Mini Normal 2333 | woah that's a lot of 3's | It's Gypover !

[SmileyDude1]

Hello everyone

also VOTE: Brian Skies

sorry, RNG told me you were scum. Don't make the rules

[SmileyDude1]

just tried it 2 more times and got Random Nurse and Blackstar.

Game is solved, you can thank me later.

[SmileyDude1]

PC jester?

[SmileyDude1]

Oh wait this is a normal?

Could've sworn a signed up for a bastard theme game, ah well.

i'll make due.

[SmileyDude1]

it was yeah.

[SmileyDude1]

Eh, just engaging in some light-hearted banter tis all.

[SmileyDude1]

it was yeah.

why? trying to be my fren? or trying to be anyones fren? or trying to be everyone's fren?

Would you consider it scummy if I was trying to do the above though. If so, why?

[SmileyDude1]

Eh, just engaging in some light-hearted banter tis all.

I think I believe you maybe tbd. but are you hiding something?

Trust me, there's nothing hidden behind this smile .

What about you?

[SmileyDude1]

Feeling good about PC right now btw.

[SmileyDude1]

anyone else getting 500 errors when they try to post?

Same

[SmileyDude1]

The lack of wagons aggravates me

Idk what y'all are yapping about

So, what, you're wanting some wagons to develop?

Sounds a bit suss to me.

Eh don't really agree with this. Early wagons can be illuminating in the sense that it can help glean info based on how people play around said wagons. Why do you think there sus?


Would say Brian Skies gets some town points for pointing this out in their 84 UNVOTE:

[SmileyDude1]

Will say I don't like the PC wagon right now though. I can see, that it's likely due to his self vote, but I don't really see it as scum-indicative given the way they've played thus far.


For me, I think posts like 45 and 50 among others show genuine intent to trying to sort people out and I feel like it's the type of analysis that feels more likely to come from town than scum given how early in the game it was. It also doesn't really matchup with the main reason self-votes can be scum-indicative in my view. Self-votes, in my opinion, can be scummy because it can be used as an avenue to not have to engage the game, but I don't see PC's play as matching that description.

I think voting PC for self-voting feels like shallow reasoning that doesn't feel like it's AI in this case and I'm not really vibing with it.

VOTE: Davesaz

[SmileyDude1]

VOTE: Random Nurse

Can you go more into this when you have a chance?

[SmileyDude1]

VOTE: Random Nurse

I think I see what BlackStar sees.

Having read it over a few more times, I think I'm starting to see something there. Will wait for Blackstar to respond to see if I'm correct.

[SmileyDude1]

The lack of wagons aggravates me

Idk what y'all are yapping about

So, what, you're wanting some wagons to develop?

Sounds a bit suss to me.

Eh don't really agree with this. Early wagons can be illuminating in the sense that it can help glean info based on how people play around said wagons. Why do you think there sus?

Would say Brian Skies gets some town points for pointing this out in their 84 UNVOTE:

To me it just seemed like an eagerness ti get a wagon going, to get someone eliminated that isn't them. Obviously wagons have to happen for the game ti progress but being eager ti get them going just hit different.

Yessiree wasn't really under threat at that point though, as shown by the VC shortly before they made the post. Not sure the point applies

1.2

---

Brian Skies (3) :

KayJayQueue / SmileyDude1 / PenguinPower

PenguinPower (1) :

yessiree

Greeting (1) :

davesaz

Political Clout (1) :

Political Clout

Not Voting (7) :

BlackStar / Greeting / Hu Tao / StraightFlush / Random Nurse / Titus / Brian Skies

With 13 alive, it takes 7 votes to execute someone, day 1 ends in (expired on 2024-03-25 13:02:46)

vote history

PenguinPower :

yessiree (8) -> Brian Skies (29)

yessiree :

PenguinPower (9)

Davesaz :

greeting (13)

BlackStar :

Political Clout (18) -> Unvote(52)

KayJayQueue :

Brian Skies (22)

Political Clout :

Politicial Clout (26)

SmileyDude1 :

Brian Skies (27)

mod notes

Brian Skies and Titus are V/LA until monday
have fun everyone !

for reference

[SmileyDude1]

VOTE: Random Nurse

Can you go more into this when you have a chance?

I thought it was a bit strange that he said wanting wagons is sus. Then he started to defend PC hard as soon as people started voting for them. I don’t like it

Yeah, reading through it, I was getting potential subtle knight/buddying vibes from their PC defense. Could vote there, but would prefer Dave atm.

[SmileyDude1]

Speaking of which,

@Random Nurse

Do you have any reads right now?

I just saw the recent questions with no real effort or trajectory imo. I thought BlackStar was seeing the same.

What do you guys think about Dave so far?

[SmileyDude1]

The lack of wagons aggravates me

Idk what y'all are yapping about

So, what, you're wanting some wagons to develop?

