Mini Normal 2325 | Game Over

[Luca Blight]

The answer is no.

I don't really have anything else to add at this point - still fully intend on condemning Dann. Just waiting for some of the quieter slots to get involved so I might be able to get a read on them one way or another.

Why am I know getting the impression that you will never actually vote Dann?

This reeks of you waiting for someone else to be just a bit 'scummier' in your eyes, and then voting them over Dann

And why do you think I want to do that?

I've said for some time now that I will vote no-one but the Bugs slot today. I just don't want the day to end before I have at least some inkling about every player in the game. I'll vote when I feel like I've seen enough.

Can I hold you to this?

Like, basically a scum claim if you don't vote Dann before the end of the day?

Well, you can perceive it that way if you wish. I assure you that I will vote Dann as I've already made my mind up about that slot.

The only situation in which I wouldn't vote Dann is if there is a quickhammer that ends the day early before I get the chance.

So you are giving yourself an out is what you are saying.

No - I'm acknowledging a possible reality - that quickhammers sometimes occur in Mafia. I hope this won't be the case as I'm not yet ready to end the day, hence my reluctance to vote despite the conviction I have.

You seem to suspect me for this - what kind of angle are you looking at this from? I'm curious.

Don't play dumb.

I called you out initially for not wanting to vote Bug, and now you don't want to vote Dann.

Why would you not want to vote someone who you think is definitely scum? Quickhammer or not, wouldn't scum being limmed a best cased scenario for D1??

I'm asking you, what do you think my motivation for this is as scum? You think I could be partners with Dann, or is there another angle here?

I do want to eliminate Dann as I've repeatedly reaffirmed. The reason I haven't voted is because I'm waiting for certain players to get into the game, as I've also explained. When I vote it means I'm ready for the day to be over - I like my votes to have a sense of gravity to them.

I want you to vote your top scum read.

Ya know, as town should.

What has more gravity then that?

I don't know, perhaps repeatedly stating unequivocally that I will not vote anyone other than my main scumread today? Votes in the earlier stages of the day mean very little - look at Black's vote on Dann, for example - that didn't last long, did it?

I get you want me to vote my scumread. What I don't get is what you think my motivation here is as scum.

[Doctor Drew]

Why am I know getting the impression that you will never actually vote Dann?

This reeks of you waiting for someone else to be just a bit 'scummier' in your eyes, and then voting them over Dann

And why do you think I want to do that?

I've said for some time now that I will vote no-one but the Bugs slot today. I just don't want the day to end before I have at least some inkling about every player in the game. I'll vote when I feel like I've seen enough.

Can I hold you to this?

Like, basically a scum claim if you don't vote Dann before the end of the day?

Well, you can perceive it that way if you wish. I assure you that I will vote Dann as I've already made my mind up about that slot.

The only situation in which I wouldn't vote Dann is if there is a quickhammer that ends the day early before I get the chance.

So you are giving yourself an out is what you are saying.

No - I'm acknowledging a possible reality - that quickhammers sometimes occur in Mafia. I hope this won't be the case as I'm not yet ready to end the day, hence my reluctance to vote despite the conviction I have.

You seem to suspect me for this - what kind of angle are you looking at this from? I'm curious.

Don't play dumb.

I called you out initially for not wanting to vote Bug, and now you don't want to vote Dann.

Why would you not want to vote someone who you think is definitely scum? Quickhammer or not, wouldn't scum being limmed a best cased scenario for D1??

I'm asking you, what do you think my motivation for this is as scum? You think I could be partners with Dann, or is there another angle here?

I do want to eliminate Dann as I've repeatedly reaffirmed. The reason I haven't voted is because I'm waiting for certain players to get into the game, as I've also explained. When I vote it means I'm ready for the day to be over - I like my votes to have a sense of gravity to them.

I want you to vote your top scum read.

Ya know, as town should.

What has more gravity then that?

