Newbie 816 - Game over!

For Newbie Games, which have a set format and experienced moderators. Archived during the 2023 queue overhaul.
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Post Post #225 (ISO) » Sat Aug 08, 2009 10:58 am

Post by purple princess »

ElectricBadger wrote: PP - Don't misinterpret me. Mislynches are to be avoided, so you should have good logic and your own reasoning behind your vote - and not just vote for anyone! - but they do happen. I generally ask myself "If this is a townie, and we lynch them, can I justify why I voted?"

However, this isn't a game about knowing for sure. If townies are too paralyzed by fear of a mislynch to act, mafia WILL win
I totally agree, I was just sharing my thoughts on the progress of the game that's all.

@havingfitz & Manzcar as you are the only ones apart from me not voting, if you had to vote for someone right now, who would you choose and why?

@zwetschenwasser what made you change your vote when ikd hasn't posted anything for a while now? are you in a hurry to end day one?
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Post Post #226 (ISO) » Sat Aug 08, 2009 11:04 am

Post by zwetschenwasser »

I'm in a hurry to lynch someone before day 1 ends on us.
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Post Post #227 (ISO) » Sat Aug 08, 2009 11:18 am

Post by purple princess »

zwetschenwasser wrote:I'm in a hurry to lynch someone before day 1 ends on us.
Your willing for this to happen without a response from him first? as electricbadger said we stil have 4 days left, your vote seems a little rushed, sure I am steering my vote towards ikd right now, but it would be unfair to lynch him before he has a chance to responed.
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Post Post #228 (ISO) » Sat Aug 08, 2009 7:21 pm

Post by Manzcar »

Princess said
I Was just wondering if lailai and tfrench are being replaced any time soon? this game seems a little quiet and slow which could be bad for us so close to deadline.


I don't believe that a tfrench replacement will be able to get up to date be the deadline, but I think that lailai's replacement will be up to date when the deadline arrives. -smiles-



Zwets said
GAH! Unvote; Vote: IKD Let's get this over with plz.
I'm in a hurry to lynch someone before day 1 ends on us.
This is the problem for voting for votings sake and fearing the deadline. So Zwets do you feel that IKD is a better lynch for the town than dram?

Princess said
@havingfitz & Manzcar as you are the only ones apart from me not voting, if you had to vote for someone right now, who would you choose and why?
My two suspects are still tfrench and IKD. My problem is I don't feel that there is a wealth of evidence for either being scum. Dram and Zwets actions towards the end of this day have definitely caught my eye. But I am leaning towards IKD for the discusion / arguing extensively over theory, lack of scum hunting due to the conflict with Adel, the unvote of his vote on tfrench when pressed that his vote didn't match his statement that the third vote is usually scum. so if I had to vote someone it would be IKD. I agree that IKD should have the chance to defend himself. Haste is not good for the town.
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Post Post #229 (ISO) » Sat Aug 08, 2009 11:06 pm

Post by havingfitz »

purple princess wrote:@ havingfitz, do you still think tfrench is still scum? or was it just a newbie move? what are your thoughts on a quicklynch the closer we get to the deadline?
Nothing has happened to change my mind about TF. Assuming TF actually was new/inexperienced I think their actions only solidify my suspicions as someone more experienced probably wouldn't have made such an obvious questionable move [ie re-putting someone at L-1 so soon after that action had been discouraged to others {me}].
purple princess wrote:@havingfitz & Manzcar as you are the only ones apart from me not voting, if you had to vote for someone right now, who would you choose and why?
I would hate to vote before TF is replaced and the replacement has had a chance to defend their position...but I would still lean towards TF at this moment for the reasons provided in my earlier posts. My next would be ZW based on initial suspicions towards Adel and ZW's subsequent behavior (ex. his recent push for a quick vote).
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Post Post #230 (ISO) » Sun Aug 09, 2009 2:56 am

Post by zwetschenwasser »

THE DEADLINE IS IN TWO FREAKING DAYS! We can lynch dramonic tomorrow.
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Post Post #231 (ISO) » Sun Aug 09, 2009 3:09 am

Post by Manzcar »

Zwets technically your vote on IKD has ensured a lynch come deadline.