Sounds a bit suss to me.

Eh don't really agree with this. Early wagons can be illuminating in the sense that it can help glean info based on how people play around said wagons. Why do you think there sus?

Would say Brian Skies gets some town points for pointing this out in their 84 UNVOTE:

To me it just seemed like an eagerness ti get a wagon going, to get someone eliminated that isn't them. Obviously wagons have to happen for the game ti progress but being eager ti get them going just hit different.

Yessiree wasn't really under threat at that point though, as shown by the VC shortly before they made the post. Not sure the point applies

1.2

---

Brian Skies (3) :

KayJayQueue / SmileyDude1 / PenguinPower

PenguinPower (1) :

yessiree

Greeting (1) :

davesaz

Political Clout (1) :

Political Clout

Not Voting (7) :

BlackStar / Greeting / Hu Tao / StraightFlush / Random Nurse / Titus / Brian Skies

With 13 alive, it takes 7 votes to execute someone, day 1 ends in (expired on 2024-03-25 13:02:46)

vote history

PenguinPower :

yessiree (8) -> Brian Skies (29)

yessiree :

PenguinPower (9)

Davesaz :

greeting (13)

BlackStar :

Political Clout (18) -> Unvote(52)

KayJayQueue :

Brian Skies (22)

Political Clout :

Politicial Clout (26)

SmileyDude1 :

Brian Skies (27)

mod notes

Brian Skies and Titus are V/LA until monday
have fun everyone !

for reference

They don't require to be under threat to want to get a wagon going to get people eliminated. To me it's one thing to pressure other players and see how they bend and fold under pressure, but another thing entirely to seem eager enough to want to get a wagon going to get someone gone. Tell me that doesn't sound crazy, yeah?

Yeah I can see that I guess. What makes you think it's more likely the latter is happening than the former though?

[SmileyDude1]

Can do

My apologies for the inconvenience

[SmileyDude1]

Spoiler:

VOTE:

VOTE: yessiree

I agree that this inconsistency from him is very strange.

What inconsistency

You say you want to get some wagons going, and you’re willing to attempt starting a wagon on someone because they won’t feed into that, but you also say you don’t expect current votes to mean much of anything since we’re still in the feel-it-out phase? Those two don’t really go together, why vote people and start wagons when they won’t mean anything yet

You also say in the same post that you won’t share what you’re looking for in a wagon/what your standards for voting are, which is scummy behavior in its own right imo

VOTE:

VOTE: yessiree

I agree that this inconsistency from him is very strange.

What inconsistency

You say you want to get some wagons going, and you’re willing to attempt starting a wagon on someone because they won’t feed into that, but you also say you don’t expect current votes to mean much of anything since we’re still in the feel-it-out phase? Those two don’t really go together, why vote people and start wagons when they won’t mean anything yet

You also say in the same post that you won’t share what you’re looking for in a wagon/what your standards for voting are, which is scummy behavior in its own right imo

I see, but you're confusing two things here. I said I'm not expecting votes to be well justified at this stage because I saw people were putting too much emphasis on this. That's not the same as having no reads at all which is Hu's case, and kinda why I was poking at her.

And I think it's pretty self-explanatory I'm obviously not telling y'all what I consider are scummy behaviours so you can do the towny thing instead the scummy thing

I think the logic in both of these posts feel relatively sound to me. i'd say this feels closer to TvT right now.

[SmileyDude1]

Spoiler: quote wall

VOTE:

VOTE: yessiree

I agree that this inconsistency from him is very strange.

What inconsistency

You say you want to get some wagons going, and you’re willing to attempt starting a wagon on someone because they won’t feed into that, but you also say you don’t expect current votes to mean much of anything since we’re still in the feel-it-out phase? Those two don’t really go together, why vote people and start wagons when they won’t mean anything yet

You also say in the same post that you won’t share what you’re looking for in a wagon/what your standards for voting are, which is scummy behavior in its own right imo

I see, but you're confusing two things here. I said I'm not expecting votes to be well justified at this stage because I saw people were putting too much emphasis on this. That's not the same as having no reads at all which is Hu's case, and kinda why I was poking at her.

And I think it's pretty self-explanatory I'm obviously not telling y'all what I consider are scummy behaviours so you can do the towny thing instead the scummy thing

I've never gotten the appeal behind using votes to "poke" people personally. Let them get up to speed on their own. At the time Hu said they had no reads, I also happened to not have any reads yet
-SNIP-

Would you say that this behavior is AI though? Like do you think it's more just ineffective or more indicative of scum intentions in this instance?

[SmileyDude1]

What do you think about self-voting in the game in general?

Strongly dislike in general. There may be very limited cases where it actually furthers one's wincon, but for the most part it doesn't.

What's your thoughts on PC disregarding the self-vote?

[SmileyDude1]

What do you think about self-voting in the game in general?

