Mini 774: Case Closed Mafia (One Truth Prevails!)

[millar13]

I have a better idea, as I think at this stage in the game a tactic should be employed.

Anyone who has any investigative roles, should step-forward with a name claim. With only six left, there can't be that many left considering I assume there is is one if not not mafia members amongst us.

Once this has occurred, any one who can protect someone could step forward. That seems slightly more logical, than just name claiming that results to very little inciteful data

[Kairyuu]

@millar: No. Your idea is flawed. If we were to do something like that, we would need to have investigatives claim, and then leave it at that, since a hidden doc is better than an outed one, because the outed one, though they will keep the investigative role safe, will also die, whereas keeping them hidden will make the scum take a potshot. I still prefer full massclaim, because it improves our odds for a guarenteed win, depending on whether or not we can break the setup.

Your continued refusal to claim is bothering me. Only you and Batt haven't nameclaimed. Get to it.

FoS: millar13

[Battousai]

@Batt:

1. You said those exact words, I just took words out of the middle. I then referenced the two roles (the one you claim and the possible safeclaim of Akemi).

The words in the middle provided the context. I was making the point that I didn't see how either of the characters you think I might be would use the kill flavor that killed alexhans.

You also said you didn't see any character that would use magic, thus expecting me to tell you how ANY character would use magic is trying to defend yourself from the kill because of magic (something every character could do).

We can also bring reasoning into it. Why would I kill alexhans when a) he has never once called me scummy, and b) I have declared in-thread that I find him pro-town?

A) WIFOM B) If your scum, it doesn't matter if you called him the freaking pope.

2. As I already said, I don't think any character can do magic, and thus drugged would be the best bet.

You missed the second bit. Why would either of the characters use drugs to kill, especially Akemi, who I couldn't even find any real info on other than that she died?

I bet with a billion yen you could get some good drugs, that and her sister was a chemist. Could have stole it like the money. Any of those possible? I think so.

3. What roles would use magic then? As you said, you found none. Therefore there has to be 1 or there is none and drugged is a good substitute.

I actually found some info on wikipedia, and there are two character's under the label Magic Kaito Characters. Since the flavor from the N2 kills show alexhans as being Kaito, the only other one left would be Saguro Hakuba. I figured that this would be a dead end too, since on the front page it said that Isacc was Richard Moore/Saguro Hakuba, but then when I looked at the kill flavor, I noticed that it was a picture of Hakuba that was found on Isacc's body. Also, the mod's flavor after that was interesting:

The oddest thing, though, was the picture of Saguro Hakuba he had on him. What he could want with Hakuba, though, one can only speculate...

This implies, at least to me, that Saguro Hakuba is probably in the game, and, if so, is probably scum, likely SK.

If so, then how come there was no magic on the body, you left out that Issac died by being shot, like madeofphail.

4. You are getting pretty defensive here about nothing. I was just making talk while waiting for the millar to post. Notice how I never FoS'd you or voted you. All I basically said was that Sajin's theory is possible and since you roleclaimed I gave an opinion on what COULD be not IS or MOST LIKELY or whatever it is that is making you so defensive.

How am I getting defensive? Your reasoning doesn't make much sense to me, so I'm attempting to either understand it or debunk it.

You started getting defensive when I said your role could be a safeclaim. There is nothing to debunk there or nothing to defend against, yet you found a way to turn it up a notch.

@all: Nameclaims tell us nothing. The point of a massclaim is to confirm enough townies for an easy win or to notice a role combo that wins us the game. Simple nameclaims are not gonna do that. Please do as SC and I have and fullclaim. I'm trying to break this game (bringing my total up to 4)

I like nameclaims first, then roleclaims. If scum goes first, it increases the chance to be outted (usually scum would pick a minor role in the theme to avoid a counter).

[millar13]

@millar: No. Your idea is flawed. If we were to do something like that, we would need to have investigatives claim, and then leave it at that, since a hidden doc is better than an outed one, because the outed one, though they will keep the investigative role safe, will also die, whereas keeping them hidden will make the scum take a potshot. I still prefer full massclaim, because it improves our odds for a guarenteed win, depending on whether or not we can break the setup.

Your continued refusal to claim is bothering me. Only you and Batt haven't nameclaimed. Get to it.

FoS: millar13

Don't you see though, there are six people left. If two of them are scum, are we two more townies die tonight. Scum effectively wins. If you can think up anything that is more useful at tracking scum tell me, unless you are scum and therefore don't like the idea. Outting power roles, is vital during this stage in the game.

[StrangerCoug]

millar13, fullclaim or die.

[Korlash]

The only problem with that theory is that alexhans was Kaito, and alexhans was the one killed by the Magicked flavor.

There's always Toichi Kuroba but I suppose that's a little bit of a stretch for Case Closed mafia... hmmm...

Alright a quick search of Magic and Case closed together brings up a lot more stuff then I thought it would... Most of them revolving around the phantom thief kid. I suppose it is possible he was the cause of his own death...

I have a better idea, as I think at this stage in the game a tactic should be employed.

Anyone who has any investigative roles, should step-forward with a name claim. With only six left, there can't be that many left considering I assume there is is one if not not mafia members amongst us.

Once this has occurred, any one who can protect someone could step forward. That seems slightly more logical, than just name claiming that results to very little inciteful data

Explain to me how outing our power roles is a good idea? And why are you continuing to not claim your name?

Don't you see though, there are six people left. If two of them are scum, are we two more townies die tonight. Scum effectively wins. If you can think up anything that is more useful at tracking scum tell me, unless you are scum and therefore don't like the idea. Outting power roles, is vital during this stage in the game.

... Ok still failed to explain why outing power roles prevents two town from dying. In my experience, outing power roles pretty much assured town dies at night...

@all: Nameclaims tell us nothing. The point of a massclaim is to confirm enough townies for an easy win or to notice a role combo that wins us the game. Simple nameclaims are not gonna do that. Please do as SC and I have and fullclaim. I'm trying to break this game (bringing my total up to 4)

Your continued refusal to claim is bothering me. Only you and Batt haven't nameclaimed. Get to it.

Am I the only one seeing a little bit of contradicting statements here... You say nameclaims tell us nothing but then tell Miller and Bat to get to nameclaiming...

I like nameclaims first, then roleclaims. If scum goes first, it increases the chance to be outted (usually scum would pick a minor role in the theme to avoid a counter).

While I do agree nameclaiming and then roels is the best way, the scum have already proven to have safeclaims and so they aren't just randomly going to pick a minor role...

[millar13]

My name is Eva (in game)

I think we need to have something put in place, so people investigating actually can be protected. As at the end of the day, Investigation > Protection

[Sajin]

And Batt your up for name commitment.

@Korlash- yes the phatom thief kid, yes also the magic Kaito series. They share many of the same characters.

[Korlash]

I assume by Eva you mean Eva Kadan because it's always good to be vague when claiming... By no means make it easy for us to understand you please...

@Korlash- yes the phatom thief kid, yes also the magic Kaito series. They share many of the same characters.

Yes what? Did I ask you a question? You're confusing me...

[millar13]

That is in fact the Eva I am talking about Korlash...i just don't want to over-steo the boundary of what the Mod sees as word for word of the Role PM

[Korlash]

Right because the rest of us that said our full name have been dealt with so harshley...

I'd say after Bat name claims we get flavor in before roles. I still think theres a chance to find the scum through that and not waste whatlittle secrecy we have on a massclaim to help Kair's record books. Besides, i'd love to brak it first on less and never let him live it down.

[Battousai]

Joseph Meguire

flavor- time in force given me experience, much better than a gun or paperwork

[Kairyuu]

@Batt:

You also said you didn't see any character that would use magic, thus expecting me to tell you how ANY character would use magic is trying to defend yourself from the kill because of magic (something every character could do).

And then I did more research, and found this shiny little thing labeled "Magic Kaito Characters."

A) WIFOM B) If your scum, it doesn't matter if you called him the freaking pope.

WIFOM is not an explanation for anything. Don't be lazy. Analyze this "WIFOM." Which of the scenerios is more likely? Calling it WIFOM and discarding it is a cop out.

Also, scum killing their allies close to lylo is extremely stupid. Why would I kill someone I could almost definitely count on for support in lylo, and leave the wildcards alive?

I bet with a billion yen you could get some good drugs, that and her sister was a chemist. Could have stole it like the money. Any of those possible? I think so.

Did she escape with the money? If I recall, she got shot before she could get away. Also, drugs =/= magic. Is that really so hard to understand? Are you trying to say that Gorrad would put Magicked as a kill flavor instead of Drugged if the victim was drugged?

If so, then how come there was no magic on the body, you left out that Issac died by being shot, like madeofphail.

The kill flavor is irrelevent to my point. Having the picture on him implies that he, a cop, was investigating the person in the picture. My conclusion from that is that Saguro Hakuba is in the game and scum.

You started getting defensive when I said your role could be a safeclaim. There is nothing to debunk there or nothing to defend against, yet you found a way to turn it up a notch.

At this point I'm just arguing for the sake of arguing. Your theories don't make sense, and I am therefore now trying to convince you that you are wrong.

I like nameclaims first, then roleclaims. If scum goes first, it increases the chance to be outted (usually scum would pick a minor role in the theme to avoid a counter).

Nameclaims are now done. Roleclaim time. Gogogogogogo.

