MKM II GAME OVER


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Post Post #1675 (ISO) » Fri Jun 05, 2009 10:26 am

Post by Kast »

@RBT-
-Do you know why your vote counts for zero?

-Are you soft claiming private information that allows you to practically confirm Sirdan?

-Did you expect Ort to object to someone calling him a townie?

I agree that Ort's agreement with Gorrad indicates that Gorrad did correctly identify the first letter of his name, the number of coins he has, and his lack of items.



Mod edit
Visible Votecount

-Empking (2): Gorrad, Kast
-Kast (1): Empking
-AceMarksman (1): Riceballtail

Not voting (6): killa seven, ZEEnon, caf19, ortolan, AceMarksman, sirdanilot

With 10 alive it takes 6 real votes to lynch.
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Post Post #1676 (ISO) » Fri Jun 05, 2009 12:48 pm

Post by killa seven »

sirdanilot wrote:
killa seven wrote:
ortolan wrote:killa seven, Riceballtail and zEEnon, all so anti-town - at least one scum here

caf19, AceMarksman and sirdanilot all need a re-read, in that order.
How am i antitown?
cause you post short posts
Short posts doesnt = anti town.
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Games Won..
Mini 545 as town.
Mini 578 as scum.
mini 618 as scum.
Mushroom Kingdom as town.
Monty pythons as town.
mini 642 bodyguard 7 as town
Explosive mafia - as scum
mini 712 -town
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Post Post #1677 (ISO) » Fri Jun 05, 2009 12:53 pm

Post by Kast »

@K7-
Lurking = Anti-town.

Not posting, posting only irrelevant comments, and/or posting extremely short semantic jabs = lurking.

That appears to be typical of your behavior so far. Pretty much the same for Empking and ZEEnon.

How about the three of you join us in playing this game?
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Post Post #1678 (ISO) » Fri Jun 05, 2009 4:45 pm

Post by Riceballtail »

Kast wrote:@RBT-
-Do you know why your vote counts for zero?
No, it's been changing every day.


-Are you soft claiming private information that allows you to practically confirm Sirdan?
No, I just think that I have been able to put 2 + 2 together and came up with what I believe to be four.


-Did you expect Ort to object to someone calling him a townie?
Hardly, but I would expect him to call him out if any of the information was wrong. Was mostly wanting to see if we should believe the information or not.
Bolding=responses.
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Post Post #1679 (ISO) » Fri Jun 05, 2009 10:55 pm

Post by Empking »

Kast wrote:@K7-
Lurking = Anti-town.

Not posting, posting only irrelevant comments, and/or posting extremely short semantic jabs = lurking.

That appears to be typical of your behavior so far. Pretty much the same for Empking and ZEEnon.

How about the three of you join us in playing this game?
So just posting long semantic jabs isn't lurking?
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Post Post #1680 (ISO) » Sat Jun 06, 2009 12:36 am

Post by sirdanilot »

Empking wrote:
Kast wrote:@K7-
Lurking = Anti-town.

Not posting, posting only irrelevant comments, and/or posting extremely short semantic jabs = lurking.

That appears to be typical of your behavior so far. Pretty much the same for Empking and ZEEnon.

How about the three of you join us in playing this game?
So just posting long semantic jabs isn't lurking?
fail

--

not sure what to think of rbt's softclaim
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Post Post #1681 (ISO) » Sat Jun 06, 2009 1:56 am

Post by Empking »

sirdanilot wrote:
Empking wrote:
Kast wrote:@K7-
Lurking = Anti-town.

Not posting, posting only irrelevant comments, and/or posting extremely short semantic jabs = lurking.

That appears to be typical of your behavior so far. Pretty much the same for Empking and ZEEnon.

How about the three of you join us in playing this game?
So just posting long semantic jabs isn't lurking?
fail
Elaborate.
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Post Post #1682 (ISO) » Sat Jun 06, 2009 4:07 am

Post by sirdanilot »

Empking wrote:
sirdanilot wrote:
Empking wrote:
Kast wrote:@K7-
Lurking = Anti-town.

Not posting, posting only irrelevant comments, and/or posting extremely short semantic jabs = lurking.