Mod for clarification if the deadline were to come IKD would be lynched correct



Yes.


I'll be on the road again today and visiting my brother before going back home, but I'll have my iphone so I'll keep up.
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Post Post #232 (ISO) » Sun Aug 09, 2009 5:55 am

Post by Vel-Rahn Koon »

2 Days to Deadline
Vote Count


purple princess - 1 (crazypianist1116)
dramonic - 1 (ElectricBadger)
imkingdavid - 3 (dramonic, Cirdua, zwetschenwasser)


Not Voting - 4 (havingfitz, imkingdavid, Manzcar, purple princess)


5 to Lynch.
Deadline
is the end of Tuesday, August 11 (Eastern, GMT - 4).
Last edited by Vel-Rahn Koon on Sun Aug 09, 2009 7:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post Post #233 (ISO) » Sun Aug 09, 2009 7:09 am

Post by purple princess »

Manzcar wrote:I don't believe that a tfrench replacement will be able to get up to date be the deadline, but I think that lailai's replacement will be up to date when the deadline arrives. -smiles-
Ooops! sorry about that, that's what I get for not checking what I post first!

@zwetschenwasser, your impatience is starting to worry me
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Post Post #234 (ISO) » Sun Aug 09, 2009 7:54 am

Post by Vel-Rahn Koon »

crazypianist1116 replaces tfrench.
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Post Post #235 (ISO) » Sun Aug 09, 2009 8:03 am

Post by zwetschenwasser »

Why should it worry you?
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Post Post #236 (ISO) » Sun Aug 09, 2009 8:14 am

Post by purple princess »

zwetschenwasser wrote:Why should it worry you?
It worries me as you are quite happy to go ahead and lynch IKD without any reply from him first, I understand that deadline is fast approaching but say for instance that IKD was to be lynched right now, I don't think we would gain from it or be in a beter postion for day two.

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Post Post #237 (ISO) » Sun Aug 09, 2009 8:16 am

Post by crazypianist1116 »

Hi everybody! I'll have a nice long post of my thoughts within the next few hours, hopefully by 11:00 p.m. eastern.
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Post Post #238 (ISO) » Sun Aug 09, 2009 10:27 am

Post by dramonic »

zwetschenwasser wrote:THE DEADLINE IS IN TWO FREAKING DAYS! We can lynch dramonic tomorrow.
waitwhat?
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Post Post #239 (ISO) » Sun Aug 09, 2009 11:38 am

Post by crazypianist1116 »

Unvote
Purple Princess doesn't deserve a vote.
I read through everything once (boy that was long). I'm first going to talk about tfrench and then in my next post after analyzing things more in depth I'll talk about other people.

Ok so I think that when you look at tfrench's posts in iso, he seems like a 10 year old who didn't want to play the game.
His posts in order:
1. He votes himself.
2. Calls 1st day votes random.
3. Said his vote was just for laughs.
4. Votes for electricbadger saying that glasses are for losers.
5. Apologizes for his last comment, votes for cirdua based on her avatar.
6. Says that lack of an avatar is sign of scum.
7. Explains why his avatar has no color.
8. Votes pancakes claiming no lynch is bad for town.
9. Says that he sticks to his vote.
10. Says that we have 3 scum.

