Medieval Mafia - Game Over

[scotmany12]

scotmany12 (reaction to Xyl earlier today)

Care to elaborate?

[camn]

Aren't you needy!

You want Tar to elaborate for this, yet

you

ask for someone to post a case on KMD when

you

call him scummy.

scotmany12 (reaction to Xyl earlier today-someone please post a case on him)

You really do keep your opinions to yourself, dont you?
Are you planning on simply reacting to others for the rest of the game, or do we get to see your ideas sometime?

[Rogueben]

Anybody want to post the case on Kmd in. or point me to where the case is? From what I get, the reasoning is jumbled among many posts and it would be easier if someone constructed the case in one post.

Scummy:
Kmd (would still like someone to post an organized case on him

I really don't like these two posts. The fact that he puts a player at scummy that he doesn't even seem to understand the case about really sits poorly with me.

I'm going to have to reread him but he's just moved up a scum category in my mind.

[Rogueben]

Also Tar can you elaborate on the camn slightly scummy vibe? I'm not getting that what-so-ever.

[scotmany12]

Aren't you needy!

You want Tar to elaborate for this, yet

you

ask for someone to post a case on KMD when

you

call him scummy.

scotmany12 (reaction to Xyl earlier today-someone please post a case on him)

You really do keep your opinions to yourself, dont you?
Are you planning on simply reacting to others for the rest of the game, or do we get to see your ideas sometime?

Well if someone calls me scummy, I'm going to ask why. I find kmd scummy for his attack on xyl. It appears contrived, and I dislike how he wanted to wait until today to first bring up his case. I feel like he was trying to push xyl's style of play as a scumtell, which is not the case. I asked others because I would like to see why others find him scummy as well.

[Korejora]

'K, postzilla for giggles.

DGB looks scummy to me because of her D1 work. The attack on TSQ seemed pulled out of nowhere, and ill-supported. Later work similarly was thin. "X is scum, Y is scum, Z is town" - lots of statements without providing reasons. The apparent style of "look at this and find the problem yourself" bothers me because it means she doesn't have to do any analysis and risk being wrong and scrutinized.
Her role does not make her town for me. It is a rather protown role but I have actually seen more scum motivators than I have town motivators, as well as powering-up-other-players roles in general.

Yos looks neutral to me because of his D1 work. I appreciate that he doesn't have a zillion useless posts. I like that he properly explained why he wanted the zwet lynch, among other things, rather than having us make assumptions about it. I disagree with his opinion on Xyl's recent claim - it doesn't seem risky to me. I don't think his participation on the town-victim-wagons implies scumminess. I have no idea why he's voting Kmd, as I saw no indication of him suspecting Kmd beforehand.

has has a lot of low-risk behaviour - saying logical things and asking logical questions without thorough analysis. I dislike his arguments with Kmd, like I said before, because they seemed like he was trying to put unwarranted focus on Kmd. I liked his arguments with sam, however, as sam was taking little things and running with them, and he was shooting that down. Other than that, fairly straightforward stuff. His attack on the modkill joke is weird but he said that was normal beforehand. His claim seems more town than scum to me.

Xyl is more town than not to me. He started out going after lurkers, which was weird and contradictory, but not very significant. His honesty and humour is appreciable but I don't see a lot of analysis early on. Um, actually, that lurker thing went on for a

while

. He had to waste a bit of time because of his vote on a lurker when he had replaced a lurker, but whatever. The rest of it seems solid. I suppose it's possible to do this sort of gut / honest play even as scum, but I'm thinking town when I look at it right now.
The claim doesn't push it in either direction for me. We have hard a hardclaimed mason and a softclaimed mason out of it, but since it's independent of alignment, that isn't useful.
On a sidenote, I think that if DGB is scum, then Xyl is town.

camn is good. I mean, town. Her posts don't bring up any of the problems I've bitched about so far. They are actually scrutinizing in and of themselves, and set out to say what needs to be said without trying to dodge around anything. They are plentiful and useful. I don't see what people have against her, so if someone could explain that to me, that'd be great.

I am getting real tired of this post, so I'm actually going to stop there. I was going to the whole living list, but whatever. I'll pick it up again when I have more time and attention span.