Strongly dislike in general. There may be very limited cases where it actually furthers one's wincon, but for the most part it doesn't.

What's your thoughts on PC disregarding the self-vote?

Insufficient data.

Eh, I feel like PC has done enough so far that some sort of read should be generated there (even if it's a null read), this feels like a cop-out.

[SmileyDude1]

fairly certain kayjayqueue is town less sure about random nurse and even less sure about dave...

I originally interpreted this post as you positing more suspicion on Nurse and Dave. Though your readlist doesn't really match up with that.

town
smiley
yessirre
kayjayqueue
penguin
nurse
dave
blackstar

null
hu tao
straight flush
titus
greeting

lean scum
brian


this is where I'm at for now.

Did something cause those reads to change?

[SmileyDude1]

What is PC?

Short for Political Clout

[SmileyDude1]

VOTE: random nurse

I might have a really busy day at work today but I’ll be checking in as often as I can!

Haven't heard from either of you recently. Would like to hear any new thoughts you guys have about the game so far, whenever you get a chance.

[SmileyDude1]

Some questions for you Brian

I voted you because unlike what smileydude things, I do not think posts like 45 and 50 are indicators of town behavior. In fact, those posts are pro-scum as you're blatantly rolefishing. And you're covering it up by a thin veil of "oh don't mind me, I'm just scum, JK, teehee."

Read my post again. I never said I don't scumhunt. Generating content isn't my forte. I'm the type that will reread the game several times at different angles.

As far as me not having much to say, it's because the game has been terribly droll so far. And the best tool for early content and scumhunting, which is wagon analysis, was argued as scummy by another player.

If you thought PC's early posts were indicative of scum rolefishing, why did they only come up here instead of when you originally voted them. At what point would you say you reached that conclusion?

Generate more alignment indicative content.

Also, why say this if you already had reason to believe in scum!PC due to them rolefishing?

[SmileyDude1]

UNVOTE: Dave, as this doesn't seem to be going anywhere.


Tbh, my initial gut reaction to Brian's response to my inquiry in 214 was that it felt like something I could see town believing, but I haven't really looked at the interaction deeper yet to see if that scenario is more likely than the one where they made up their reasoning in post. I'm currently busy atm, but I plan on taking a deeper look at their progression again soon to see if it checks out. Will try to get that out sometime tomorrow at the very latest

[SmileyDude1]

Just on this page, I see a claim of hider but I don't necessarily believe it. Different roles can fake claim. For instance, a doctor may want to fake being a hider particularly if weak.

I'm so lost as to why someone claimed

Also i'm pretty sure no one's explicitly claimed yet btw, Yessiree has theorized that PC claimed Hider, though they haven't confirmed or denied that yet.

Spoiler: hider soft for prosperity

are you

hiding

something smileyman?

Eh, just engaging in some light-hearted banter tis all.

I think I believe you maybe tbd. but are you

hiding

something?

it was yeah.

why? trying to be my fren? or trying to be anyones fren? or trying to be everyone's fren?

Would you consider it scummy if I was trying to do the above though. If so, why?

I would think you are

hiding

a pr. your entrance suggests eagerness your consecutives posts suggests stealth and trying to blend in. Your deflection suggests slight annoyance at me.

that was not a crumb tho, I think it was a straight up claim

[SmileyDude1]

Just on this page, I see a claim of hider but I don't necessarily believe it. Different roles can fake claim. For instance, a doctor may want to fake being a hider particularly if weak.

I'm so lost as to why someone claimed

Also i'm pretty sure no one's explicitly claimed yet btw, Yessiree has theorized that PC claimed Hider, though they haven't confirmed or denied that yet.

Spoiler: hider soft for prosperity

are you

hiding

something smileyman?

Eh, just engaging in some light-hearted banter tis all.

I think I believe you maybe tbd. but are you

hiding

something?

it was yeah.

why? trying to be my fren? or trying to be anyones fren? or trying to be everyone's fren?

Would you consider it scummy if I was trying to do the above though. If so, why?

I would think you are

hiding

a pr. your entrance suggests eagerness your consecutives posts suggests stealth and trying to blend in. Your deflection suggests slight annoyance at me.

that was not a crumb tho, I think it was a straight up claim

also also for posterity sake, IMO PC probs shouldn't answer this right now.

Anyways see you later

[SmileyDude1]

Looked through Brian's ISO starting from their original Political Clout vote and came away with a negative outlook

Spoiler: Quote Wall

VOTE: Political Clout

They originally vote PC here

So, what, you're wanting some wagons to develop?

Sounds a bit suss to me.

Wagons are a valuable tool for hunting scum.

yessiree seems town to me.

This implies they voted there in order to create competing wagons for the benefit of scum hunting. I don't think their reasoning in 185 tracks with these initial postings. Like i get not pointing out the exact reasoning immediately if you think it should be apparent, but I feel like town in that position would've at least alluded to the fact that they were voting due to seeing scum-indicative behavior if that was the reasoning. The progression from this point doesn't feel natural to me.

