Newbie 807 - Game Over

[bgg1996]

I don't need a prod I'll get back to you in a second.

[Snow White]

Right another game of mine has just gone night so ive had a bit more time to think.

That quote shows a connection, how exactly? Frankly i was flabbergasted at the fact Kichirou was revealed as mafia. I didnt have a read on him. In fact, the way he seemed so disinterested in the game made me think he was a bored town. Like FadedLunar was and like i am.

A psychological trick? All i know here is im innocent and cant trust either one of you. I was trying to save my own skin and either i believe that bgg1996 is mafia due to implications he was cop or i believe you were apparently "all knowing" yesterday when YOU stood by the fact that something suspicious was happening.

I know im not scum so for me to think "im still alive because im scum" is illogical. Yes, i had a wagon, but i had convinced CancerBottle of my innocence with my yesterdays response which in all honesty. I had given up hope and was quite willing to die. Perhaps the fact he changed his mind is what got him killed. And who was it that asked who his next suspect was previously? CDB.

@ CDB why would you have been shocked if i'd been killed?

Yes it is.

@CDB. Why would you not believe a power role claim?

Confusion. Its always a good thing in my opinion. Town is usually confused enough with not knowing who to trust. Confusion = bad cognitive abilities and the potential for town to turn in on each other. I LOVE confusion when ive been mafia. Revel in it. Now, you can see me clearly lost and dismayed so make of it what you will.

@CDB if you WERE scum. You would have kept me alive today?

Well, you had a certain alliance with CancerBottle. At one stage you said you thought he was innocent. But Cancer i think was fairly independant in his own thinking and if you were scum i dont blame you for thinking that he may have changed opinions or had a change of heart if he so felt like it.

I think bgg1996 might have been the next person to suspect, except he didnt hammer me given the chance. Frankly i think he lacked the balls to as i was vocal about him being mafia in previous days and feared the focus would be on him next but i dont think Mafia would have hesitated and they could always claim "Snow's death's and implication of me is the mafia doing the exact same thing as they done to Snow with Meji fan and CrazyPianist."

Whereas you... have nothing really to lose. In my opinion.

Because he didnt hammer me given the chance. This maybe mislaid loyalties but were i scum i would have jumped.

Really? I find when im mafia i do take guilty pleasure in watching people run around like headless chicken. That maybe just me though...

@CDB. I still dont think you have explained why you would vote me if you had to vote then, to a satisfactory degree. Can you elaborate?

I think you said that because if you were scum you could expect bgg1996 to vote for me. As i said before, he disliked me. Maybe he still does i dont know. We'll see where his vote lies when he votes.

But for now, it appears everyone is rather reluctant to vote and im very near to doing so. So i would like some feedback from bgg1996 when he gets a chance.

There are no mafia connections between myself and kichirou. But who knows this could be very well because im NOT mafia. This is what i meant by shooting your mouth off. Saying things that from my point of view are not there.

I dont know if your bluffing here or not frankly i trust neither one of you and this post is as if your trying to appease both myself and bgg1996.

I like my case. Ill reconsider and re adjust how i form my case after the scum of this game is revealed if necessary.

If your scum DTF's alignment is something you would have known and have played off.

@CDB. Can you give me some examples where you were indeed "barking" vehemently up DTF's tree?

Not always but in some cases they can be. If the scum is clever enough, which from my point of view they clearly are.

I had been barking up bgg1996 tree since day 2. I htink ive proven that before if anyone would like reminding?

Today im entertaining the idea you may be scum. Since your still alive and im still alive its something im entitled to do. It was also something i was aware of yesterday but obviously i was not going to shoot down someone who could see the possiblity of me being a scapegoat.

Make up your mind if your innocent. Am i scum because the quote or the change of opinion in trying to decide who is scum?

Ive been shitting a brick about my "image" since Meji Fan's death. Crazy's death did not help matters. As town i tend to go temporarily insane in the last day, their deaths just propelled the inevitable. Lol. you can even meta me on that if you wish.

I wouldnt blame someone for thinking i was scum. (and im not just for the record) Perhaps im tooting my own horn a bit much but no one can say they werent told.

However for the outsider who does not know the pm i recieved, i do not blame DTF of thinking i was scum. Sure I wish he'd had come to his senses like Cancer and see i was innocent and it was a frame but ce sera.

I did not know dtf was an innocent as did i not know crazy was (obviously i would not have barked so hard up his tree for him to be NK'd but who knows, to the outsider this could all just be one big glass of wifom) So vote me off if you please. I can assure you i will at least die standing and do not intend to do another Kard.

@bgg1996? Are you seriously reading over everything with the lenght of time you've spent away? Im beginning to worry this game will be at a never ending one which sees my being an mafiascum grandmama. who says i cant try to be funny walking toward my potential deathbed?

[ChannelDelibird]

I'll respond tomorrow, Snow White, although I was really hoping to hear something substantial from bgg today.

