open 896: describing conker (game over)

[Meuh]

I'm kind of concerned about how universal the feeling the bad feelings on Ari have been, but I definitely don't adore her recent posting

[Meuh]

I'm kind of concerned about how universal the bad feelings on Ari have been, but I definitely don't adore her recent posting

[Elements]

Sorry I can't go into much detail, I'm in the middle of a panto rn

A member of the cast or there as audience? Which panto?

Snow White
Stage crew

[Elements]

VOTE: Daisy I wanna poke here

I'll poke Diasy with you
VOTE: Daisy

[Elements]

so you've been following him on voting for Jupiter, Afayeed, Meuh.

but you decided on his alignment as town off what he interacted with me in the last twenty four hours.

ok cool

I don't think dann is town, I don't think you and dann are red together

That makes no sense

What about it doesn't make sense?
I don't think Dann and Ari are exactly the red team

[Aristeia]

(3) Claiming that my reasoning for you not sorting meuh is better than my reasoning for you not being here and saying its post hoc is ?
You not being here to sort is the same thing as you not sorting Meuh. My point is that you didn't sort her.

Uhhh

and meuh's only real significant contribution to this game is 262 which feels like a scum post

so im happy with a page 15 solve of ari/meuh

like I don't see how town dannflor feels that he's one vote away from winning a game vs me/meuh and just ghosts?

like I guess maybe he was just busy but I also feel like maybe it was just awkward for him to re-enter thread and actually interact with meuh when she's ateing because he doesn't know how to close her without making himself look bad and he hopes Black will push her over the edge for him.

it feels like he doesnt want to be here and I can see why he'd not want to be here if black!town is pushing meuh!town for him and he can just kind of cheer from the sidelines.

maybe he just has a life and has better things to do on a friday night than geek out on mafia message boards in which case im sorry i am needy and stupid

like if he believes the meuh/ari solution, I would think he'd be here to press meuh and sort her

but he doesn't

ok sure let's say its because he was busy with his sister etc

now he's back and he's just kind of casually walking away from it with a comment about it after its happened and he moves onto the next step to respond to me.

I don't think anything he's done with respect to meuh is to sort her or place her.

The groundwork for Dann scum here was him not being there, it's something you made pretty clear? It was specific to the timeframe in which he was not there. Then later you added that Dann's pop in after the E-1 shenanigans still wasn't trying to sort me. Dann is saying that the second argument is better than the first, but that the first was the base of the argument? At least as far as I understand it.

ok so danns point is that him continuing not to sort you is a better reason for him being scum than the initial reason of him not being here and that i am adding it in as "post hoc"

like i came up with a reason for scumreading him and then added more stuff.

so when i accuse someone of being mafia and then they do more scummy stuff later that makes me more convinced they are mafia am i supposed to like not add it in as additional reasoning?

[Dannflor]

no im not saying that

[Dannflor]

i just find your sudden confidence that i was scum weird because of the original reasoning

[Meuh]

(3) Claiming that my reasoning for you not sorting meuh is better than my reasoning for you not being here and saying its post hoc is ?
You not being here to sort is the same thing as you not sorting Meuh. My point is that you didn't sort her.

Uhhh

and meuh's only real significant contribution to this game is 262 which feels like a scum post

so im happy with a page 15 solve of ari/meuh

like I don't see how town dannflor feels that he's one vote away from winning a game vs me/meuh and just ghosts?

like I guess maybe he was just busy but I also feel like maybe it was just awkward for him to re-enter thread and actually interact with meuh when she's ateing because he doesn't know how to close her without making himself look bad and he hopes Black will push her over the edge for him.

it feels like he doesnt want to be here and I can see why he'd not want to be here if black!town is pushing meuh!town for him and he can just kind of cheer from the sidelines.

maybe he just has a life and has better things to do on a friday night than geek out on mafia message boards in which case im sorry i am needy and stupid

like if he believes the meuh/ari solution, I would think he'd be here to press meuh and sort her

but he doesn't

ok sure let's say its because he was busy with his sister etc

now he's back and he's just kind of casually walking away from it with a comment about it after its happened and he moves onto the next step to respond to me.

