Mini 715: Legends of Literature Mafia (Over)

[CarnCarn]

Vote: roflcopter

Any reason why?

Yes

[Caboose]

Vote: roflcopter

Any reason why?

Yes

I think I know what you mean CC.
But no, you're almost definitely wrong.

[vaquero]

I'm not scum - I only have one vote at this point so I won't roleclaim yet (that would make it easier on the mafia) but I will if pressed. For now all I can really say is I'm not scum, I wasn't lying about my reasons for trying to slow the Sly wagon. Note I said 'slow'. I just didn't want him to go down without a chance to explain himself. I also think that if you look back at my posts, my vote for Sly hardly came out of nowhere. I gradually became more suspicious of him as the game went on. And I know that could be interpreted as busing, but I don't know what to tell you other than it wasn't.

That said, I think Caboose is right on the money about CC. And if we accept for a second that CC is scum, I think we should be wary of his comments about RBT.

Vote: roflcopter

Any reason why?

Yes

This, to me, looks like CC is tying himself to RBT so that if we kill CC or accept that he's scum, we think RBT is scum. This seems particularly likely since he hasn't given any reasons for his defense of RBT, so as to appear scummy. If he and RBt were actually scumpartners though, he would earnestly be trying to defend him, rather than throwing up a weak one-line argument. The fact that he defended RBT in such a transparent way tells me that he's trying to connect himself to RBT in the way that he was connected to Sly, so that we possibly kill the wrong person.

Now, before that gets taken out of context, I'm not saying RBT is innocent. I'm saying there's a chance he's not, and we need to ask ourselves if all of the pieces fit. This is what I was doing with Sly; this is the way I play mafia. The more ideas that are shared by players, the more time people have to defend themselves, the better it is for townies.

Vote: roflcopter

Any reason why?

Yes

[vaquero]

EBWOP

My apologies on that last post - didn't mean to post the quote twice.

[roflcopter]

vaquero and scum are both scum lets finish this

[Tenchi]

don't buy the claim, tracking ice makes no sense

I want to ask Roflcopter: What makes you think so?

Next:

This, to me, looks like CC is tying himself to RBT so that if we kill CC or accept that he's scum, we think RBT is scum.

I think that's stupid. Why would "scum CC" associate with the most suspicious person in the game?

[roflcopter]

ice is obvtown thats why tracking him makes no sense

[Tenchi]

No, tracker.

Sly N0, didn't leave his house.
Ice N1, no result (probably RB'd)

Question RBT: Somebody died N0. Why did Sly didn't leave the house? Does this mean that scum needs to specify a person to do the kill (I haven't heard of this one before) or does this imply a third-party killed him?

[Riceballtail]

Usually the scum have to select an individual to perform the kill, so a tracker result does not, necessairly, confirm or deny someone's innocence. It merely says if they have a night action, and who they targetted.

[Der Hammer]

Vote Count

Riceballtail (2): icemanE, roflcopter
vaquero (1): Caboose
roflcopter (1): CarnCarn

Not Voting (6)
Tenchi
vaquero
Riceballtail
GhostWriter
neko2086

Mada

Jazzmyn

6 to get a lynch.

Jazzmyn is replacing Mada, and Ghostwriter has responded to his prod and will continue playing

[Caboose]

I think that's stupid. Why would "scum CC" associate with the most suspicious person in the game?

Oh no. Here comes the WIFOM.

I see rofl's point about RBT and I have another issue with the claim. Farside was a miller, implying the existance of a cop. There's a cop

and

a tracker in a 12 player game? I find that a little hard to swallow. Also, assuming that RBT is telling the truth, I think he (am I using the correct pronoun?) was roleblocked by a town RB.

I think I'm beginning to figure out CC, and I think he's scum.

This, to me, looks like CC is tying himself to RBT so that if we kill CC or accept that he's scum, we think RBT is scum. This seems particularly likely since he hasn't given any reasons for his defense of RBT, so as to appear scummy.

Nope, not it. CC is trying to act very power-rolish to try to bring down rofl. But really, it's classic mafia trying to bring down someone who can't be nightkilled. He's not necessarily tying himself to RBT.

[roflcopter]

yeah thats a good point too. cop + town doctor or rb (something prevented that kill), i think a tracker on top of that would be terribly unbalanced

[CarnCarn]

I will shortly compile the list of reasons why rofl is scum. SlySly's death miller claim should not be dismissed so easily.

[Caboose]

I will shortly compile the list of reasons why rofl is scum. SlySly's death miller claim should not be dismissed so easily.

Do what?
So we have a death miller and a miller in the same game?

That's complete bullcrap.

[CarnCarn]

So we have a death miller and a miller in the same game?

Sure, why not? It's possible. Shere Khan is pretty much a textbook villan in Jungle Book, but Comrade Napoleon (from Animal Farm?) doesn't make much sense as a miller. In fact, he's kind of a real villan himself in the actual book, towards the end.
Also, this is kind of WIFOMy, but why the hell would scum claim death miller when it is such a rare role, when there is already a miller dead, and when there are better roles that they can "out" if they feel they are going to be lynched?
In addition, SlySly had no one defending him at all D1 for his case on Caboose, which suggest to me that he was really town who got lynched too easily. RBT and vaquero offered the most "defense" in that they suggested Sly was getting too much attention early in the game, but they then placed the L-1 and hammer votes on SS too quickly for it to have been scum bussing by them.

---

roflcopter:

should we perhaps claim our novels? it can only serve to limit future fakeclaims from scum, which is a good thing imo

Only? And it does no such thing since, as all of our novels are "Legends of Literature", we can have any number of possible character-fakeclaims. Then, when I suggest a possible drawback to his scummy plan, he attacks me for doing so, and asserts that I am scum for thinking so:

Scum could be looking for character(s) from certain books, etc.

unvote, vote: carncarn

that implies some sort of inside knowledge about scum mechanics

The reasoning has no basis, and the motive for this post is to turn his scummy play of suggesting mass book-claim into a manipulated, twisted attack on the person who pointed out why the plan is bad.

from where i'm sitting, the vaquero case gets a lot stronger once slysly is dead scum, and moving your vote derailed all momentum on the slysly wagon,

effectively stalling the game, which is exactly what vaquero wanted anyway, so you're playing right into his hands.

Emphasized. Once again, we have pretty blatant misrep here to make another player look scummy; not unlike how he misportrays my comments re: bookclaiming.

vaquero

vaquero

Tried to stop the scumSly wagon early. Stalling defense. Late jump onto scumSly wagon. Very scummy.

Riceballtail

Riceballtail

Also tried to stop the scumSly wagon, stalling defense. Another late jump onto scumSly wagon.

My biggest suspicion falls on RBT from this list for trying to kill a scumwagon's momentum and late vote jump onto scumSly.

Vote: Riceballtail

looks like caboose has this one on lockdown

vote: riceballtail

I really don't like this vote, especially because Caboose's "case" was the same against both vaq and RBT, and rofl, from post 100 quoted above, suggested that the vaquero case would make more sense when Sly flipped scum. So, why is voting RBT now on basically nothing but Caboose's equivalent case against RBT and vaquero? Seems like scum hoping/having planned out a wagon for today, and person was RBT.

I also don't like icemanE's vote, which is pretty similar. I also think he is pretty scummy based on some of his voting patterns D1. I'll explain his case separately when I have more time.

don't buy the claim, tracking ice makes no sense

Wait, why?

ice is obvtown thats why tracking him makes no sense

Wait, how?

my theory is that you claim to have a negative track result on sly to try and explain away your scummy behavior regarding him yesterday and you claim to have been rbed last night because you probably were, thus why there was no kill

This makes no sense and is probably fabricated just to make RBT's night actions look more scummy. Why is a negative track result on Sly something that scum would make up? And why would it explain away their "scummy behavior"? Why would scum claim to have been RB'd last night, since, for their claim to work (i.e., convince people they are town), that would require at least one roleblocker to be in the setup (i.e., if there is no roleblocker in the setup, that scum gets lynched in endgame/after massclaim anyway)?

yeah thats a good point too. cop + town doctor or rb (something prevented that kill), i think a tracker on top of that would be terribly unbalanced

Why do you think there would be a cop, doc, protown RB in this game? There are lots of other reasons why the kill might not have gone through. Plus, it's quite possible mafia have powers to balance things out, too (mafia RB, doc, GF, etc.), even if those protown roles were in the game. Plus, with mini-themes, I don't think lots of power roles necessarily means the game is unbalanced anyway.
roflcopter is trying too hard to discredit the Tracker claim, which is really scummy.

Overall, at this point, I'm pretty sure roflcopter is the most likely to be scum and is thus the best lynch today.

[Caboose]

Sure, why not? It's possible.

Death Miller and Miller in the same game? I will assume that DH is a competant mod.

Shere Khan is pretty much a textbook villan in Jungle Book, but Comrade Napoleon (from Animal Farm?) doesn't make much sense as a miller. In fact, he's kind of a real villan himself in the actual book, towards the end.

What's your point? We know Farside was a miller, sense or no sense.

In addition, SlySly had no one defending him at all D1 for his case on Caboose, which suggest to me that he was really town who got lynched too easily. RBT and vaquero offered the most "defense" in that they suggested Sly was getting too much attention early in the game, but they then placed the L-1 and hammer votes on SS too quickly for it to have been scum bussing by them.

So scum have to have their scumbuddy defending them to be scum? Come on.

And I don't get your late bandwagon vote thing, either. Are you saying that it couldn't have been bussing because it was so quick? In fact, I think that the scumbuddies would want the day to end quickly to curtail discussion. Give me a break, that's just a load of craplogic.

