Mini 808 - Rabbit Doubt Mafia: Over!

[Kmd4390]

Myko, what is your read on me alone? What is your read on Phily alone? If Phily flips town at some point, what is your read on me? If Phily flips scum at some point, what is your read on me? If I flip town at some point, what is your read on Phily? For sake of completeness, if I were to flip scum, what would your read on Phily be? How does Tenchi fit in with all of those scenarios? Do you have other suspects?

[mykonian]

Myko, what is your read on me alone? What is your read on Phily alone? If Phily flips town at some point, what is your read on me? If Phily flips scum at some point, what is your read on me? If I flip town at some point, what is your read on Phily? For sake of completeness, if I were to flip scum, what would your read on Phily be? How does Tenchi fit in with all of those scenarios? Do you have other suspects?

mafiaman, and I have a bunch of people where I have little read on.

If you turn up town, Phily is a bit more likely scum (buddying)
If you are scum, phily is most likely town.

if phily is scum, you are likely town
if phily is town, that doesn't say a thing about you.

Tenchi fits not with Phily scum, as phily defends you partially by making me vote for Tenchi. Tenchi scum would make phily town. But your attacks on tenchi could easily be early bussing, the way you posted them. So it doesn't say a thing about you.


@phily: it could be, I'm still trying to make sense out of your aggressive defense of yourself, and your defense for KMD with making me vote Tenchi.

[Kmd4390]

Myko, thanks for putting up with my "just came home from work and extremely tired so I'm gonna ask a thousand questions" post. Your answers are probably helpful, but I can't make sense of them right now or even of my own post where I asked the questions. Wow, I really need to sleep. XD

[PhilyEc]

Myk, I've said it so many times now, IM ATTACKING YOU.

You've made a scummy move distancing from Tenchi and voting for KMD through gut feeling, would you ever stop trying to drag away from that fact. You've turned my attack on you into a case of defense through no explanation besides speculating that I'm trying to buddy with KMD.

I see you as scum for how you are playing, I dont see you as scum because I want a hug from Tenchi or KMD, give it over would you and show some sense of logic here, you're starting to resemble a brick wall.

Me, Attacking Myk for double votes, Myk, using this as excuse to accuse me of buddying to save his own hide.
Got it now?

[ZazieR]

Only MafiaMann is in prod territory. However, he's V/LA till the 7th (see his sig) so he won't be prodded.

[MafiaMann]

Sorry I see my name being mentioned alot but I dont have the time to look for when it was first mentioned can someone please help me.

[PhilyEc]

Sorry I see my name being mentioned alot but I dont have the time to look for when it was first mentioned can someone please help me.

If you're V/LA till the 7th then you should address these issues when you actually have the time to. I'm sure no one would mind highlighting their questions or rephrasing them.

[Iecerint]

Repeating mine:

Having just read MM in isolation, I agree that it would be nice to have on record his view of the various miniwagons, and of other not-yet-wagon'd players. I think the post restriction makes this a bit of a pain for him, which may explain why there's relatively little out there. From what I've read, it seems like he's agreed with Batt's points against Tenchi and is suspicious of Phily's room assignments form, but he does think that we should room in small groups overnight.

My avatar is the painting "Satan sowing his seeds," so I can be Satan if you need a name for me.

I'd just like you to contribute your perspective of the various conflicts (namely, Kmd/Phily/myko and Tenchi/Batt). Looker's question may be a reasonable way to approach Tenchi's wagon.

[mykonian]

Me, Attacking Myk for double votes, Myk, using this as excuse to accuse me of buddying to save his own hide.
Got it now?

Can't a man have two suspects, and like one better.

what I hate, is that you disagree with my choice and then actively try to change that, to move my vote from KMD to Tenchi. I've been very clear why I believed KMD more scum then Tenchi, and why tenchi was second choice because of that.

you haven't been so clear why your defense of KMD is justified, and your attacks on Tenchi have been "he acted scummy and posting a lot shouldn't help him, and so shouldn't towntells be".

and this disagreement results in two votes on eachother, and you've been quite eager to make an OMGUS case on me. Not that protown, my dear.

[PhilyEc]

Me, Attacking Myk for double votes, Myk, using this as excuse to accuse me of buddying to save his own hide.
Got it now?

Can't a man have two suspects, and like one better.

what I hate, is that you disagree with my choice and then actively try to change that, to move my vote from KMD to Tenchi. I've been very clear why I believed KMD more scum then Tenchi, and why tenchi was second choice because of that.

What I hate is the fact that you never once addressed my arguement correctly so save your own hide. Its not one bit town and shows you dont want to tackle the subject directly but rather deflect my accusations and turn them into a case worthy of a vote. That is essentially what you've done and it screams scummy to me. Read back over your posts and see how defensive you got rather than addressing the issue properly. You painted it a different colour and then addressed this colour as scum tendancy. ITS BULL.

