Mini Normal 2324: Fake Fantasy Facts | Postgame

[Mucho Man Randy Passion]

The TOP ROPE!

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: upward

[Mucho Man Randy Passion]

Enchant was also on Gamma.

As Laplacian RISES to DOMINANT town status through the COOPERATION of THE MUC-HU TAO-WNCORE RANDY PASSION, The Prince of tiny mafia sees 3 of Laplacians scumreads:

Uppercutwards
Enchant
DeltaWave

Laplacian votes DeltaWave - misguided, but JUSTIFIED in his MIND. And the Prince of tiny mafia shades one of the other scumreads of DOMINANT town Laplacian - drawing attention away from his tiny mafia cohort Uppercutwards.

The top rope ruins the continuity of my posts.

GUESS WHO else was on Gamma? tiny mafia Uppercutwards.

[DragonEater70]

Votecount 2.04

Day 2 will end in (expired on 2024-01-22 03:32:58).
Combined mod ISO.

Votecount

Upwards (3):

Gypyx, Mucho Man Randy Passion, Hu Tao

Prince of Paterson (1):

DeltaWave

Mucho Man Randy Passion (1):

Enchant

Enchant (1):

Laplacian

Not Voting (4):

Upwards, Naerys, lucca261, Prince of Paterson

With 10 alive, it takes 6 votes to throw someone to the lions.

Flavor

Elf Fact #4:

While Sun Elves are awake during the day and worship the sun, and Moon Eleves are awake during the night and worship the moon, Star Elves are constantly half-awake and are pretty crazy. They claim there are other suns and other planets outside of the solar system!

[Prince of Paterson]

Point number 1 is complete NONSENSE. The way you describe the posts you linked I would expect to find that Uppercutwards was fighting against the Gamma lim given the tone of FRUSTRATION you say CLEARLY exists. He does not look frustrated by the situation AT ALL. He is in fact, feeling quite JUSTIFIED in throwing Gamma from the ring. He emphasizes that HE will ACCEPT RESPONSIBILITY and he shades Hu Tao and Delta Wave alike, casting doubt upon which of them would be responsible if Gamma were E-1ed. If he truly cared, he would have FOUGHT to get to the bottom of this. INSTEAD, he spends all of the posts you linked having a meaningless back-and-forth with my brother THE CLAPPENING, wherein he mainly discusses THEORY and occasionally mentions Gamma. You missed the mark by SO FAR in your tiny mafia "analysis", the only conclusion can be you are protecting your tiny mafia friend Uppercutwards.

This response doesn't have anything to do with the point I was making.

[Upwards]

The way that Upwards is forming his reads and finding things to talk about reads far more like new town player struggling to find his footing in the game than new scum player trying to blend in or manufacture stances.

Some examples that stand out to me:
1) The focus on the situation surrounding Gamma nearing E-1 (Delta said she'd unvote if E-1, and Hu Tao said they'd hammer if E-1). He made several posts about this (462, 464, 466, 484, 532, 539, and there's a clear tone of frustration that nobody else finds this as compelling as he does. I don't think that tends to come from mafia. He wants people to listen to him because he thinks he's found something interesting.

2) Similarly, a bit earlier, his engagement with Gamma in 306, 333, and 356. Again, his point is a little off the wall, bringing up how it doesn't make sense to him that Gamma could see it beneficial to die early as scum. And again, there's some frustration at not having his point understood.

Together, these aren't how scum, particularly new scum, approach the game. The points are proactively made, show original and unique thought, and there's a distinct lack of self-consciousness: when faced with others disagreeing with or not understanding his point, he doubles down to try to make it understood, because it's something that he genuinely feels and is interested in, and he's frustrated that it isn't gaining traction. New scum are much more likely to fold on a point or follow the lead of others.

The best point for Upwards being scum is that Margot's read on him in 373 is awkwardly defensive while still having him at the bottom of her null reads. I agree that is a read that sounds partnered.

I don't think that lucca's point about Upwards' vote being the one to turn Gamma into a real counterwagon to Margot is very meaningful. It was page 12, there was always going to be another wagon that happened at some point. Being the 3rd vote on Gamma doesn't make him significantly more likely to be scum. Nor does lack of talking about Margot. Scum are aware that they partner is being run up and are self-conscious about how they appear in relation to it. If you want a better example of what that may look like, read Claptastik's ISO.