That appears to be typical of your behavior so far. Pretty much the same for Empking and ZEEnon.

How about the three of you join us in playing this game?
So just posting long semantic jabs isn't lurking?
fail
Elaborate.
Kast's post may be long, but they are not 'extremely long semantic jabs'.

Anyway, instead of spending 10 seconds posting that one liner, you could have scumhunted (preferably longer than 10 seconds, but even 10 seconds is better than nothing).
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Post Post #1683 (ISO) » Sat Jun 06, 2009 4:24 am

Post by Empking »

sirdanilot wrote:
Empking wrote:
sirdanilot wrote:
Empking wrote:
Kast wrote:@K7-
Lurking = Anti-town.

Not posting, posting only irrelevant comments, and/or posting extremely short semantic jabs = lurking.

That appears to be typical of your behavior so far. Pretty much the same for Empking and ZEEnon.

How about the three of you join us in playing this game?
So just posting long semantic jabs isn't lurking?
fail
Elaborate.
Kast's post may be long, but they are not 'extremely long semantic jabs'.
When did anyone say differently?
Anyway, instead of spending 10 seconds posting that one liner, you could have scumhunted (preferably longer than 10 seconds, but even 10 seconds is better than nothing).
I was scum hunting.
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Post Post #1684 (ISO) » Sat Jun 06, 2009 11:16 am

Post by Riceballtail »

sirdanilot wrote:not sure what to think of rbt's softclaim
Wait, what?
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Post Post #1685 (ISO) » Sat Jun 06, 2009 11:19 am

Post by ZEEnon »

I'm afraid i'm not seeing a softclaim.
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Post Post #1686 (ISO) » Sun Jun 07, 2009 4:05 am

Post by sirdanilot »

Riceballtail wrote:
sirdanilot wrote:not sure what to think of rbt's softclaim
Wait, what?
that you 'know' I am town implies you have role knowledge others don't have. but if you don't think it's wise to claim that now, don't.
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Post Post #1687 (ISO) » Sun Jun 07, 2009 8:11 pm

Post by Kast »

Riceballtail wrote:-Are you soft claiming private information that allows you to practically confirm Sirdan?
No, I just think that I have been able to put 2 + 2 together and came up with what I believe to be four.
This is a bit hard to believe. Buddying to a townie? Defending scumbuddy? Hiding a soft claim or slip?

Without some kind of private information, I see no way you can know sirdanilot's affiliation with any certainty.

The only public knowledge we have about players ready to jump in is:
-Millar jumped in as a "Boo" on Bowser's Army and couldn't tell us or chose not to tell us why he jumped in.
-Gorrad claims to have the power to summon BA players.
-Gorrad did not summon Millar.
-Sirdanilot does not know or chooses not to tell us why he jumped in.

@Empking-
You try to distract by arguing against something that is neither Sirdanilot's point nor relevant to his point.

-I did not state an exclusive list of forms of lurking. I posted a list of the behaviors which the three players I named are engaging in which are all anti-town behaviors. Your comment is a semantics argument about what lurking includes but has no relevance to my point.

-Your comment is ambiguous enough that it could be interpreted as accusing me of engaging exclusively in long semantic jabs. I think it reads a bit more sensibly as just trying to be cheeky and distracting from the point with some humor.

-I've seen some games where you did more analysis of player actions and potential motivations for those actions. I'm not seeing anything similar to that in this game. You're voting based on gut with no posts to support it; despite looking with intent to find "evidence". It certainly does not look like you are scum-hunting. Please share some more thoughts with us.

@Sirdanilot-
RBT claimed that he has no private information and that his post was not intended as a softclaim. He claims to have deduced your role from whatever information is available to the town.
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Post Post #1688 (ISO) » Sun Jun 07, 2009 8:40 pm

Post by sirdanilot »

oh regarding rbt that's clearly bullshit

vote: rbt


You have secret role info or something to deduce I am town, but you don't wish to tell? Fine. But if your reasons for thinking I am town are not secret, tell them at once. Or give a good reason not to tell them while scum are watching.

Another possibility might be that you send a letter or something.
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Post Post #1689 (ISO) » Sun Jun 07, 2009 9:17 pm

Post by Empking »

Kast wrote: @Empking-
You try to distract by arguing against something that is neither Sirdanilot's point nor relevant to his point.