I'm not even going to respond to the rest of your post, its meaningless prattle. I'm basically talking to a brick wall. Batt seems to agree here, I've not seen KMD nor Iece (Satan) comment on my attacks either. Do you not see how out of thin air your case is?

I apologise for my tone but this is getting ridiculous now, I want others to give a more substansive opinion over this arguement. Maybe that'll draw some sense into this dispute.

[mykonian]

What I hate is the fact that you never once addressed my arguement correctly so save your own hide.

just in case we are two townies bashing heads, could you provide the arguement in a way that I cant miss it, so I can try to react appropriately.

because even as scum I don't go around arguments, so it is always a mistake.

[mykonian]

btw, something I will then try to look at with a clear mind, so you have the time, I will react tomorrow.

[PhilyEc]

What I hate is the fact that you never once addressed my arguement correctly so save your own hide.

just in case we are two townies bashing heads, could you provide the arguement in a way that I cant miss it, so I can try to react appropriately.

because even as scum I don't go around arguments, so it is always a mistake.

Read back its all there, its down to if you're willing to understand I down have ownership over your thoughts. I'm pretty pissed off at the moment for other reasons so I'm not going to bother tonight man, sorry.

[Iecerint]

Batt seems to agree here, I've not seen KMD nor Iece comment on my attacks either.

Phily, if I recall correctly, your case against myko is based mostly on the doublevote post, though you think his response to your pressure has also been scummy. If that's accurate, I don't think I find the argument convincing. I'm pretty sure myko had been promising a catching-up post for awhile, so I think it's reasonable that he'd make a write-as-you-read post that included a doublevote. I agree with you that his response to pressure may contain elements of OMGUS, but a couple of your posts are similarly questionable (Post 449, where you implied that myko had made claims I don't believe he'd made). Moreover, I think myko has done a better job than you of avoiding the appearance of tunneling.

I think myko's scummiest moment that is difficult to attribute to poor play has been his attack on Tenchi that in my view unfairly characterized his attacks on Batt.

The original purpose of my Tenchi vote was to discourage Tenchi from lurking to safety, which is no longer relevant.

Unvote

for now.

[PhilyEc]

Batt seems to agree here, I've not seen KMD nor Iece comment on my attacks either.

Phily, if I recall correctly, your case against myko is based mostly on the doublevote post, though you think his response to your pressure has also been scummy. If that's accurate, I don't think I find the argument convincing. I'm pretty sure myko had been promising a catching-up post for awhile, so I think it's reasonable that he'd make a write-as-you-read post that included a doublevote.

Also consider the fact that he admits hes choosen KMD mostly for gut feeling after making enough reason for himself to vote Tenchi. The constrast between these two choices makes one think hes just stretching and truely only opposes KMD because KMD opposed him. Now look at how hes reacted to me, in the exact same fashion.

^ This is a summary of my reason for pressing myself so hard on Myk.

Moreover, I think myko has done a better job than you of avoiding the appearance of tunneling.

Have you not noticed I've been argueing with him this entire time about the same thing? How is it tunneling when its all down to the same problem which cannot be ironed out if he is infact lying like I suspect him to be?

[Iecerint]

I didn't focus as much on the "mostly gut" comment as on myko's mention of Kmd's early game solo mykolynch campaign, which I've repeatedly said didn't make much sense to me, either. I agree that it's a big stretch to vote Kmd on that basis alone, but I could imagine OMGUS feelings contributing enough to push it to a vote regardless of alignment.

Regarding the other -- I may misunderstand your question, but whether myko's lying or not, I don't expect him to change his story. It seems like his sketchiest behavior has been from before you started applying pressure; similarly, it doesn't seem like the pressure has been very productive. I think myko's response to Kmd's question, by contrast, has been productive.

It seems that you think myko has lied about his suspicion of Kmd and that he really suspected Tenchi. IMO myko's most obvious motive to lie in this way would be to protect scumbuddy Tenchi. Given that, shouldn't a player with your suspicions be focusing on Tenchi rather than myko, since myko flipping town tells us less than Tenchi flipping town? I'm not saying I ascribe to this view of things, but it seems to fit what I believe you find suspect about myko's play. Please correct me if I have forgotten something important that changes this.

[Battousai]

The only thing I do not grasp is how PhilyEc has been defending KMD. I see his response to the doublevote post is in response to how you overlooked clear scumminess that you found scummy, for gut. I do not think that he wanted you to vote Tenchi, but that gut shouldn't overshadow scumminess.

Now I agree that your doublevote was obviously a way to track your thinking as you reread, but the outcome is what I find suspicious as well. If you would have voted Tenchi, and then revoted KMD for a good reason, then it would have been much different.