Point number 1 is complete NONSENSE. The way you describe the posts you linked I would expect to find that Uppercutwards was fighting against the Gamma lim given the tone of FRUSTRATION you say CLEARLY exists. He does not look frustrated by the situation AT ALL. He is in fact, feeling quite JUSTIFIED in throwing Gamma from the ring. He emphasizes that HE will ACCEPT RESPONSIBILITY and he shades Hu Tao and Delta Wave alike, casting doubt upon which of them would be responsible if Gamma were E-1ed. If he truly cared, he would have FOUGHT to get to the bottom of this.
VOTE: Uppercutwards

This looks to me like it’s made in really bad faith, Mucho Man. I brought up my point about Delta and Hu Tao again and again, but it got ignored almost completely. And why the hell should I fight against the Gamma lim when I was suspecting her at that time?

[lucca261]

a little too tired to talk about this right now, so I'll just say that I read @986 and my first thought is:

@Upwards, somehow in my 10 re-reads of late D1 I've missed that @580 was a question for me. Didn't intentionally ignore you, sorry. Do you still want an answer?

[lucca261]

about the E-1 stuff

[Upwards]

a little too tired to talk about this right now, so I'll just say that I read @986 and my first thought is:

@Upwards, somehow in my 10 re-reads of late D1 I've missed that @580 was a question for me. Didn't intentionally ignore you, sorry. Do you still want an answer?

It’s interesting you’d say that, because you quoted my 580 in your 591 and answered… half of it. The half nothing to do with the E-1, to be exact.

In fact I even thought about bringing this up as prime example in my 1005 reply to Mucho Man. Just decided not to do that in order to not give her ( an excuse to get, perhaps ) the wrong impression that I’m trying to distract from myself here.

I believe there would be merit in uncovering what Delta and Hu Tao were trying to do back then, so yes, better late than never, I’d appreciate your thoughts Lucca.

[Naerys]

I think we should find the scum that was on gamma. So I think we vote delta or upward

+1

[Naerys]

I dont mind sorting out Alianna slot though

[Naerys]

VOTE: Upwards
meanwhile putting pressure on this slot

[Upwards]

VOTE: Upwards
meanwhile putting pressure on this slot

Pressure, yes…

May I ask what this pressure is supposed to amount to? I’m happy to respond to any actual questions or arguments about what I may or may not have done d1 ( and d2, for that matter ). That’s the case for however many votes there are on me though. You can all unvote me right now or put me at E-1 and nothing changes in that regard as far as I’m concerned.

The only issue I have with this wagon right now is that there’s nothing new to talk about.

[Naerys]

Votecount 1.03

Day 1 will end in (expired on 2024-01-14 01:13:22).

Votecount

MargotRosa (5):

Claptastik, Gypyx, Gamma Emerald, Laplacian, FuDuzn

Upwards (2):

lucca261, Hu Tao

Gamma Emerald (1):

Alianna

Alianna (1):

Naerys

Not Voting (4):

Upwards, Zebedee, DeltaWave, MargotRosa

With 13 alive, it takes 7 votes to send someone on the fast route to the afterlife.

flavor

Dragon Fact #4:

While often depicted as cruel and beastly monsters, dragons are actually highly intelligent, and have a better grasp on science than most humans. In fact, dragons invented modern computers!

Upwards why didnt u vote Margot here? What was your read on her through D1?

[DeltaWave]

I'm down for an Upwards elim today. I plan on reading thru the thread when I'm done with my errands today.

[Upwards]

Votecount 1.03

Day 1 will end in (expired on 2024-01-14 01:13:22).

Votecount

MargotRosa (5):

Claptastik, Gypyx, Gamma Emerald, Laplacian, FuDuzn

Upwards (2):

lucca261, Hu Tao

Gamma Emerald (1):

Alianna

Alianna (1):

Naerys

Not Voting (4):

Upwards, Zebedee, DeltaWave, MargotRosa

With 13 alive, it takes 7 votes to send someone on the fast route to the afterlife.

flavor

Dragon Fact #4:

While often depicted as cruel and beastly monsters, dragons are actually highly intelligent, and have a better grasp on science than most humans. In fact, dragons invented modern computers!

Upwards why didnt u vote Margot here? What was your read on her through D1?

I had no read on her, otherwise I would have shared it. I did so in 121 and then 273 for some players that I actually was forming an opinion on at that point, but you’ll notice it’s far from the full read list more experienced players were able to post.

That’s also the reason why I didn’t vote her, plain and simple.

