In post 3215, Hu Tao wrote: Okay I'm caught up. I'm for a DP vote. I'm unsure the vote count right now since it was wrong earlier
These postsIn post 3217, Hu Tao wrote:Gob, Oats maybe Luca. I definitely liked Luca more in the catchup than dp for sure though.In post 3216, SuperfluousNinja wrote:In post 3215, Hu Tao wrote: Okay I'm caught up. I'm for a DP vote. I'm unsure the vote count right now since it was wrong earlier
If not DP, who are the other two you'd want to lim?
In post 578, Hu Tao wrote:I don't see the DP scumread here DannIn post 568, DarthPunk wrote:No, if it was a good case with something worth responding to I would happily respond.
But I don't think you have established anything in that case other than some arbitrary expectations about how I 'should' have reacted to the ninja case.
and the fact that being reasonable= mafia.
the problem I have with you is that you have already acknowledged and it should be quite clear to you that we approach the game in a radically different way, so why are you so confident with a case that boils down to: (doesn't do what I think he should do as town, therefore he is mafia)
This super long day phase is super pro town, there is no reason to dive in to a elim on Ninja when there are people who aren't even posting.
It was the correct play to not just jump on the wagon and get more information in the thread. Strictly correct even.
As to being reasonable. You should have read a post I made when you ISO'd me talking to oats about toning down our level of aggression as we are guests on the site. Being reasonable is not alignment indicative.
Lack of curiosity is, not wanting to get to the truth of peoples alignments is. Reasonableness no. In fact, on my site the opposite tends to be true.
Now the real question is, why does it seem like you are operating with an agenda, you write cases that are worse than you present them as, with a level of confidence that is not commesurate to the 'evidence' you are presenting.
It smacks of holding an agenda tbh. Are you trying to wrest thread control from the active players? Or are you mafia?
Can you expand on this with some quotes because I don't really follow.In post 3673, Oatsmaster wrote: I don’t really understand why ninja is scumreading me for holding onto a view that she doesn’t agree with but is in turn holding onto a view that nobody else agrees with and that’s somehow fine? I’m referring to not realizing that naeyrs did that whole thing about the night kills.
Oh like the beginning of day 1. I'm talking about the time frame of the question oats is talking aboutIn post 3676, DarthPunk wrote:In post 578, Hu Tao wrote:I don't see the DP scumread here DannIn post 568, DarthPunk wrote:No, if it was a good case with something worth responding to I would happily respond.
But I don't think you have established anything in that case other than some arbitrary expectations about how I 'should' have reacted to the ninja case.
and the fact that being reasonable= mafia.
the problem I have with you is that you have already acknowledged and it should be quite clear to you that we approach the game in a radically different way, so why are you so confident with a case that boils down to: (doesn't do what I think he should do as town, therefore he is mafia)
This super long day phase is super pro town, there is no reason to dive in to a elim on Ninja when there are people who aren't even posting.
It was the correct play to not just jump on the wagon and get more information in the thread. Strictly correct even.
As to being reasonable. You should have read a post I made when you ISO'd me talking to oats about toning down our level of aggression as we are guests on the site. Being reasonable is not alignment indicative.
Lack of curiosity is, not wanting to get to the truth of peoples alignments is. Reasonableness no. In fact, on my site the opposite tends to be true.
Now the real question is, why does it seem like you are operating with an agenda, you write cases that are worse than you present them as, with a level of confidence that is not commesurate to the 'evidence' you are presenting.
It smacks of holding an agenda tbh. Are you trying to wrest thread control from the active players? Or are you mafia?
Fine speech. You know Vivax, i like you. We should play another game togetherIn post 3641, Vivax wrote:UNVOTE THIS MAN, HE HAS DIARRHEAIn post 3640, gob wrote:well currently im having diarrhea cause… either i ate undercooked chicken or the edible i had earlier. Not sure which.In post 3638, DarthPunk wrote:Then why aren't you trying harder to do that?In post 3634, gob wrote:We can lim you instead, i would prefer thatIn post 3630, DarthPunk wrote:So you want to lim your town read?In post 3623, gob wrote:Im moreso into solving like day 1. Bia pools.In post 3615, DarthPunk wrote:So what are your thoughts on the game based on the wagons between you and I both at e-2 and then you and oats at e-2In post 3588, gob wrote:vca usuallyIn post 3587, DarthPunk wrote:Gob how do you find mafia as town?In post 3582, gob wrote: I havent read and do not plan on reading anything recent. Vote me if you must.
Anyway right now to be frank; i think we need to lim some of these TL players. No offense tk you guys, but all i see is anti-town play and honestly unfun ways of communicating.
Oatsmaster i think is town, pretty strongly too. The way things have went and how against everyone he has been, at every corner, doesnt seem like mafia to me. The TL players can correct me if that is his meta. But i feel like his tone throughout the entire game has been inconsistent.