Sure, I see myself more as an analyzer than a scum hunter.

This is in response to PC's 179 and I don't think this makes sense either when looked at from the perspective of scumreading PC from before. This response assumes a level of good faith that I don't think matches with the stance they took in 185. I would expect Brian to be more immediately dubious of PC here given the stance they took if that was there natural thought process.

I'm not really convinced your vote on me is anything other than OMGUS.

This is the last post they made before their 185 and I think it has the same issue as the above post. I feel like calling PC's vote an OMGUS there also kind of assumes a level of good faith that doesn't match here. Like OMGUS does have negative connotation, but it leaves room for "misguided townie making a bad vote" in such a way that it feels dissonant given the stated thought process indicates that Brian would've believed that PC is more likely scum than town at this point. I could see this post being an attempt at giving themselves an off-ramp with 185 coming afterwards when PC doesn't back down.

It kind of gets into heated back and forth between the two slots afterwards that I don't think I have enough expertise with emotions to accurately sort (not to mention I don't think i'd get much out of it anyways)

Conclusion: I don't think Brian's PC read is real. I feel like if they were voting PC for AI behavior specifically, they'd have been more likely to allude to that at some point before their argument, and their interaction with PC before they stated the reason they voted there doesn't feel like it was approached in the manner I'd expect if they harbored a preexisting scumlean/scumread of the slot. This feels like it's a justification made in post in response to PC pressuring them to me.

VOTE: Brian

It's post midnight where I am right now, will probs be back tomorrow

[SmileyDude1]

E-2 btw

[SmileyDude1]

Not really interested in limming bs day 1 on his first game back in ages.

Respectfully disagree with the logic presented here but I digress. What's your read on Brian right now, it's apparent that you don't lean scum on Brian given the above post, but was wondering whether you felt more neutral or positive towards them at the moment?

[SmileyDude1]

VOTE: PC

Also was wondering what changed for you on PC since you took this stance from earlier

Meh, i feel pc and bs are both town based on this page but i am still on vacay and need to read.

[SmileyDude1]

VC please

Nevermind

VOTE: Brian

Meant to ask you about this, was wondering about your motivations for this vote. Was it more agreement with other cases, or did you have your own reasons for voting there.

[SmileyDude1]

Not really interested in limming bs day 1 on his first game back in ages.

Respectfully disagree with the logic presented here but I digress. What's your read on Brian right now, it's apparent that you don't lean scum on Brian given the above post, but was wondering whether you felt more neutral or positive towards them at the moment?

Is it even logic? It doesn’t seem based in logic in the slightest. It’s an emotional response of wanting a friend to stay around. If there was logic behind it, I think she would’ve led with that not just used the excuse of him having been gone a long time.

Probs less so logic, and more so reasoning. Kind of used it interchangeably there.

[SmileyDude1]

VOTE: political clout

Can you go more into this vote when you have a chance?

[SmileyDude1]

Those who town lean Brian can I have you respond to my case in 269 (presented below for convenience).

Looked through Brian's ISO starting from their original Political Clout vote and came away with a negative outlook

Spoiler: Quote Wall

VOTE: Political Clout

They originally vote PC here

So, what, you're wanting some wagons to develop?

Sounds a bit suss to me.

Wagons are a valuable tool for hunting scum.

yessiree seems town to me.

This implies they voted there in order to create competing wagons for the benefit of scum hunting. I don't think their reasoning in 185 tracks with these initial postings. Like i get not pointing out the exact reasoning immediately if you think it should be apparent, but I feel like town in that position would've at least alluded to the fact that they were voting due to seeing scum-indicative behavior if that was the reasoning. The progression from this point doesn't feel natural to me.

Sure, I see myself more as an analyzer than a scum hunter.

This is in response to PC's 179 and I don't think this makes sense either when looked at from the perspective of scumreading PC from before. This response assumes a level of good faith that I don't think matches with the stance they took in 185. I would expect Brian to be more immediately dubious of PC here given the stance they took if that was there natural thought process.

I'm not really convinced your vote on me is anything other than OMGUS.

This is the last post they made before their 185 and I think it has the same issue as the above post. I feel like calling PC's vote an OMGUS there also kind of assumes a level of good faith that doesn't match here. Like OMGUS does have negative connotation, but it leaves room for "misguided townie making a bad vote" in such a way that it feels dissonant given the stated thought process indicates that Brian would've believed that PC is more likely scum than town at this point. I could see this post being an attempt at giving themselves an off-ramp with 185 coming afterwards when PC doesn't back down.

