Newbie 865 - Game over!

[tracker]

Hey Everyone, in my last game that I played instead of random voting, we asked questions instead, I would like to try that again as that in my opinion is a better way to start the game off than random voting, so,

Toon Fighter: How many games have you played? (Real and anywhere online)

Canada: Do you prefer to be town or scum?

CommieX: What is your favorite part about playing mafiascum?

PaltryExcuse: Do you think the presence of power roles distracts the town from scumhunting?

Neo-con John: What is your opinion on lurkers(ing)?

Gayle: Have you ever played real-life mafia and if so do you prefer that or online mafia better?

RPG*Twilight (SE): Do you think that different questions to everyone or the same question to everyone would be more beneficial?

imkingdavid (IC): As our IC, what are your concerns about this game?

And one final question for everyone: What is your view on No-Lynching? Is their ever a time where No-Lynching would be better than a lynch?

[tracker]

ok, just going to go down the line here and answer/comment on everything

I would be estatic if everyone commented/answered on everyone else's question as this would give the town more information which is always a good thing. So yes, answer them all but try and wait till the to the person the question was directed to answers first.

David-

I'm thinking I phrased that wrong. I kind of meant what are your thoughts but concerns kind of works as well.

heads up I'm kind of scatterbrained, and don't have the best memory in the world, and I'm impulsive but I'm getting better.

From my expierence the only good way to deal with lurkers force them to post or lynch 'em. Most games are lost for the town because of lurking and scum often lurk as it helps them avoid attention.

I've played five games online(all on this site), never played offline in my life, though it hasn't been for the lack of want. I'm also trying to start modding on this site. After this game is over, I will probably mod. co-mod, or back-up mod for the first time.

Again, I'd love it if everyone answered all the questions, but not if your going to parrot what somebody else already said.

I prefer both ways of questioning, while seeing the same question to everyone is beneficial for comparing answers, eventually someone gets lazy and just copies answers.

Ah, I didn't know that the game exsisted elsewhere, , I never seen your avatar of sig,

I really don't use meta's, I probably should but I don't.

I honestly wouldn't mind it if lurkers were policy lynched, at worse you lose someone anti-town.

In my last game we actually had a situation in which it was better to No-Lynch than it was to lynch. I wanted to see what everyone elses thoughts were on No-Lynching, but it was mostly the fact that No-Lynching actually can be a good thing and even the best option intreges me. (I will explain the situation at the end)

I'm actually a better as scum than town. So i sometimes prefer scum. While playing as town is almost always more interesting just because you don't know anything for certain. Town provides a bigger challenge but it's fun to lead the town around in circles as scum.

RPG- What do you mean by "agenda"?

Here's an example of when it might be better to no-lynch than lynch. Let's say we're in mylo, this is different than lylo as we don't have to lynch and we'll have another day to lynch but if we lynch from then we're dead. Ex: 4 players left 3 town 1 scum. Town lynches town, down to 2:1, scum nk town, 1:1 and game over for town. But if the town No-Lynches then the day ends at 3:1 again, Nk and 2:1. The situation I was in there were 8 of us, 5 town and 3 scum. if we lynched wrong then it would be 3:3 the next day. and that's game over, but if we No-Lynched then it would 4:3 and we would have the night kill information to go off of. We probably would have lynched anyways except that we had a cop claim and come forth with 3 results, 2 guilty 1 innocent. We still probably would have lynched except that we also had a bodyguard who protected the cop and let us get one more informational result. (In this game we thought that the cop might be insane so all innocents are guilty and guilty are innocent) so we wanted one more result. Our doctor died that night and we couldn't confirm the sanity of the cop and ended up lynching an innocent. (The cop was insane) But it was better to No-Lynch in that case so we could get another result from the cop.

I have to go to scouts, will try and get back on later and post new questions for everybody. Also I should probably inform everyone one that tommorow is opening day of deer season in North Dakota so I'll be V/LA all tommorow (maybe in morning I might get on) and most of Saturday. Should be back on Sunday though. If I don't get back on, have a great week-end everyone!

If I missed anything please point it out. Thanks!

[tracker]

if i believe someone to be scum then they're lynch candidate #1, if i just don't know who the scum is, from what I've seen, it seems to me that lurker lynching is probably the better option. In short, if I believe you to be scum, I'll do my best to get you lynched, if I don't know, or don't agree with the case on anybody, I would prefer to lynch a lurker.

FYI: Sundays work best for me, might only do 1 or 2 posts a day on weekdays but sunday I'm normally on a lot. Saturdays vary. Heads up in advance I'm going to be busy on Nov 21 and Dec 5.

[tracker]

I'm back,

if i believe someone to be scum then they're lynch candidate #1, if i just don't know who the scum is, from what I've seen, it seems to me that lurker lynching is probably the better option. In short, if I believe you to be scum, I'll do my best to get you lynched, if I don't know,

or don't agree with the case on anybody, I would prefer to lynch a lurker.

That bolded part of the quote strikes me as odd. "Anybody" is a vast generalization of... well, everybody. That would include lurkers. If you are preferring to lynch a lurker, isnt that a case, that he's lurking? I just find this a bit contradictory. Sounds like your just going to use any old reason in the book to get someone lynched.

No Lynch=bad, as it generally puts the town behind. Unless there is an extreme case such as one provided the we're a bloodthirsty mob who has a need for blood.

That being said, this mod does No Lynch if there is no true-lynch. So if the majority of the town doesn't find any players to be truly scummy, should we let the scum have a free kill or lynch someone anti-town? and often times, from what I've seen, scum are heavy lurkers so you'll often hit scum. however if you would rather let the scum have a free kill.... I guess everyone is entitled to their own opinions.

RPG- What do you mean by "agenda"?

As far as that question: Would you rather be town or scum?

I agree with kingdavid that it can be a tricky question, gauging on the person's... "agenda"...

but the question being asked early in the game warrants no worry... yet.

I mean that it could be part of thier ploy for later on in the game to look pro-town. They could say "I love being town, blah blah blah, this is what I do" and do it, while being scum.

So you mean it depends on their role/alignment? The word agenda just doesn't make sense to me here, is there some kind of hidden meaning there that I just don't understand?

I find to great that RPG is questioning things, even if he's wrong, but conversation's conversation and we should take it where we can get it.

I would rather lynch scum that waste my days policy lynching lurkers.

Questions for eveybody!

What is your favorite role and why?

What is your least favorite role and why?

Both of those only include the roles that you've actually played as.

also where did everyone go?

finally I would enjoy it if other's made questions for everybody else too.

I got to get to work, I'll try and get back on tonight

[tracker]

one question before I start,

Is it better to have one big wall of text,WOL, with everything I have to say at the moment, or a multitude of shorter posts each relating to one point?

So many questions... why? why do insist on knowing everyone's opinions on everything?

You didn't answer my question from the previous page: what is your mafia experience? How many played, what roles, win/lose?

these last group of questions were to get an inside view on the people in the game.

Nothing offline, 5 games on this sight. none elsewhere,

3 games as vanilla townie lost all of them

1 game as semi-elite bodyguard lost that one by a hair.

1 game as a mafia goon won that one.

Who is the

least

suspicious player so far?

I am choosing not to answer this for the following reason...
I don't want to give the scum knowledge of who I suspect the least, as doing so will let them know who not to try and push the lynch of. Also mafia often NK (night kill) the most pro-town players that they would have a hard time building support for a lynch of. So by answering this question, I would only be aiding the scum, which is something I do not wish to do.

Plus, there isn't very much info to go on right now, as we're still only on page 2, so it's difficult to decide. I suggest we give it a little more time, but that we also start asking some more game-specific questions, rather than general-mafia-theory questions.

David - What is your opinion on "scumlists"?

I only question what I want answered. I believe that's how that works. If it's scaring you that I ask questions, arent you the one who's paranoid? You know, it's really interesting that you say i'm trying too hard to appear town. Because I think you're aiming that statement at the wrong person.

what's with the use of the word paranoid?

That said, Tracker is almost too scared to get out of "beginning" question mode. At least I answer questions and move on, but seriously, a second round of pretty much "beginning" questions?

Here is where your wrong. All of post-37 has it's purpose. Starting with the first part where I "put words in you mouth". You overexaggerated my case so I returned the favor.

And on topics that mean very little to this specific game. My favorite role is townie, and I dont have a least favorite because I like the challenge that brings about with each role. Wow, did that help you get some much needed dirt on me?

dirt? this wasn't about dirt. What do I need dirt for? This was about gaining insight into your thoughts. The fact that you say townie tells me that you probably have an analitical mind. You enjoy decidphering people's posts to find discrepancies that signal scum. correct?

I'm happy to answer any question, but there comes a time when enough is enough and the more you start asking "beginning" questions the scummier you look.

did you fail to notice that half the town is AWOL? These questions are useful in the sense of getting players involved.

Start scumhunting, find things from the previous questions.

just because I haven't chosen to announce my findings to the world doesn't mean I don't have any.

We dont need to play Jeopardy here. It's one thing to ask start-up questions, it's another to make that your whole day 1 activity.

Ask follow up questions.

Thats what i'm doing, and it seems to be scaring a couple of you. Which is noted.

So the questions I've been asking don't count as follow-up questions?

You're the only one doing anything to search for scum, so I'm questioning why you're focusing on tracker.

Well, if you recall, I did get on Gayle. (Before this post.) But, like I said about tracker, these first go around questions were nice, but we really dont need the second batch. That, in it of itself, is a bit shady if you ask me. I dont understand why i'm the only one picking apart the text here, we are reading the same thing, correct?

actually in the beginnings of the post but whatever. And I say that I'll do what I can to get the missing players back in the game. and correct I'm reading the same thing as you.

RPG - Why is a second batch of questions shady?

I find to great that RPG is questioning things, even if he's wrong, but conversation's conversation and we should take it where we can get it.

That's a nice twist on Gayle's words. Pretty much pulling out the paranoia card, again. Interesting. Again, noted.

Gayle's to depressing questions, I'm trying to encourage more. not really twisting is it?

What is the paranoia card?

however if you would rather let the scum have a free kill.... I guess everyone is entitled to their own opinions.

Um. Of course not. Where did you get this from? It's nice to see that you're putting words in my mouth.

Where did you get that I'm willing to lynch anybody?

I'm trying to move past the molasses that is your questions and pick apart the text from the answers from the first batch, which you really havent done yourself. Quite interesting. Maybe you should yourself pay attention to the answers people have. It'll do wonders.

Again, just because I haven't revealed my observations doesn't mean I don't have any.

The only way we'll get past the "majority not finding scum" is if we start, oh I don't know, scumhunting.

Elucidate on this.

And it seems you're trying to deflect by asking even more questions that, like I said, have nothing to do with helping us find scum.

you worry to much, i have nothing to delfect. and while the last bunch of questions don't magically reveal scum doesn't mean that they're useless, the fact that we now know that much more about someone could be crucial later.

That being said, i'm going to put a little pressure on tracker. See if it cant get him to at least talk a bit.

Vote: Tracker

So, I haven't been talking? Roger that, I'll make a note to start.

[tracker]

oops, i messed up

5 games total,

1 scum - won

1 bodyguard - lost

1 cop - lost, i had this as vanilla as i was roleblocked every night

2 vanilla - lost

[tracker]

V/LA tommorow sorry for the short notice

[tracker]

Not all lurkers are scum and some scum are the most active players, lurking is not a true scumtell. Keeping that in mind, in a lot of the games I've played in or read, normally at least one of the scum team lurked. and in a couple of games they lurked to victory.

I would like to venture so far as to say I've been misunderstood.

if i believe someone to be scum then they're lynch candidate #1, if i just don't know who the scum is, from what I've seen, it seems to me that lurker lynching is probably the better option. In short, if I believe you to be scum, I'll do my best to get you lynched, if I don't know,

or don't agree with the case on anybody, I would prefer to lynch a lurker.

That bolded part of the quote strikes me as odd. "Anybody" is a vast generalization of... well, everybody. That would include lurkers. If you are preferring to lynch a lurker, isnt that a case, that he's lurking? I just find this a bit contradictory. Sounds like your just going to use any old reason in the book to get someone lynched.

In this post(#29), RPG overexaggerates my case as to say I'll lynch anybody for any reason whatsoever, when this is not true, and I would rather lynch someone who's given off solid scum tells as I've already said.

however if you would rather let the scum have a free kill.... I guess everyone is entitled to their own opinions.

Um. Of course not. Where did you get this from? It's nice to see that you're putting words in my mouth. I'm trying to move past the molasses that is your questions and pick apart the text from the answers from the first batch, which you really havent done yourself. Quite interesting. Maybe you should yourself pay attention to the answers people have. It'll do wonders. The only way we'll get past the "majority not finding scum" is if we start, oh I don't know, scumhunting. And it seems you're trying to deflect by asking even more questions that, like I said, have nothing to do with helping us find scum.

so do I accuse RPG of overexaggeration(strawmanning) or do it in return?

That said, Tracker is almost too scared to get out of "beginning" question mode. At least I answer questions and move on, but seriously, a second round of pretty much "beginning" questions?

Here is where your wrong. All of post-37 has it's purpose. Starting with the first part where I "put words in you mouth". You overexaggerated my case so I returned the favor.

this was already explained in above post(#43)

This is really just out of curiosity. I agree that Lurkers do not help the town, even if they have a pro-town role, so they should not be allowed into LyLo. However, I think that a better way eliminating lurkers is to just replace them,

rather than policy lynch them. Of course, not to say that I won't lynch someone who has been lurking, but IMO if you waste your days policy lynching lurkers,

you're going to run out of days, and chances are, scum will win.

and as for the other case of strawmanning I was just using a phrase already out there.[/quote]

Gayle puts the names of RPG and tracker in bold letters in PS#35 questioning RPG's suspicions and had the following to say about tracker

He asks about the everyone's opinion on allowing a no lynch, but does not give his own until everyone else has given theirs. Then he goes out of his way to explain why a no lynch may be feasible.

He establishes that he is scatterbrained and doesn't have the best memory. A good excuse for a mistake later in the game.

He questions twilight's use of the word agenda, as if he thought twilight was accusing him.

He first advocates lynching lurkers as a policy, and then waters it down a bit with 'if i believe someone to be scum then they're lynch candidate #1'.

A strong case indeed.

Tracker seems very suspicious to me. From the beginning I saw the questions as good for the game but also as really good for tracker as it provides a great cover for scum. He gives the appearance of being pro-town while at the same time collecting valuable information on all of us and maybe even dividing us amongst ourselves. His second line of questions looked to me like someone trying to divert our attention away from the RPG/PE fiasco in PS# 29-33. The questions themselves just seem weak and quickly put together, What is your favorite role?, C'mon. I am not quite quite ready to vote but I am

Seriously considering:tracker

I'm pretty sure I countered above points but I don't have the time to back and find them now, so I'll just restate my view.

1) I know IKD said something about this as well and I'll try to remember what he said. Another question before I start, if I had given my answer before the rest of the town commented how would that have affected your answer? I believed it would affect and judging that nobody found it to be even remotely possible as a good option for the town, i'm going to continue believing that it would have.

I try my hardest to understand both sides of an arguement, and the very fact that a No-Lynch can be feasible I had to ask that question. My side is the same as everyone else's No-Lynch=bad, and that we should make an educated lynch every day. It's the only way to win.

2)I didn't of it so much as an excuse for forgetting things in this game but as informing you guys that my schedule is hetic and I may have to priotize other things before this.

3)I still don't understand RPG's use of that word and I'm still waiting for him to get back at me.

4)I don't see myself policy lynching lurker's, EVER, I never said that, IKD said that, I don't think I ever advocated policy lynching lurkers, I said that if we're close to the deadline (were No-Lynching is the set course of action)and the town is divided about wether Player A is scum or Player B is scum, and I don't agree with either of them I would rather lynch a lurker(who is at worst an anti-town player) than let our lynch slip away.

Have to go eat now, try and get back on later

[tracker]

V/LA - That is when you know that your going to be gone so you announce it in the thread ahead of time. I don't know what it stands for but thats how it's used.

@Tracker: Just so we're clear:

just because I haven't chosen to announce my findings to the world doesn't mean I don't have any.

Announce your findings.

my "findings" in this case would really not be of much use as we're on page 3 d1, basically what i meant by my "findings" where my thoughts and what i found "interesting" and stored away for future reference, I would prefer to save them for later, but if you and 2 others ask I will reveal them.

I guess if i had to take a stance on it I would have to say I would be more towards replace all lurkers than lynch all lurkers, sorry for not answering/clarifying that before.

IKD if there was a deadline approaching and you didn't think the town concrete a lynch on anybody,(and you didn't agree with the case on either of the top lynch canidates) would you rather try and lynch a lurker, jump on one of the other wagons and hope for the best, or what?

Also IDK, I know that you weren't accusing me of wanting to policy lynch lurkers it was that other's were using that as an example in an attack against me when i didn't even coin the phrase. I figured that I should clarify that.

What's IMO?

Mod: What happened to toonfighter?

[tracker]

will answer everything later tonight siblings bawling for the computer

[tracker]

blah, I'm out of time tonight, I'll have the Player Analysis done (hopefully tommorow(Friday) afternoon) sat, morning at latest, unless hunting interfers then Sat evening, sparing unforceable circumstances, I have Canada - Gayle down. Stopping at IKD as he's a big poster.

[tracker]

I mean I've been doing this in alphabetical order and I've analyazed everyone from Canada - Gayle.

I just cut my left pinkie to the bone so if any a's, q's, z's, or anything else I use that finger for is messed up I apologize.

[tracker]

Ya so i'm pretty sure my finger's infected with something, and I'm sorry I haven't gotten on since friday for more than a couple of minutes, I don't have access to what I've already done, will get on the other computer, later tonight (hopefully) but I will go fast for all I have left.

IKD

More helpful than other IC's, coins phrase later used against tracker, prods galore, 1 long post rather than 2-3 shorter, overuses findings, as with the rest, votes RPG, Votes TF w/o unvoting RPG, unvotes, Votes TF. Total posts page, IDK might have the biggest post count but who has the most content in their posts? I think the post count is being overplayed a little bit.

“I noticed that as well. That being said, I don't plan on giving anyone any extra leeway for being "scatterbrained". If you can't remember something, go back and look it up. Even if you accidentally misrepresent what someone says or what happened in the past, we don't know that it was an accident, and must assume that you did it on purpose. Which is a scum tell.” - IKD


Interesting.

Neo-Con John – 6 posts

Count on a lot of him.hasn't posted since Thursday. Not much for idea creation, more of taking what others find, suspects Tracker, from Gayle case, suspects RPG from scum-buddy slip

Paltyy-Excuse

PR can distract but shouldn't, contradict and lies good for scum finding, brings up a good point as IKD is the most “too townie” case of them all. Mentions that most of Tracker's comments have been commented on, when in reality not much of the meat has actually been touched on.

RPG – 14 posts

1 Q to everyone, No NL allowed, uses word agenda in completely confusing way, a lurking case is still a case, valid point, overstates lurker stance, mentions agenda line, didn't even talk to his scumbuddy day 1 in his other game, we have info, so what?

I would withhold my findings if I thought that they would do more if withheld until day 2 where we have 2 deaths to go off of.

TF

Many IRL games, Lynch rather than NL, takes what others said about tracker's findings rather than what tracker said.

So after all that I'm finding IKD and RPG kind of scummy. More later for now,

vote: RPG

[tracker]

Canada- total posts – 7

Prefers Town roles, doesn't like disception? Unsure about RVS or RQS. Nl may be ok in mylo. Skeptic about day length. ~ Canada I’m mearly giving the village when I’m more likely to get on. ~

comments about overexplantion of NL

Because I’m not the IC I should keep everything in super simple form?

, Agenda = priorities

Another comment on agenda, I don’t believe it’s aimed at anyone either, only that I’m confused as to why he used that word.

If he meant priorities he would have said so. Semi-agree’s w/ lurker lynch if unsure.

The only way we’ll get past the “majority not finding scum” is if we start, oh I don’t know, scumhunting.

Elucidate on this

The only way we’ll get a majority of people who think someone is scum is to scumhunt? Sounds like you’re already acting a little "scatterbrained".

I wanted to know where he got the “majority not finding scum”, and again why he phrased it like that, Now please let RPG answer the question, comments on the Q debate,

In this post(#29),

RPG overexaggerates my case as to say I'll lynch anybody for any reason whatsoever

, when this is not true, and I would rather lynch someone who's given off solid scum tells as I've already said.

I don’t believe that he was implying that –

I think he was implying that you would use any excuse to get someone lynched

(

actually, I think that was stated, not implied

).

Are the underlined parts EXACTLY THE SAME? And you are the only one I remember calling things “implied”. Unsure where I stand with Canada at the moment.

CommieX – Total posts – 4

enjoys challenge of the game. Doesn't like town/scum Q,

I know it's a little past it's time but could you tell us why you don't like this question, goes scumhunting, asks for examples on why questions are stretch, never answered, Accuses me of strawmanning, no comment on my counter-point. Votes Tracker, Commie, can you take a look at my counterpoint of the strawman case and give us your reply?
Gayle- 7 posts

Prefers bandwagon to NL, more info, prefer online mafia, NL rule = good, NL itself = bad, random accusation, 2 cases 1 on RPG, one on Tracker, RPG – questioning things, super paranoid, (watch for the word paranoid ), Tracker – NL – overdone, scatterbrained, agenda as if accused, and that I “advocate lynching lurkers as policy”, pulls newbie card in response to his Q, probably one of the most suspicious people in the game


sorry for the delay again. I'm going to lose one of the computers I have so that may reduce my online time. Not sure how long it's going to be gone, depends on where we have to send it for repairs. also I'm unsure of how often I'm going to be able to get on this upcoming weekend as it's the last weekend of deer season and I still haven't got my buck. I will comment on everything current, that I omitted in this player analysis as it was posted after I started and I didn't want to update it as by the scimming and what i did anaylsis, people are in a rush for this info. Will comment more tommorow, for now good-night.

[tracker]

My hands comin' along fine, should be fine in a few days. I started my analysis, last Wednesday, actually, did quite a bit of work on it Thursday, then spent most of Friday getting ready for Saturday's Hunt, then was able to do a little more work on it, hunted all Saturday, Church and family breakfast till 1 Sunday then finally got on and finished the analysis. I realize that the second post is kinda outdated as it's mostly my thoughts from Wednesday-Thursday, and Friday wasn't so much a work day as a re-read day, just for stuff to think about over the weekend, and while waiting for the deer to come around, I mused on it, and changed my thoughts, then while finishing the analysis I noticed how anxious everyone was for the overplayed "super-case, great findings" that I had, so I didn't update the first one just posted it as soon as I was able.

Post Counts

The post count was a personal note to me moreso than the town, I had planned on deleting it but rushed and forgot it in the end. IKD, I'm not saying that we should disregard your post count, just take it with a grain of salt, as it's content versus however many posts you have that I personally find more beneficial.

suspicion

As of Thursday, I found Gayle to be suspicious, this changed over the weekend, and I realize that it's undoutbly confusing, and I'm a bonehead for not taking the time to update it before posting. After thinking about it, I decided that maybe I was wrong on my suspicions.

RPG

I'm sorry about the overemphasis on certain wordings, I've just been remembering another game I was in where the scum used certain actions to coordinate their attack and defense. However, I do believe that you've cleared that up nicely.

I will review, RPG, Gayle, IKD, John, and TF over the course of this week, and will post a case or another review of each on the upcoming days, I'm hoping to do one a day every day until I finish. Probably start with TF tommorow, I'm really runnning out of time now.

I'm sorry IKD, I reviewed this mod's rules and it's true that you don't have to unvote before vote switching, I forgot that, and apologize.

