Mini 692: Boost Mafia (Game Over!)

[Green Crayons]

I don't entirely believe that your vote was placed as a last minute "preventing a 'No Lynch'" vote.

vote: ice. Because a no lynch is bad.

I think what I said at the time speaks for itself. I'll also note that I had my lynch on iceman before anyone else yesterday, and took it off after things had started to heat up. My vote was then placed on him once again after the deadline was nigh. The claim that I only voted him because I was jumping on the bandwagon is just ignorant - I was voting him

before the bandwagon began

, unvoted to switch to Huntress and only reapplied my vote because I preferred a ice-lynch over an Eld-lynch.

To me, this looks very much like you were warming up to the idea of icemanE being scum. Do you agree or disagree with this assessment?

out of the two leading lynch candidates (ice and Eld), I thought iceman was the less believable of the two.

The one of the reasons I thought iceman was the better lynch than Eld was because:

How am I supposed to not vote you after you yourself admitted to lying to the town about your lurking?

I was warming up to the idea that iceman was more likely scum than Eld. Thus, I voted accordingly as a deadline was breathing down our necks.

I'm thinking on a TDC-GC pair now...

Any special reason why?

I think he makes some ok points, but that post is a lot more wordy than it needs to be.

Welcome to the story of my life.

I'm not big on reading meta, not because it isn't useful, but because it requires me reading through a bunch of games when I have neither the time nor inclination to utilize what free time I do have to engage in such a mind numbing process. So, for you metaheads out there: Xtox's town meta basically boils down to being crappy and his scum meta boils down to him being not as crappy?

And I think I might be putting a vote on TDC. I need to reread his posts to reassure the scum vibes I'm getting, but since I think the scum partner is either Xtox or RR, I would rather go for the constant other player in the scum pair (assuming there are two left, that is): TDC.

[Elmo]

Day 3, Vote Count #2 - Lynching

Xtoxm <- Raging Rabbit
Raging Rabbit <- eldarad
Green Crayons <- Xtoxm

Not voting: Green Crayons, TDC, Incognito.

Boost Count

Eldarad (2) <- Green Crayons, TDC
Xtoxm <- Incognito
TDC <- Raging Rabbit

Incognito will be boosted in twilight. With 6 alive, it's 4 to lynch/boost.

[eldarad]

Eld, if you think i'm town, boost me.

I don't think you're a safe boost. I think the best boost Today is me, as it happens, but I don't get to make that call.
Raging Rabbit is correct that if I am right about him being scum, he can only really be scum with you. I have not discounted that possibility, although I don't particuarly regard it, in a vacuum, of being more likely than any other possible scumpair. Although see below...

eldarad, I never got the impression that Raging Rabbit ever tried to link anyone with anyone. I always felt like the cases he pushed against people were completely independent of one another (for example, when he came after me and iLord pretty hard during Day 1, I never felt like he thought the two of us were a scum team -- just that we were independently scummy).

If anything, that adds weight to my argument - RR isn't linking people he thinks are scum to each other indiscriminately, he's only linking people to Xtoxm. It also shows how RR's defence "it's natural to try to find scumpartners for people you think are scum" doesn't hold water when applied to his approach to people who aren't sthar/Xtoxm.

For examples of RR linking sthar/Xtoxm to others, I would point to post 766 where the sthar-Iceman pair emerges (when finally modified by post 776. #764 attempts to link me to "sthar or Electra"
Most of Yesterday RR was working hard to link Iceman to Xtoxm, as I pointed out at the time.

I find this vote count interesting because the wagon on Skillit involved four (4) different players who are currently alive whose alignments are unknown
<snip>
What are your current thoughts on this? More specifically, who do you think of the remaining three people (I'm not including you for obvious reasons) the scums are?

Well my first reaction is to be very impressed at my own incitefulness way back in post 389. I still think it is true.
It's also consistent with my view that RR-Xtoxm as scum is plausible.

Thinking about it, I have failed to realise how few potential scumpairs are left:

RR-Xtoxm

: I'm prepared to gamble on this scumpair with our lynch Today. I can shift to Xtoxm in order to also cover the possible GC-Xtoxm pair (and, to a lesser extent, the TDC-Xtoxm pair).

GC-TDC

: I have re-read both of these players in isolation recently, and I just don't see anything scummy about either of them.

GC-Xtoxm

: huh. It does fit the "one of the Skillit wagoners is scum, even if Skillit is scum" mould. I guess it's possible.

TDC-Xtoxm

: which is not likely given the vote count you have just quoted. I don't see both scum jumping on Skillit's early Day 1 wagon.

To me, RR is the high-stakes lynch. If RR is scum, we automatically get his scumbuddy. A Xtoxm lynch covers more bases but by definition makes Tomorrow wide-open. On top of that, a Xtoxm lynch appears to have majority support if pushed, pending the massclaim.

Speaking of which, GC - you're up...

[Green Crayons]

I'm a psychic. If I'm boosted, I can determine if someone made a night choice by targetting them. If I'm double boosted, I can determine who that person's target was, if anyone.

[Raging Rabbit]

NG 651

Scary.

I never knew about that game, but I don't think it changes my vantage point. Xtoxm, what does farside know about your gameplay?

How can that not change your vantage point? Your whole meta premise relies on Xtoxm never being in tune with the game as scum. This game shows your assumption can sometimes be false, and from Xtoxm's recent posting it's clear he knew you're capable of reading him and would therefore be onto him very quickly if he played his usual scum game. If he has the ability and the motive to be in tune as scum, why automatically assume he couldn't have done that?

