Stars Aligned - GAME OVER

[Kise]

dramonic, why didn't you ward me?

Insanity Infraction

[semioldguy]

I don't recall dramonic ever saying he was going to ward you.

[Kise]

I know, but we're supposed to be boys. I warded him N0, yet he didn't return the love on N1. And because of that, there's now a voodoo doll designed to kill me soon.

Insanity Infraction

[dramonic]

There are two "slight" issues with that.

First, I don't have wards
Second, unless I'm wrong, if you have the doll then they can't kill you. They need it to perform the ritual on. That's how I see it anyways.

[semioldguy]

Voodoo dolls that have been given to people last night were made night zero, as they can't be given away the same night they are made according to the rules.

[semioldguy]

@dramonic
They could always have made multiple dolls in one night of the same person. Though I don't know whether or not that is likely. The only true way to know if you are safe is if you have never heard any noise.

[dramonic]

I'm sorry Kise-kun...

Wouldn't making multiple dolls be kind of a waste of a turn? That and I still don't quite understand why you'd want to give a fetish to someone. Yes they gain an insanity, but what's the good of that?

[Kise]

Voodoo dolls that have been given to people last night were made night zero, as they can't be given away the same night they are made according to the rules.

Did Percy include this info on page 1? I can't find it.

Insanity Infraction

[Kise]

@SOG - Dolls can be made, but a player cannot be ritual-killed the same night of this.

Insanity Infraction

[semioldguy]

It's under "Craft Fetish"

A possible reason to make multiple dolls would be to give them all to one person... making that person very insane. Insanities are disadvantages, and giving even one insanity can potentially hinder a town player as well as get in the way of things such as research (either being researched or doing the research).

[Kise]

*twitch* You're right. Insanities are disadvantages. I forgot to include my twitching in the last 4 posts. I'm modkilled now... fuck

[semioldguy]

@SOG - Dolls can be made, but a player cannot be ritual-killed the same night of this.

Correct, since starting the ritual is the first thing that happens each night, there is no way to get a new doll before the ritual begins, it must be a doll that was made on a previous night.

[semioldguy]

*twitch* You're right. Insanities are disadvantages. I forgot to include my twitching in the last 4 posts. I'm modkilled now... fuck

I don't think anyone should take that insanity... because they WILL forget. Some of the other insanities are easier to keep track of.

[Kise]

This is all dramonic's fault.

Bah. Go Town.

Insanity Infraction

[semioldguy]

In reviewing the night action resolution order, using forensic tools doesn't seem very useful. Everything that gets someone bloody happens after forensic tools are used and then launder the next night will always happen before you can investigate that person's clothes from the previous night. Considering one of the insanities (and one of the easier/beneficial ones) is forced laundering, it seems unlikely to find blood and finding no blood does nothing to clear anyone.

[semioldguy]

Kise, if you are going to die, what was you action/result from last night?

[Sajin]

You got yourself modkilled kise? Come on ><


Forensics is useful. If scum have to launder every night they get blood on them, thats slower killing. A combination of forensics and researching will stop some kills.

[semioldguy]

Forensics is useful. If scum have to launder every night they get blood on them, thats slower killing. A combination of forensics and researching will stop some kills.

No, it isn't. Cultists get to take an action in addition to the ritual every night. How does half of them needing to clean clothes every other night slow down their killing?

[Percy]

Ruling

: the Insanity Infractions that Kise has just received constitute one warning, not five, so there will be no modkill. Yet.

Ruleset has been amended to ensure consistency.

Carry on.

[Sajin]

Because it can have uses and does not up insanity counts. Insanity going high is bad for researching as results can get inaccurate. I do agree res kit and research are far better tools.

[Sarag]

Hey I'm back, and catching up.

I heard noise last night. I didn't rob the grave, since I wasn't really around to discuss/defend my case, and a quick scan of the end of day 1 indicated zwet was still going to do it.

DeathNote, why didn't you resuscitate zwet, like you suggested you would?

It looks like Drench was probably going Murderer, so we probably don't need to rob his grave.

Someone (Sajin, I think) was asking me yesterday why I defended Datadanne's playstyle. You seem to be claiming that he was worth lynching for unhelpful playstyle, rather than scumminess. My problem was that a lot of people were saying they thought he was scummy and were voting for him on that basis. I didn't think that was a good read - his behaviour seemed consistent with his meta, and it was still unclear what his role might be. I don't want a lynch going through based on faulty analysis.

If people then took a look at his meta and decided a utility lynch was worth it, well then I didn't refute that, it's true, and there is an argument to be made there. But if he was to be lynched then it should be on those grounds rather than because he seemed scummy.

Regardless, a utility lynch of Datadanne didn't seem that great to me at the time. We still had plenty of time to try and catch scum.

[semioldguy]

Yes, researching should not be done every night... but can't be done every night anyway since anytime you get a "yes" it consumes your tools, keeping your insanity from rising too much.