But im okay with voting him because he has been a nusanxe alongside Luca, Ninja, and some other people im forgetting.
Again no offense to any of ya’ll. We cant all get along.
As stated before, i do want to play this game but its not that fun with Ninja, Oats, you to a certain extent, Etc. etc.
In post 3677, DarthPunk wrote:Can you expand on this with some quotes because I don't really follow.In post 3673, Oatsmaster wrote: I don’t really understand why ninja is scumreading me for holding onto a view that she doesn’t agree with but is in turn holding onto a view that nobody else agrees with and that’s somehow fine? I’m referring to not realizing that naeyrs did that whole thing about the night kills.
I’ll follow these up later, I need more than my phoneIn post 3675, Hu Tao wrote:In post 3215, Hu Tao wrote: Okay I'm caught up. I'm for a DP vote. I'm unsure the vote count right now since it was wrong earlierThese postsIn post 3217, Hu Tao wrote:Gob, Oats maybe Luca. I definitely liked Luca more in the catchup than dp for sure though.In post 3216, SuperfluousNinja wrote:In post 3215, Hu Tao wrote: Okay I'm caught up. I'm for a DP vote. I'm unsure the vote count right now since it was wrong earlier
If not DP, who are the other two you'd want to lim?
It’s possible.In post 3682, Hu Tao wrote: You were already lost since you have me as scum
In post 3681, DarthPunk wrote: Im going to re-read the last 30 pages or so. feeling pretty lost when I try to view the game through the lens of luca being town.
Probably just means he isn't town tho.
I already considered them. I don't think that is right.In post 3685, Luca Blight wrote:In post 3681, DarthPunk wrote: Im going to re-read the last 30 pages or so. feeling pretty lost when I try to view the game through the lens of luca being town.
Probably just means he isn't town tho.
try viewing it through the lens of oats/Vivax being scum.
I've been working off this post as a basis of a rethink on the game.In post 3490, outoforder wrote: I am just gonna blurt out everything i have thought about after yesterday. I've been able to follow the thread at work.
I think Luca vs DP is T/T. I am fairly certain of it. Both side's reasoning for other one being mafia makes sense (+ Grack on DP), but i don't think it makes either of them mafia. The more i read Luca's posts i think it just how he posts, rather than that he is trying to deceive. It looks annoying to me (i mean this with no offence) because from what i know appearing certain is a way you get the people you want on the chopping block. He did appear certain though lately, when he was willing to go 1v1 against DP, and that looked townie to me, because i don't think he thinks he can win that argument.
DP did some weird shit at the end of D1, yes. I still don't think it makes him mafia because he simply just doesn't have to do that. If there is a choice of getting rid of either Luca or Dunn D1 for him, what's the point of having a player who is defending themselves to death alive D2 over a fairly passive player? Again, being wrong doesn't make anyone mafia, and the misyeet could be easily blamed on someone else -- for instance on people who joined the wagon without much reasoning (as Luca himself said, almost everyone has thought he is scum in this game).
I also believe Ninja is town. This is more of a tone read than based on content, because i don't understand most of her point by point arguments (no offence again). I also can't place her in any mafia team in based on my reads.
Another person i think is town is Naerys. It's very hard for me to explain why i townread her. It's basically -- especially now during D2, whenever she posts it seems like there is some sort of thought going on in her head. Although i tend to have no idea what that is at each point, i think it's townie lol. ^^
I also think Grack is town. This is the weakest town read i have. I don't think he has done much and yeah technically he could be mafia for sure, i just don't think he is since every once in a while he comes in with a super smart comment or observation.
That leaves me with Dann/Oats/Vivax/gob/Hu Tao.
I have absolutely no idea what to think of Hu Tao. Every other time i read i think she is town and every other time i think she is mafia. I think it is slightly more likely to be town for the stupid gambit at the start of the day. I simply don't know what there is to achieve, if Luca is town OR if Luca is mafia (since basically that was the ONLY assumed wagon start D2 and Dunn flipping town)????
gob is most likely mafia for what i said.
Dann has faded off and i feel like that's strange. I need to look further into his reads on day 2 and mirror them to the fact he said he is purposely stepping down from trying to be a town leader. I don't understand why someone who is able to lead the town would not want to lead the town. If people are pushing his scumreads, then i guess that can make sense. If not, then there is a problem in what he's doing. I myself have found this day phase quite all over the place and there has been not so good direction or agreement between people. That's why i find his play weird this phase, and statistically scum can't keep up with "townie play" the more the game goes on.
Oats and Vivax i have to completely reread, as there is probably at least one mafia in those people. I haven't done that yet, but i am planning to start this evening.
Can we please now use the time we have and not yeet anyone when we have like 3-4 day self in the phase????
