Mini 746: Speed Dating - I've Had The Time Of My Life (Over)

[Caboose]

/confirm

[Caboose]

/confirm

What's so funny?

BTW no need to confirm just start playing.

Table 5 a lady who needs no introduction, but that's because she's the most famous strip dancer in the world, Caboose!

[Caboose]

I'm tempted to make a Tucker alt for this game, but I won't since alts are annoying.

[Caboose]

I don't even understand who's scum and who's not.

I you knew the town win con, you would know the answer to this question.

Vote: zwet

[Caboose]

knowing that they will lose if they are lynched but wanting to help the town anyway.

I think you need to read the win condition again.

I think

you

need to read the win condition again.

FoS: Kmd

[Caboose]

Then you should know that if a townie leaves with a scum, then the townie will lose.

[Caboose]

Then you should know that if a townie leaves with a scum, then the townie will lose.

Are you getting this from your role PM?

Unvote, Vote Caboose

In the OP, it says don't leave with married people.

Hint: I don't see that in my Role PM.

Asking Mod via PM if my paraphrasing of it is ok.

Exactly.
What's with the vote?

[Caboose]

Asking Mod via PM if my paraphrasing of it is ok.

I win when all of the scum are out.

Then you should know that if a townie leaves with a scum, then the townie will lose.

Are you getting this from your role PM?

Unvote, Vote Caboose

In the OP, it says don't leave with married people.

Hint: I don't see that in my Role PM.

Asking Mod via PM if my paraphrasing of it is ok.

Exactly.
What's with the vote?

Exactly? You are saying that town loses by leaving with scum. I do NOT see that in my Role PM at all.

Well, then, you either didn't get a town role PM or mole and I have some kind of survivor aspect to our roles, I'm inclined to believe it's the former.

Since Max said analyzing our win cons aren't going to help, I'll stop talking about it.

[Caboose]

Would the mod pair a townie with a scum at the same table?

Since the pairs are rotating, I would imagine so.

[Caboose]

Caboose is definitely twisting my words, that's for sure.

Show me where I did this.

Unvote

Vote: The Countess

Second vote on Jebus looks opportunistic.

[Caboose]

unvote, Vote: Caboose

Second vote on The Countess looks opportunistic.

OMGUS much?

Both my votes have been random so far. I like to mimic. It's a turn on.

I am not amused.

[Caboose]

Can't we wait to lynch Zwet until Zwet is at a table with another married person though? Or at least at a table with someone who doesn't have a PhD?

I don't like this argument.
We have to lynch scum. Which means that we have to lynch whoever is at the scum's table.
Any one of us could come up with an argument like yours (even scum) as to why they shouldn't be lynched -

I always win as town, trust me

, or

I have a Psychology degree

, whatever. In my opinion, that is completely irrelevant. It smacks as an attempt to save your own life, and ignoring the main issue here - lynching someone who could very well be scum, and helping the town (Or in this case, the honest single people looking for a date!).

Now, the 'mrs' thing is a very difficult situation. It could be an honest mistake, as zwet has claimed. Or it could be a scum slip-up. Whilst this means I don't think we should lynch based on this evidence alone, it does go a way towards it.
Sometime when I have time, I'll try and do a post-by-post of Zwet's play so far and see what comes up.

*facepalm*
mole...

[Caboose]

mole, you missed the entire point of EGL's post.

[Caboose]

EGL claimed a certain pro-town power role.

[Caboose]

The recent zwet wagon was a load of horsehockey.
Scum probably was on it.

[Caboose]

Nameclaims are going to do squat for us.
Still like my countess vote.

[Caboose]

Dropping the hammer vote is

NOT

a scumtell.

FoS: mole

for acting like it is. If anything, I would expect scum to jump on the wagon early in order to leave the hammering to town.

[Caboose]

FoS: Jebus

Your "case" on zwet consists of nothing but raw bullcrap.

[Caboose]

reinforced with other scummy behavior.

Mind showing me all this scummy behavior?

[Caboose]

Can anybody make a convincing case on zwet?

[Caboose]

Why have you only revealed this now?

This.

The lack of a counter-claim also leads me to think it's genuine.

Be careful about this.

Jebus is still scummy. A bandwagon would be nice here (notice, NOT a lynch yet).

[Caboose]

The last few posts confuse me. Are people debating the viability of the doc claim, or am I missing something?

