Newbie 810 - Game over!

[12Keyblade]

villa lean
keyblade
blueraven

purgatory
illiniguy

wolf lean
kittymo
geekalicious
ronnieroo

Oh no Monsieur, that got me in trouble earlier. That being said, I concur with most of what's listed there.

[Monsieur]

Why would it get you in trouble?

[12Keyblade]

Why would it get you in trouble?

Ah, I just did something similar earlier in the game and got chewed out for it.

Scum-O-Meter:

Town
ronnieroo (3)
KittyMo (3)
Krauthammer (4)
TFGM/Zachrulez (5)
reverendpsycho (5)
xRECKONERx (6.5)
BlueRaven (7)
geekalicious (7)
Scum

And I got chewed out for it.

[geekalicious]

You mostly got chewed out for your Scum-O-Meter, 12Keyblade, because you pointed out the KittyMo could have been breadcrumbing that she's a cop.

That said, Monsieur, could you provide an explanation on why you placed each player in the category that you did?

[Vel-Rahn Koon]

Official Vote Count

geekalicious - 2 (Riddle, Monsieur)

BlueRaven - 1 (geekalicious)

Not Voting - 4 (12Keyblade, BlueRaven, KittyMo, ronnieroo)

4 to Lynch.

Deadline

is the end of Sunday, August 9 (Eastern, GMT - 4).

[Monsieur]

I will abstain providing an explanation to my reads because:

1) KeyBlade and I have been the only ones to post a full reads list on the entire cast, while everyone else has not. I find this ironic because although Keyblade had taken the time to post his reads list, while others have not, they are quick to judge and criticize.

My suggestion: Everyone should post their list of reads. It doesn't matter how you present it.

2) I have contributed to the discussion far too many times, and I'd prefer other people to talk other than myself.

My suggestion: Either exert effort into this game, or it will be discouraging and the expected value of us winning will decrease.

[12Keyblade]

^this.

Also, where is everyone?

[ronnieroo]

I will not hold it against anyone for the content or lack thereof that they are contributing because you have to understand people's personalities and tendencies. This requires knowing people and their idiosyncrasies.

Ok... Umm... I'm sorry but aren't you accusing Geek for not posting and thus lack of content? At least, that's the way I took your accusation of her. Did I mis-understand?

wolf lean
kittymo
geekalicious
ronnieroo

Reasons por favor?

[BlueRaven]

sorry my computer is playing up again, i am here and i am reading but i have no comment on it. Im doing checks on my computer but if i may have to send it off.

btw when did i become a girl?

[KittyMo]

Had a panic attack today. Not entirely stable. I'll answer everyone's questions tomorrow, hopefully.

xoxo KittyMo

[geekalicious]

I will abstain providing an explanation to my reads because:

1) KeyBlade and I have been the only ones to post a full reads list on the entire cast, while everyone else has not. I find this ironic because although Keyblade had taken the time to post his reads list, while others have not, they are quick to judge and criticize.

My suggestion: Everyone should post their list of reads. It doesn't matter how you present it.

2) I have contributed to the discussion far too many times, and I'd prefer other people to talk other than myself.

My suggestion: Either exert effort into this game, or it will be discouraging and the expected value of us winning will decrease.

No.

You do not post a whole list of people you find suspicious and not suspicious, not back that up, then defend your lack of proof by saying something along the lines of "Oh wellz, I've posted too much content."

[12Keyblade]

I will abstain providing an explanation to my reads because:

1) KeyBlade and I have been the only ones to post a full reads list on the entire cast, while everyone else has not. I find this ironic because although Keyblade had taken the time to post his reads list, while others have not, they are quick to judge and criticize.

My suggestion: Everyone should post their list of reads. It doesn't matter how you present it.

2) I have contributed to the discussion far too many times, and I'd prefer other people to talk other than myself.

My suggestion: Either exert effort into this game, or it will be discouraging and the expected value of us winning will decrease.

Mon, I would like to suggest that you continue contributing. Sometimes Mafia Games die because the most prolific posters stop and wait. Plus, I really don't want to see a Mafia win because there was no discussion.

[geekalicious]

My suggestion: Everyone should post their list of reads. It doesn't matter how you present it.

I'm composing a longer content post in reply to this. I've just been really busy with school since it's the end of the semester this past week. Hopefully, I'll get it posted by tomorrow.

[12Keyblade]

Had a panic attack today. Not entirely stable. I'll answer everyone's questions tomorrow, hopefully.

xoxo KittyMo

I'm composing a longer content post in reply to this. I've just been really busy with school since it's the end of the semester this past week. Hopefully, I'll get it posted by tomorrow.

I understand both of your difficulties, but now'd be a wonderful time. Let's see some discussion!

[geekalicious]

My suggestion: Everyone should post their list of reads. It doesn't matter how you present it.

Alright, I'll respond to this call. If I use a classification system similar to yours this is where I'd be placing players:

Villa lean
KittyMo
Monsieur

Purgatory
ronnieroo

Wolf lean
illiniguy09
BlueRaven
12Keyblade

Now detailed explanations:

KittyMo

I feel like the part from the second page where KittyMo says

OMGUS is scummy.

wasn't particularly scummy even though 12Keyblade and reverendpsycho had placed votes on each other too. I get the feeling that events from Day 1 in the random voting phase have the potential to be overblown, so I don't think the 12Keyblade-reverendpsycho interaction was really significant either.