It kind of gets into heated back and forth between the two slots afterwards that I don't think I have enough expertise with emotions to accurately sort (not to mention I don't think i'd get much out of it anyways)

Conclusion: I don't think Brian's PC read is real. I feel like if they were voting PC for AI behavior specifically, they'd have been more likely to allude to that at some point before their argument, and their interaction with PC before they stated the reason they voted there doesn't feel like it was approached in the manner I'd expect if they harbored a preexisting scumlean/scumread of the slot. This feels like it's a justification made in post in response to PC pressuring them to me.

VOTE: Brian

It's post midnight where I am right now, will probs be back tomorrow

[SmileyDude1]

Also thought it pertinent to clarify something here. I do see how PC's early game could be viewed as an attempt to rolefish, but I don't think that's what is going on here. As I mentioned in my 92, I liked the analysis PC presented early on (took a quick look at their ISO before going to bed last night and I think that still holds up to me) and I think this gave me more vibes of reaction gauging over rolefishing, in this instance.

[SmileyDude1]

Tbh, Brian's recent postings relating to his wagon kind of don't feel like what I'd expect to come from scum there. Like their observation about players they know not joining their wagon feels like something I wouldn't expect scum in their position to focus on. I think I'm at a point where how I feel about the slot from a pure logical standpoint isn't matching up with how i'm currently perceiving their behavior and it's kind of annoying. Like I don't think Brian Skies progression really tracks at all, but the way their approaching their wagon feels somewhat passive towards those pushing them which is throwing me off.

My scum game is actually not that bad. I just never roll it.

quoting for ping

Brian, can I have you go deeper into your thoughts on PC. Was wondering what you were seeing there besides the rolefishing?

[SmileyDude1]

Going to go against the grain here a bit though, and say that I think this gamestate feels better than rand that PC/Brian isn't TvT. I just came out of a game where town didn't manage to wagon scum day 1, and the vibes i'm getting here feel different to the gamestate of that game.

viewtopic.php?t=92315

This is the game for reference, the day 1 there, a higher amount of flippancy was present (like there was a decent amount of "i'm fine with either"), there was a higher amount of hesitation in terms of pushing, and it kind of just felt like people didn't have a vested interest in who got limmed there (to the point where one of the players called this out shortly before that day ended).

Comparatively it just generally feels like people give more of a **** (innocent censor ) about who's getting flipped here that feels like there is something at stake there.

Like it could just be a different flavor of the same vibe, or the difference could be due to the playerlist, so I wouldn't say i'm sure on Brian/PC having scum there. I do think it feels better than rand though given the above.

[SmileyDude1]

Quick Readlist time
(Feel better about)
(Feel neutral/eh about)
(Feel worse about)

yellow

= stale read, should be adapted at some point. Though depending on pertinence and inner motivation (warding off my inner lazeball), I may not get around to all of these immediately.

(Blackstar,

greeting

,

Straightflush

, Political Clout)
(

PenguinPower

,Titus, Yessirree, Hu Tao, KayJayQueue)
(Random Nurse, Davesaz, Brian Skies)

greeting and straight were more mind meld reads (found myself agreeing with a lot of what they were saying), that part of my brain became paranoid of (though another part of my brain thinks it may be getting influenced by recent thread events). probs my top priorities in terms of a relook.

Penguin is a case where I feel like they've done a lot to the point they probs shouldn't be in neutral but I haven't gotten around to sorting it yet. Like my gut says it feels good, but I my brain says take another look to be sure. Don't find that one to be a particularly pertinent read to sort atm though.

Nurse and Dave also could be put into stale read given both of those suspicions date back to stuff that happened a while ago now, though I don't think either has really done much since then that warrants raising them. A case of need to see more in that seense

[SmileyDude1]

StraightFlush fell for the bait. So he's probably scum.

I'm going to say Dave/StraightFlush/????

To be clear, HT you are implying that you took issue with Straight's 369 response to your 346 right?

[SmileyDude1]

htinking Brian is town here; gives off the energy from our last game where he was town and how confrontational he was. I also think he would know to have better optics as scum whereas town he would care less

liking my vote still, think I got something there. I find it a little odd how so many people seemed ready to defend Hu Tao. Could either be Hu's partner, or TMIing she's town. Think there's a good chance at hitting scum in that group

VOTE: PC

Also was wondering what changed for you on PC since you took this stance from earlier

Meh, i feel pc and bs are both town based on this page but i am still on vacay and need to read.

My pc read is stale and go vca.

Lean town on Brian.

Would still like an answer to the below btw, when you have time. Anyone else feel free to answer if you have input, pinging you two cause both of you explicitly stated a town lean on Brian

Those who town lean Brian can I have you respond to my case in 269 (presented below for convenience).

Looked through Brian's ISO starting from their original Political Clout vote and came away with a negative outlook

Spoiler: Quote Wall

VOTE: Political Clout

They originally vote PC here

So, what, you're wanting some wagons to develop?

Sounds a bit suss to me.

Wagons are a valuable tool for hunting scum.

yessiree seems town to me.