At least give people time to play friday evening and saturday, since that's the time i can acually be active.
Okay so you see here, shes fine saying that my logic didnt add up by her standards and because I didnt bend to her will and admit it, im mafia.In post 3259, SuperfluousNinja wrote:In post 3253, Vivax wrote: Luca and Ninja scum together seems impossible to me. They work together too obviously when it comes to derailing the thread.
Look I promise I am done doing what I was doing against Oats. The fact that it was WITH Luca is not the important part here. I needed to know what Oats' deal was, why he was being stubborn on what seems like a lot of really low-stakes stuff, trying to see if we could just talk through a read, be logical about it, come to an understanding. And to make an admittedly enormous story short, he won't, so I'm content to just scum read him and leave it at that. He had his chance to admit that his logic didn't add up and that his read strategy is faulty, and he did everything in his power to avoid having to admit it. So he's just scum in my book.
But for real, you won't see that from me again. I got the answer I needed.
So here, obviously her logic doesnt add up for DP, so she just says, well deal with it. And obviously thats not a problem for her.In post 3576, SuperfluousNinja wrote:In post 3570, DarthPunk wrote:Thats a cool job. have you written any papers?In post 3555, SuperfluousNinja wrote: Oh I am interested in the alignment; I'm just not interested in analysis of Naerys herself, because there's just not enough to chew on. Whatever tools I want to use to sort someone out, I can't really use those at all on Naerys. You realize it takes like 5 minutes to read through her ISO?
My real life job is biostatistician, and in my profession, we often caution against even conducting a statistical test on anything with too little data. A conclusion based on small sample size is quite dangerous.
Mafia is not that though, we need to be able to infer probable truths from small pieces of information.
I do know her iso is really small, that is why it bothers me that you didn't
1.) read it when she was in your POE
and
2.) Notice what I did and rule her out from being mafia at least from the time being, or at least consider and dismiss it as being non-indicative of alignment.
Well, you're just going to have to be bothered, then. You don't think small sample size conclusions apply to games like these. I do.
In post 3555, SuperfluousNinja wrote: Oh I am interested in the alignment; I'm just not interested in analysis of Naerys herself, because there's just not enough to chew on. Whatever tools I want to use to sort someone out, I can't really use those at all on Naerys. You realize it takes like 5 minutes to read through her ISO?
And she constantly repeats how it only takes 5 minutes to read through naerys' iso but somehow she didnt do it because its not large enough? Thats not good logic to me or anyone imo. She couldve easily admitted that her method was faulty but she doubles down on the exact same type of thing that shes calling me mafia for.In post 3664, SuperfluousNinja wrote:
I think I've explained my viewpoint to Darth as thoroughly as I can. I try to look at as many interesting tidbits and nuggets of whatever as I can and I add those up as things that look towny, things that look scummy, and however the chips fall after adding it all up, that's how I tend to feel about the person ultimately. The bit about sample size, I just don't know how else I can get the point across that we do have an abundance of data on pretty much everyone here, while we have a staggering dearth of it with Naerys. It's not just about the post count; it's about what's in the posts. I insist that you can read through and understand everything she's done in this game in 5 minutes. That's just not enough of hardly anything for me to want to bother investing time into directly solving her alignment by studying her directly. I don't know how I can be any clearer on that point.
In post 3383, Vivax wrote:I don't know about that but he should form the two following thoughts:In post 3380, DarthPunk wrote:Do you think dann could fake the introspection and adjustment to his approach with the TL players this game?In post 3379, Vivax wrote: Ergo Dannflor is mafia, cause he ignores that, votes Oats, but still should rather vote DP if he was town adhering to his stated beliefs.
The gob vote was a distancing attempt.
I found that really townie to be honest.
Are these wagons town on town?
He voted gob previously so clearly he doesn't think that.
If he thought gob was mafia, why vote Oats who was just coming around to vote gob (unless he assumed that was a setup for a bus)?
If Oats isn't bussing he can only be partnered with you, so if he thinks gob is the mafia being wagoned, how can he ever suspect Oats for prepping a vote on him?
Yeah ok I see what you are saying, but do you think that makes her mafia.In post 3692, Oatsmaster wrote: @darth punkOkay so you see here, shes fine saying that my logic didnt add up by her standards and because I didnt bend to her will and admit it, im mafia.In post 3259, SuperfluousNinja wrote:In post 3253, Vivax wrote: Luca and Ninja scum together seems impossible to me. They work together too obviously when it comes to derailing the thread.
Look I promise I am done doing what I was doing against Oats. The fact that it was WITH Luca is not the important part here. I needed to know what Oats' deal was, why he was being stubborn on what seems like a lot of really low-stakes stuff, trying to see if we could just talk through a read, be logical about it, come to an understanding. And to make an admittedly enormous story short, he won't, so I'm content to just scum read him and leave it at that. He had his chance to admit that his logic didn't add up and that his read strategy is faulty, and he did everything in his power to avoid having to admit it. So he's just scum in my book.