Well the only posts that have any real content are 8 and 9. 8 was after Cirdua and ElectricBadger explained that the L-1 move was bad for town. I'm beginning to think that he didn't read the posts before him in depth before he voted. The rest of the posts are crap; they just exemplify the point that he didn't care about the game. I'm positive I can help more than he ever did. I'll post later about my opinions on others.
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Post Post #240 (ISO) » Sun Aug 09, 2009 2:29 pm

Post by imkingdavid »

Back. Will post in a bit.
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Post Post #241 (ISO) » Sun Aug 09, 2009 3:22 pm

Post by imkingdavid »

[appeal to emotion + side note]
Alright, so I see I'm about to be lynched (or at least I'll be auto-lynched if we reach deadline with me at 3+ votes). So first off, I want to say sorry to town for acting as I did. I was a bit over-excited coming into my second game (probably still shaky about winning in my previous game--I got so nervous near the end of that game) and hoped to try and be of help. I guess I acted a bit too excitedly. I dug a hole and now I can tell I'm not going to be able to reach back to the surface and pull myself out. So while lynching me (a townie--yes I just claimed) isn't highly beneficial to the town, maybe it'll give you some insight on day two as far as watching who jumped on attacking me once Adel latched on. I hope that town pulls through in the long run and does nail both scum instead of letting an IC and a few SE's latch onto someone to keep attention off of anything else (yes, I did just put the blame for the distraction on Adel; as I've already said countless times, I put my opinion out and my reasoning, and he went after me for it without any tact).
I understand that I did provide plenty of reason to be voted with my whole attitude this game, and I am hoping that it won't affect your opinion of me if we play again in another game.
[/appeal to emotion + side note]

In any case, here are my answers to your posts.
EB:
I'm understanding that you're doing something you believe is anti-town because others are pressuring you: is that interpretation correct?
Well, if that's how everyone is going to be expected to scum hunt, my opinion on the ethics of the method seems a bit null. I'll be voted now for asking that question (which you will note hasn't been answered in lieu of asking why I asked it), but realize that I would have been voted also for holding onto my opinion of not looking for scum buds, as current popular belief is against it.
Judging by the overall quantity of your posting, I disagree. You are merely sidetracked; the question is whether it's intentional or not.
Unintentional. I have lost interest in this particular game given the whole theory argument between myself and Adel.

Dramonic:
baaaaaacktracking on his own opinion and doing stuff he himself deems anti-town.
Parroting and jumping on the wagon, I see? Anything else you want to say? I find your short posts that merely parrot others' opinions (which you've consistently done throughout the game) without providing your own thoughts to be a bit scummy.

Zwet:
IKD, you can't say that just because right now we are suspicious of you that we're tunneling, per ce, as tunneling is usually considered scummy. Can you give us a list of suspicions?
...just suspicious, huh? Yeah right. That explains 3 votes on me and all of the discussion based pretty much completely on me and how scummy/arrogant I've been.
By the way, did you just say that it can't be tunning because tunnelling is considered scummy? (aka... you wouldn't be doing something because that would be considered scummy so it would be a dumb thing to do... WIFOM)

Princess:
No I would still think you are arrogant even with an IC/SE tag, from peoples replies from my question so far I see that no one is completley new, so your teaching points didn't really help anyone apart from me thinking you may be scum.
No one is completely new? Well, maybe not many of the people currently playing, as most of the newbies have been replaced with more experienced players. But my post trying to be helpful was before all of those replacements.
Also, I hope you don't use my apparent arrogant attitude in this game as a reason not to play later. If you read my previous game and my other current game, you'll see that that's not the attitude I try to have all the time and it definitely wasn't intentional.
So, pairing people up as scum didn't work in favour of town in your last game, so why are you asking me then?
See my response to EB.

havingfitz
And to answer your question about IKD...I am finding his 'teachings' good food for thought. Several people have given 'lessons' throughout the posts and I for one appreciate all of them...but IKD has been a little more vocal...not that I find that a bad thing.
Well, at least someone appreciates my attempt at being helpful.