[Tenchi]

Myko: Who was your primary suspect? Can you briefly explain your case against him/her?

[Looker]

Oreillio

[ZazieR]

1) Kmd4390
2) mykonian (1) - PhilyEc
3) Bitchibee (1) - PaperPenguin
4) Ztife (1) - Looker
5) Looker
6) Iecerint
7) MafiaMann
8) Kreriov

9) Tenchi (2) - Battousai, Kmd4390

10) PhilyEc (1) - mykonian
11) Battousai (1) - Tenchi
12) PaperPenguin (1) - Mafiamann

Not voting (4) - Bitchibee, Ztife, Iecerint Kreriov

With 12 players alive, you''ll need 7 votes to lynch.
Green indicates closest to lynch.

Room 1: Male Restroom - Kmd4390
Room 2: ???

Room 3: Library - Bitchibee, PaperPenguin

Room 4: ???
Room 5: ???

Room 6: Dark Room
Room 7: Storage Room - PhilyEc, Mykonian
Room 8: Great Hall
Room 9: Bedroom - Kreriov
Room 10: Empty Room - Iecerint

Room 11: ???
Room 12: Crime Scene Room - Looker, Battousai

Room 13: Exit Room - Ztife

Room 14: ???

Black means that that the door is open.
Red means that the door is closed.
Room 14 is in darkred, as it's its door in a different room, which got locked by Iecerint. So nobody, except for Iecerint (who can't use his barcode on it) can get to this door. So nobody can open this door until Iecrint unlocks his door.
Then there's purple. Room 7 also had an extra door in it. This one was opened by Mykonian. As Mykonian didn't leave this room when PhilyEc closed Room 7 and as Mykonian's door isn't locked, both Mykonian and PhilyEc can still move between these two rooms.

Corridor - Tenchi, Mafiamann

NOTE: When you open a room, you''ll automatically enter it.

[Kreriov]

@PhilyEc - I, too, would like to see a summary of your case against Myko. Yes, you have been pursuing it for pages now, but it essentially seems to boil down to you don't like him voting twice in one post and that you believe his vote on you was OMAGUS.

[PhilyEc]

@PhilyEc - I, too, would like to see a summary of your case against Myko. Yes, you have been pursuing it for pages now, but it essentially seems to boil down to you don't like him voting twice in one post and that you believe his vote on you was OMAGUS.

Also consider the fact that he admits hes choosen KMD mostly for gut feeling after making enough reason for himself to vote Tenchi. The constrast between these two choices makes one think hes just stretching and truely only opposes KMD because KMD opposed him. Now look at how hes reacted to me, in the exact same fashion.

^ This is a summary of my reason for pressing myself so hard on Myk.

Yes, and that is scummy. His reaction is the same as when KMD pressed into him which was OMGUS. I pressed into him show displaying more fact and reason on his second choice and instead attacking someone who suspects him back, this isnt town play.

How could I be any clearer as to why hes been acting scummy at this point? Why dont you post your opinion rather than piggybacking? It seems like you're fishing for a good point to use.

[Gregory]

I am playing the game. I'm trying to lynch scum.

players who say they are town, mostly aren't. Why did you do this?

1) Why would I want to go to a smelly restroom?

why do you want to leave the starting room? Why travel to a suspicious room, while you could stay in a room where nothing happens?

KMD, do you wanna keep watch over him together in the toilet tonight? (sounds so wrong)

I'd prefer if we all stayed in our own rooms for tonight, but he has no room..

NO, what if scum doesn't have to be in the same room as the killed one? Room was locked up, so we will never be able to get there anymore.

I see there are other plans now. ok. kinda dangerous when scum kills the keyholder.

Myk, why is everyone who suspects you scum?

agree, looks like omgus myk. Allthough I think you should cool down a little, phily.

gregory moves to corridor, moves to room 7, moves to room 3, moves to room 10, moves to corridor

meh, tired of running.


btw, KMD, could you open door 1, as I think that's the only room that can give protection to some (female) players. (Looker is scaring me )

[Gregory]

why would you guys close doors? at night, they aren't protecting us, are they? The only thing it does is keep a door locked if you're killed. and really, town doesn't want that.

[Ztife]

Myko's double vote post was actually like, all over the place, but I actually do agree with him on KMD's playstyle being a little less dominant than his usual town plays. The whole post was of weak cases and not very strong votes, it warrants little attention on my part.

Not that I'm an expert on KMD's playstyle or anything.

@ Post 448
Why do you think phily and KMD are not scum buddies? Im not too clear on this point.

I do agree that a KMD/Tenchi bus might be possible, since KMD has been attacking tenchi ever since the batt-in-the-storage-room case.

Tenchi what's your read on KMD?
And KMD what's your read on phily?