Additionally, in the earlier part of the game around post 167, 12Keyblade used the Scum-O-Meter to point out the following:

KittyMo
Post 5: Votes Krauthammer for having the funniest username.
Post 10: Admits to lurking being a pet peeve of hers. Likes to get them replaced, not lynched.
Post 16: Posts a game for geekalicious to read where she and xRECKONERx play, and xRECKONERx fails at scum.
Post 18: Playstyle is scumhunting, which she sometimes fails at.
Post 29: Votes TFGM for voting no lynch and claiming to be experienced. Inference: No Lynch is a horrible idea.
Post 61: Tells TFGM to stop screwing with the game, unless he’s frustrated scum.
Post 160: Accuses me of “tunnel vision” and mentions an “investigation.” Cop breadcrumb?
Post 162: FOSs reverendpsycho for having weak voting reasons.

Scum-O-Meter says: 3 out of 10

So I'm going to say that at least very early in the game, KittyMo wasn't appearing scummy. Moving forward, I've looked through KittyMo's posts, and I just don't see anything particularly wrong-looking. In general, she seems to asking questions and putting her opinion out there. When she voted for Zachrulez, she had reasons that seemed well-thought out and backed up by solid evidence. My only issue with her is her lack of posting as of late. So.... That's why I'm placing KittyMo in the villa lean category.

Monsieur

Overall, I've found your posts very conductive of discussion and helpful in the process of scumhunting. However, your recent refusal to support your suspicions is making me somewhat suspicious of you. If are excused from posting more content at one point because you've already posted "too much" this sets up a precedent of you continually being allowed to call that excuse, something that's not acceptable in a game that's entirely based on the way you present your arguments and suspicions.

ronnieroo

Monsieur, though you say that you and 12Keyblade are the only ones to have posted reads on each player (though, I'm going to go ahead and note that, unlike 12Keyblade's reads, yours included no post proof to back them up), ronnieroo also gave her read on the game with some questions in her post 544.

Though she doesn't post as much as some other players, when she does post it tends to be informational and insightful. However, I'll continue to monitor for the fact that her lack of posting could also constitute lurking. Additionally, I don't think you've ever voted ronnieroo... Now, this could just mean you're really weighing your options before putting your vote out there, or it could indicate scum trying to avoid the responsibility of having been on someone's wagon. I'm not sure which.

illiniguy09

This player slot is looking like it's going to have to have a third player in it now that illiniguy09 has fallen into inactivity, so getting a read is difficult. However, illiniguy09 never offered full support for his vote, only saying:

Vote: Zachrulez
- Has made weak cases and voted for several people. Seemed to be trying to frame someone.

- Refusing to role claim.

Additionally, he hammered Zachrulez when we had explicitly agreed not to do so until 12Keyblade and ronnieroo returned from their V/LA. Both of these factor make me put him in the wolf lean category.

BlueRaven

See my post 569. In response to your comment,

BlueRaven is not like us, her contributions are more of analyzing the reactions that surround her. She isn't the type to post long analysis posts such as myself.

I can understand not making long posts. However, BlueRaven only really comments when pressed to, rarely contributing to the conversation without prompting. This seems scummy to me, like BlueRaven isn't even looking for scum.

12Keyblade

Early in the game, we had this interaction:

Um, 12Keyblade, where's the analysis of yourself?

Listen, if I analyze myself, I'll come up town, even if I am scum. (cause I'm biased). Feel free to do it.

At the time, this seemed a rather reasonable thing to say that you couldn't really evaluate yourself. However, post-Zachrulez lynch in your post 535 that was filled with evaluations of others you said

So here's what I think:
geek, BlueRaven, Zach and I looked scummy to start.

So wait, did you suddenly gain the ability to perceive yourself as scummy, hm?

Additionally, going back to the Scum-O-Meter you putting

Post 160: Accuses me of “tunnel vision” and mentions an “investigation.” Cop breadcrumb?

is still looking like a scummy role-fish. Finally, you very recently accused me of lurking, saying

2. It's possible his lurking can be attributed to panicking.

However, you also weren't posting during the exact same period of time! When I pressed you about it, you said

So why couldn't I have been doing the same thing instead of "panicking"? Granted, I was sick, but what led you to jump to the conclusion that I was lurking?

I wasn't aware that you were sick, and as such, I apologize.

Your part of the post was not a response to my question; it was an apology, totally different. You were caught in the place of accusing me of lurking while not posting yourself, so you dodged the question.

While these factors aren't enough to warrant a vote, 12Keyblade, they do put you in a category leaning towards wolf for me.

[geekalicious]

Oh, and

mod, illiniguy09 hasn't posted anything since July 19....

See this post.

[12Keyblade]

I'm not quoting your post, because it's way too long. But it should be understood that I've read it.