I've been thinking about it, and realised a rather startling fact. In this game, I don't think the mafia actually have a night kill. If they did, 1 mislynch followed by a NK would leave 8/9 people in the game, 2 or 3 of which could be mafia. Which, seeing as we lynch 2 by 2, is lylo. This makes me doubt the presence of a doc role in this setup, as the potential killing power of the mafia far exceed normal balance measures. Added to this zwet's actions, and I feel I have a compelling reason to vote off the entire table.

unvote, vote: zwetschenwasser

N.B. My numbers and percieved effictiveness of the mafia's supposed NK may be off. If you see any number fallacies that I may have made, please point them out so I may correct my assumptions.

Ever thought that this game could be protective role heavy?

[Caboose]

KMD is hinting something. I'm going with that for now.

I'm not saying he's scum. Just probably not doc.

Who else besides scum would lie about being a doc?

[Caboose]

Is it possible that he neither is the doc nor lied?

No.

Not very many cops I know have PhDs. I also don't know of many stripers with PhDs, either.

[Caboose]

^Just in case anyone missed it, I was saying that there aren't very many alternative roles to EGL's "PhD" thing (cop, roleblocker).

[size=0]Also, in case you missed the other part of the joke, the above post implies that I know stipers. :P[/size]

[Caboose]

zwet, make your list I'm dropping the hammer.
EGL's doc claim looks fishy looking at roffman's point about NKs + Kmd's info.

[Caboose]

Alright, then.

Unvote

Vote: zwet

I hope you're info is reliable, Kmd.

[Caboose]

RTFT

[Caboose]

I thought your reason for doubting the doc idea was down to your role, Kmd?

Basically, I figured he had doc flavor, but wasn't a real doc.

I guess it doesn't hurt to explain why I thought this.

When I thought we lynched Zwet before, I sent in a night action. I was told by the Mod that my role wasn't what I thought it was. It was just flavor. So it made me think EGL's role was probably just doc flavor too.

I didn't reveal this right away because it's basically claiming. But yeah. That was my reasoning for thinking EGL wasn't really a doc OR lying about his role.

Why couldn't you tell us this before?

[Caboose]

Oh well. Jebus is still really scummy.

[Caboose]

Soon after Jebus shows up, zwet's "slip" occurs. Jebus is on the zwet wagon early, by the way. But then, Jebus turns on Kmd...

So why did it come up as a good idea to hammer zwet without even letting him say very much in defense?

And how the hell did we get to hammertime so quickly?

This comes after Kmd's "hammer." Jebus doesn't waste anytime flinging the bullcrap at Kmd for hammering someone that Jebus knows will flip town.
+scumpoints for Jebus

Well what do you expect to get as defense of a typo?

"Oh, it appears I've pressed the wrong key on my keyboard. Mis-typing something so vital is a null tell at best - anyone, town or scum, could possibly be prone to doing it"

And I should probably recount the votes to confirm hammer...

...and Jebus continues to heap the bullcrap onto Kmd even BEFORE the day ends. What's your frikin' point in the post anyway? Preemptive crap attacks are scummy.
+scumpoints for Jebus

Claiming jester, joke or not

('cause being on the internet, I can't tell which)

, is very scummy.

I don't believe this. You know it was a joke. You just wanted to put some bull**** in the gas tank of the zwet wagon to fuel it just enough to get it to a lynch.

But honestly, I've not got anything on anyone yet, so I look to pressuring zwet.

Using your vote just to "pressure" someone is just flat out Stupid, with a capital S.

Almost immediately after I drop the hammer, Jebus starts distancing himself from the lynch:

What a waste of a lynch, imo.

AFTER he made this post:

Prove it, please, or explain your thinking.


By the way, I still don't really get this game

So let's get this straight -
>You claimed Mrs. Johnston
>You correct yourself, saying it was Miss. The reason I don't completely believe it is because I would have expected you to say Ms, which I would have taken as a typo any day.
>Aside from that, you nameclaimed before we really got any thoughts on it. [Jumping the gun/haste]
>You think EGL is scum, and I've got no clue why you say this.
>You mention Jester.
>You self-vote.


You are at L-1, and I really want to hear what you've got to say, so for the sake of avoiding a quicklynch, unvote: Zwet

That vote will almost surely be replaced sooner or later.


As for EGL, there are no nights, and you've soft-claimed power role. Full claim please?

Now, the fact that Jebus is at a table with me could be a problem for me...

[Caboose]

Mod: Please fix my quote tags in the last post. The "Well what do you expect to get as defense of a typo?" should be INSIDE the quote box below it. Thanks.

[Caboose]

This game is way too easy. Caboose and Monkey are the scum so can we wait with lynching them until they are paired together?

