MKM II GAME OVER

[zwetschenwasser]

Disembowl: poptajo

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-sirdanilot (1): Gorrad
-Looker (1): populartajo
-Gorrad (1): AceMarksman
-populartajo (1): zwetschenwasser

Not voting (12): killa seven, Kast, ZEEnon, Riceballtail, Looker, sirdanilot, Moratorium, ortolan, semioldguy, WeyounsLastClone, Empking, caf19

With 16 alive it takes 9 real votes to lynch.

[ZEEnon]

First of all, we have a problem.
One of the scum knew our item descriptions.
Second of all, the fact that a mushroom kingdom role died is confusing.
Could this mean that only bowser's army can kill, while mushroom kingdom can't?

No, sorry, I don't abide by some code of MafiaScumdom that only allows me to discuss certain things
at certain times and not other things at other times.

See Gorrad, i'm not the only one!
In Bleach Mafia that you mentioned, I commented on the NK (or lack of) too. Was I scum? No.
You tried pushing a lynch on me commenting on the NK when you in fact were scum.
Watch how you push your vote this game.

[semioldguy]

Semioldguy, what makes you think that the order is the same? I can't tell from the names which would go with which, considering I know the abilities of neither, but they could have the same effects with a changed order. Either way, the night kill proves that the item idea was bogus.

The order the items are listed in the rules post were the same order as listed in our PM's for Bowser's Army.

[Gorrad]

So? What if this were the case:
Mushroom Kingdom possible PM:
mushroom = x, 1-up shroom = y, fireflower = z, star = a

Bowser’s Castle possible PM:
green shell = y, red shell = z, poison shroom = x, bob-omb = a

All letters were assigned arbitrarily. Even if the items were in the same order, there's nothing to say the powers assigned to the items were.

[Gorrad]

No, sorry, I don't abide by some code of MafiaScumdom that only allows me to discuss certain things
at certain times and not other things at other times.

See Gorrad, i'm not the only one!
In Bleach Mafia that you mentioned, I commented on the NK (or lack of) too. Was I scum? No.
You tried pushing a lynch on me commenting on the NK when you in fact were scum.
Watch how you push your vote this game.

You did it, you were town. UROE and Seraphim did it, they were scum. 2/3 is still a trend.

[semioldguy]

So? What if this were the case:
Mushroom Kingdom possible PM:
mushroom = x, 1-up shroom = y, fireflower = z, star = a

Bowser’s Castle possible PM:
green shell = y, red shell = z, poison shroom = x, bob-omb = a

All letters were assigned arbitrarily. Even if the items were in the same order, there's nothing to say the powers assigned to the items were.

So even if that was the case, how do they figure out which value goes to which for the other faction other than a random guess?

[Gorrad]

Heck if I know. Maybe they're told, maybe they just have really good guesses. I have a theory which I will not say yet.

[semioldguy]

I don't really think it matters so much how they know. The fact is they do know and it compromises our list.

[Gorrad]

Which I said twenty-seven posts ago.

[semioldguy]

Then what was the point of your question to me in that post?

[Gorrad]

I'm half-engineer. It's very hard for me to let a point die.

[AceMarksman]

You do realize that every player in this game that has spoken today has talked about the NK, right? I find it hard to fathom that there are that many scum in one game. Your trend, it fails.

[populartajo]

Well Gorrad, I can understand where you come from but I dont think nk speculatiuon hurts a game like this when there are no explicit doctors and very vital information can be obtained of these events.

[killa seven]

Vote: poptajo

Nightkill proves that yesterday was a calculated scum gambit.

explain?

[Gorrad]

You do realize that every player in this game that has spoken today has talked about the NK, right? I find it hard to fathom that there are that many scum in one game. Your trend, it fails.

But he started off the conversation. Without him, I daresay it would scarcely have been mentioned.

[AceMarksman]

I was about to mention it had he not.

Also, what tajo said. This game doesn't use standard roles.

[Gorrad]

Nor did Random Mafia. Still caught us scum D1.

[populartajo]

Well, this is the situation right now.

We exactly dont know if all scum had item descriptions fromm Bowser Army in their posts. The mos probable scenario that also deals with the fact that SK was scum but didnt have item descriptions is that some scum did get intem descriptions in their PM and some scum didnt.

This rule is important:

2) The game will start in Day 1.

So its safe to assume that scum didnt communicate in night 0 since there wasnt night 0.

Another likely scenario is that qwints guessed his answer with a)pure gold luck or b)information of his own items.

This quotes are important.

The relatively small number of people objecting to the item claiming plan makes me wonder if it consists entirely of scum.

Still analizing this.

Also, I think ortolan has been more honest in his intentions than ShadowKnight.
Since apparently, one of them must be scum:
unvote, vote Shadowknight

Why there had to be scum between ortolan and Shadowknight? This is the same fallacy Looker used to vote for Shadow Knight. It just doesnt feel well and it feels like qwintsscum decided to bus Shadowknight in the hopes of clearing ortolan.