[Kmd4390]

Sorry all. Marathon Day got all of my attention. I'll catch up this afternoon.

Unvote

because I've skimmed and seen a few people say that Xyl is nearly confirmed. I also see votes on me, so I'll address those when I'm caught up. So class then ketchup time.

[Yosarian2]

I disagree with his opinion on Xyl's recent claim - it doesn't seem risky to me.

Ok. In what scenerio does Xyl's claim seem not risky for a scum to make? Either he's lying about having a multiple member mason group already recruited (in which case, I can't see him getting away with it long), or...what?

I have no idea why he's voting Kmd, as I saw no indication of him suspecting Kmd beforehand.

Well, no, he wasn't really on my suspect list yesterday. However, everyone on my suspect list from yesterday is dead, so if I'm going to scumhunt, I have to find new scummy actions from people I haven't attacked before. And, like I explained, I found that post of his scummy.

[Kmd4390]

So sorry I didn't get to this game. I'll get to it tonight or tomorrow.

[Korejora]

Sorry, I meant that he could be scum claiming accurately. If you were assuming he was lying (in your theory), then we're not in disagreement.

[Yosarian2]

Sorry, I meant that he could be scum claiming accurately. If you were assuming he was lying (in your theory), then we're not in disagreement.

Well, that's what I'm saying. If he's scum who's competly lying through his teeth, it'd be an incredibly risky play.

If he's scum partly lying (say, a cult leader who recruited only one person last night, and somehow killed at the same time), then it's still an incredibly risky, because he might be asked to produce another one of those masons. That's also an overpowered cult he can kill and recruit during the same night, so it's not that likely anyway.

And scum but otherwise telling the truth would mean that he's a scum who can recruit an entire mason group with a kill in one night. I really have trouble even picturing how that could work.

[OhGodMyLife]

Vote Count:

8 to lynch

stark: 6 (Xylthixlm, Xylthixlm, Tarhalindur, DrippingGoofball, camn, Rogueben)
Kmd4390: 2 (populartajo, Yosarian2)
camn: 1 (sam.samhorn)
populartajo: 1 (scotmany12)

Not Voting: 5 (hasdgfas, Korejora, stark, farside22, Kmd4390)

[Korejora]

Having that sort of ability can be good for scum, because they can specifically target town players whom they expect to use the kills on other town. If not restricted to recruiting town members, he can even get his teammates to influence the players further.

I'm not saying I suspect this is the case here, but I don't feel like the role (i.e. the claim assumed true) makes him town.

[camn]

Stark, seriously...

Whats the deal?
Are you playing this game with us, or not?

Claim or die.
Also scumlist, please..

And KMD.. you are getting to be on my radar. Lets hear what you have to say.

Xyl.. are you still sore at Kore for not voting yesterday?

And Farside... Scumlist, please.

MY revised scumlist =

Stark

(all promises, no delivery)

KMD

(process of elimination on qwints wagon)

sam.sam

(OMGUS. Plus RedSox Suck)
and

Farside

OR

scot

(lurkiness vs. anti-logic)


PS..

a side note to KMD... when I say yankees suck or redsocks suck.. I don't mean "suck" as in "bad at baseball" I mean "suck" as in "ruining baseball". I also mean "suck" as in "I hate you."

[Xylthixlm]

Kore is scum and needs to die. Whether I am "sore" at her is irrelevant.

[Xylthixlm]

Not totally obviously town

scotmany12
hasdgfas
Yosarian2
farside22
Kmd4390
sam.samhorn
Korejora
stark

^ Each player on this list should die just as soon as everyone after them on the list is dead.

[camn]

Ok, then. Lets do it.

I go on vacation on the 17th.

I intend to see stark dead by then, unless he delivers on the following:

a) claim.
b) analysis on all players.
c) scumlist. With backup.
d) no allegories.
e) Explanations for low activity level. I see you on other games!

[Kmd4390]

Well, for one, he is eventually going to have to name his mason buddies (he's already named one), and if they start coming up dead and cult...

Good point. That would be retarded for cult to do.

Okay. If the cult possibility is unlikely as more than one has said then I think the choice is pretty clear here.

Vote: KMD.

Got a case to go with this vote? Or am I supposed to defend with, "nuh-uh"?

