Mini 859 - Cleansing of Falls Church - Over

[DeathRowKitty]

Unofficial Vote Count

brothernature (4) - ZazieR Shrinehme DeathRowKitty Peabody
ConfidAnon (1) - Sanjay
DeathRowKitty (1) - ConfidAnon
EtherealCookie (3) - BigBear nook Idiotking
nook (1) - brothernature
Shrinehme (1) - EtherealCookie

Not Voting: BigBear Looker

Unfortunately BN's play here remotely matches that Newbie game half of us were in.

What was his alignment in that game?

[Idiotking]

Mod: Request Replacement

I'm sorry, guys, I'm just too busy to be able to be in this game. Maybe my replacement will be able to be more active.

[Kreriov]

Vote Count

brothernature (4) - ZazieR Shrinehme DeathRowKitty Peabody
ConfidAnon (1) - Sanjay
DeathRowKitty (1) - ConfidAnon
EtherealCookie (3) - BigBear nook Idiotking
nook (1) - brothernature
Shrinehme (1) - EtherealCookie

Not Voting: Looker

With 12 alive is takes 7 to lynch.

Looking for replacements for Idiotking and brothernature

[DeathRowKitty]

Looking for replacements for Idiotking and brothernature

Unvote, vote: ConfidAnon

Mod, if you can answer this, did BN ask to be replaced or are you replacing him for his lack of posting?

[BigBear]

Unfortunately BN's play here remotely matches that Newbie game half of us were in.

What was his alignment in that game?

He was town. And him asking to be replaced out would fit his small town meta.

[Looker]

vote brothernature

[DeathRowKitty]

He was town. And him asking to be replaced out would fit his small town meta.

The only other game I played with BN (he was town tracker), he replaced out after 2 posts (one of which was an edit of the other).

Nook seems to have completely and mysteriously disappeared from the site...

I'll probably mostly stop posting until replacements come in or CA posts because I really don't have much to say at this point.

[Looker]

here here

Reminder: Brother, Shrine, Cookie, & Nook

[Shrinehme]

@Mod

: In the last three vote count, you've had BigBear both voting and not voting... Heh.

I sure as hell, would have commented on that, and probably placed a vote on Nook specifically for the Jester comment

I really don't get this.
I mean, we've established that Jester discussion is more of a distraction than helpful, but I'm not seeing why people seem to go gung ho over who

started

the discussion. It's a lame excuse to rush after someone. It doesn't tell scum to me.

The only way that I can imagine it would tell scum is if someone were deliberately and constantly harping on Jester possibilities so much to the point where he made it become the center of conversation and it became a huge distraction. I don't see how "bringing it up" is a big deal. Which is why I'm not understanding why ConfidAnon is going with DRK so far for... merely

hinting

at the Jester... or whatever he did. Who cares?

So, Confid, why push this? Do you really think that DRK made such a significant tell that he's worth tunneling on? What about Nook, who also
brought up Jester?

[Shrinehme]

leaning town

-EC

Could you elaborate more on this Zazie? What about EtherealCookie makes you think he's Town?

[EtherealCookie]

Vote: BigBear

Still voting for me. Still not asking any questions.

[BigBear]

Vote: BigBear

Still voting for me. Still not asking any questions.

You're right. I should

Unvote: Vote: ConfidAnon

, But I was also in the not voting category....

Also, do you mean that I'm not asking questions? and that is why I am scummy?

[Sanjay]

It's more lazy than scummy IMO.

[EtherealCookie]

Vote: BigBear

Still voting for me. Still not asking any questions.

You're right. I should

Unvote: Vote: ConfidAnon

, But I was also in the not voting category....

Also, do you mean that I'm not asking questions? and that is why I am scummy?

How were you in the not voting category if your vote was on me?
And, do you read the posts? I said, I expected questions from people still voting for me.

[Looker]

Just so everyone knows, that's L-2.

@IK
Can you think of any non-mafia motivations for EC's actions? I'm just looking for a yes or a no (I asked you specifically because your experience playing with me makes you more likely to figure out what I'm implying).

I don't think EC is a bad lynch, but I would prefer to look in other directions right now. Of course, FC's replacing out puts a bit of a damper on that, but I'm keeping my vote on him until his replacement convinces me to take it off.

This is the quote that sparked the jester discussion. (DRK admitted that was the intention of the post later on.)

I think lynching the jester is a bad idea. and if there really is a jester, which I doubt, i think they should be either vig'd or night killed. Bringing up the idea of a jester, is actually scummy, I forget who brought it up, but it's scummy.

BigBear says that talking about a jester is scummy.

Nook brought it up (I quoted it a few posts ago ).

This is in response to BigBear saying bringing up jester is scummy. Funny, if I'm not mistaken, DeathRowKitty sparked that conversation. Trying to pin the blame on someone else and cast suspicion on them?

The jester win condition and the town win condition aren't mutually exclusive. That's just my two cents. I'm done talking about that possibility for now.

A few posts later, he tries to shut down the discussion about the jester that he started. To me, this reads like scum trying to avoid suspicion. Right now, I like DRK as a vote more than EC.

This is what started it, is it not? That whole argument about the jester ordeal? Confid pickin fights? How did something so trivial manage to be blown into such a big ordeal? Surely it couldn't have been done on accident.

I have a wild speculation that he's a Jester out to get lynched as quickly as possible.

That's what I was trying to suggest to IK.

@IK
I thought you might pick up on the fact that I said "non-mafia motivations," when I normally use "scum" almost exclusively to refer to the mafia. By non-mafia, I was trying to imply third party (perhaps one that wanted to be lynched or accumlate votes).

Of course, best play with a jester is probably not to mention it and to just lynch the person anyway. Why? Glad you asked!

Jester=insta-lose in lylo via self-vote. Therefore we can't bring a jester to lylo. This means that if we find ourselves one mislynch from lylo, unless we're sure someone is scum, we're forced to lynch the jester and put ourselves in lylo, which is an unfortunate prospect. We can continue this reasoning down the line, with the conclusion that a jester becomes more and more dangerous to the town the longer (s)he's left alive. Optimal play is (probably) to lynch immediately, without mentioning the possibility and try to gain some tells off the wagon. A jester wants to be lynched and (as much as I would love to spite a jester by refusing to lynch him/her), it's in the town's best interest to lynch a jester. That's of course why jester is a stupid role in most games.

Optimal play by EC right now (theoretically) if he were a jester is probably to claim jester right now and get himself lynched. However, having the lynch already determined has a tendency to take the town out of scumhunting mode. If EC is a jester and decides to do this, I would strongly push to lynch someone else out of spite.

Keep the possibility in mind now that it's out in the open, but right now, we have to play as though EC isn't jester (most mini normals don't have jesters and he probably isn't one...).

@ZazieR
What do you think of your predecessor's play?

You did start the jester discussion. 1. Why are you lying? 2. Why are you getting so defensive?[/quote]
"Why are you lying?" is something I take as a rhetorical question. What possible answer could be derived in response to this question? I believe Confid's and DRK's argument was contrived.

Meh, I'm not gonna restate the case again. I believe that you were the one who sparked the jester discussion, you believe that you didn't and that nook did. We'll agree to disagree.

No one said anything to nook about this? No one asked his opinion? Where is his input about all this? Where are even any of his posts in any of the quotes? This leads me to believe that the argument was contrived and that it was an intentional exaggeration.

This is frustrating.

Right now the of the two best leads that we have on so far, one is being extremely random and annoying while the other is getting replaced. Both would have been good lynches for the town today IMO, but Far_Cry is getting replaced and to be fair we should give his replacement some time to settle in.

And of course theres EC, who doesn't seem to be playing to win at all, in that case he should be replaced with someone who is actually willing to play, either that or I have a wild speculation that he's a Jester out to get lynched as quickly as possible. Simply because of the assumption that everyone plays to win, and the only way he'll be able to win playing like this is if has the role of the jester. This could just be idle speculation, of course.

And, lurkers like BN don't help much. Stop lurking and get something in before we start shifting our attention on you.

I'mma gonna do a reread soon to try to find some more clues while Far_Cry is being replaced.

Yes, I said it could be just idle speculation. Still I'm working on my stated assumption that everyone plays to win, so if he's not a jester he would be a good lynch anyway if we don't get any better cases. Even if he pro-town in character, he is not being pro-town in behaviour.