I'm inclined to agree with you on just about everything. I'm going to nitpick the analysis of me on a couple of things.

Re: My lack of self analysis:

My comment that I looked scummy to start was based on other's reactions. If I were to analyze myself at any point, I think I looked town, because I read my role PM. So the analysis of myself as "scummy" was based on my perceptions of other's perceptions.

Re: The "panicked lurking:"

I thought I had posted this, but the reason I was "lurking" was because I was waiting for others' opinions before commenting further. By the way, that fact that you pointed out (that I was seemingly avoiding this game) is an excellent point for some other players. I hadn't thought of that particular tactic, so you win a cookie.

[12Keyblade]

EBWOP:

Ha, found it!

12Keyblade, you hadn't posted in the thread since about the same time I had, but I'm the one lurking and "panicking." Uh. Huh. However, I note going through your post history that you were posting in other places such as General Discussion and the Queue after that time. Were you the one "panicking" in this thread?

Short answer: no.

Long answer: I was waiting for others to post their opinons and answer the questions directed at them. You and KittyMo had been away for a bit, so I was waiting to hear their opinions, particularly on our new replacement.

[KittyMo]

I am really really sorry about my lurking as of late. It's totally unintentional... Last week was one of the worst weeks of my entire life, and I'm still not doing well from that, and my internet broke yesterday, which would've been a great day to have posted content. Anyways, as a result, I'm going to bust out content today. (Hopefully it'll be coherent...the 100+ degree heat as of late is kind of messing with my brain. :/) I really don't want to replace out, because I don't want to do that to you guys, so I'll do my best. Though I can't promise my best for today is up to par with my usual best.

Expect more stuff in an hour or less.

- Kitty

[KittyMo]

villa lean
keyblade
blueraven

purgatory
illiniguy

wolf lean
kittymo
geekalicious
ronnieroo

Reasons please.

1) KeyBlade and I have been the only ones to post a full reads list on the entire cast, while everyone else has not. I find this ironic because although Keyblade had taken the time to post his reads list, while others have not, they are quick to judge and criticize.

You weren't ever critisized for posting your list. We're all just looking for something a little more from you - the reasons behind your leans. This shouldn't be difficult, unless you're scum having to fabricate reasons for finding people scummy or not scummy.

My suggestion: Everyone should post their list of reads. It doesn't matter how you present it.

Not everyone agrees with PBPAs. Some feel that they are anti-town because they are helping the scum choose who to nightkill. I think they help more than they hurt, so I'd be happy to do one. However, I am going to refrain from making one until you give the reasons for yours, because it makes me uncomfortable that you're acting scummy in relations to this, and you're asking me to make one. (I don't think that last sentence made much sense...I really can't figure out how to better explain it though. :/ )

2) I have contributed to the discussion far too many times, and I'd prefer other people to talk other than myself.

Nah, you're doing great. Keep up the good work! You are in no way posting too much, especially since the person you replaced was so quiet. We need all the help we can get determining our read on you.

My suggestion: Either exert effort into this game, or it will be discouraging and the expected value of us winning will decrease.

I totally agree. I'm going to try to improve my posting amount to what it was when I first joined the game.

Surprisingly, I agree with almost everything Geek just said.

[ronnieroo]

Additionally, I don't think you've ever voted ronnieroo... Now, this could just mean you're really weighing your options before putting your vote out there, or it could indicate scum trying to avoid the responsibility of having been on someone's wagon. I'm not sure which.

You're correct. I haven't placed a vote the entire game. My reasons being:
a. I left for a week. I didn't want to leave my vote on someone, and didn't have time to vote after I got back.
b. Before I left, I didn't see anyone scummy enough to place a vote on.

[geekalicious]

villa lean
keyblade
blueraven

purgatory
illiniguy

wolf lean
kittymo
geekalicious
ronnieroo

Oh no Monsieur, that got me in trouble earlier. That being said, I concur with most of what's listed there.

Villa lean
KittyMo
Monsieur

Purgatory
ronnieroo

Wolf lean
illiniguy09
BlueRaven
12Keyblade

I'm not quoting your post, because it's way too long. But it should be understood that I've read it.

I'm inclined to agree with you on just about everything. I'm going to nitpick the analysis of me on a couple of things.

12Keyblade, Monsieur's post of suspicions is somewhat of an inverse of mine that you agreed with at the beginning of the page. Yet, somehow, you now are inclined to agree with me "on just about everything" near the end of the same page? What, are you just sponging up opinions?

[12Keyblade]

12Keyblade, Monsieur's post of suspicions is somewhat of an inverse of mine that you agreed with at the beginning of the page. Yet, somehow, you now are inclined to agree with me "on just about everything" near the end of the same page? What, are you just sponging up opinions?

Allow me to clarify:

Agree=understand your opinions and understand why you have chosen to evaluate the players in that manner, while reserving final judgement until after illiniguy09 is replaced.

[geekalicious]

I just wanted to let you all know that I won't be available on the thread tomorrow (Saturday). And sorry about the avatar. I just couldn't resist the temptation to change it after I mocked this up for another forum I'm posting on.

[KittyMo]

Nooooo! I loved your old one! D: