In post 4294, jjh927 wrote:Maybe I should actually meta Prism given I've done so with everyone else in this game but I
just feel like the level of effort to justify his reads has been so far above and beyond what most mafia players are capable of
and actually metaing Prism would probably require me to read at least one entire game rather than just prism's iso
If that's the primary reason then you don't even have to read the games. It's NAI. Not once in this entire game would I have pushed myself even slightly out of my scum comfort zone.
It's more that you 'd have to put in a lot more effort to consciously do things that a town play would do unconsciously in a way that meshes with the gamestate
"As best I can tell, jjh is some kind of wizard with mind control powers." -Jingle
I can't take your word on it because you don't necessarily know what I am looking for, although amusingly if I did then I would have to reconsider you right this moment
"As best I can tell, jjh is some kind of wizard with mind control powers." -Jingle
I have multiple reasons to be candid about this that are to my win condition. The first is that you will struggle to understand both T3 and Ydrasse if you insist on staying oblivious.
In post 4309, Prism wrote:
I am directly telling you that T3 is correct and your refusal to reconsider is in error, and is betting the game on luck.
I understand you think I have a strong interest, beyond my win condition, to play up my scumgame. Again, skimming D&C should be sufficient.
What's the end result here? I decide that it's impossible to determine your alignment due to your impressive scumrange and then decide it's time to BOP you for being on the Alisae wagon, coaxing me off the Camel wagon, and hardpushing Andres into EOD?
"As best I can tell, jjh is some kind of wizard with mind control powers." -Jingle
In post 4307, jjh927 wrote:
It's more that you 'd have to put in a lot more effort to consciously do things that a town play would do unconsciously in a way that meshes with the gamestate
I don't know. I'm a lot better at engaging with the gamestate when I'm scum (see the scumgame I linked earlier), when I'm town I just go off and do my own thing to solve which is part of the reason why I'm scumread frequently as town. I think Prism has definitely been providing a lot of passive commentary but I don't think Prism has been all that in-tune with the gamestate.
Again I view understanding the perspective of other players, particularly two you think are the likely scum candidates, as a worthwhile endgoal in itself, but suit yourself. I won't belabor the point further.
I think there are strongly AI points in my favor, but I'm not really interested in them at the moment. If you come out of the skim with your read intact, then that's fine.
This isn't a Jeopardy! category titled "Good reasons to townread Prism", I'm not looking for an answer where if I am personally satisfied I will pay you on the back and mail you $100. My interests are more varied and open-ended.
Alright, time is up. I'm healthy and I'm home. Let's get the party started.
I'm going to work through this methodically. I'm going to take each individual player and do a triple ISO with camel, Fire, and that player. I don't really care about the posts/interactions with town players right now. I'll probably do 2 or 3 slots today and more tomorrow.
After that, I'm going to sort them into buckets to further review as needed, and probably do a second round.
Working through Ydrasse, but I'm really wondering about Firebringer and his intentional subversion of the "rule of 3" with names. More specifically, I'm wondering if he's overshot it and virtually always gives 3 town, but that's a question for a bit later.
Overall, I lean town on Ydrasse. I'm going to assign a number from 1-10 where 1 is very scummy and 1 is very town so I can easily order players as I work through, and Ydrasse is at probably a 6 after looking through the interactions.
i dont think snivy should be town for efforts but idk. i have wavered on this in my head, where i have been posting instead of this thread.
i feel some kind of way about someone arriving and inserting themselves into the game in a way that is like: "im scum with these people"
and then when asked if he's played w those people before there's deflection
i asked if he had because i think if he just said no i would have given a townread because a wolf would imo be more self conscious in saying stuff like that with strangers
but instead i dont get why theres just another joke its v weird to me
idk if he is wolf trying to integrate with vibes or town, who naturally just has vibes
im trying to parse where ur at with this and all im getting is css has weird vibes. which i don't think i agree with
Interesting discussion if it's camel/Firebringer/Ydrasse. At first I thought this was strongly AI, but the strength of camel/Fire's interactions has made me downgrade it to that vague non-conclusive "interesting"
In post 209, Ydrasse wrote:
i do think t3 should be in town for now tho because the way he's responded to people has felt distinctly not-wolf to me
like the just "but why is this scummy" repeat etc etc feels town to me
(when he originally asked something to this effect i wanted to be like why me fry me vote blah blah but i think town now)
why u putting in so much effort early
In post 486, Firebringer wrote:
i think ydrasse is way more actively involved in this game than i would say is usual for her.
but i lean town on her
this is my weak sauce surface level take right now
Pretty standard so far.
In post 800, Ydrasse wrote:
i would feel marginally better about a camel vote than an alisae one but confidence is at a low
In post 963, Shirou wrote:
Even if Patchwork is scum, and I did mention he gave "newbie scum" vibes, I've no idea how someone can be more confident on those 10 posts or so from early game or rather than people actually playing the game right now
Unless you think Titus posting is bad but I haven't read that unless I missed it
I think titus vote on imaginality was bad, I think titus vote on ydrasse was slightly less bad in grand scheme of it being titus but yeah.
If im scum here and imaginality is town, thats 100% who i would be voting just because easy pushing.
and titus immediately went for it.
also as others said patchwork felt like disengaged scum
This one actually isn't here for Ydrasse, I just don't want to lose this one.
here's a solve that i saw (admittedly i did iso her)
where is imaginality solving?
In post 1938, Ydrasse wrote:
i don’t think imaginality is solving which is why i’m voting them but i don’t think that’s the post you want to use to prove someone’s solving
In post 1938, Ydrasse wrote:
i don’t think imaginality is solving which is why i’m voting them but i don’t think that’s the post you want to use to prove someone’s solving
fine
then ill say titus is voicing her thoughts more publicly than imaginality
okay
fundamentally i disagree with you because i think that while it is nice as a wolf to be able to do as you want sometimes it’s not optional to do what you want in order to live
my interpretation of her play in a nutshell is that she took a slot that was suspected partially due to inactivity. she kicks it up immediately with her opening and doubles down on certain reads which she’s mostly kept throughout the entire game
i’m going to argue to you that she is wolf because she is inflexible; i think that if she was town, i think that she would have come to more conclusions post flip. she’d be more interested in actual content than, fmpov, fighting and fearmongering and trying to broker deals. i feel like the fights she’s getting in now with shirou are like… not actually things rooted to content in the game in a way that matters. they’re a way to push a wagon through under some very flimsy prospects.
i’d appreciate it if you’d reread even part of her iso considering this because it’s very hard for me to see what she’s done in this game as towny
I really, really like this entire back and forth. Ydrasse is pretty earnestly annoyed at Titus being off the table for camel, but it takes several posts for her to really lay it out. This really doesn't seem like she's just going through the motions.
The short takeaways:
1. Post 612 from camel seems pretty town-indicative for Ydrasse.
2. The extended back and forth with camel starting at post 1935 seems incredibly genuine, like Ydrasse is annoyed that camel is taking Titus off the table. I think this is very town-indicative.
3. There are a scattering of lesser interactions riddled throughout early/middlegame, but these seem in range for both parties.