-I did not state an exclusive list of forms of lurking. I posted a list of the behaviors which the three players I named are engaging in which are all anti-town behaviors. Your comment is a semantics argument about what lurking includes but has no relevance to my point.
So I'm not allowed to make my own points?
-Your comment is ambiguous enough that it could be interpreted as accusing me of engaging exclusively in long semantic jabs. I think it reads a bit more sensibly as just trying to be cheeky and distracting from the point with some humor.
Or trying to get more info about you to see if certain things are scum tells.
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Post Post #1690 (ISO) » Sun Jun 07, 2009 11:54 pm

Post by Riceballtail »

sirdanilot wrote:oh regarding rbt that's clearly bullshit

vote: rbt


You have secret role info or something to deduce I am town, but you don't wish to tell? Fine. But if your reasons for thinking I am town are not secret, tell them at once. Or give a good reason not to tell them while scum are watching.

Another possibility might be that you send a letter or something.
Well, you left a breadcrumb, and I double-checked it with other information from players, and was able to, from that information, decide that you absolutely have to be what I think your role is. It is five letters, is it not?

And no, I have absolutely no secret information, or any role/ability/item/power that gave me this information. The only reason I am trying to be vague is that I think your role would be more useful if the scum don't know it.
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Post Post #1691 (ISO) » Mon Jun 08, 2009 12:45 am

Post by ortolan »

Kast (1675) wrote:-Did you expect Ort to object to someone calling him a townie?
Yer, my thoughts exactly lul.

I think Empking's probably town from what I've read recently.

Interested to see RBT v.s. sirdanilot conclude.

Kast do you know why you have a double vote?

I'll be honest I haven't re-read yet.
Currently modding Mole Mafia: http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=20529

Feel free to PM me to be ready in case I need a replacement.
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Post Post #1692 (ISO) » Mon Jun 08, 2009 7:09 am

Post by sirdanilot »

Riceballtail wrote:
sirdanilot wrote:oh regarding rbt that's clearly bullshit

vote: rbt


You have secret role info or something to deduce I am town, but you don't wish to tell? Fine. But if your reasons for thinking I am town are not secret, tell them at once. Or give a good reason not to tell them while scum are watching.

Another possibility might be that you send a letter or something.
Well, you left a breadcrumb, and I double-checked it with other information from players, and was able to, from that information, decide that you absolutely have to be what I think your role is. It is five letters, is it not?

And no, I have absolutely no secret information, or any role/ability/item/power that gave me this information. The only reason I am trying to be vague is that I think your role would be more useful if the scum don't know it.
unvote


Thanks for saying it's useful if the scum don't know it.... :/

rbt is not cleared btw but less suspicious
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Post Post #1693 (ISO) » Tue Jun 09, 2009 4:58 am

Post by AceMarksman »

I'm baaaaaaaaack!

re-reading now, but if there's anything important you guys want me to see now, then tell me and I'll zero in on it first.
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Post Post #1694 (ISO) » Tue Jun 09, 2009 7:22 am

Post by Kast »

@Empking-
You are welcome to make new points and nothing that I posted indicates otherwise.

You were attempting to argue with Sirdanilot but actually did not respond to his real point. You seem to enjoy these straw-man tactics; they are pretty characteristic of your behavior as scum.

@RBT-
So your previous comment was softclaiming to have found a plausible breadcrumb?

Sirdanilot practically confirmed that now, so I am less suspicious of your claim to think/know he is town.

One point though, just because a player made a breadcrumb does not mean that he is a townie or that the breadcrumbed role is his actual role.

@AceM-
Welcome back. I'd like to hear your thoughts on Empking, Gorrad's claimed role, and RBT.
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Post Post #1695 (ISO) » Tue Jun 09, 2009 7:24 am

Post by Empking »

Kast wrote:@Empking-
You are welcome to make new points and nothing that I posted indicates otherwise.

You were attempting to argue with Sirdanilot but actually did not respond to his real point. You seem to enjoy these straw-man tactics; they are pretty characteristic of your behavior as scum.
What wa his real point?