In hindsight I can say that her behavior shortly before the Gamma elimination was strange, starting a huge discussion with Delta pretending to try to save Gamma, a player she knew was her opponent, while interacting comparably little with Hu Tao who I saw as the other piece of the puzzle in that situation. As I said in my 828, that looks like an potential avenue to explore for me and I would be interested in hearing an opinion from Delta and Hu Tao on it.

Back then though, I didn’t think any of that.

[Gypyx]

tired me speaking but while his recent talking doesn't really light off my scum alarms like day1 did, still think upward's a bit weird


our exchange in 938 gives me small vibes of cognitive dissonance? Like, it's the thing where it's harder for scum to manage irony / sarcasm and all that stuff, and here, upwards starts by complaining about fluffposting, which yeah, i have no big problem about, that's just ToS culture here, but his attempt at mirrorring the joking style reads a bit shallow and forced?

the annoyance around there being nothing to talk about might also come a bit from an informed perspective? Like, that's maybe a me thing but as a townie there's thousands of things i could ask about at anytime, irrelevant yes but when you know the truth it's hard to have theories that are so out there come to your mind

Otherwise enchant's vote on mucho reads as really weird to me, like, i don't think they truly belive in the push / their scumread?

[DeltaWave]

In hindsight I can say that her behavior shortly before the Gamma elimination was strange, starting a huge discussion with Delta pretending to try to save Gamma, a player she knew was her opponent, while interacting comparably little with Hu Tao who I saw as the other piece of the puzzle in that situation. As I said in my 828, that looks like an potential avenue to explore for me and I would be interested in hearing an opinion from Delta and Hu Tao on it.

Back then though, I didn’t think any of that.

It's clear from the end-of-day events on D1 that Margot knew Gamma was going to flip town and was trying to collect townpoints by vehemently opposing a mis-elim. The fact is (and truly no offense to Gamma) is that Gamma did a bunch of scummy things despite being town and got eliminated for it. But Margot's apparent certainty about Gamma's flip sounded very much like she was trying to go into D2 looking spotless by opposing the wagon.

That being said, the timing of your vote really did look like it was trying to distract from the Margot wagon.

I am still way behind since I just got home but my limpool right now is pretty much just Upwards and PoP. I do want to take a look at Enchant because I also felt that Enchant's vote against Mucho was weird. I'm not sure if Enchant is running a gimmick or what but most of Enchant's posts (as I recall them) were pretty devoid of anything useful. Not sure if it counts as "IIOA" but it wasn't really participation. I am going to catch up sometime tonight.

[Gypyx]

i mean, i think we're gonna have to read enchant through their 10 words style posting and i'm fine with that, let people do their thing i guess

[DeltaWave]

I am not a fan of unreadability, even if it's a gimmick or something.

[Prince of Paterson]

I don't think Enchant is always unreadable. Their current behavior is more likely to be scum.

[DeltaWave]

Have you played with Enchant before?

[Laplacian]

Scumreads on Enchant and Delta seem like stretches to me - could you explain what you mean by Delta "misreading" you and Luchador?

Check out 264
With Lucca, she misreads the now-infamous 91, missing that Upward actually read the game, not just heard of it. This is the entire basis on the Lucca vote

For the misread on me, it's less definitive, and maybe this is just me being a massive nerd, but I'll always take an opening to talk about my nerdy interests. If I joke about neuroscience giving grad school flashbacks, that implies that I've studied it and clearly liked it enough to do research. I've already brought up game design twice in this thread because I love it, and if someone else brings it up I'm'a immediately chat with them about it. Or asks what a laplacian is I'll drop a math ramble. I tried to give an opening for a nerdy discussion, and it weirdly got parsed as "he didn't like neuroscience". To me, that's a very strange interpretation of my words.

If there was just one misread, sure, whatever. But when a read list has 2 misreads, that speaks to skimming for justifications over having opinions. I retract my point about her postcount, but 264 still radiates bad vibes.

[Laplacian]

Laplacian, did you make any of your reads out of FEAR of being HAMMERED DOWN for standing out? If so, which ones? How would they be different if you were not worried about The People's Elbow?

Hmmm. I think I was maybe a little too lenient on Gypyx because everyone else seems to TR them. Not hard scum, but a solid orange on my list. Thanks for encouraging some PASSIONATE INTROSPECTION!

PoP is moving townier as they post more too. I like 1020 and point #2 of 986.

[Laplacian]

I don't think Enchant is always unreadable. Their current behavior is more likely to be scum.

Have you played with Enchant before?

Reading Enchant's iso in some other games, the terseness and tiny posts seems normal. The

bold

and writing style seems new