I don't know, perhaps repeatedly stating unequivocally that I will not vote anyone other than my main scumread today? Votes in the earlier stages of the day mean very little - look at Black's vote on Dann, for example - that didn't last long, did it?

I get you want me to vote my scumread. What I don't get is what you think my motivation here is as scum.

People vote early and often on D1, especially early.....and will switch it up. That is the struggle of D1

People don't show the confidence that you have shown about Bug/Dann......and not back it up with a vote.

You can say you will vote dann as much as you want, but the fact that you will not vote that slot is probably the most telling thing about this game.

Dann is not in danger of being quick hammered

So again, why are you scared of voting your top scum read?

[Luca Blight]

227 feels LAMIST to me and I don't think it makes sense for Jacob to get off the bug wagon if he thinks Luca's read is accurate. Feels more like he wants to give Dannflor a chance to save himself

I want to know how Black went from suspecting Dann and Jacob of being partners in crime to then voting Project along with Dann?

This whole progressions reads incredibly fake to me. The last sentence is quite ironic also.

[Luca Blight]

And why do you think I want to do that?

I've said for some time now that I will vote no-one but the Bugs slot today. I just don't want the day to end before I have at least some inkling about every player in the game. I'll vote when I feel like I've seen enough.

Can I hold you to this?

Like, basically a scum claim if you don't vote Dann before the end of the day?

Well, you can perceive it that way if you wish. I assure you that I will vote Dann as I've already made my mind up about that slot.

The only situation in which I wouldn't vote Dann is if there is a quickhammer that ends the day early before I get the chance.

So you are giving yourself an out is what you are saying.

No - I'm acknowledging a possible reality - that quickhammers sometimes occur in Mafia. I hope this won't be the case as I'm not yet ready to end the day, hence my reluctance to vote despite the conviction I have.

You seem to suspect me for this - what kind of angle are you looking at this from? I'm curious.

Don't play dumb.

I called you out initially for not wanting to vote Bug, and now you don't want to vote Dann.

Why would you not want to vote someone who you think is definitely scum? Quickhammer or not, wouldn't scum being limmed a best cased scenario for D1??

I'm asking you, what do you think my motivation for this is as scum? You think I could be partners with Dann, or is there another angle here?

I do want to eliminate Dann as I've repeatedly reaffirmed. The reason I haven't voted is because I'm waiting for certain players to get into the game, as I've also explained. When I vote it means I'm ready for the day to be over - I like my votes to have a sense of gravity to them.

I want you to vote your top scum read.

Ya know, as town should.

What has more gravity then that?

I don't know, perhaps repeatedly stating unequivocally that I will not vote anyone other than my main scumread today? Votes in the earlier stages of the day mean very little - look at Black's vote on Dann, for example - that didn't last long, did it?

I get you want me to vote my scumread. What I don't get is what you think my motivation here is as scum.

People vote early and often on D1, especially early.....and will switch it up. That is the struggle of D1

People don't show the confidence that you have shown about Bug/Dann......and not back it up with a vote.

You can say you will vote dann as much as you want, but the fact that you will not vote that slot is probably the most telling thing about this game.

Dann is not in danger of being quick hammered

So again, why are you scared of voting your top scum read?

I feel like we're going around in circles here. I've explained why and if you can't accept it, and choose to scumread me for it, then that is your gift.

But as a last comment on the matter - I would argue that my assurance of voting the Dann slot and no-one else today is worth a lot more than a mere early vote that can be changed at any time.

[Doctor Drew]

227 feels LAMIST to me and I don't think it makes sense for Jacob to get off the bug wagon if he thinks Luca's read is accurate. Feels more like he wants to give Dannflor a chance to save himself

I want to know how Black went from suspecting Dann and Jacob of being partners in crime to then voting Project along with Dann?

This whole progressions reads incredibly fake to me. The last sentence is quite ironic also.

So you might vote Black over Dann?