Manzcar:
Also IKD is suspicious to me. The talk about the teory and arguing over is a distraction to thee town and not discussing theory was brought up in my first game with him so it seemed odd.
I started out by stating my opinion and backing it up. I only continued to discuss it once Adel decided to do so also.
I also didn't lke how he dropped his vote on tfrench just because I said that his vote did not line up with his theory on third vote is scum.
If you will read my post, I said:
In any case, until I get a chance digest everything that has happened so far, I will go ahead and remove my vote on TF.
Unvote
I didn't unvote based on you saying anything about how my vote lined up with theory. In fact, you encouraged me to look at others (you said in post 150 "Why have you not looked at the others on the bandwagon?"), so that actually justifies my unvote.

In any case, you know how I played as scum, and you know how I am playing right now. Keep that in mind.

Zwet (again):
WE DON'T WANT A NO LYNCH PEOPLE!
And yet you're unwilling to actually prevent a no lynch by voting me for another ~4 hours. And you act like we're rushed to lynch someone. Yes, a no lynch is bad, but as EB kindly pointed out, there were still 4 days (and now there are still 2 days).
THE DEADLINE IS IN TWO FREAKING DAYS! We can lynch dramonic tomorrow.
........................................
How are you so sure that dramonic will be tomorrow's lynch?



Anyway, like I said, it
was fun
wasn't that fun playing with all of you. I hope that my play during this game doesn't tarnish our ability to play civilly in future games together. As I realize my lynch is pretty much inevitable, this will probably be my last post in this game unless I feel like entertaining your questions a bit more. Cheers!
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Post Post #242 (ISO) » Sun Aug 09, 2009 4:46 pm

Post by crazypianist1116 »

Too much reading for one night...
Anyways, it looks as if the two main cases are against imkingdavid and dramonic. There are several good points against both.
For imkingdavid:
The main points against him were that he was being sarcastic and arrogant. He was also being rather counter-intuitive by asking questions which he himself wouldn't answer, specifically:
imkingdavid wrote:If you find me scum (since Adel seemed to have wanted it this way) who would you think might be my partner?
He originally said that speculating on scum pairs was probabilistically pointless yet he asked a question about it himself. Additionally others didn't like the fact that he had "Teaching Points." Personally, the points themselves were fine but the fact that he was making such a big deal seemed a bit scummy in my opinion. One more point to make towards imkingdavid. Don't mention your other games so much. Sure people use metas occasionally, but it's really boring to have to wade through stuff outside of the thread. Try and get across what you're saying inside this thread, not in another.

P.S. in response to your recent post:
There's no reason to go cry in a corner. Fight until you die. If you think others are being irrational with their attacks on you, call them on it. 2 days is enough time to sway everyone's ideas.



The points against Dramonic I find much stronger.
First, he voted against pancakes and yet he didn't leave a reason. Note that this was after he worried that Adel was at L-1 (even though Adel wasn't) and said that it was too early for a lynch. Then he votes for Tfrench, also without reason. After answering questions from others about suspicions on him, he votes for imkingdavid citing mainly ElectricBadger's reasons. After this he makes several short posts saying he wants Tfrench lynched. Specifically:
Dramonic wrote:I'm still 100% supporting a Tfrench lynch
I mean if the case pops up, I think his reputting at l-1 was scummy as hell.
So he's 100% supporting a Tfrench lynch yet he's voting for imkingdavid...right. One might think this was all but NO. Dramonic continues barking in his posts for a lynch.
Dramonic wrote:the deadline is close... I'd prefer either a Tfrench or IKD lynch, but if by sunday we're not close to lynching either I'll embark on the highest wagon.

I prefer lynching someone seemingly innocent over not lynching
Scummy much? Note that this was while others were hoping for a replacement for Tfrench. If there was more time left I would hold off my vote but:
Vote: Dramonic
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Post Post #243 (ISO) » Sun Aug 09, 2009 9:08 pm

Post by Cirdua »

crazypianist1116 wrote:5. Apologizes for his last comment, votes for cirdua based on
her
avatar.
Last time I checked, I believe I was still male, I might be wrong but I don't think that's the case.
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Post Post #244 (ISO) » Mon Aug 10, 2009 3:35 am

Post by crazypianist1116 »