You seem to be mentioning what I was attempting or planning to do a lot. Why is that?
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Post Post #1696 (ISO) » Tue Jun 09, 2009 8:09 am

Post by Kast »

@Empking-
-To be clear:
You realize that I did not post anything remotely related to telling you that you are not allowed to post new points.

You realize that you have not been directly addressing the points made in your responses to myself, sirdanilot, and other players in general.

Your straw-man responses are scummy and are characteristic of your normal play as scum.

-Sirdanilot's point is the same point that others have raised against you; you are not contributing and are not scumhunting.

You should change your behavior from the short, irrelevant, semantic jabs and straw-men to actual scumhunting.

-When I have said you were attempting to do something, it has been accompanied with the implication that you failed to actually do that thing. If it looks like I say it a lot, that's probably because you fail a lot.
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Post Post #1697 (ISO) » Tue Jun 09, 2009 8:31 am

Post by Empking »

Kast wrote:@Empking-
-To be clear:
You realize that I did not post anything remotely related to telling you that you are not allowed to post new points.
Well considering you called me scummy for posting new points. No.

You realize that you have not been directly addressing the points made in your responses to myself, sirdanilot, and other players in general.
I have. So no.
Your straw-man responses are scummy and are characteristic of your normal play as scum.
Yet, incredibally you've yet to give an example of me strawmanning.
-Sirdanilot's point is the same point that others have raised against you; you are not contributing and are not scumhunting.
Sir: How am I not scumhunting?
You should change your behavior from the short, irrelevant, semantic jabs and straw-men to actual scumhunting.
Do you think making long posts to justify OMGUS is better than short scum hunting?
-When I have said you were attempting to do something, it has been accompanied with the implication that you failed to actually do that thing.
Why presume I attempted to do that thing? Why are you strawmanning? Why are you lying?
If it looks like I say it a lot, that's probably because you fail a lot.
Ad hom.
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Post Post #1698 (ISO) » Tue Jun 09, 2009 9:30 am

Post by Kast »

@Empking-
-Post an example of me calling you scummy for posting a new point.

-Please try to be consistent. I pointed out that your post failed to address the post it was responding to. You answered that you were making a new point. If you are making a new point instead of addressing the old point, then you are not addressing that old point.

-I have pointed out the examples but here again for your convenience:

I posted a series of thoughts about you. Instead of addressing them, you called me a liar without any elaboration. On further clarification, it turns out you don't understand the meaning of the word implicit and so thought that I was lying. In either event, you attempted to avoid answering my points by calling me a liar (the straw man).

The next example is not a direct straw man, but does show you avoiding addressing the points brought to you by claiming confusion about the number of votes against you, and then continuing to act confused after it was clarified.

After multiple players asked for K7, ZEEnon, and Empking to contribute more, you responded to my post by asking an irrelevant question.

You also use a straw man against Sirdanilot's point. Sirdanilot called you out for not scumhunting. Your comment is ambiguous and could be taken as an accusation of Kast as lurking or as an inane continuation of your lurking, non-contributory behavior. If the former, then he corrects you. If the latter, then it shows that you are continuing your anti-town behavior. Instead of addressing this, you argue semantically that you did not specifically state that Kast is lurking; but inconsistently claim that your useless comment was scumhunting. In either case, you are using that straw man post to avoid addressing the point that you are not actually scumhunting.

You also fail to address my response to your ambiguous comment. Instead, you use another straw man and pretend that I was telling you that you can't bring up new points.

-Making up things to justify an OMGUS vote is NOT scumhunting. It is not better than short scumhunting.

Your question is a straw man; you are not engaging in short scumhunting. I am not making things up to justify an OMGUS vote. That question does not excuse you from needing to participate in this game. That question does not provide you with a valid defense.

-Given that you claim that your posts are responses, I feel safe in saying that you were attempting to respond. You can't have it both ways.

-Pointing out that another player failed to do something is not ad hom. You fail to use that term correctly.
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Post Post #1699 (ISO) » Wed Jun 10, 2009 3:14 am

Post by sirdanilot »

Empking, I cannot possibly prove that you don't scumhnunt. However, you can prove that you have scumhunted, by giving us a couple of quotes of you scumhunting. Burden of proof is with you.

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