Usually when someone makes a post like this, I type up a really angry post that I end up not posting anyway. So, I'll try to be really nice this time.

Dear BSG and penguins

I am writing you with regards to your lovely two-sentence

complete bullsh*t attack

post. However, I find it very difficult to defend myself against such

crap attacks

vague statements as you have made and it would be much appreciated if you could give some reasoning so that we may clear up some misunderstanding.

I speculate

chainsaw defense

some comraderie between you and Jebus given that your drastic change of heart comes after I post a case for Jebus being married. But if you post something that we can all read, maybe we will understand your reasoning behind your suspicions.

Also, it would be much appreciated if you would stop acting

arrogant

so confident. While I like aggressive play, there is quite a thin line between aggressiveness and

trying to fling accusations around in the form of nonsense

unsubstantiated suspicions.

Sincerely,

Caboose

[Caboose]

No, it doesn't.
It doesn't explain a thing that I addressed in my case.

Read it.

[Caboose]

Vote: KMD

You were obviously wrong about KMD being scum, so why should we believe you about you being town?

Don't like the ad hom here.

[Caboose]

@Kmd: Dropping a hammer is in and of itself, never a scum tell.

Fixed.

Dropping the hammer early, in game where there is still extreme doubt about the mechanics, and you knowingly kill 2 people at once, is.

Who was in doubt about the mechanics?

What ad hom? And even if it is, what does it matter?

[craplogic]Kmd was wrong about zwet. Therefore, Kmd cannot be trusted[/craplogic]
He's trying to attack your credibility, not the argument, which bothers me.

Dropping a well-reasoned hammer is

NOT

a scumtell.

[Caboose]

It wasn't well reasoned enough for me to be on board, so I'm not letting him off the hook.

Maybe that's a negative point against you then...

I refused to vote off two townies and it's a negative point against me? Okay.

Not voting for townie lynch =/= towntell

[Caboose]

^Nice strawman

[Caboose]

No, but not voting for townies doesn't clear you.

[Caboose]

No, but not voting for townies doesn't clear you.

There's a difference between something being a "towntell" and being "cleared". If you want to think I'm scum that's up to you, but for myself I'm going to suggest we look heavily at voting records and suggest to others to do the same.

Not being on town wagons is not even a towntell.
In fact, it's a very very very very mild scumtell.

Stop trying to declare yourself town because you didn't vote for zwet. It's kind of scummy.

[Caboose]

No, but not voting for townies doesn't clear you.

There's a difference between something being a "towntell" and being "cleared". If you want to think I'm scum that's up to you, but for myself I'm going to suggest we look heavily at voting records and suggest to others to do the same.

Not being on town wagons is not even a towntell.
In fact, it's a very very very very mild scumtell.

Stop trying to declare yourself town because you didn't vote for zwet. It's kind of scummy.

I didn't declare myself town, I was defending myself against people who were calling me out without any reasoning. And explain to me how refusing to vote off townies is a scumtell.

They usually don't want to have anything to do with a townie lynch.

[Caboose]

Well, that's obviously not true if the scum vote is needed to get the townie lynched.

How do you know this?

Again, not being on a townwagon is mostly a nulltell. Stop acting like it's a towntell.

[Caboose]

Monkey - surely that only applies if the case made is actually 100%

against scum

? It could be an amazing case, but scum could still jump on it, promote its wisdom, and lynch a townie.

Since we don't know, we can't be sure the alignment of those who jump on.

No, we don't know for sure, but when building a case for someone or against someone, surely you would want to avoid lynchking those who are consistantly voting town and lynch those who are consistantly voting scum, is my thinking.

Apparently, you've never heard of bussing.

[Caboose]

Monkey - surely that only applies if the case made is actually 100%

against scum

? It could be an amazing case, but scum could still jump on it, promote its wisdom, and lynch a townie.

Since we don't know, we can't be sure the alignment of those who jump on.

No, we don't know for sure, but when building a case for someone or against someone, surely you would want to avoid lynchking those who are consistantly voting town and lynch those who are consistantly voting scum, is my thinking.

Apparently, you've never heard of bussing.

I certainly have heard of it, but you don't want to base a strategy on something that's the exception rather than the rule. More often than not, townies vote town and scum vote scum.

Well, then. Shouldn't we be looking at people

not

on the zwet wagon by your logic?

[Caboose]

Hey, DGB.

[Caboose]

So by your logic we should throw voting records completely out the window, huh?

Yes.