[Luca Blight]

227 feels LAMIST to me and I don't think it makes sense for Jacob to get off the bug wagon if he thinks Luca's read is accurate. Feels more like he wants to give Dannflor a chance to save himself

I want to know how Black went from suspecting Dann and Jacob of being partners in crime to then voting Project along with Dann?

This whole progressions reads incredibly fake to me. The last sentence is quite ironic also.

So you might vote Black over Dann?

No. The Dann flip will go a long way to helping me sort Black.

[Doctor Drew]

227 feels LAMIST to me and I don't think it makes sense for Jacob to get off the bug wagon if he thinks Luca's read is accurate. Feels more like he wants to give Dannflor a chance to save himself

I want to know how Black went from suspecting Dann and Jacob of being partners in crime to then voting Project along with Dann?

This whole progressions reads incredibly fake to me. The last sentence is quite ironic also.

So you might vote Black over Dann?

No. The Dann flip will go a long way to helping me sort Black.

Ok then, we are in agreement.

Vote Dann

[Thomith]

Votecount 1.8

Votecount 1.8

Dannflor (3):

Hu Tao, Jacob24, Doctor Drew

ketchup777 (2):

DeltaWave, OutWorldER

ProjEctRy (2):

Black, Dannflor

Doctor Drew (1):

ketchup777

Hu Tao (1):

iamveryhappy

Not Voting (4):

Gypyx, Luca Blight, ProjEctRy, Psyche

With 13 Alive, it takes 7 to secure an execution.

Day One ends in (expired on 2024-02-03 02:13:32)

Mod Notes

None

[Dannflor]

I’m town

[ketchup777]

Ketchup. If not Dann, who are you reading?

If you like I can give my current reads on every player

I would like this yes

Hu Tao: seems friendly and said at some point I'm the only player they're confident is town, so they must be doing something right! But could be a ploy to gain my trust, if it is one it's working tho! However my main point against is the vote on Bugs felt very jump-on-the-wagony, not giving reasons for it until pressed. A little sus perhaps.
Gypyx nee. ssbm_Kyouko: no reads.
ProjEctRy: seems suspicious, has done nothing besides a small bit of filler and go for me.
Dannflor nee. bugspray: due to bugs allowing replacement and my initial gut I'm like 66% for town, but Luca is so damn confident so there's a chance he's mafia. I am kind of scared by how professional Dannflor already seems, but don't want to vote out a townie just because they seem smart. Indeed having a smart person is good for voting out the mafia you'd think (:
Luca Blight: Very confident and accusing a lot of people. I agree with the general sentiment that this seems to be pretty townie. If awesome mafia bluff, hopefully Luca slips up later on.
Jacob24: I've backtracked a little bit from my initial guess turned mafia read, and now am in more neutral territory slightly leaning towards town. Anyone who said they think I'm town at some point will get some credit, and Jacob's one of those.
iamveryhappy: nightmare. posts are funny but I am struggling to read into them. One of the games I looked over there was a player like this who I also couldn't fathom out when I was making my guesses going along.
ketchup777: yo this guy's the most townie townie I ever have seen. he needs to start thinking before he clicks submit so people stop thinking he's mafia tho
Psyche: bro said I'm adorable +1000000 jkjk haven't seen much town-looking stuff from Psyche yet. Mostly filler.
DeltaWave: A bold meme opening where the punchline was about killing people was bound to grab attention. Does a mafia want that attention? I think not. You should probably not vote me if you're trying to get a mafia out tho (;
Black: Friendly. Thinks I'm town. There's daggers in [wo]men's smiles they say and all that though so I'll keep an eye out but behind Luca I think Black's second most likely town for me atm
Doctor Drew: Came in super early, then did a massive dip for filler and has only just now made a reappearance. Something about the tone feels off, I agree with Dannflor on that.
OutWorldER: That sussy werewolf gif got me thinking if OutWorldEr could be mafia, and yes, I think they well could be. At the risk of sounding repetitive, anyone trying to get people to vote me will naturally look sus to me. Not fully confident. OutWorldEr was part of the four(five) on the Bugswagon, and while Dann said he thinks there's a maximum of one mafia on that wagon, I would kind of expect between 1 and 2, likely 1, but probably not 0. So potentially one/both of OutWorldEr/Hu Tao

TLDR:

Super sus: ProjectRy, Doctor Drew
Slightly sus: Psyche, OutWorldEr, Hu Tao
Slightly townie: Dannflor, Jacob24, DeltaWave
Very townie: Black, Luca Blight, me
no idea: Gypyx, iavh

there you go lots of juicy content for ya.