I don't think anything he's done with respect to meuh is to sort her or place her.

The groundwork for Dann scum here was him not being there, it's something you made pretty clear? It was specific to the timeframe in which he was not there. Then later you added that Dann's pop in after the E-1 shenanigans still wasn't trying to sort me. Dann is saying that the second argument is better than the first, but that the first was the base of the argument? At least as far as I understand it.

ok so danns point is that him continuing not to sort you is a better reason for him being scum than the initial reason of him not being here and that i am adding it in as "post hoc"

like i came up with a reason for scumreading him and then added more stuff.

so when i accuse someone of being mafia and then they do more scummy stuff later that makes me more convinced they are mafia am i supposed to like not add it in as additional reasoning?

I think your reasoning for dann!scum because I didn’t sort meuh more is like better and more believable, but most of that stuff has been post hoc. Your original focal point for saying im 76% scum was that i was not around to engage with meuh being at e-1. To me that just seems like you wanted me to be scum and were looking for reasons as to why that was the case, not the basis for a scum read.

I thought he was saying that your original reasoning wasn't very good and not something he believed that you believed? and that your later reasoning is better, but doesn't undo this?

[Dannflor]

A) i think you are just the type of person who reflexively pushes people who push you as town. I think you know this and would try to replicate this as scum. But, i just don’t believe your scum read on me. It seems fabricated and very weak coming from you and I don’t expect you to have weak reads.

(1) I don't do this as town, I pretty much only push back if I need to sort the player or I think it's likely the person pushing me is mafia. I can pretty easily show games where I just ignore pushes on me as town.

(2) I didn't replicate anything as scum, you are trying to claim the impetus of me pushing you is you pushing me, which is simply not true. My initial reaction to you pushing me was to say I thought you would pretty much never push me with "ari is too nice so she's scum" because its just like kind of ? to say about someone, the implication being that when I'm town I'm mean or whatever. I only began pushing you after watching meuh get pushed and you basically not being here for all of it and being afk. This has nothing to do with you suspecting me and you trying to claim I'm trying to "replicate town meta" by pushing back is simply a verifiable lie and not what actually happened.

(3) Claiming that my reasoning for you not sorting meuh is better than my reasoning for you not being here and saying its post hoc is ?
You not being here to sort is the same thing as you not sorting Meuh. My point is that you didn't sort her.

I have to run but ill address the rest later

ok maybe im wrong about your meta

I am not trying to lie and you dont have to frame it as such

My experience with you has lead me to believe you are prone to OMGUS pushes but maybe im misremembering or my sample size is bad

[Dannflor]

i guess really the whole point is i dont believe your original push on me is all

Whether or not it’s because you were trying to replicate something in your town game was just a theory i had

[Dannflor]

Like I’m not saying it’s because of that

You asked why i thought you would want to push me as scum

I explained why i thought that

I’m not trying to misrepresent your meta or whatever

[Elements]

and like my reasoning for elements town right now is mostly a combo of vibes, me thinking you are more likely to be scum, and that i think he’d pick an easier small hood for him to thrive in

Check my pronouns pls

[Aristeia]

But, i just don’t believe your scum read on me. It seems fabricated and very weak coming from you and I don’t expect you to have weak reads.

I think the issue here is "weak"

I do not really have an issue fabricating read strength as mafia. I find it to be one of the easiest things to do because people tend to listen to loud voices with a lot of conviction.

I think you know I am perfectly capable of faking conviction as mafia so its so weird to me that you think me being purposefully restrained in regards to you is because I am mafia.