This implies they voted there in order to create competing wagons for the benefit of scum hunting. I don't think their reasoning in 185 tracks with these initial postings. Like i get not pointing out the exact reasoning immediately if you think it should be apparent, but I feel like town in that position would've at least alluded to the fact that they were voting due to seeing scum-indicative behavior if that was the reasoning. The progression from this point doesn't feel natural to me.

Sure, I see myself more as an analyzer than a scum hunter.

This is in response to PC's 179 and I don't think this makes sense either when looked at from the perspective of scumreading PC from before. This response assumes a level of good faith that I don't think matches with the stance they took in 185. I would expect Brian to be more immediately dubious of PC here given the stance they took if that was there natural thought process.

I'm not really convinced your vote on me is anything other than OMGUS.

This is the last post they made before their 185 and I think it has the same issue as the above post. I feel like calling PC's vote an OMGUS there also kind of assumes a level of good faith that doesn't match here. Like OMGUS does have negative connotation, but it leaves room for "misguided townie making a bad vote" in such a way that it feels dissonant given the stated thought process indicates that Brian would've believed that PC is more likely scum than town at this point. I could see this post being an attempt at giving themselves an off-ramp with 185 coming afterwards when PC doesn't back down.

It kind of gets into heated back and forth between the two slots afterwards that I don't think I have enough expertise with emotions to accurately sort (not to mention I don't think i'd get much out of it anyways)

Conclusion: I don't think Brian's PC read is real. I feel like if they were voting PC for AI behavior specifically, they'd have been more likely to allude to that at some point before their argument, and their interaction with PC before they stated the reason they voted there doesn't feel like it was approached in the manner I'd expect if they harbored a preexisting scumlean/scumread of the slot. This feels like it's a justification made in post in response to PC pressuring them to me.

VOTE: Brian

It's post midnight where I am right now, will probs be back tomorrow

And I think that's it for now. Sorry for spamming the thread a bit, will let it cool off

[SmileyDude1]

Quick Readlist time
(Feel better about)
(Feel neutral/eh about)
(Feel worse about)

yellow

= stale read, should be adapted at some point. Though depending on pertinence and inner motivation (warding off my inner lazeball), I may not get around to all of these immediately.

(Blackstar,

greeting

,

Straightflush

, Political Clout)
(

PenguinPower

,Titus, Yessirree, Hu Tao, KayJayQueue)
(Random Nurse, Davesaz, Brian Skies)

greeting and straight were more mind meld reads (found myself agreeing with a lot of what they were saying), that part of my brain became paranoid of (though another part of my brain thinks it may be getting influenced by recent thread events). probs my top priorities in terms of a relook.

Penguin is a case where I feel like they've done a lot to the point they probs shouldn't be in neutral but I haven't gotten around to sorting it yet. Like my gut says it feels good, but I my brain says take another look to be sure. Don't find that one to be a particularly pertinent read to sort atm though.

Nurse and Dave also could be put into stale read given both of those suspicions date back to stuff that happened a while ago now, though I don't think either has really done much since then that warrants raising them. A case of need to see more in that seense

Decent list, but I find it hard to believe that Titus and yessiree could be anything resembling null at present. Perhaps a better explanation is in order.

In this case. I think both of these are just cases of slots that I felt had reads on a smaller bandwidth of players then the tier above for me to judge off of. Titus feels like they're generally making decisions that benefit the gamestate, but she just hasn't really outted much in terms of reads on other players (main instances to the contrary being Brian and greeting). Yes feels closer to a read i'd consider stale, I think their response to your inquiry earlier to feel fine. Kind of has the same reasoning as Titus where their stance and contribution in regards to wagons feel good, but it seems to come at a cost of individual reads feeling vague. Came to the conclusion on Yes a while ago though (like to the point I kind of forgot why I'd originally put them there), so that probs is another slot I need to reread again at some point.

Will say that I feel strongest on Brian right now, and that is also causing a slight penalty to be incurred for the above two (like if I were to preflip Brian!Scum, my brain's immediate gut reaction is to look there), though I don't really like doing team solving like that until scum has actually flipped (tbh even then I wouldn't say it's my go to, feel like i'm more of a 1 step at a time type when it comes to these things) so the effect there is minor.