Approximate insanity values for Cultists (scum) are likely to be equal to about half of the number of days. Approximate insanity count for cleanly murderers would be about two thirds the number of days. And dirty murderers would have insanity approximately equal to the total number of days. Town should aim to stay below these levels as best as they can. (I didn't just make up values, I can explain them if need be)

Murders gaining insanity slower will never be able to win the game. Similarly a cultists who gains insanity slower only means it is easier to find his buddies, and then when there are fewer cultists the remaining ones will have their insanities rise much more quickly.

People should still avoid taking the twitch insanity in my opinion. Seems easier to avoid infractions that way. Unless your scum.... then by all means become twitchy.

[Sarag]

Sarag and Datadine both claimed they were stalking someone before.

Uh, no, I have not stalked anyone, and never claimed to do so. In fact, I was arguing that people should be cautious about using the one-shot vig.

[Sarag]

Ah I see people have already been hassling DeathNote for not resuscitating someone. Cool. Letting Datadanne kill him seems ok I guess. Better than lynching him, certainly.

At the folks saying I'm suspicous for being worried about zwet being killed - I looked at the situation and correctly identified a good target for the cultists to NK. I mentioned it in thread because it was preventable and I was trying to get it prevented! The fact that I didn't succeed in convincing people to have someone else grave rob (partly because I flaked on the game), means that I may have just given them the idea, which is kinda lame.

[nhammen]

A note on the dead bodies: EtR had 0 insanity, which means that the dead bodies with 0 insanity are not cleared. Also, Tuberkulos supposedly had a ward, so if someone wants to equip wards, it would be more beneficial to rob his grave.

*twitch*

Night1 noise-claims:

Ward:
Magua

Nyx

Cass

Noise (Ward unclaimed):
chenhsi

Exalt

RestFermata (Magua claims to have Warded him)

itacv2

Sajin
Sarag

Noise and no Ward:
Datadanne
DeathNote
dramonic

sideney

Pablo Molinero

No Noise:
JamesBond

xxFabianxx

Jebus

Cephrir

Knight of Cydonia
nhammen

jasonT1981

ryan2754

12Keyblade

Seraphim

Unclaimed:
arelian
Kise
semioldguy
ZykeZero

You're accumulating votes because you said you had more than one item, yet you say you didn't know you could equip and thought it was randomly given. It makes no sense whatsoever.

By claim I was referring to Data's action, of course.

Actually, he accumulated my vote for this:

Drench would have been the only person who I might have resed and he had the potential to be murderer as he took on a kill action night one.

He was saying his decision relied on information he DID NOT HAVE YET at the time he made his decision. He lied. Plain and simple.

Though I must add I love you for doing the work for us, nhammen

You are welcome!

Lynching DN might not be such a bad idea,
He could get resed tonight.
(Resing dn is only hurtful to the town, so if anyone does it, they are prob cult.)

Actually, if you are ready to vig him, it might be better to solve it that way. I think the odds are not so high that the scum have res kits

and

that they'd use one up to save Deathnote... If we decide to do that, we could discuss something more constructive for the rest of the day. Vote: for Datadanne to vig Deathnote.

Let's weigh the options. If we lynch him today, we lose an opportunity to lynch someone else. If we don't and someone blocks the kill, we lose the same thing tomorrow, plus Datadanne's N2 action is wasted. So even if someone blocks the kill, this is only slightly worse than lynching.

unvote

. Now, town would not want to block this kill as it would give our enemies extra actions in comparison to not blocking the kill. Cult may be willing to spend one res kit to get an extra night to do their deeds... I'm not sure. A murderer would not want to waste a night that they could spend killing, unless they think Datadanne is a murderer that has a chance of surviving until night 7, which he wont, because KoC is vigging him tonight, and if that vig fails, then we will eventually lynch him. Thus, only Cult could possibly want to prevent this kill, and even then, he would still die the next day, when we lynch him.

@DeathNote
Which insanity did you choose?

I don't think people should use resuscitate tonight. The reason being, that kills from stalkers can only happen every other night. They need to be preceded by a stalk action, which means the killers from last night need to stalk again tonight (or wash their clothes, delaying the killings even longer). As for tonight's kills, I think most of them are already claimed to be happening by players who stalked those they suspected last night. Using Resuscitate on those people seems somewhat counterproductive.

Res kits can be used multiple times until they prevent a kill. No reason not to use them, in my opinion. If they will be used, it needs to be discussed though.

In reviewing the night action resolution order, using forensic tools doesn't seem very useful. Everything that gets someone bloody happens after forensic tools are used and then launder the next night will always happen before you can investigate that person's clothes from the previous night. Considering one of the insanities (and one of the easier/beneficial ones) is forced laundering, it seems unlikely to find blood and finding no blood does nothing to clear anyone.

I agree. The only benefit to forensics is to find a murderer that is skipping laundering so that he can kill faster.