[Snow White]

Take your time. Although bgg1996 should have his time too to be reading over. Its not an easy call to make if he is town. Likewise goes for you.

Dayum... I dont like think either one of ye are looking too hot right now and i know one of ye isnt the lying scumbucket. But am not that confident to just go ahead and vote. Though at this stage i really would like to.

I am however looking forward to the games end and being able to play another game. lol. Marginally sad but oh well! Its been a good game and i learned a few new things. Je ne regrette rien pas.

@CDB. If you dont mind my asking. Whats the "iso"? people tell me (elsewhere) to look at the iso and i havent got enough metaphorical balls to just say "the what!?" as your the experienced member here i thought itd be ok to ask you.

[ChannelDelibird]

I'm all for people reading up, but for what I understood to be bgg's only game at the moment, I am not convinced it takes nearly a week to reread 15 pages. I am also acutely aware that I don't want us to post so much more than bgg that we end up getting caught in a huge argument and potential lurking bggscum can just wait until one of us votes for the other. We need to be participating equally.

So I am sorely tempted to wait until we hear from bgg to respond to your post, but we will see how it goes.

[ChannelDelibird]

Oh, and "iso" is short for "isolation". When you're reading a thread, below the Quick Reply box there is a little bar saying "Display posts from previous:" where you can select individual people from the dropdown menus and look at their posts in isolation.

[bgg1996]

antiprod post

[Snow White]

Ah you know i had been thinking of that. Us getting into a heated arguement with no comment from bgg1996 and thats not what i would like either. But he's entitled to his time. This just gives more time for thought and im hoping bgg1996 makes a substancial post given the time he needs.

About the arguement, im fairly passive anyway. Unless i feel like im under attack.

This waiting around has kinda diffused it. XD lol. But thank you for explaining iso. It was very helpful.

[ChannelDelibird]

bgg, if you really are compiling your thoughts, then please give us some of what you are thinking even if you have not finished. The longer you continue to post purely to avoid a prod and avoid giving us your opinion, the scummier I have no choice but to believe you are.

[ChannelDelibird]

This is getting ridiculous, and needs to be sorted out either way ASAP. bgg, please give us something.

[ChannelDelibird]

Mod:

I hate to mention the word 'replacement' in a newbie game, but this game is stagnating with only 2 of us here. We need bgg to post or be replaced.

[Xtoxm]

I can only be so patient with RL issues. Bgg prodded; if you don't make a game related contribution, you'll be replaced.

[bgg1996]

I had a contribution-related post ready, but my sister deleted it. >(

I'll contribute in a second, but tell me CDB, if the mod didn't prod me, and I continued to not post, would you have voted me?(this is a question about your stategy)

[bgg1996]

Snow white is the most suspicious to me.

Night kills by my standards are a source of information, while not the most reliable one.
Consider this, Someone is found with a knife repeatedly stabbing a corpse, there is no solid proof that (s)he is the murderer. While this may be misleading about how faulty they can be, it is still a valid source of information.

CDB, you have close to no scummy posts. (the ones you do have aren't that scummy. That may very well be why Snow white's suspicions are mostly made up of reasons why she thinks I'm not scummy.

This is the final round, and she seems to have half of her argument reasons why I am not scum.

CDB has proved to me, that he was telling the truth about when he said he always tells the truth as an IC. He however, is not always correct. That may be the reason he has not been very suspicious, or it could be that he is more experienced, either way, I don't think he is very scummy

I believe snow white to be most suspicious and am growing quite bored.

[ChannelDelibird]

Hooray! I'm glad we don't have to replace anyone. In answer to your question, bgg, if you didn't post, I would have waited until you got replaced, heard that person's opinions, and it would depend to an extent on what they said, but yes, I probably would have voted you.

That's not to say, however, that your reappearance makes me think you are town. In fact, the fact that you returned with a content post almost immediately after you were prodded suggests to me that you may well have been strategically lurking and waiting for either me or Snow White to vote for the other.

Snow White, I will have to go back and re-read your post before I can respond, as it's been a while since I last read it, but I'll do so at the earliest opportunity. I haven't forgotten!

Snow white is the most suspicious to me.

Night kills by my standards are a source of information, while not the most reliable one.
Consider this, Someone is found with a knife repeatedly stabbing a corpse, there is no solid proof that (s)he is the murderer. While this may be misleading about how faulty they can be, it is still a valid source of information.

While I take your point, we're

not

seeing somebody repeatedly stabbing a corpse. We're seeing reasons why somebody might

possibly

have wanted to stab said corpse, and you must admit that the two are vastly different. Most of the theories that have been espoused for why people have been killed in this game have been plausible, but we don't really have any way of telling which of the many mostly-equal-in-plausibility theories has more weight. As such, we have to look at what we can see in writing, concrete records of people's opinions and positions.

CDB, you have close to no scummy posts. (the ones you do have aren't that scummy. That may very well be why Snow white's suspicions are mostly made up of reasons why she thinks I'm not scummy.