@millar:

Don't you see though, there are six people left. If two of them are scum, are we two more townies die tonight. Scum effectively wins. If you can think up anything that is more useful at tracking scum tell me, unless you are scum and therefore don't like the idea. Outting power roles, is vital during this stage in the game.

I'm not at all against outing roles. In fact, I want to out all of them. However, a forced massclaim has the increased likelyhood of outing scum in the process. Keep in mind, massclaim was my idea.

@Korlash:

There's always Toichi Kuroba but I suppose that's a little bit of a stretch for Case Closed mafia... hmmm...

Alright a quick search of Magic and Case closed together brings up a lot more stuff then I thought it would... Most of them revolving around the phantom thief kid. I suppose it is possible he was the cause of his own death...

That would actually make sense. It would also imply that there is some sort of redirector. I wouldn't be surprised if alexhans JoaT powers included a vig. However, that would leave us with a living scum.

Am I the only one seeing a little bit of contradicting statements here... You say nameclaims tell us nothing but then tell Miller and Bat to get to nameclaiming...

No contradiction. Nameclaims are worthless, but people seem to be dead set on them. Now that we have that tedious little thing done, we can get to the fullclaims.

I still think theres a chance to find the scum through that and not waste whatlittle secrecy we have on a massclaim to help Kair's record books. Besides, i'd love to brak it first on less and never let him live it down.

I will consider that a challenge.

@all: Flavor: I'm done with the Black Organization, and I want revenge on them. All I've got is my vote, but I'm gonna put it to good use.

[Battousai]

@Batt:

You also said you didn't see any character that would use magic, thus expecting me to tell you how ANY character would use magic is trying to defend yourself from the kill because of magic (something every character could do).

And then I did more research, and found this shiny little thing labeled "Magic Kaito Characters."

At the time when this first became posted, I believe you didn't say anything about Magic Kaito Characters (which are magicians who use tricks. I'm pretty sure none of them uses real 'magic').

A) WIFOM B) If your scum, it doesn't matter if you called him the freaking pope.

WIFOM is not an explanation for anything. Don't be lazy. Analyze this "WIFOM." Which of the scenerios is more likely? Calling it WIFOM and discarding it is a cop out.

Also, scum killing their allies close to lylo is extremely stupid. Why would I kill someone I could almost definitely count on for support in lylo, and leave the wildcards alive?

A) Killing someone who hasn't called you scummy and using it as an excuse later. Also, Alexhans was a powerrole, scum might have wanted all powerroles dead. A dead Alexhans could also be attributed to framing SC, as you already pointed out when you voted him in the very first post of the day.

B) He was a powerrole. So you can use it as a defense. Not many people of the ones that are alive actually have been attacking you or calling you scummy. So killing alexhans wouldn't be that big of a loss.[/quote]

I bet with a billion yen you could get some good drugs, that and her sister was a chemist. Could have stole it like the money. Any of those possible? I think so.

Did she escape with the money? If I recall, she got shot before she could get away. Also, drugs =/= magic. Is that really so hard to understand? Are you trying to say that Gorrad would put Magicked as a kill flavor instead of Drugged if the victim was drugged?

Do not know. Possible there was traces of 'real' magic in the drug, and I'm saying magician =/= 'real' magic (which can kill people). I haven't read up on Gorrand so anything is possible. Gorrad said the body was in perfect health, which could be attributed to drugs.

If so, then how come there was no magic on the body, you left out that Issac died by being shot, like madeofphail.

The kill flavor is irrelevent to my point. Having the picture on him implies that he, a cop, was investigating the person in the picture. My conclusion from that is that Saguro Hakuba is in the game and scum.

I thought you meant Saguro, as the SK, killed Isaac.

You started getting defensive when I said your role could be a safeclaim. There is nothing to debunk there or nothing to defend against, yet you found a way to turn it up a notch.

At this point I'm just arguing for the sake of arguing. Your theories don't make sense, and I am therefore now trying to convince you that you are wrong.

Since when is arguing just to argue a good thing? It muddys up the water on purpose. You are trying to convince me that I am wrong in thinking that it is possible your claim could be a safeclaim. Yeah, not going to happen.

@millar: I doubt there is a doc in the setup. If there is, either they were roleblocked N2 or are bad since two outed powerroles were killed.

[StrangerCoug]

Flavor claim: Some of my students have called me a witch, but I've actually been nicer over the years. I have nothing special other than the change of heart.

[Kairyuu]

@Batt:

At the time when this first became posted, I believe you didn't say anything about Magic Kaito Characters (which are magicians who use tricks. I'm pretty sure none of them uses real 'magic').

Well duh. Why do you thing I said "

and then

I went and did more research."

Killing someone who hasn't called you scummy and using it as an excuse later.

People alive who have called me scummy:
Sajin

People alive who have expressed doubts about me:
you
Korlash

People alive who have said nothing either way:
millar
SC

People alive who have expressed that they feel I am town
No one (previously only alexhans)

I had one supporter. Killing him hurts my chances if I'm scum. I still say that the likelyhood is that as scum I wouldn't kill him.

Also, Alexhans was a powerrole, scum might have wanted all powerroles dead.

He was a pro-scum power role. Governors, statistically speaking, hurt the town's chances if they use their power. If I was scum, keeping him alive could have given me an extra Day if I got lynched and he was still alive.

A dead Alexhans could also be attributed to framing SC, as you already pointed out when you voted him in the very first post of the day.

This is actually a valid point, but the cons of killing him far outweigh this one pro, since it isn't lylo yet.

Do not know. Possible there was traces of 'real' magic in the drug, and I'm saying magician =/= 'real' magic (which can kill people). I haven't read up on Gorrand so anything is possible. Gorrad said the body was in perfect health, which could be attributed to drugs.

I still say this makes no sense at all.

Since when is arguing just to argue a good thing?

Since that's the way I play. I like to argue, and then analyze people's reactions to the argument I am embroiled in. Sometimes the argument is just a stupid one like this. Either way, it helps me build reads.

[madeofphail]

This was a triumph
I’m making a note here, Huge Success.
It’s hard to always state my satisfaction.
Aperture Science
We do what we must, because, we can
For the good of all of us, except the ones who are dead.
But there’s no sense crying over every mistake you just keep on trying ‘till you run out of cake,
And the science gets done, and you make a neat gun for the people who are still alive.

I’m not even angry
I’m being so sincere right now
Even though you broke my heart and killed me
And tore me to pieces,
And threw every piece, into, a fire
As they burned it hurt because I’m so happy for you,
Now these points of data make a beautiful line, and we’re out of beta, we’re releasing on time.
So, I’m glad I got burned, think of all the things we learned, for the people who are still alive.

Go ‘head and leave me,
I think I prefer to sit inside
Maybe you’ll find someone else to help you
Maybe like mesa.
That was a joke, ha-ha, fat chance.
Anyway this cake is great; it’s so delicious and moist
Look at me still talking when there’s science to do
When I look up there it makes me glad I’m not you
I’ve experiments to run; there is research to be done
On the people who are still alive
And believe me I am still alive
I’m doing science and I’m still alive
I feel fantastic and I’m still alive
While you’re dying I’ll be still alive
And when you’re dead I will be still alive
Still alive, still alive.

[Gorrad]

Vote Count brought to you by Aperture Science- Thank you for helping us help you help us all.

StrangerCoug(1): Kairyuu
Kairyuu(1): Sajin

Not Voting(4): Korlash, StrangerCoug, Millar13, Battousai

[millar13]

Battou the fact that you don't believe I am Doc says a lot...at this stage in the game. Townies start to believe each other even in "false hope".

The fact that you very much, your own man make me feel you don't want to come up as having a group mentality. Why don't you role claim? No....you must role claim!

[Korlash]

Battou the fact that you don't believe I am Doc says a lot...at this stage in the game. Townies start to believe each other even in "false hope".

Did you claim doc? And sayingg that someone should believe a doc claim out of "false hope" and using it to suggest he isn't town is just dumb on your part. I'd have to lower my standards to even argue it it's such a stupid point to make...

The fact that you very much, your own man make me feel you don't want to come up as having a group mentality. Why don't you role claim? No....you must role claim!

Why must he role claim before anyone else?


My Flavor: I have a lot going on for myself with my detective job, but it's not going to be of much help here. I do have a vote though so I should be careful with it.

I will consider that a challenge.

Alright.

[Battousai]

Millar: I don't recall you ever claiming doc, but I'm guessing you have claimed that at least now. After the flavor claims get done, we will need to know who you targetted each night.

[Sajin]

Flavor: I got myself into a fine mess. Perhaps jimmy will show up, in the meantime I need to help my dad.

Role: Vanilla Townie

@miller- if you were a doc, why did madeofphail die? He was a vig, practically confirmed town because of day 2, and the roleblocker was dead. I don't understand. Targets. Now. With explanations preferably.



@all about alexhans- He was probably redirected to himself since apparently kairyuu knew nothing of magic kaito....hmm. I guess I can

unvote

So what does everyone think about the pictures in the death scenes? I think that the first listed person turns into the second listed person if hit with the drug. Does that seem consistent?

[millar13]

why did madeofphail die....because i didn't protect him as totally forgot about him possibly being a town vig. Too busy protecting you

[Battousai]

N1, N2 - who did you target exactly. I'm guessing N2 was Sajin from your last post.

[Korlash]

And I'd like flavor from you Miller asap...