Voting records doesn't clear nor condemn anybody. It has little to do with the vote itself and everything to do with how and when the vote is cast.

[Caboose]

Not buying the DGB claim.

[Caboose]

Not buying the DGB claim.

I know it sounds too good to be true, but I have to admit to a major drawback. I'm a miller, too.

Now I'm

really

not buying your claim.
Plus, assuming that you are telling the truth, you ever thought of the possibility of a mafia roleblocker?

[Caboose]

Plus, assuming that you are telling the truth, you ever thought of the possibility of a mafia roleblocker?

No, is it you?

So you think it's unreasonable to think of the possibility of a mafia RB?
If you're telling the truth, your role sounds kind of broken if there isn't a mafia RB to cancel you out. Also, if you're the cop, what's the use of making you a miller?

[Caboose]

Oh, yeah, and results from N1 please.

[Caboose]

Plus, assuming that you are telling the truth, you ever thought of the possibility of a mafia roleblocker?

No

, is it you?

I got an innocent on The Count Night 1, and

no result

Night 2.

Wow, I must be the mafia RB to expect that there is such an exotic role as that.

[Caboose]

Yeah, the DGB claim is pure excrement.

Vote: DGB

[Caboose]

Will someone explain the DGB votes please?

DGB's falseclaimed:
[*]Her "role" of "NK immune miller cop" sounds ridiculously broken.
[*]She claimed to have "no result" on N2.
[*]There aren't any NKs in this game, so I don't see how NK immunity would be applicable in this game.
[*]If DGB really is the cop, then what's the point of making her a miller? The only way that's possible is if there's a second cop, which sounds incredibly unbalanced.

DGB's scummy behavior:
[*]When I bring up the possibility of a mafia RB, which I believe is perfectly reasonable given her overpowered claimed role, DGB immediately accuses me of being the mafia RB for some reason.
[*]She bandwagons for no apparent coming into the game, which is starting to look like a bus to me.

[Caboose]

Everyone: Please ignore my previous post as the list tags are screwed up.

Will someone explain the DGB votes please?

DGB's falseclaimed:

• Her "role" of "NK immune miller cop" sounds ridiculously broken.
  
• She claimed to have "no result" on N2.
  
• There aren't any NKs in this game, so I don't see how NK immunity would be applicable in this game.
  
• If DGB really is the cop, then what's the point of making her a miller? The only way that's possible is if there's a second cop, which sounds incredibly unbalanced.

DGB's scummy behavior:

• When I bring up the possibility of a mafia RB, which I believe is perfectly reasonable given her overpowered claimed role, DGB immediately accuses me of being the mafia RB for some reason.
  
• She bandwagons for no apparent coming into the game, which is starting to look like a bus to me.

[Caboose]

Is DGB more likely to make an obvious fakeclaim as scum than as town?

I didn't expect a player like DGB to make such a sloppy fakeclaim, either.
Who else besides scum would fake claim cop?
And if DGB comes out and says she did this "for reactions," my vote will stand.

I doubt a RB exists. I doubt any power roles exist (Nobody tell me otherwise. I don't want this post to be someone's excuse for claiming out of nowhere.) But do you honestly think DGB had scummy motives for calling you RB?

Yes. Flinging around unjustified suspicions is scummy.

What makes it look like a bus by the way?

It's not based on anything real and it would make DGB look good if you ended up flipping scum.

That's weak, though. But still, the wagoning troubles me.

[Caboose]

The 'no result' was on Caboose, that's why I'm certain Caboose is the mafia roleblocker. It's a powerful scum role, we have to kill her today.

Also, just a friendly reminder of the blue symbol under my avatar.

TOWN:
MonkeyMan576

Caboose

molestargazer
Nightfall
The Count

This made me lol.

Is it possible that we have a Jester type role?
And by DGB's list I seem to be both town and scum... :S

^Scummy, big time.
+lots of scumpoints for Nightfall

Lynch time for DGB.

[Caboose]

Anyone who doesn't vote DGB in posts from here on is scummy.

Vote: DGB

For good measure.

[Caboose]

Caboose, guess I'm scummy.

I really don't agree with the case on DGB so far.

WTF? We have virtually confirmed scum here, and you're not voting her?

Why?

[Caboose]

I really don't agree with the case on DGB so far.

Hahahaha, ah ah aaaaAaAaAaaaaaaaa

HAHAHAH ahhahdhhahha *sigh* Hahhahah

What is it going to take?????

Pray tell, what is it you disagree with?

The case is pretty much your playstyle is scummy.