You trust Luca but not his read on Dann/Bugs?

Just because he’s confident doesn’t mean he’s right. I’m aware that if I voted for Dann while he was still on 5 votes, someone would have probably voted him off. I didn’t think I was ready for that yet. Maybe the combination of town reading me and posting a lot was trying to appeal to me to avoid being voted off, but I’m not sure. Luca raised a good point later on that the flip might be informative tho. I’m ok for now tho.
Meanwhile, Drew’s argument against Luca over the last two pages makes no sense. Maybe he is bussing his partner Dann and trying to seem good for it later? He himself acknowledged that ‘Dan is is in no danger of being quickhammered'- ok, so why does it matter so much that you get Luca to vote for him?

[ketchup777]

I’m town

oh that’s cool. I’m town too bestie

[Dannflor]

ketchup must be town

someone would not lie to me on the internet

[Dannflor]

Look Luca I’m gonna be kind and spare a few words to you instead of saying fuck you and turbolimming you because I think there’s a decent chance you are town this game

There are two total players that I have *ever* played with that I would actually genuinely trust if they said they had a lock scum read and were never going to vote anyone else. Neither of those players are in this game.

The thing is, those players are good enough to know when their reads are actually approaching 100%, which is actually an incredibly rare thing in mafia. Most players are not self aware enough to even have a rough idea of how accurate any of their individual reads are. The exceptional players I’m talking about? There’s maybe one in fifty games that they will actually get a read like the one you think you have on bugspray.

All of this is to say, your play is bad. Your reads are not as good as you think they are.

I believe you have a history with bugspray. I even believe you might have an above average read rate on them. But I doubt it is truly better than 60% or 70%. Which are good chances but nowhere near high enough to lock yourself into a tunnel that would be highly destructive to town if you’re wrong.

And you are wrong. Sorry, but the way you are using meta isn’t actually as accurate as you think. You can’t just compare the type of content people produce as different alignments. I mean, you can. But it’s lazy and isn’t actually an accurate measure. People have town gamss where they can’t or won’t produce their usual towny content. People have scum games where they suddenly become inspired to post walls they never have before. In bugspray’s case? They were clearly never into the game. Are they more likely to not get into a game as scum? Maybe idk. But i think it’s clear by their last posts that they were feeling burnt out on the game of mafia in general.

all of this is really to say, you are wrong and i hope you can learn to better assess that possibility rather than blaming me or bugspray after this game is over

[Dannflor]

I guess I kinda like Drew wanting to back Luca into a corner

[Luca Blight]

I guess I kinda like Drew wanting to back Luca into a corner

it was unnecessary - I had made the statement earlier of my own accord that i won't be voting anyone but the Bugs slot this game.

As for your 437, I appreciate the effort, but you're wasting your time trying to convince me when I've seen enough from your slot already to know its alignment. The fact that you don't trust my ability to read players correctly is irrelevant when yours is the slot I'm pushing. My conviction regarding Bugs isn't only based on meta - I think they were scummy independently in this game, but the meta is what makes me 100% sure as I've followed this exact pattern at least twice before, which I've documented in this thread. Even their reaction (or lack thereof) to my push is exactly the same as the games I've caught them as scum previously. This is why I was able to predict their lack of content and disengagement long before their replace-out. But forget meta - that's for me, and others can trust me on it or not. There has been enough to eliminate your slot from what has transpired in this game, independent from anything else.