Cirdua wrote:
crazypianist1116 wrote:5. Apologizes for his last comment, votes for cirdua based on
her
avatar.
Last time I checked, I believe I was still male, I might be wrong but I don't think that's the case.
Whoops sorry.
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Post Post #245 (ISO) » Mon Aug 10, 2009 5:00 am

Post by ElectricBadger »

imkingdavid wrote:EB:
I'm understanding that you're doing something you believe is anti-town because others are pressuring you: is that interpretation correct?
Well, if that's how everyone is going to be expected to scum hunt, my opinion on the ethics of the method seems a bit null. I'll be voted now for asking that question (which you will note hasn't been answered in lieu of asking why I asked it), but realize that I would have been voted also for holding onto my opinion of not looking for scum buds, as current popular belief is against it.
Not really. I disagreed with your stance, but felt you had enough reasoning that YOU believed it.
imkingdavid wrote:
Judging by the overall quantity of your posting, I disagree. You are merely sidetracked; the question is whether it's intentional or not.
Unintentional. I have lost interest in this particular game given the whole theory argument between myself and Adel.
Tempted to kill you off just because of this. Again - YOU started off your play with broad and controversial statements on game theory; YOU are who started the debate - complaining because someone didn't blithely accept your logic is silly.
imkingdavid wrote:Dramonic:
baaaaaacktracking on his own opinion and doing stuff he himself deems anti-town.
Parroting and jumping on the wagon, I see? Anything else you want to say? I find your short posts that merely parrot others' opinions (which you've consistently done throughout the game) without providing your own thoughts to be a bit scummy.
Agreed.
imkingdavid wrote:Anyway, like I said, it
was fun
wasn't that fun playing with all of you. I hope that my play during this game doesn't tarnish our ability to play civilly in future games together. As I realize my lynch is pretty much inevitable, this will probably be my last post in this game unless I feel like entertaining your questions a bit more. Cheers!
Well, the current pouting aside, I think I'd happily play with ya again. Also, if you are town, one huge step you could take is to use your vote to try to steer a lynch towards someone you think is mafia. It's really hard to complain people aren't voting for better suspects when you aren't, either.

--

ATM, I think most of the issues with IKD center on his style/personal issues - being arrogant/sarcastic/pouting. I don't like his theories or his willingness to compromise just to stay alive, but I'm not sure I can specify most of the points against him as SCUM tells. I don't think he's a bad lynch, especially in the face of his complete lack of scum hunting, but I don't think he's the best either.

Dramonic's pre-emptive excuses for mislynches, hawkishness combined with lack of posting and scumhunting, and other comments are much more pro-mafia. I think he's a much better lynch today, but managing to skate under many radars because of his short posts and lack of content.

Zwet, did you switch because you prefer IKD or just to ensure a lynch?
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Post Post #246 (ISO) » Mon Aug 10, 2009 5:14 am

Post by zwetschenwasser »

To ensure a lynch, although I am suspicious of ikd.
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Post Post #247 (ISO) » Mon Aug 10, 2009 5:19 am

Post by ElectricBadger »

Me too; and I won't tell you how to vote at all, but with crazy's vote and mine, switching back to dramonic would switch the lynch.
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Post Post #248 (ISO) » Mon Aug 10, 2009 5:27 am

Post by zwetschenwasser »

Unvote; Vote: Dramonic


Let's do this thing.
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Post Post #249 (ISO) » Mon Aug 10, 2009 5:54 am

Post by imkingdavid »

Ok, I'll tell you what. If I am still alive on Day 2, I promise to start playing better and to drop my whole discussion of game theory and such. It really was not my intention at any point of this game to be such a pain in the ass.

Since EB wants me to vote, here are my thoughts. As I said in my previous post, Dramonic is very jumpy with his vote and parrots people without adding to the discussion. I first noticed that with his switch to voting TF right after I did without posting his own thoughts. He has done it more than that (including what I quoted in my last post).
So, my best bet for mafia is
vote Dramonic
.
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