[SmileyDude1]

1.8

Flavor coming a bit later

---

Brian Skies (4) :

Political Clout / BlackStar / SmileyDude1 / KayJayQueue

Political Clout (3) :

Davesaz / Brian Skies / yessiree

Random Nurse (2) :

Greeting / PenguinPower

StraightFlush (1) :

Hu Tao

greeting (1) :

Titus

Not Voting (2) :

Random Nurse / StraightFlush

With 13 alive, it takes 7 votes to execute someone, day 1 ends in (expired on 2024-03-25 13:02:46)

vote history

PenguinPower :

yessiree (8) -> Brian Skies (29) -> Random Nurse (118) -> Political Clout (284) -> KayJayQueue (405) -> Random Nurse (415)

yessiree :

PenguinPower (9) -> Political Clout (82) -> Hu Tao (121) -> Political Clout (316)

Davesaz :

greeting (13) -> Political Clout (76)

BlackStar :

Political Clout (18) -> Unvote(52) -> Random Nurse (90) -> Brian Skies (250)

KayJayQueue :

Brian Skies (22) -> Titus (95) -> Brian Skies (271)

Political Clout :

Politicial Clout (26) -> Brian Skies (151)

SmileyDude1 :

Brian Skies (27) -> Unvote (91) -> Davesaz (92) -> Unvote (256) -> SmileyDude1 (269)

Greeting :

BlackStar (70) -> Unvote (332) -> Random Nurse (335)

Brian Skies :

Political Clout (83)

TItus :

Random Nurse (94) -> Political Clout (285) -> Greeting (422)

StraightFlush :

yessiree (124) -> Brian Skies (216) -> Unvote (400)

Hu Tao :

yessiree (128) -> Brian Skies (419) -> Unvote (420) -> StraightFlush (421)

mod notes

-

@Gypyx

, there's an error in my vote history btw. I voted Brian Skies in my 269 not myself.

[SmileyDude1]

Conclusion: I don't think Brian's PC read is real. I feel like if they were voting PC for AI behavior specifically, they'd have been more likely to allude to that at some point before their argument, and their interaction with PC before they stated the reason they voted there doesn't feel like it was approached in the manner I'd expect if they harbored a preexisting scumlean/scumread of the slot. This feels like it's a justification made in post in response to PC pressuring them to me.

interesting cause thats how i feel about PC in that whole back and forth between them

i think we just have fundamental differences in what we consider scummy/townie, but part of my townraed on brian also comes from the last game so theres a bit of meta involved. Things like being confrontational and assertive early on, being critical of the gamestate as time goes on, etc

Can I have you go more into the bolded point, why do you think this?

[SmileyDude1]

Ok, so read over the game in 460 and Brian feels somewhat similar to here I think. It feels like their rate of generating reads felt the same in both games, though I felt in the linked game Brian was generally more adaptive with his reads than what I've seen from them here so far. I did see instances in the link where Brian was pretty confrontational so I can see how Yes came to that read.

I guess my thing is I'm currently scumreading Brian due to them having an illogical progression from a town perspective imo, and I didn't really see anything in that game that points to that being natural or reasonable for town!Brian.

This is tough because I think I mainly scumread Brian off play and I don't think meta is going to be of much help in that instance. Thing is some of their behavior doesn't vibe with what I would expect scum to do in spots and I can see some similarities with their town game. There's a part of me that thinks I might be hard tunneled or putting too much focus in the wrong thing, though it is the scumread I feel most confident about by a large margin right now.

I'm probably going to try to take another look at some other people sometime tomorrow and see if I can get to a similar level of confidence there.

[SmileyDude1]

Also for reference we are less than 3 days out from deadline (~2 and 1/2 days as of the time of this post)

[SmileyDude1]

WE TOPPING THE PAGES WITH THIS ONE!

[SmileyDude1]

and would you look at that it's midnight where i'm at now,

drifting into sleep mode, catch you later

[SmileyDude1]

-SNIP-

one thing that gives me a lot of pause is how the thread died it seems scum might be comfortable here. Let me think on it more. I might convince myself but I wanna hear what smiley has to say.

I'm also open to titus moving me from brian.

That point does seem fairly prescient, and I would agree that the game's slowed down a bit. I'm not sure if it's more a sign of entrenched viewpoints or scum content with the gamestate and that's worrying to say the least.

I think given the gamestate we're likely either in a scumBrian/ Town! PC world or in the world where there both just town. I feel like i've probs been the person most aggressive in terms of pushing here, and I think in a Scum!PC/ Town Brian world PC's buddies likely just sheep me onto Brian. I'd say the wagon actually has decompressed a bit since it's peak which doesn't feel like it happens if PC scum here unless both buddies were on the wagon already necessitating exactly PC/Blackstar/Kay solve which I don't really see here.

[SmileyDude1]

Here's an idea, speed wagon Greeting.

So i've reread Greeting while at work and I think i'm Ok with trying this out.


Looking back I noticed some weird idiosyncracies in their play such as their readlist in 225 having Blackstar at the bottom when there seemed to be no indication of suspicion there besides what I presumed to be an RVS vote and their 333 which feels like a weird perspective given that myself and Straight (refer back to their readlist) were on the wagon at that time,


Kind of agree with your point that in the world where Brian/PC is town vs town, it makes sense for scum to waffle on making a decision there. Was initially unsure given they advocated a Random Nurse wagon, due to my opinion that this seemed like a dangerous play to make considering it risks diverting away from Brian/PC which would be bad for scum if they're both town. Though upon rereading again I realized that it didn't come organically, it came after Kay pressed them in their 334 and wasn't really expanded upon after their initial vote there.