No, it was perfectly clear.

You believe that DRK thinks that nook started the jester conversation, correct?

I fail at wording posts. This is going to look scummy, but what I meant was that neither of us are going to change our minds on this matter. He says that nook started it, I say that he started it.

Nook says that Nook started it.

Do you think that if DRK actually does believe that nook started the conversation about jesters then his reaction is unreasonable?

No I do not.

I admit that my theory is not as strong now as when I first posted it, but the possibility still exists for him to be scum lying through his teeth after being caught.

"lying through his teeth" as opposed to "lying" gives off the feeling of AtE to me, but I'm new so I could just be spouting new terms I've learned

Implying a jester is starting a conversation by placing the thought into the thread.

Yet you dominated several full pages with DRK concerning the matter. It seems the only people affected were you...and DRK. It wasn't that important to the rest of us, which is another reason why I believe this was an old-fashioned setup.

My point is that you're being inconsistent. Unless you can reconcile your statements and show me a post where I either started a conversation about jesters or said I was trying to start a conversation about jesters (or whatever your view is supposed to be) IN YOUR NEXT POST, my vote will land on you IN MY NEXT POST.

Caps don't scare me. Your question implied a jester. You were the first person in the thread to do so. Therefore, you started the conversation about a jester. I'm done talking about this because, as Peabody pointed out, it's trivial.

I've kept it going in the past because I like to argue. But now we are to the point where we are talking in circles. I've already pointed out the post several times before.

I'd just like to know the point of the argument. ConfidAnon, what were your intentions for this dispute?

unvote
vote ConfidAnon

[DeathRowKitty]

I believe Confid's and DRK's argument was contrived.

By "contrived," are you saying you think I'm bussing CA? If so, what made you choose to vote CA over me?

[Looker]

Simply put: He started it.

[Kreriov]

Effective immediately,

Knight of Cydonia

replaces Idiotking.

nook has also failed to pick up the prod. I will be prodding again and looking for a replacement for nook. If I find a replacement before nook responds, nook will be replaced.

[Knight of Cydonia]

Jeez, 20 pages And already two replacements. I dunno, Lazy people on ms these days. Eh, in a lecture right now, so... Really, my big "Wot I Think" will be coming soon. Tonight. Anything I desperately need to know?

[Kreriov]

brothernature asked to be replaced in response to the prod sent him.

Vote Count

BigBear (1) - EtherealCookie
brothernature (3) - ZazieR Shrinehme Peabody
ConfidAnon (4) - Sanjay DeathRowKitty BigBear Looker
DeathRowKitty (1) - ConfidAnon
EtherealCookie (2) - nook KnightOfCydonia
nook (1) - brothernature

With 12 alive is takes 7 to lynch.

Looking for replacements for nook and brothernature

I will be on vacation for a few days with internet access through my iPhone only so do not expect another official vote count until Wed morning. I will continue to look for replacements and hopefully find them quickly.

[ZazieR]

Peabody

, regarding Post 111, I wanted you to elaborate on this:

Far_Cry's post 59 and post 60 makes me a bit uneasy. I think it is a bit strange to failvote and then revote during the RVS. It's a vote that doesn't matter anyway..

They seem contradictory because EthrealCookie seemed to acknowledge the power of his vote, and then said that his vote did nothing.

Did you read the quotes in context?

After reading, I am really starting to suspect Brothernature.

Why?

[ZazieR]

Define 'jumpy'

Overly careful with your vote, taking it off just as quick as you put it on.

So how was this the case regarding EC's vote against Shrine?

[ZazieR]

You started it . . . whats the point of arguing this point? There is very little difference between either argument.

No, he didn't. If you only want to hear 'yes' or 'no', you're not starting a discussion.

[ZazieR]

So...who won the jester argument? Sorry, but DRK's sig is a serious turn-off. It hurt my eyes...

Neither. Both are very stubborn to see that it's a town VS town discussion.
(Though Confid is wrong in saying that DRK started it)

[ZazieR]

Speaking of brothernature, I think we have our first lurker-scum.

That took you a while to find out.