Only? And it does no such thing since, as all of our novels are "Legends of Literature", we can have any number of possible character-fakeclaims. Then, when I suggest a possible drawback to his scummy plan, he attacks me for doing so, and asserts that I am scum for thinking so:

It wasn't a scummy suggestion. It was bad. It wasn't scummy.

Emphasized. Once again, we have pretty blatant misrep here to make another player look scummy; not unlike how he misportrays my comments re: bookclaiming.

No misrep exists. vaquero

was

trying to stall a scumSly lynch. Stop trying to invent misrep.

I really don't like this vote, especially because Caboose's "case" was the same against both vaq and RBT, and rofl, from post 100 quoted above, suggested that the vaquero case would make more sense when Sly flipped scum. So, why is voting RBT now on basically nothing but Caboose's equivalent case against RBT and vaquero? Seems like scum hoping/having planned out a wagon for today, and person was RBT.

I also don't like icemanE's vote, which is pretty similar. I also think he is pretty scummy based on some of his voting patterns D1. I'll explain his case separately when I have more time.

So it's not possible that rofl just thought both of them to be scummy?

This makes no sense and is probably fabricated just to make RBT's night actions look more scummy. Why is a negative track result on Sly something that scum would make up?

If you read the post, you would know why the negative result of Sly is something that scum would make up.
Scumbuddy defends scum that gets lynched
Scumbuddy then claims negative result N0 on scumbuddy in order to explain away D1 behavior

Make sense?

And why would it explain away their "scummy behavior"? Why would scum claim to have been RB'd last night, since, for their claim to work (i.e., convince people they are town), that would require at least one roleblocker to be in the setup (i.e., if there is no roleblocker in the setup, that scum gets lynched in endgame/after massclaim anyway)?

*facepalm*
Why would a scum roleblocker claim in the endgame?

This load of horse hockey is just too much for me. I can't believe that you're actually trying to make an argument that a miller and death miller exist in the same game AND I can't believe that you're calling rofl down on non-scumtells. There are a lot of holes in your arguments. Compound the fact that you were chainsaw defended by scumSly and you lurked most of this game and we have scum.

Still think that vaquero is guilty, but

Unvote
Vote: CarnCarn

[CarnCarn]

Why are you answering for rofl?

FoS: Caboose

I'll respond to your points later.

[Caboose]

Why are you answering for rofl?

FoS: Caboose

I'll respond to your points later.

Were you addressing rofl? I thought you were just laying out your crappy case for all to see and comment on. The FoS also reeks of OMGUS.

[CarnCarn]

Why are you answering for rofl?

FoS: Caboose

I'll respond to your points later.

Were you addressing rofl? I thought you were just laying out your crappy case for all to see and comment on. The FoS also reeks of OMGUS.

Yes, no, and not really because the connection between you and rofl is pretty clear from as early as page 2 for anyone who's paid even the slightest attention to this game.

[CarnCarn]

Vote: roflcopter

Any reason why?

Yes

I think I know what you mean CC.
But no, you're almost definitely wrong.

Also, please explain what you thought I meant.

[Caboose]

Why are you answering for rofl?

FoS: Caboose

I'll respond to your points later.

Were you addressing rofl? I thought you were just laying out your crappy case for all to see and comment on. The FoS also reeks of OMGUS.

Yes, no, and not really because the connection between you and rofl is pretty clear from as early as page 2 for anyone who's paid even the slightest attention to this game.

I tend to defend people who are crap attacked.

And are you seriously trying to make a case that I'm scum and the Sly is a death miller?

[GhostWriter]

Vote: roflcopter

Any reason why?

Yes

I think I know what you mean CC.
But no, you're almost definitely wrong.

Also, please explain what you thought I meant.

I'd actually like for that to be answered. You just kind of threw that out there, hinting at something, and then didn't explain what you thought you knew Carn meant. I'd like to hear what it is and how it is definitely wrong.

[roflcopter]

Vote: roflcopter

Any reason why?

Yes

I think I know what you mean CC.
But no, you're almost definitely wrong.

Also, please explain what you thought I meant.

I'd actually like for that to be answered. You just kind of threw that out there, hinting at something, and then didn't explain what you thought you knew Carn meant. I'd like to hear what it is and how it is definitely wrong.

hint: stop fishing

[Jazzmyn]

Hello, all.

As Der Hammer mentioned above, I am replacing Mada. I will read the thread and catch up as soon as possible, hopefully by tomorrow night, but Tuesday at latest.

Regards,
Jazz

[Caboose]

Vote: roflcopter

Any reason why?

Yes

I think I know what you mean CC.
But no, you're almost definitely wrong.

Also, please explain what you thought I meant.

I'd actually like for that to be answered. You just kind of threw that out there, hinting at something, and then didn't explain what you thought you knew Carn meant. I'd like to hear what it is and how it is definitely wrong.

Stop fishing. Wake up and see the fact that CC is obvscum.