I felt somewhat embarrassed and guilty about misreading you as mafia the last time we were T/T and I appreciated how nice you were about it. I wouldn't really want to push you that hard anyway because I enjoy playing with you. Even if I were at 100% I think I would still be nice about it. I am not sure you are mafia, I am just guessing here.

you claim my read of you is bad/weak and thus I am mafia except its pretty much the same thing I said about you in the last game we played together, you were mafia then so I think you would remember. You could have said I am mafia replicating a previous read but instead you claim I am mafia because my reads are not this weak as town when you should know thats not true.

I guess i could be pushing you harder but I dont really want the responsiblity tbh. like if you are mafia and you lim me and then town ignores me and lets you win i wouldnt feel bad about it. id just feel vindicated that i was right where everyone else was wrong. and if you are town and i limmed you then i would feel bad because everyone else is right and I am wrong. so despite me thinking you are mafia maybe I just dont want to kill you. i am kind of silly sometimes.

[Aristeia]

Like I’m not saying it’s because of that

You asked why i thought you would want to push me as scum

I explained why i thought that

I’m not trying to misrepresent your meta or whatever

my main point wasnt even about the meta it was the fact that you are trying to misrepresent the chain of events

you're claiming you pushed me and i tried to reflexively slap you back for it when thats not even what happened.

[fireisredsir]

idk if im just reading dann's posts more charitably but it feels like ari is repeatedly arguing against points that dann isn't making

[Dannflor]

and like my reasoning for elements town right now is mostly a combo of vibes, me thinking you are more likely to be scum, and that i think he’d pick an easier small hood for him to thrive in

Check my pronouns pls

apologies

I believe she’d pick an easier hood to survive in

[OopsieDaisy]

Ok gamers I'm just stuck right now. Essentially I wanted to look at other people in the big hood who hadn't been posting much like Afrayed and Dann but I've come to the realisation I can't rly do that without solving Fire first. He's the one person left in the POE so in order to break past that I need to justify to my head why I can let myself push past that.

The issue is I don't know how to solve Fire because he's mostly just been pushing me in recent pages and I don't know how to separate my bias from just objectively analysing the push. It's completely broke my brain lol. Like I think the push is just a bit shit and uses one mid read of mine to justify continuing to sit on me for the entire game, but it doesn't look like anyone in the game actually agrees with me on this so is it just bias?


I've wanted to maybe look at associatives in the small hood but with El there's been little interaction (El was on the push onto Fire but El's been on p much every push this game lmao) and Ari's 575 feels like way too easy of a fold on what is a good point towards me being town so I think both of the sussy small hood gamers are likely to be with a scum!Fire in a scum!Fire world, tho based on gamestate I prefer my vote being on El right now.

I'll be honest Dann and Ari just seem like they're talking past each other based on a skim, but I've not had the energy to properly analyse any recent posting so take that with a grain of salt.

[Elements]

in a scum!Fire world, tho based on gamestate I prefer my vote being on El right now.

In a red!fire world you'd rather vote me than just win?

[OopsieDaisy]

in a scum!Fire world, tho based on gamestate I prefer my vote being on El right now.

In a red!fire world you'd rather vote me than just win?

I don't have confidence in my read, and with that in mind I would rather take a chance on the 50/50 between you & Ari I'm feeling because voting in the small hood and the flip being town is way less punishing than voting in the big hood and the flip being town.

[Black]

VOTE: Daisy

Lacking motivation but I'm ok poking here

[Elements]

I'm feeling because voting in the small hood and the flip being town is way less punishing than voting in the big hood and the flip being town.

Why do you say this?

[OopsieDaisy]

e-1 btw gamers

[Elements]

My read on the Ari/Ydra coin flip has been going up or Ari and down for Ydra for a couple of days. Dann's push is what made me think Ari was more likely town, her responses to it helped but it was mostly feeling "that just doesn't feel right" to the pushes
I then decided I'd do a fake scumslip in the hood to see if either of them commented on it, which they didn't but to be fair I feel like it was pretty obviously fake

[Elements]

Someone else have it