For examples of RR linking sthar/Xtoxm to others, I would point to post 766 where the sthar-Iceman pair emerges (when finally modified by post 776. #764 attempts to link me to "sthar or Electra"
Most of Yesterday RR was working hard to link Iceman to Xtoxm, as I pointed out at the time.

D1 I always go for lynching the scummiest player regardless of possible linkage, as the info we have about others' alignments is too slim. D2 I had stronger suspicions and also thought ahead about who could be the third member of the Jahudo-prime suspect X scumteam. Iceman and Xtoxm happened to be both my two top suspects and strongly connected, so off course I tried to "link" them.

[Raging Rabbit]

Oh, and I'm vanilla.

Mod

, can the same player be double-boosted?

[Xtoxm]

Meta is based on feel.

You are retarded.

[Raging Rabbit]

Meta is based on feel.

You are retarded.

Not true. It's based on both feel and analysis, like most other things in mafia. I doubt the swearing helps your cause much.

[Xtoxm]

I couldn't care less.

[TDC]

I'm vanilla, too.

[Incognito]

--No Read--
fuzzylightning (RandomGem)
eldarad

Green Crayons, can you explain what it was or has been about eldarad's play that had you list him as neutral to begin with and most recently be practically sold on his towniness? Also, with regard to your role, does your role PM really go into that level of detail with regard to boosting or did you deduce all of that on your own?

---

eldarad, why didn't you respond to my question about Green Crayons?:

What do people think about Green Crayons's post 649?

Raging Rabbit, upon closer examination of that "scary" game, Xtoxm pretty much produced walls of words that didn't really amount to much and pretty much joked around much of the time. The content looks scarier when I just glazed through it but when I actually examined it, I noticed that he was still quite lurky and still fairly IIoA. There's a different feel here with Xtoxm in Boost.

[Patrick]

Mod, can the same player be double-boosted?

No. Two different people have to be boosted each day.

[eldarad]

I am a vanilla townie.

unvote

because I don't think GC's claim checks out but I'm going to give him an opportunity to elaborate.

Incog, I see your question and I'll answer it later.

[Xtoxm]

I think GC is confirmed scum, seeing as no one else knows their role name.

Boost me, then lynch plox.

[TDC]

Incognito: Do you have an explicit role name?

[Incognito]

Nope. Just knew I was a vig by deduction. Look at the other people who flipped power too and how they all claimed at one point another. Electra specifically even went so far as to call herself a

Vanilla

who gets a power when boosted when she was actually revealed as a Researcher.

[TDC]

I also remember Huntress claiming "Booster" and not "Priest".

None of the other claims included boost descriptions this detailed either. (Nevermind the "double boost"-thing).

I could see the Mod including roles with or without names, but including just one role with a name? (Well I suppose Guardian might've had "Doctor", but we'll never know.)

[Incognito]

I don't think you're a safe boost.

I think the best boost Today is me, as it happens, but I don't get to make that call.

I am a vanilla townie.

[Xtoxm]

Also interesting, is how TDC was hoping to get boosted on previous days, then claims vanilla. GC is basically certain to be mafia though, so the better lynch. I should definately be boosted.

Boost Xtoxm

If I can't self boost then scum can make it impossible to boost anyone, really...

[Incognito]

lol. You can't boost yourself. Where did TDC mention that he hoped to get boosted?

[Xtoxm]

There was definately a wagon for his boost, and he did nothing to suggest anyone else would have been a better lynch.

If I can boost myself, then it's impossible to boost toen without a scum vote on the wagon. I think that's a bit stupid.

Mod is it possible to boost no one?

[Xtoxm]

can't*

[TDC]

I don't remember any boost wagon on me ever being near completion. Mind pointing out where I should've jumped in to prevent my boosting?

[eldarad]

I also remember Huntress claiming "Booster" and not "Priest".

Huntress said that her role PM did not say her role, but contained flavour "of a spiritual nature"

@Incog's 1267: yeah.
My role PM is the same as the sample PM, and we're all assuming that it is the vanilla townies who don't get anything from being boosted per Electra's flavour. But we don't know that.
I also believe that it is far more important to ensure the boost is not given to scum Today.

Post-mass claim, I'm still of the view that my position is the correct one. We either boost GC - the only "new" claimed role but who I think we're all pretty much happy with lynching Today unless there's an awesome explanation forthcoming, or Xtoxm - who already has an extra vote that he hasn't used, or a vanilla townie.
So yeah, I'd boost me.

Since I *do* have to boost someone, I am fairly confident that GC-scum isn't buddies with Raging Rabbit. So I'd boost RR...but he's claimed vanilla too. So I still reckon I'm a better boost choice.

[Green Crayons]

I think GC is confirmed scum, seeing as no one else knows their role name.

I never claimed a role name, so I'm not sure where you're getting this from. I said that I'm a psychic. As in, the flavor to my role indicates - and I type this without quoting - that I read people's minds and the like. That sounds pretty psychic to me. I was then given a more firm understanding of what my abilities would be if boosted. Without quoting, something along the lines of "You will learn about someone's night choices." (The quotation marks is the paraphrased portion of the role PM.) Then in my replacement PM I was given, in quotation form, a PM to the mod from skillit about a double boost, and the mod said something along the lines of "You will get more specific information about choices from a target."

There's a mild sense of ambiguity, but it's pretty clear cut in determining how it might play out in a game dynamic. That is, exactly as how I described it.

Green Crayons, can you explain what it was or has been about eldarad's play that had you list him as neutral to begin with and most recently be practically sold on his towniness?

People who I don't get reads on one way or another get a neutral tag stuck to their names. I didn't get too strong of a vibe one way or another regarding Eld in my extensive read through upon replacement. Since that point in time, I think the suspicions of Eld have been confronted, addressed and suffiicently dismissed by Eld to convince me of his town play.