Wouldn't say i'm confident, but there's enough there that inspires doubt that I'm willing to see where this goes

VOTE: Greeting

[SmileyDude1]

the speed of the Greeting wagon makes me think he's probably not scum here

admittedly had slight paranoia creeped in for a sec myself, though I think given the amount of time left, it's semi-inevitable that new wagons are going to coalesce fast here so it feels NAI to me.

Think the better metric to judge it on would be judging based on who hopped on the wagon and seeing if motivations make sense, do you see any inconsistencies there?

[SmileyDude1]

I need to be someone’s butler. Can I pretend this is botc? Who wants to let me serve them so I don’t have to think about my vote lol I don’t know why I’m finding this particular game so difficult to get a good read on.

Who would you say you trust most right now. When in doubt sheep a townread?

Spoiler: rambling

(i'm actually going through a slight mini-crisis with the above advice right now. Cause obviously i'd prefer you stand behind your own take cause it makes you easier to read, so my gut doesn't want to suggest you just sheep someone, but my brain says suggesting you do this still gleans useful info for later while making it easier to engage now. Anyways this is a bit of a irrelevant ramble so i'm probs just going to spoiler this.

[SmileyDude1]

I need to be someone’s butler. Can I pretend this is botc? Who wants to let me serve them so I don’t have to think about my vote lol I don’t know why I’m finding this particular game so difficult to get a good read on.

Who would you say you trust most right now. When in doubt sheep a townread?

Spoiler: rambling

(i'm actually going through a slight mini-crisis with the above advice right now. Cause obviously i'd prefer you stand behind your own take cause it makes you easier to read, so my gut doesn't want to suggest you just sheep someone, but my brain says suggesting you do this still gleans useful info for later while making it easier to engage now. Anyways this is a bit of a irrelevant ramble so i'm probs just going to spoiler this.

I trust no one.

Hmm, given this stance, why offer to lend out your vote then?

[SmileyDude1]

We have a little over a day left before deadline here. IMO, the following should be provided ASAP from everyone here.

1. A pool of people you'd be willing to launch here
2. A general statement in regards to whether you'll be available before deadline

i'll start.

(Brian,Greeting)- Preferred Launches. Mixture of higher confidence suspicions and high info equity motivate these choices

(Nurse, PC)-Compromise Launches. Don't like these nearly as much, Have minor suspicions on Nurse but it feels like a blegh low-info lim if town here (+ gut is giving me similar vibes to the last game i played where he was town). PC is a lim I really don't like since I feel their likely just town here, but objectively it probs would give the most info to launch either them or Brian today. I'd join these if it came to it (probs would more readily join a nurse wagon than a PC wagon at this moment), but i'd probably be a bit of an unhappy camper for having to do so.

For me most everyone else is some combo of low info equity or low confidence this hits red. I'd probs be willing to hammer a good chunk of these to avoid a no-lim but I don't rally have interest joining beforehand.

I should be around at various points throughout today, but i'm likely not going to be able to be here to discuss after I go to sleep tonight. Pretty sure deadline will occur while i'm at work tomorrow, so I can probs only be there to hammer at that point.

[SmileyDude1]

UNVOTE:

Don't want this hammered before Greeting has a chance to give input

[SmileyDude1]

whatevs, don't need to prove myself to anyone. Just would rather hear from Greeting first if possible before going forward.

[SmileyDude1]

No worries, didn't take much exception to it. it's all good

[SmileyDude1]

I do think

Brian Skies

and

Political Clout

are both town.

Greeting if you can come online soonish, that would be nice.

[SmileyDude1]

I'm probs going to get ready for bed in 3 hours from now. Will revote Greeting if I don't hear from them by then.

[SmileyDude1]

Alright then VOTE: Greeting
E-1

Aight, Greeting can go ahead and claim

I'd say I agree with this at this point. Probs not going to be able to do more than blank votes the rest of this phase due to work, will try to make time to hammer if need be should things shift.

Goodnight, everyone

[SmileyDude1]

ggs to the scum team, well played

[SmileyDude1]

Despite having 4 power roles, I did not think town had a lot of power in this game and can understand why you would want to put 3 goons. However, the number of power roles town had naturally makes one think mafia has as least one power role, even if it's a weak one. But this is all just my opinion.

I noticed the vote tracker, but I did not utilize it.

Kay, I wouldn't beat yourself up over this game. You were the most resistant to the idea of Enchant being cleared. And I probably would've screwed up in your place. This was also not a good game for me and I can understand if you just thought I was scummy.

+1

This pretty much sums up my thoughts.

[SmileyDude1]

From the Mod PT:

just tried it 2 more times and got Random Nurse and Blackstar.

Game is solved, you can thank me later.

lol

If only I had followed the RNG