This is the final round, and she seems to have half of her argument reasons why I am not scum.

This is an interesting point which I'll refer to again when I respond in detail to Snow White's post. She may be trying to buddy up to you to persuade you to lynch me rather than her.

CDB has proved to me, that he was telling the truth about when he said he always tells the truth as an IC. He however, is not always correct.

I'm glad this message got through. My experience does not mean infallibility, and it's why it's wrong for anyone to suggest that I must be scum because the IC could never be allowed to survive this far as town.

I believe snow white to be most suspicious and am growing quite bored.

Well, that's a bit rich, considering your recent antics (or lack thereof).

Seeing as it's the final day, and the pace has gone out of the game of late, could you summarise your case against her again for us?

[ChannelDelibird]

Sorry, it's been a busy few days, I'll respond to you as soon as possible, Snow White. In the meantime, what do you think of bgg's disappearance and the circumstances of his return?

bgg, are you going to answer my last question or are you going to disappear again?

[bgg1996]

Sorry, I can't post right now, I'm on vacation ill be back on the 22nd.

[Snow White]

Its hard to say what i think of bgg1996's disappearing act... ironically i have been thrown behind in my other games because i had suddenly gotten ill among other things(men), and basically now must put in a lot more time to catching back up and back hand peopple who found my absebce unnerving. But happily theres not too much to catch up on in this game. lol But basically i can genuinely see how real life problems may effect ones posting but then on the other hand he could be lying.

bgg1996. You have never been a big poster to begin with. Why should i not just believe you were exactly the same as kichirou and just actively lurk?

@Mod. How unfortunate is it ill be V/LA from the 22nd? As far as i know we will have some access to the internet so ill try to get online there as best i can

CDB. I dont think its necessary you re read. In fact doing so may cause you the will to continue posting lol.

Frankly, i dont trust either one of ye. lol. But i do think i'd vote CDB if the situation was minus the whole lylo conundrum. Im a believer in townies make mistakes. lol. Oh well, i can admit defeat. lol. whichever one of yous townie you kill me and you'll be endgamed. least i can laugh/hacking cough about it afterward.

[ChannelDelibird]

The question I am really trying to ask, Snow White, is do you think it is suspicious that bgg posted almost immediately after the mod prodded him?

[Snow White]

Prods are scary shit. Im not surprised he posted asap. Ive been prodded twice in 2 seperate games and i know i shift my ass into gear when i get them.

Do you find it outwardly suspicious? You've been here wayyy longer than I. I think the notion of him thinking we're just going to turn on each other at this stage is absurd. Secondly, is that put up with here? O.o

[ChannelDelibird]

Prods are scary shit. Im not surprised he posted asap. Ive been prodded twice in 2 seperate games and i know i shift my ass into gear when i get them.

This is all true, but he posted twice purely to avoid a prod, so he knew he wasn't contributing as much as he should but he promised to hurry up and post something for us - that only came within hours of being prodded. The timing of that to me suggested heavily that he had both the time and the opportunity to post

before

the prod, and that the only reason he actually did was that he thought we were going to vote for him.

Do you find it outwardly suspicious? You've been here wayyy longer than I. I think the notion of him thinking we're just going to turn on each other at this stage is absurd. Secondly, is that put up with here? O.o

Think about it, the longer two people have to talk and argue cases while the third doesn't speak, the more chance that one of the two will say something, either deliberately or accidentally, that the other picks up on and the two start to argue about. With the third person not speaking, the two can forget the third is even there and just get into a shouting match. It's definitely plausible that scum would want to lurk in endgame and wait for one town to vote for the other, but no, it's usually not put up with becuase it's obviously good for the scum, and hence I made sure bgg got called out on it. It took longer than I wanted, though.

Dammit, I still need to go back and answer your post. This is getting ridiculous. Sorry.

[bgg1996]

I'm back from vacation and ready to contribute, but I would like to point out that I had a post ready before the prod, but my sister deleted it.
The reason I didn't rewrite it before the prod is because I was too lazy, but seeing the prod pushed me over the top to rewrite it.

[Xtoxm]

Deadline hits with no votes in place.

The day ends with no lynch.

CDB -

Vanilla Townie

- Endgamed
Snow White -

Vanilla Townie

- Endgamed

Bgg1996 -

Mafia Roleblocker

- Survives

Mafia win!

[crazypianist1116]

You're fucking kidding.

[ChannelDelibird]

Ugh...completely forgot newbie games are deadlined these days. I feel terrible, especially as I was leaning towards bgg.

Well, there's a lesson that even ICs need to learn sometimes: never forget the deadline.

Well, good job stalling, bgg, I guess, though your tactics were nothing short of infuriating. I was probably too afraid of voting someone with genuine limited access for the loss to go with my instinct and vote you for lurking. Sorry, Snow White, I know this is partly my fault for taking so long to get round to responding to your post.

I'll come back to this a bit later and give a bit more detail and suggestions for you guys.