I like your bit of emotional manipulation at the end, by the way. Don't worry, I won't be blaming anyone if I end up with egg on my face - I'll take full responsibility. For what it's worth, I think you've done a good job as the replacement and perhaps you could even turn the tide, but my vote (when I eventually decide to vote) is never leaving you.

[Luca Blight]

VOTE: ketchup

i think this is a better vote by far right now

OutWorld, you've seen me catch Bugs first-hand in such a manner in the game I linked earlier, and you've been suspicious of that slot as well since the beginning of the game. Let's eliminate Dann today and ketchup's alignment will become clearer as a result.

[Black]

227 feels LAMIST to me and I don't think it makes sense for Jacob to get off the bug wagon if he thinks Luca's read is accurate. Feels more like he wants to give Dannflor a chance to save himself

I want to know how Black went from suspecting Dann and Jacob of being partners in crime to then voting Project along with Dann?

This whole progressions reads incredibly fake to me. The last sentence is quite ironic also.

I mulled Dann's 321 over for awhile and decided I want to let him get his footing in the game. My reads are pretty fluid so you should probably get used to that

[Luca Blight]

227 feels LAMIST to me and I don't think it makes sense for Jacob to get off the bug wagon if he thinks Luca's read is accurate. Feels more like he wants to give Dannflor a chance to save himself

I want to know how Black went from suspecting Dann and Jacob of being partners in crime to then voting Project along with Dann?

This whole progressions reads incredibly fake to me. The last sentence is quite ironic also.

I mulled Dann's 321 over for awhile and decided I want to let him get his footing in the game. My reads are pretty fluid so you should probably get used to that

So does that mean you still scumread Dann and Jacob? I'm a little confused.

[Luca Blight]

it kind of seems like you want to hurry up and kill me before i become a threat, black

I think you're scum and I don't want you weaseling your way out of being faded like I know you are completely capable of doing as scum

What happened to this mindset you displayed not so long ago?

[Black]

227 feels LAMIST to me and I don't think it makes sense for Jacob to get off the bug wagon if he thinks Luca's read is accurate. Feels more like he wants to give Dannflor a chance to save himself

I want to know how Black went from suspecting Dann and Jacob of being partners in crime to then voting Project along with Dann?

This whole progressions reads incredibly fake to me. The last sentence is quite ironic also.

I mulled Dann's 321 over for awhile and decided I want to let him get his footing in the game. My reads are pretty fluid so you should probably get used to that

So does that mean you still scumread Dann and Jacob? I'm a little confused.

I still think they could be scum. I feel a little better about Jacob over the last few pages

it kind of seems like you want to hurry up and kill me before i become a threat, black

I think you're scum and I don't want you weaseling your way out of being faded like I know you are completely capable of doing as scum

What happened to this mindset you displayed not so long ago?

The worry is still there. The possibility of Dann being scum manipulating his way to the endgame is always something I consider. However I've been wrong about Dann before and if he is town then I think he's very valuable to keep around. If he's scum then he at least has to give reads and potentially spew his teammates

[Black]

Luca what are your thoughts on Project?

[Luca Blight]

Luca what are your thoughts on Project?

I don't have any real thoughts on them yet. i'll check their ISO again just to see if anything pops up.

In the meantime, could you explain your change of heart regarding Jacob recently?

[Luca Blight]

I feel like Project's points against Ketchup have been quite fair and well-considered. I agreed with a few of his observations. But other than that I really can't give a confident read. Probably a slight-town lean, but I'm conscious of the fact he is playing a safe kind of game so far.

[Hu Tao]

Maybe I'm delaying the inevitable, but if Dann flips town then at least I know I wasn't part of it.

scum post

Disagree. Feels like honest town

[Hu Tao]

Maybe I'm delaying the inevitable, but if Dann flips town then at least I know I wasn't part of it.

I don't think scum ever says this out loud

Agreed bestie