But for real, you won't see that from me again. I got the answer I needed.
So here, obviously her logic doesnt add up for DP, so she just says, well deal with it. And obviously thats not a problem for her.In post 3576, SuperfluousNinja wrote:In post 3570, DarthPunk wrote:Thats a cool job. have you written any papers?In post 3555, SuperfluousNinja wrote: Oh I am interested in the alignment; I'm just not interested in analysis of Naerys herself, because there's just not enough to chew on. Whatever tools I want to use to sort someone out, I can't really use those at all on Naerys. You realize it takes like 5 minutes to read through her ISO?
My real life job is biostatistician, and in my profession, we often caution against even conducting a statistical test on anything with too little data. A conclusion based on small sample size is quite dangerous.
Mafia is not that though, we need to be able to infer probable truths from small pieces of information.
I do know her iso is really small, that is why it bothers me that you didn't
1.) read it when she was in your POE
and
2.) Notice what I did and rule her out from being mafia at least from the time being, or at least consider and dismiss it as being non-indicative of alignment.
Well, you're just going to have to be bothered, then. You don't think small sample size conclusions apply to games like these. I do.
In post 3555, SuperfluousNinja wrote: Oh I am interested in the alignment; I'm just not interested in analysis of Naerys herself, because there's just not enough to chew on. Whatever tools I want to use to sort someone out, I can't really use those at all on Naerys. You realize it takes like 5 minutes to read through her ISO?And she constantly repeats how it only takes 5 minutes to read through naerys' iso but somehow she didnt do it because its not large enough? Thats not good logic to me or anyone imo. She couldve easily admitted that her method was faulty but she doubles down on the exact same type of thing that shes calling me mafia for.In post 3664, SuperfluousNinja wrote:
I think I've explained my viewpoint to Darth as thoroughly as I can. I try to look at as many interesting tidbits and nuggets of whatever as I can and I add those up as things that look towny, things that look scummy, and however the chips fall after adding it all up, that's how I tend to feel about the person ultimately. The bit about sample size, I just don't know how else I can get the point across that we do have an abundance of data on pretty much everyone here, while we have a staggering dearth of it with Naerys. It's not just about the post count; it's about what's in the posts. I insist that you can read through and understand everything she's done in this game in 5 minutes. That's just not enough of hardly anything for me to want to bother investing time into directly solving her alignment by studying her directly. I don't know how I can be any clearer on that point.
In post 3061, SuperfluousNinja wrote: If you all want me to sheep on a Luca vote, I probably will at this point. It seems like the most informative flip we could be making right now.
Ninja was kind of also pushing you and me as lims next after LucaIn post 3073, Luca Blight wrote:In post 3061, SuperfluousNinja wrote: If you all want me to sheep on a Luca vote, I probably will at this point. It seems like the most informative flip we could be making right now.
Btw, what sparked this comment anyway?
Wouldn't Darth be as informative a flip as my own, if not more so? I would definitely say more so, given his connections to other tl members, especially the likes of Oats who has been backing him up every step of the way.I also got the impression that you townread me more than Darth, so I'm just a little puzzled by this.
big assumption, but if we assume luca, yourself and me was TvTvT, that is kind of setting the stage for a Mafia!Ninja to line up a few mislims in a row.In post 3075, SuperfluousNinja wrote:In post 3062, Luca Blight wrote:In post 3061, SuperfluousNinja wrote: If you all want me to sheep on a Luca vote, I probably will at this point. It seems like the most informative flip we could be making right now.
What will your view of the game be after I flip town?
I would be extremely suspicious of Darth and Oats if you flipped town.
I don't think it would change my mind on OOO since he seems to at least have good reasoning for everything, whereas it seems like Darth's case on you is built largely on emotion and overplaying his read on things, and Oats is just trying to frustrate you and everyone else to make you look worse.
In post 3144, SuperfluousNinja wrote: In the meantime, this is where I want my vote to be for the time being.
VOTE: DarthPunk
This is E-2, by the way.
In post 3148, SuperfluousNinja wrote: No lol. It's not a coincidence I vote for him after his most recent contributions.
FWIW I absolutely positively do not want him yeeted while he's asleep, and if anyone pushes him to -1 right now, I'm canceling my vote.
In post 3150, SuperfluousNinja wrote: In fact I am having second thoughts about this, now that I think about it some more. There's a chance, actually maybe a pretty good chance, that you're both town.
And if that's true, holy shit have we ever handed scum a great play. Yeet one of you today, and when whoever we flip flips town, we immediately go after the other. We are literally grounding into a double play here. They follow through on that, and voila, we are only one misyeet away from gg at that point.
I don't like it.
UNVOTE:
