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[Oatsmaster]

I don't understand why you guys think he will self resolve

if he's scum he just kills the people who scum read him and wins

If he’s alive d4 I’m yeeting him and so should everyone else.

[Dannflor]

I'm not scum reading DP because people said he's good at town or because I'm jealous oh my lord

I genuinely think he is scummy and has a high chance of flipping scum

[Dannflor]

I understand this is an uphill battle

I understand none of his friends are going to want to kill DP D1

Is this not a waste of time then?

I am hoping not! or at the very least it might show enough of his colors that we won't lose to him

[Dannflor]

I don't understand why you guys think he will self resolve

if he's scum he just kills the people who scum read him and wins

If he’s alive d4 I’m yeeting him and so should everyone else.

this feels extremely naive

[Oatsmaster]

I'm not scum reading DP because people said he's good at town or because I'm jealous oh my lord

I genuinely think he is scummy and has a high chance of flipping scum

Ngl I’m not really taking your reads seriously because of how little conviction there is behind them

[Dannflor]

I am convicted

[Roden]

. A quick disclaimer, remember also that there's a human behind this account, and I'm looking primarily at oats with this one. Just because you suspect someone is scum, that doesn't give you permission to be rude and hostile to them. Oats, you pull that shit with me where you insult my intelligence like you did on Roden just because you think I'm not aligned with you, we are going to have a HUGE fucking problem, you understand? I don't care if you think I'm so scummy that not even the most intense bathroom cleaner on the planet could make a dent in me; you don't treat the actual human like shit over a fucking form game. Please do your utmost to remember that.

This is getting WAY too personal and I'm going to ask you to stop. Like for real if you're doubling down on this, then I think what I'd like to do is defer to the mod and ask if they think I'm gaslighting you, because THAT IS EXTREMELY SERIOUS. If I were actually doing that, if I were actually trying to psychologically manipulate you in this way, that's something that I should be modkilled before. I REALLY, REALLY do not think that is what I am doing, but if it is, I'm going to defer to the mod and to some higher level of judgment, because you are making this about a lot more than just a game when you accuse me of this.

I find the accusation of gaslighting you to be extremely serious, by the way, on a personal level, so obviously I want to be really crystal clear about all of this. I want to understand why you think I'm doing this.

Just some absurd posts to make if ninja is scum imo

These are just examples of basic AtE

[Dannflor]

How about DP and Dann kiss and make up (***) and vote Luca?

why is Luca your most confident scum read?

[Vivax]

Dannflor do you hold bias in your read on SuperfluousNinja?

I think I saw bias. I think you might actually be scumreading her, cased her and gave town exactly one shot at limming her before you decided to give her some leeway.

Mind you, I don‘t want this to be a cheating accusation, at most an accusation of being good hearted.

[Oatsmaster]

I don't understand why you guys think he will self resolve

if he's scum he just kills the people who scum read him and wins

If he’s alive d4 I’m yeeting him and so should everyone else.

this feels extremely naive

You guys don’t have strong players here?
Realistically who gets nightkilled the first 3 nights?
Nobody is killing gob/naerys/hu Tao/ninja/Luca/vivax/you/Roden/Dunn

[Oatsmaster]

think I saw bias. I think you might actually be scumreading her, cased her and gave town exactly one shot at limming her before you decided to give her some leeway.

What does this even mean

[Dannflor]

Look, I've laid out over the last couple pages why I think DP is approaching the game with a scum mindset. Generally, I don't think he cares about detecting alignment, I think he cares about looking good and making sure others in the game look bad.

If everyone looks at that and decides it has no merit or doesn't apply to DP, whatever. I'll just sheep my town reads and compromise.

But I believe in this read a lot so I would appreciate at least some consideration of it rather than a *shrug* and telling me DP will self resolve.

[Dannflor]

Dannflor do you hold bias in your read on SuperfluousNinja?

I think I saw bias. I think you might actually be scumreading her, cased her and gave town exactly one shot at limming her before you decided to give her some leeway.

Mind you, I don‘t want this to be a cheating accusation, at most an accusation of being good hearted.

I don't know what this means. I have lingering suspicions because I think her posting style triggers a lot of the scum tells I use but ultimately I think she's town and feel pretty strongly about that. I'm not lying to be nice.

[DarthPunk]

Do you honestly expect me to respond to that differently than I did?

Honestly? I don't know you and don't necessarily know how you react to stuff as each alignment. But I do think generally town has more curiosity about read changes like that, and are less prone to jump on perceived inconsistencies as scummy.

I think your gameplay pretty much consists solely of jumping on perceived inconsistencies in everyone's posts but not really doing so in a way that shows you're curious about my alignment.

When you started asking me about my read change on you you began the discussion ready to shed me in a negative light

when you called my OOO vote in the early game terrible you didn't bother asking me my thought process behind it until I started interrogating *you*

Inconsistencies in thought processes with zero evidence are like the number one way to find mafia in my opinion. You are an active poster that I never really considered to be town. Then I get back to the thread and you have basically completely backflipped off your read, when I know that nothing about the evidence has changed.

I already was sus on you for not really believing your reads and that you just post cases for the sake of it. So it just looks like a mafia claim to me tbh.

Why do you think I am the best yeet today? I cannot understand how any decent town player could hold that belief, so could you please explain more than just a summary that is basically untruthful?

Most of my posts are questions trying to get more information or clarify perspectives. So clearly curious.

As to the sorting, I am sorting so meh. Maybe you are just not happy I haven't sorted you into the town column

[DarthPunk]

I am convicted

You can say that, but you only really talk the talk, you don't walk the walk.

You backflip the backflip - literally.

[outoforder]

How about DP and Dann kiss and make up (***) and vote Luca?

why is Luca your most confident scum read?

Are you asking ME that, out of everyone??

[Dannflor]

yes i'd like to hear your own words on it

[Roden]

I caught up

I didn't see much of a case on Luca, is it that their posts feel safe?

[outoforder]

Look, I've laid out over the last couple pages why I think DP is approaching the game with a scum mindset. Generally, I don't think he cares about detecting alignment, I think he cares about looking good and making sure others in the game look bad.

If everyone looks at that and decides it has no merit or doesn't apply to DP, whatever. I'll just sheep my town reads and compromise.

But I believe in this read a lot so I would appreciate at least some consideration of it rather than a *shrug* and telling me DP will self resolve.

I am considering, at least.

[Vivax]

Dannflor do you hold bias in your read on SuperfluousNinja?

I think I saw bias. I think you might actually be scumreading her, cased her and gave town exactly one shot at limming her before you decided to give her some leeway.

Mind you, I don‘t want this to be a cheating accusation, at most an accusation of being good hearted.

I don't know what this means. I have lingering suspicions because I think her posting style triggers a lot of the scum tells I use but ultimately I think she's town and feel pretty strongly about that. I'm not lying to be nice.

I‘ve seen that happen in a few games. Most of the time, the entire game may play to comfort a particular player. I think it‘s nice to beat a ruleset with compassion. It‘s what prevents us from becoming selfish killing machines.

I don‘t know if DP is scum, but I know that he can help me win if he isn‘t. I respect him being busy. I may even assume he prefers to watch how less renowned players approach the game so he prefers to do less.

[Oatsmaster]

Look, I've laid out over the last couple pages why I think DP is approaching the game with a scum mindset. Generally, I don't think he cares about detecting alignment, I think he cares about looking good and making sure others in the game look bad.

If everyone looks at that and decides it has no merit or doesn't apply to DP, whatever. I'll just sheep my town reads and compromise.

But I believe in this read a lot so I would appreciate at least some consideration of it rather than a *shrug* and telling me DP will self resolve.

The case is bad, I fully support him saying it’s bad

[DarthPunk]

Look, I've laid out over the last couple pages why I think DP is approaching the game with a scum mindset.

Generally, I don't think he cares about detecting alignment, I think he cares about looking good and making sure others in the game look bad.

If everyone looks at that and decides it has no merit or doesn't apply to DP, whatever. I'll just sheep my town reads and compromise.

But I believe in this read a lot so I would appreciate at least some consideration of it rather than a *shrug* and telling me DP will self resolve.

Can you actually make the case with examples please, cause you say this, but It isn't actually clear to me that this is anything more than something you are just saying.

[Vivax]

I caught up

I didn't see much of a case on Luca, is it that their posts feel safe?

Pretty much. Being reasonable and having thread adjacent reads but having no skin in the game by challenging anything.

He‘s chamaleontic

[Luca Blight]

The main thing I'm bothered about by Luca is that he hasn't really pushed anything himself and doesn't have any strong scum reads outside of the consensus Roden

I'm about to start work but just wanted to answer this. When I first voted and pushed Roden he wasn't a ''consensus scum read' at that time.

But generally I can see your point. It's a difficult game state for me to work with, because there are a lot of strong, verbose players who for the most part strike me as being more likely town, and a bunch of quiet players who are very difficult to read. Roden has been the only one who has stood out to me as scummy, and he has been in the process of catching up. So, given he has been in catch-up mode and what I've seen from this catch-up hadn't moved me at all, there hasn't been much to push there either.

[Oatsmaster]

Instead his initial inclination is to focus on how the case doesn't make him mafia. Again, I don't think a town player's inclination here is to try and debunk the case point by point.

we’ve literally seen ninja do this exact thing earlier in this day and you thought she was town off that.

Your case can be summed up to “I don’t play mafia this way and therefore DP is scum because of it”
It’s just playstyle differences you are pointing out