I dont have the time to hunt for quotes. Yos is being pretty decent with his reasoning lately. KMD is just crazy going against Xyl and was a heavy supporter of the qwints wagon. Im basing my current decision in these facts.

Was my Xyl case unreasonable at the time I presented it? The Qwints thing, I can see why you would think that. Scum on the wagon seems likely. So I can't say much more to that than you're wrong.

Also, do you expect bad reasoning from Yos as scum? The game is ongoing (I'm dead), but I recently saw him flip scum in another game and was shocked.

KMD
stark
Jebus

Looks like the scumteam to me.

Why? And why did you remove Farside?

NOW.. I eliminate all CONFIRMED townies. I also eliminate DGB for having double-vote power. I eliminate Xly for being a mason-recruiter. I eliminate myself as obvtown, and HasCow as namecop.

Why did you remove yourself?

• qwints -- Kmd4390, Yosarian2, camn
  zwet -- Thestatusquo, Yosarian2, scotmany12, sam.samhorn, Kmd4390
  cow -- scotmany12, sam.samhorn, farside22, populartajo, Tarhalindur
  wolf -- populartajo, Yosarian2, stark, Tarhalindur, farside22, camn

Before reading your stuff, I want to point out who was on how many wagons.

Yos-3 (Qwints, Zwet, Crywolf)
TSQ/Tar-3 (Zwet, Cow, Crywolf)
scot-2 (Zwet, Cow)
camn-2 (Qwints, Crywolf)
sam-(Zwet, Cow)
Kmd- 2 (Qwints, Zwet)
Tajo-2(Cow, Crywolf)
farside-1 (Cow)
Stark-1 (Crywolf)

Yos and TSQ/Tar are on 3 of these wagons.

Now.. we see the 2 people on the qwints wagon. I assume at LEAST scum got on that wagon..... so one of those 2 = scum.
Then I notice that Yosarian is on 3 townie-wagons. I ask myself.. would THE Yosarian2 allow himself to be on 3 townie wagons in one day? For now, no.

Using that logic, to me, Yos has to be scum. I'm not going to say, "Hey, Yos voted for Qwints. He's scum.", but it's a place to look. And just because he is "THE Yosarian2" doesn't mean he gets away with everything. If Yos is scum, I wouldn't be shocked to see you as a partner.

Let us also notice that KMD AVOIDED being on the crywolf wagon, though he EXCELLENTLY fence-sat here:

Note that I'm still here and willing to vote Crywolf before deadline if needed.

I was only going to vote her over no lynch. I wanted Qwints lynched, but anything beats a no lynch.

Now when we look at stark's wagon:

• stark --
  DrippingGoofball
  , populartajo,
  crywolf20084
  ,
  Xylthixlm
  ,
  Tarhalindur
  ,
  camn

You can see by the bold how incredibly town-driven that wagon was.. adding Tar for the whole cult-vig stuff.

First of all, why are DGB, Tar, and you "incredibly town"?

Wait. Tar was part of Xyl's claim? Ok, I won't erase what I have here because that was my thought process, but I guess Tar is town.

So if scum is on Stark's wagon, it's DGB, Tajo, and/or camn. Tajo and camn were on 2 of the 4 previously mentioned wagons. Good to know. If Stark is town, I'm going to look at both players more closely.

Also, Tajo, when asked by DGB to look at Yos and myself, called me scum with little reason and never really gave Yos a good look. I can see a connection between these three.

Totally obviously town

Xyl
DrippingGoofball
Tarhalindur
Rogueben
camn
populartajo

Not totally obviously town

scotmany12
hasdgfas
Yosarian2
farside22
Kmd4390
sam.samhorn
Korejora
stark

Why are Tajo and camn town? Why isn't Cow?

I had some thoughts about Xly while in the shower this morning.

Semi-disturbing.

I had some thoughts about Xly while in the shower this morning.

a) Xyl... did you say you were a one-shot?

b) Did you have anything to do with the Zwet Vig?

c) Shouldn't we just lynch Yosarian, then.. if he is unreadable? Better now than have him burn us in endgame, right?

d) Scumlist. Everyone. Now, please.

