Mini 2321: Classic Commercials (Postgame)

[Bingle]

I really really struggle with seeing why a townWiz dies over a townCeleb unless Bingle exactly is scum. Celeb, in theory, being scum is another option, of course, but that also makes Bingle look bad on the way they defended.

What? If I'm scum and Cele is town I deliberately opened myself to the invest and then did not shoot the person who could investigate me, and also didn't shoot my protective read. Why the hell would I have shot Wiz here?

[Bingle]

Potential setups:

Neap
RC
1x BP
JK
6VT
Anything where the JK isn't town is just not viable

Neap
RC
1x BP

is not balanced v triple goon, let alone more power for scum.

Neap
JK

is actually pretty decent against triple goon, so to add a RC would be to add scum power. This being a simple, the scum power is likely something usable and not just a situational guilty for the RC, which means tracker/rc/strongman. This is backed up by the RC dying over the Neap, especially if there's a sman.

Neap/RC/BP/JK would require fairly substantial scum power, considering the likelihood of two clears on D1 and a successful NK prevention after that. RC has 3 people that are basically clears off of targeting, and potentially a guilty. It's completely reasonable if the scumteam has something like tracker/1x sman, but if they do why didn't any of them claim PR?

[Flavor Leaf]

I really really struggle with seeing why a townWiz dies over a townCeleb unless Bingle exactly is scum. Celeb, in theory, being scum is another option, of course, but that also makes Bingle look bad on the way they defended.

What? If I'm scum and Cele is town I deliberately opened myself to the invest and then did not shoot the person who could investigate me, and also didn't shoot my protective read. Why the hell would I have shot Wiz here?

Cele was targeting me, and I dont believe you claimed Vanilla?

And if Cele is scum partner, thats why you die.

or to open that up.

there's reasons, doesnt have to be true, but let's not try to act like there's no reasons.

[Flavor Leaf]

X-shot Juggernaut, Goon, Goon against JK, RC, Neap, 1-shot BP is balanced imo.

[Bingle]

Cele was targeting me, and I dont believe you claimed Vanilla?

I did. And then said that Cele should target me over you repeatedly.

[Flavor Leaf]

Cele was targeting me, and I dont believe you claimed Vanilla?

I did. And then said that Cele should target me over you repeatedly.

Eh, that’s fair then. I checked out back half

[Bingle]

Does anybody wanna claim vanilla

Sure. I'm vanilla, and potentially the best clear for the gamestate, because it has the double whammy of basically clearing you.

[Bingle]

X-shot Juggernaut, Goon, Goon against JK, RC, Neap, 1-shot BP is balanced imo.

Eh...

If it's anything more than 1x Juggernaut, the BP only really exists to be a rolecop clear, which is not a very 'simple' game design strat. If it's a 1 shot Juggernaut, there's still the very real chance that scum is basically fucked after N1 purely on night play, which is just kind of bad game design.

[Bingle]

I could see 1x Juggernaut 1x Juggernaut Goon, I think, but that begs the question of why didn't scum claim any power roles when they had to have known that claiming all vt would clear at least 2 players.

[Flavor Leaf]

What if 1-shot juggernaut goon goon, vs Rolecop, Neap, JK?

[Celebloki]

Yeah, I was considering somewhere in {FL, Bingle, Hu Tao} for my target. In a similar vein to my Kyouko target D1, I ultimately decided FL for semi-selfish reasons. I wanted to clear him in my own book so I could trust his analysis. In my limited experience so far with him and in general what I've heard of his reputation, I still wasn't certain he was actually town yesterday. I feel he risks and succeeds at crazy gambits.

Only I can fully trust my clear on him since my slot isn't confirmed, but at least going forward I know his posts are coming from town and not some other strategy.

[Flavor Leaf]

And a goon Roden would have gotten a Vanilla from Rolecop, but a Not VT from Neap.

[Bingle]

Yeah, I was considering somewhere in {FL, Bingle, Hu Tao} for my target. In a similar vein to my Kyouko target D1, I ultimately decided FL for semi-selfish reasons. I wanted to clear him in my own book so I could trust his analysis. In my limited experience so far with him and in general what I've heard of his reputation, I still wasn't certain he was actually town yesterday. I feel he risks and succeeds at crazy gambits.

FWIW, Flavor was an objectively bad choice, because it is entirely in town FL's wheelhouse to have been fakeclaiming VT as town PR there. It's why I bothered claiming VT in the first place.

[Bingle]

What if 1-shot juggernaut goon goon, vs Rolecop, Neap, JK?

I'd pass that. I'd be more likely to do limited tracker than limited juggernaut, because scum benefit from finding the prs early way more than killing through a protection, but a juggernaut is reasonable.

[Flavor Leaf]

I haven’t fake claimed as VT as a tPR in years

Plus, I’d have objected to being checked more

[Naerys]

Unless some town PR decided to stay hidden it feels like vanilla heaven.
I dont like Bingle play very much, i think i will feel comfy voting there.
Bingle+ cele or Bingle+Dunn feels likely a scum duo
The third scum idk
VOTE: Bingle

[Flavor Leaf]

Who didn’t like Dunn’s 50/50 comment?

Might be scum

[Flavor Leaf]

I am actually leaning the exact same way for Thomith to 33/33/33 Jailing Celebloki/Me/Jail for the kill stop.

I would say 50/50 with Celeb/Me, but think the WIFOM of getting blocked is fine too

[Flavor Leaf]

With Celebloki targeting a Hu Tao.

[Naerys]

Anyway seems like some people thinks i am scum. Shoot ur concerns at me, i am willing to discuss them during the day. Now is time to go to work (hurray, really)

[Thomith]

Whatever I'll just claim.

I'm Town Jailkeeper.

This was why I kept saying I believed Celebloki when he said he was roleblocked Night 1, because he was my night 1 target. I also said that I thought Bingles (at least I think it was Bingle) theory about a Jailkeeper made sense, because I knew he was right, because I was a Jailkeeper.
I wasnt confident I'd be able to protect correctly Night 1, so I instead tried to block the kill by targeting someone I suspected. I targeted off wagon, for the WIFOM reason that scum may think someone on the wagon might be targeted by a town roleblock, so sent someone off wagon to do the kill instead.

I Jailkept Flavor Night 2, because I did believe that the Rolecop/Neap were on opposing factions, so assumed both claims would live through the night, so instead Jailkept a Vanilla claim I thought was likely to be attacked.

Tl;dr:
I'm claiming Jailkeeper
Night 1 Target was Celebloki
Night 2 Target was FL

That was me. Maybe flip a coin to decide if you are jailkeeping Celebloki tonight.

Why Celeb specifically?

OK I think Celebloki has a possibility of being mafia with the role claims. I think Roden's claim if investigated by the town rolecop could be assumed to be town, given town has no vigilante. Celebloki would likely be a mafia power role who would know when their action fails. It's hard to say because 3-4 power roles seems correct and the roles we have still seems on the weak side if Celebloki is mafia. Maybe the rolecop is stronger than we thing depending on mafia roles.

I am alright with looking elsewhere today though, just something I am keeping in mind. I doubt the jailkeeper claim is a fake. Roden if mafia would be claiming to keep Celebloki in the suspect pool because with only 3 power roles claimed I would be ready to call Celebloki town. I think the role cop dying makes Celebloki look worse.

Yeah I was thinking similarly. If no other PR claimed i was probably going to locktown celeb, because JK and RC only seems weak for town.

I'm honestly still kind of struggling to see RC/Neap being together, but dont think I wanna aim there today.

[Naerys]

Whatever I'll just claim.

I'm Town Jailkeeper.

This was why I kept saying I believed Celebloki when he said he was roleblocked Night 1, because he was my night 1 target. I also said that I thought Bingles (at least I think it was Bingle) theory about a Jailkeeper made sense, because I knew he was right, because I was a Jailkeeper.
I wasnt confident I'd be able to protect correctly Night 1, so I instead tried to block the kill by targeting someone I suspected. I targeted off wagon, for the WIFOM reason that scum may think someone on the wagon might be targeted by a town roleblock, so sent someone off wagon to do the kill instead.

I Jailkept Flavor Night 2, because I did believe that the Rolecop/Neap were on opposing factions, so assumed both claims would live through the night, so instead Jailkept a Vanilla claim I thought was likely to be attacked.

Tl;dr:
I'm claiming Jailkeeper
Night 1 Target was Celebloki
Night 2 Target was FL

That was me. Maybe flip a coin to decide if you are jailkeeping Celebloki tonight.

Did u mean this post, flavor? I do dislike it.

[Naerys]

Pleasantly surprised Dunn didn’t die after telegraphing so hard, fwiw.

Bingle+ dunn could be buddies mhmm

[Hu Tao]

I thought roden was the one who softed the innocent on me. I'll need to reasses a few things

[Thomith]

I thought roden was the one who softed the innocent on me. I'll need to reasses a few things

Can I ask why you thought that?