will do you the favour:
VOTE: FancyPants

You don't have to offend people, you just have to have an opinion.

In this post 21, you point out that Eiralox's behavior is erratic, I know this was done in a jokey way but you don't specify if that erratic behaviour is scummy or townie, you just bring it up with a smiley face. You're pointing to a behaviour but don't commit as to what it could mean.

Then in this post 148 you bring up a few things, I'll quote you so you aren't taken out of context:

So here are my thoughts about the game so far.

There is Eiralox who voted and changed votes twice very early in the game.

I made a (in my eyes) fun comment about this. I know it is RVS, so those vote changes are very likely a thing of trying to beating around the bush in hope of someone reacting to being voted.

FancyPants tries to push me for this comment. This feels wierd. But maybe it is because they are torn pants (thanks Irrelephant for that pun).

The most fascinating thing about Irrelephant is, that Shoshin is probably town. Not that I think Shoshin is scum, but I don't see how he should have gained the towncred.

ConfidentlyWrongs selfvote in the early RVS is NAI for me. As mentioned by someone else earlier (too lazy to look it up again) this seems to be a humoristic approach (haha).

BlueBloodedToffee pushing CW for the selfvote and then, when the waggon didn't get on track too well, hopping on the CSF waggon seems fishy.

I don't see why CSF deserves the waggon that's now going on.

Everyone else is just a blank card for me right now.

From my perspective here's what you brought up in this post:
- That Eira voted a few times again (I don't understand your explanation for it).
- That my push on you is weird (you don't explain why it's weird, you do however only soft commit to the comment)
- You think Irrelephant's town read of shosin is fascinating (you don't say why or whether this is alignment indicative of anything).
- You think CW's self vote is NAI, you aren't sure who brought this up (For reference - I did, the person you're voting for).
- You throw some sus on to BBT for switching wagons from CW to CSF (This whole idea was Cat Scratch Fever's originally, importantly you don't actually vote BBT here).

So essentially you're simply stating things that have happened in game, or just recycling ideas other people have come up with without taking any strong stances.

- Scum are more afraid to offend people or take strong stances.
- Scum struggle to manufacture opinions or reads because they know they are BS.

Hence you are scum.

Since you're voting me, can you try and explain why you think I'm scum? Also why didn't you vote BBT since you thought his wagon switch was "fishy"? Can you explain why my push on you was "weird" in your eyes?

[MalcolmTucker]

I know I shouldn't have confidence in this, but Malcolm feels super scummy. Does anyone disagree?

Kenny is town.

More votes on Malcolm, please.

I'm not really sure how you deduced I seemed "super scummy" after a grand total of two posts - one of which was me just saying hello, which I pretty much always do regardless of my alignment, and another of which was me giving some helpful info on how I like playing the game/when I tend to be online.

If it was coming from a more active player I'd perhaps be more understanding and forgiving of an early gut-read - but so far you've made a total of six posts, three of which involve you honing in on a player who hadn't done much so far. If you're scum this would be a nice, easy early cop-out approach to the game early on where you're able to appear as if you have a conviction read without having to particularly back it up or face a major challenge for it. Out of interest, what about my early posts made you suspect me?

[MalcolmTucker]

Kenny is town.

More votes on Malcolm, please.

And here is another "X is town" post without any reason. This time it is Shoshin on the giving and not the receiving end.

Mind to share, why you think I am town?

And why voteing Malcolm (except maybe for not posting much)?

I actually kind of like this post. Now Kenny is under pressure the easiest thing for them to do would be to easily accept the town-cred from anyone willing to give it out. Instead they're willing to put some pressure on someone who is backing them.

I thought post 178 was generally reasonable - it's a little bit defensive but town can be defensive as well as mafia, and I've definitely been guilty as town early on of not really having well-formed thoughts and appearing to be very on the fence. What gives me a second pause there is the vote on FancyPants, which feels too defensive for me, but maybe that's because I TR the slot.

[MalcolmTucker]

Hi Shoshin are you town? I'll have much more fun if so

Also Shoshin is probably town but I’ll be able to say for sure after she posts a dozen more times

Realizing CSF is V/LA this weekend takes some of the wind out of my sails. I don’t have any read on Malcolm yet.

I could do VOTE: Lowell

Shoshin is a she, and I’ve played with her a lot. I’m not ready to defend her as definitely town but I see similarities to her town game already. I’ll need a few more posts to get a more confident read

Shoshin is Kenny scum or is that just me

Shoshin why isn’t Kenny’s over-explaining-himself a scumread for you

I don’t see it but I’ll VOTE: Malcolm anyway

If Shoshin is town then I feel like Irrelephant could potentially be scum trying to pocket them a bit going forward.

There's several posts here repeatedly indicating Irrelephant thinks Shoshin is town, based on their past experience together, but we're never given a sense as to why this is beyond what must presumably be a gut-read. But Irrelephant appears to be viewing Shoshin's slot completely uncritically - it's more like they desperately want them to be town more than anything else.

The eventual vote on me is weird in that regard, Irrelephant doesn't particularly suspect me, and doesn't actually see me as scum but...votes for me anyway? This just seems really odd. Why waste time voting for a slot you don't think is mafia purely on the gut-read of a player who has made six posts so far?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Can we stop voting Malcolm now and start voting Kenny?

Thanks.

[Confidently Wrong]

im gay

[Confidently Wrong]

This game feels hard but thats probably because i have meta on like none of you and those i do i am still bad at reading

[Confidently Wrong]

Wait i was trolling, loftwing is town

[Loftwing]

UNVOTE: Kennyk

I like their recent posting, it feels a lot better than before.

[FancyPants]

@loftwing, Can you point out specifically what you like about Kenny's recent posts?