A and B are rolefishing. Especially B. As far as C, a Yos lynch would be ok, but not for being unreadable.

I had some thoughts about Xly while in the shower this morning.

OMG!!

Bah. Tajo beat me to the comment. I'm too slow.

Anybody want to post the case on Kmd in. or point me to where the case is? From what I get, the reasoning is jumbled among many posts and it would be easier if someone constructed the case in one post.

I voted Qwints.

Anyway, KMD's recent posts seem off to me; especally the way in his last post he stuck to his vote on the (in my opinion) nearly confirmed innocent Xyl, and used pop's weak cult speculatation as an excuse to do so. I don't necesarally think it's scummy for Pop to have wondered about that, but I distrust Kmd's:

I asked one question. I saw after I typed it that Tajo asked the same thing. And why is me asking the question scummy and Tajo asking it ok? (Note that I don't consider Tajo's actions regarding Xyl scummier than my own, I just want to know what you think seperates his from mine.)

I still think it was a valid point to make at the time.

Well if someone calls me scummy, I'm going to ask why. I find kmd scummy for his attack on xyl. It appears contrived, and I dislike how he wanted to wait until today to first bring up his case. I feel like he was trying to push xyl's style of play as a scumtell, which is not the case. I asked others because I would like to see why others find him scummy as well.

READ MOAR.

The Xyl case was up yesterday. I quoted it today for reference. Xyl was my number 2 suspect after Qwints yesterday. Also, what about the case didn't you like specifically?

How did I push his playstyle as scummy? (I've never played with Xyl, so maybe I did it unknowingly, but I don't think I did.)

And KMD.. you are getting to be on my radar. Lets hear what you have to say.

I don't usually lurk. You know this. I hate doing it. I didn't look at games during Marathon Day (with the exception of the game I was modding that had a deadline) and I spent most of today IMing Zazie. I said I'd catch up tonight or tomorrow, and I am doing that now.

PS..

a side note to KMD... when I say yankees suck or redsocks suck.. I don't mean "suck" as in "bad at baseball" I mean "suck" as in "ruining baseball". I also mean "suck" as in "I hate you."

LOL!!! Ruining baseball how? Being too successful? That's OMGUS and you know it!

Oh, and you didn't think I forgot the scum list, did you?

Basically confirmed:
Cow
Xyl
Kmd

Town Read:
DGB
Rogue

Slightly Scummy to Nuetral (scummiest on bottom):
sam
Tar
farside
Stark
Scot
Kore

Scummiest:
Yosarian2
camn
populartajo

Vote Tajo

*Waits for "OMG KMD THAT'S TOTALLY OMGUS"*

[populartajo]

OMG KMD THAT'S TOTALLY OMGUS

Confirm vote: KMD.

[Kmd4390]

OMG KMD THAT'S TOTALLY OMGUS

Confirm vote: KMD.

That didn't take long. It's not OMGUS if I have reasons to think you are scum. I could care less that you are voting me.

[Rogueben]

TSQ/Tar-3 (Zwet, Cow, Crywolf)

Um... I replaced TSQ not Tar. Tar replaced Jebus...

What puts camn in your absolutely scumlist KMD. I'd like a full case against him as I'm not seeing it whatsoever.

[Xylthixlm]

Also, do you expect bad reasoning from Yos as scum? The game is ongoing (I'm dead), but I recently saw him flip scum in another game and was shocked.

I was in that game too, and I wasn't shocked.

[populartajo]

Tell me why I am scum, then. Basically your case is that I dont have a case against you which is partially true because Im basing my vote in wagon analysis and POE.
Following your logic, everyone suspecting you for this reasons should be scum which is an obvious fallacy or do you think that analysing bandwagons is scummy?

[populartajo]

Last post to KMD.

[Kmd4390]

TSQ/Tar-3 (Zwet, Cow, Crywolf)

Um... I replaced TSQ not Tar. Tar replaced Jebus...

Shit. My bad. TSQ (1) vote Zwet. Tar (2) voted Cow and Crywolf.

Rogue and Tar are both voting Stark.

What puts camn in your absolutely scumlist KMD. I'd like a full case against him as I'm not seeing it whatsoever.

I'll do a full case before I got V/LA (see sig). 1592 is the most I have right now.