Its also remarkable that qwints has an obsession with me. He votes me, foses me and this quote looks terribly bad, like trying to set me up, knowing that SK would flip scum.

By my count we're back at L-2 in visible votes.

Still gonna try to save SK, tajo?

My scumhunting powers say that Looker and ortolan should be the next people dying in this game.

[AceMarksman]

looker yes, ort maybe, gorrad maybe. I forgot about this:

This is the same fallacy Looker used to vote for Shadow Knight

Thanks for reminding me. I knew there was a reason I thought of for why looker should die.

Unvote: Gorrad.
Vote: looker
FoS: Gorrad

[ZEEnon]

_________________________

1. Anti-Bowser player died.
2. The player qwints died.
_________________________

I would have commented on the night events
regardless of whether or not that other guy did or not.

I mean seriously, I didn't even know qwints was in the game.
Who would choose to kill him is the question . .
_________________________

[AceMarksman]

Actually,

Unvote

. I've got to remember, that's just looker's playstyle. I'm going to go back and re-read ort.

[AceMarksman]

_________________________

1. Anti-Bowser player died.
2. The player qwints died.
_________________________

I would have commented on the night events
regardless of whether or not that other guy did or not.

I mean seriously, I didn't even know qwints was in the game.
Who would choose to kill him is the question . .
_________________________

Maybe someone just decided to vidge the lurker?

[ZEEnon]

Possibly.

[ortolan]

Hello friends.

I shall refrain from any "I told you sos" at this stage.

Gorrad still looks like a good target to me. His 858 is perfectly consistent with being a last minute bus. Starting today by voting a "jumped in" player is also interesting when the mechanic was made clear before the game even started- what is intrinsically scummy about jumping in?

sirdanilot would do well to answer his question however.

tajo, now as I said yesterday tajo did tell us he had a "gut belief" in SK's claim which didn't seem to have much basis. And as I pointed out in 864, his justification for believing the claim was contradictory. Plus he tried to redirect votes to another wagon, Looker's, solely on the basis of "lurking", which is a very weak justification for a day one wagon, especially when one compares it to the now flipped-scum SK wagon. That said I do not think he is scummy alone for the suggestion of mass-claiming. I also don't think I've seen him as scum before which makes reading him all the more difficult.

I note he is again voting Looker for lurking.

Can you explain why did you find out ortolan very rational?

No comment.

906- Gorrad still being very aggressive toward sirdanilot.

Or hey, how about the fact that Castle folks win when all three non-Castle groups are dead? AKA three anti-town factions. AKA more than one anti-town NK.

Now be quiet, commenting on NKs is scummy. I'd vote for you if I wasn't voting for Sirdanilot. Backing up this is Bleach Mafia with Seraphim as well as Random Mafia 3 with UROE.

Is it just me or are all of Gorrad's reasons for attacking people really weak? Especially Moratorium, probably the most pro-town player in this game so far. Why exactly is it scummy to speculate on night-kills exactly, especially, when, as you say, we're trying to work out how the apparent two extra factions fit into the game?

That said, maybe quints actually was Bowser's Army, but a special power made him look like Mushroom Kingdom (although his after death reaction would be a bit strange in that regard). It would also explain why qwints could answer an item question.

Errrrrr......? And you think this is plausible why exactly?

The first one had Seraphim-scum lynched, the second had UROE-scum lynched. Both cases started with nightkill commentary, and in both games the scumminess of nightkill-commentary was brought up by yours truely. What does speculation gain? Nothing. What can it lose? An outted doctor.

This argument is invalid. A sample size of two does not a scum-tell make. Furthermore we have entirely different circumstances. Contrary to expectations, we had one scum die night one, with no other deaths. We are also trying to work out where the other two apparent factions fit in the game. How can you scum-hunt without some speculation about how many scum factions/killing-roles there are. And how exactly do you foresee Moratorium speculating about the setup being likely to out a doctor?

semioldguy can you explain what 925 means in practice for those of us not well acquainted with the first game.

You did it, you were town. UROE and Seraphim did it, they were scum. 2/3 is still a trend.

STATISTICS FAIL

My scumhunting powers say that Looker and ortolan should be the next people dying in this game.

LOL. I know I've never seen you as scum but this is so dumb it's worth lynching you for alone.

See, yesterday, while you were voting me for opposing a mass-claim plan as being useless which has since turned out to be...useless, I was busy catching scum. At the last minute, you tried to redirect from the scum's wagon, to someone else's (Looker), on the sole basis of "lurking". Additionally your reasoning for believing the scum's claim was contradictory (it was both too simple to be a fake-claim, and later too in-depth).

And your rationale for wanting me lynched today, apart from being incredibly pro-town, is???

Vote: poptajo

I'll leave Gorrad alone until sirdanilot answers his questions.

[sirdanilot]

k so reading the game may take a while though, anyone has a summary about what happened this would help my reread a bit otherwise count on about a week or so.