No, the case is pretty much DGB

fakeclaimed

cop.

RTFT

[Caboose]

As scum, would DGB fakeclaim something ridiculous, get called on it, and say "I give up" any more than she would as town?

Yes.

I think Kmd and Nightfall are DGB's scumbuddies.

[Caboose]

You weren't voting her either until just a little while ago.

Yeah, the DGB claim is pure excrement.

Vote: DGB

I voted her after I realized her claim was BS, which was yesterday. I think everyone who posted today on should be aware of that fact.

Jester speculation is just crap and a way for scum to excuse the scummy actions of their about to be lynched scumbuddy.

Also, even if by some really, really, really slim chance DGB IS really a jester, she still needs to be lynched because jesters are anti-town, which is just about the same thing as scum. The only exception to this is if the game ends if a jester is lynched, in which case, this will be the last Max game I play.

[Caboose]

This is excruciating.

How long is it going to take to lynch DGB?

[Caboose]

Oh, crap.

Speed Dating Mafia

Ah, it's Valentine's day, you see a lonely woman reading her copy of a 'Mills and Boon', you thank god that at least you have the looks to get you a date. Even if it is by speed-dating...

12 Hours Later
You arrive at the speed dating centre, you learn that several people there are already married, you don't know which but you remember seeing their "Million Pound Wedding" in the news paper. This means that you'll have to dismiss table by table, as they find true love or a good shag

Town Win Condition: You win if you leave with another town person and the people who are cheating on their lovers leave without love

Mafia Win Condition: You win if you leave with a towns person you lose if you leave with another mafia member or leave without love

Possible Third Party Win Condition: You are destined to be with X if they leave without you you commit suicide. If they leave with you, you will get married have 3 children, buy a house when the market recovers. Well you win.

Another Possible Win Condition: You feel sorry for these people, so much so you think they all deserve to die. You win if every table but the one your on dies.

I hope it isn't DGB's win con to leave with the Count.

[Caboose]

Wow... yeah... my Jester post doesn't seem so stupid now does it -_-'

Let's see how the count flips...

[Caboose]

This sucks.

[Caboose]

I'm getting weird vibes from KMD yesterday. Any rational person would've voted DGB after her claim. I think KMD knew she wasn't going to flip scum.

Vote: KMD

[Caboose]

I'm getting weird vibes from KMD yesterday. Any rational person would've voted DGB after her claim. I think KMD knew she wasn't going to flip scum.

Vote: KMD

Even if he were scum, how would he know that? DGB was a Jester.

If KMD were scum, I would think that he knows who his scumbuddies are. He might not have known that DGB was a Jester, but it looks like to me that he knew that she wasn't going to flip scum.

[Caboose]

I'm getting weird vibes from KMD yesterday. Any rational person would've voted DGB after her claim. I think KMD knew she wasn't going to flip scum.

Vote: KMD

Even if he were scum, how would he know that? DGB was a Jester.

If KMD were scum, I would think that he knows who his scumbuddies are. He might not have known that DGB was a Jester, but it looks like to me that he knew that she wasn't going to flip scum.

Did you see my response to this accusation?

No, I didn't.
Sorry.

But your behavior is still weird to me.

[Caboose]

Yes, you have something better?

[Caboose]

I went back to the Mini Theme queue.

Town Win Condition: You win if you leave with another town person and the people who are cheating on their lovers leave without love

Mafia Win Condition: You win if you leave with a towns person you lose if you leave with another mafia member or leave without love

Possible Third Party Win Condition: You are destined to be with X if they leave without you you commit suicide. If they leave with you, you will get married have 3 children, buy a house when the market recovers. Well you win.

Another Possible Win Condition: You feel sorry for these people, so much so you think they all deserve to die. You win if every table but the one your on dies.

[Caboose]

This makes me even more confused. So, Mafia actually WIN if they are lynched with a townsperson at their table?

How do mafia "leave without love"? If they survive to the endgame?

Are we trying to lynch town in this game? Or are we actually trying to lynch a survivor?

Unvote

if I have a vote down.

I think we need to stop right now and establish what the town's goal is and what the scum's goal is. I just assumed this whole game that the town's goal was to lynch scum and the scum's goal was to survive to the endgame.

[Caboose]

KMD, you need to seriously stop making avatar bets.

Also, please summarize to me why you didn't find DGB scummy.

[Caboose]

I thought this was what she was doing based on her normal playstyle. I saw no reason to think she was scum.

How about the fakeclaim?
Was that scummy to you or not?
If not, why not?