[tracker]

Wow, I almost didn’t get on today, as I had to work late. Tomorrow and Thursday might be about the same, but I will try my best.

Neo-con John

20 Questions great way to start game
Lurking = bad and anti-town
Admits to going with crowd and NL=bad

Why NL rule =interesting?

RPG, PE, Gayle and Tracker are all under suspicion, one must be scum
Gayle’s case is super
Tracker-very suspicious, questions good way to start but also very scummy. Collecting valuable information about all of us, and dividing us among ourselves. Second bout of questions distraction questions.

PE-Why’d you jump to Tracker’s defense

Show us your findings

RPG-Freudian Slip, RPG=scum, and RPG’s scum-buddy hasn’t been talked, says he’ll figure out who that is. This would mean tracker does not = scum so this probably is poor word choice.

Dismisses PE’s vote as personal feeling rather than, actual scum-tell.
Summary=analyzed, as it gives “perspective”
I want to vote Tracker, but only if somebody gives me permission, either tracker=town and his wagon is scum, or tracker=town and his wagon is right.

The above are my initial thoughts on NCJ after a second reading, now here are my reaction and question thoughts

you say lurking is bad and anti-town at the beginning, yet you haven’t contributed much.
Goes with town, almost as if trying to blend in.
Town suspects 4 people to be scum, one should be scum, Gayle seems to have the best attack, let’s jump on tracker,
picks up IKD’s tell on RPG,
doesn’t want to analyze PE’s attack.

Case:

1) Few-None original thoughts, even the summary to gain perspective through another’s eyes doesn’t any insight into NCJ’s thoughts.

2) Goes with flow on everything, advocating a lynch on the most suspicious or whoever comes under fire.

My thoughts and comments to NCJ

Update your stance on me. Look at my resonces to the questions, points, and attacks brought against me, then pick them apart and build your case.

Do the same with PE’s attack on you. I don’t see it as personal emotion at all, why would it be? All of your suspicion seems to be on me.

Go ahead and vote me NCJ, I know your probably going to flame me for saying your asking permission before voting, but that is how I’m interpreting;

My strongest suspicion is on tracker though with the amount of votes on him already I am hesitant to put one through. Anyone want to discuss this?

If you are asking permission I give it to you, as there are only 2 votes on me and yours will put me at L-2, not much to worry about, if I’m wrong and your not looking for permission to vote please correct, I will apologize in advance if I interpreted that wrong.

Also, analyze my analysis of you and post your respsonce to it.

[tracker]

RPG, I'm on it, going back over my summarization now and will repost with quotes. CCD is in 15 minutes however and I'm still eating, so not sure how much I will get done, maybe more afterwards.

[tracker]

Neo-con John

ok, underlined what my responce is relevant to. italics are other interesting tidbits, I didn't find relevant enough to include the first time.

Hello All

I

like the idea of asking questions

as it seems like it will get everyone a bit more engaged. It just seems like a more sophisticated way to play which I would imagine is why the deadline is set for 20 days!

20 Questions great way to start game

I don't really see how someone could have a positive opinion on lurking, I definitely see it as bad behavior.

The more people talk the better it is for the game and the less people talk the more likely we are to make a bad decision as a whole.

I plan to talk... a lot, so count on seeing plenty of me.

Lurking = bad and anti-town

I do not have any experience with a no-lynch so

I can only follow the wisdom of my fellow players

who seem to agree that a

no-lynch actually only favors scum.

Admits to going with crowd and NL=bad

so that's hard to do, so I'm switching methods, underlined is still relevant and italics are other tidbits.

So

from what I gather so far there have been small fingers of suspicion cast at RPG and PE, a very small finger pointed at Gayle, and what I would describe as a strong finger being pointed at tracker

which has actually resulted in a vote. That is 4 out of 9 players that have been accused in some fashion, and

I like to think that the group

cannot be dead wrong on all four,

meaning we have a fairly good chance that at least one of those listed is actually scum

.

RPG, PE, Gayle and Tracker are all under suspicion, one must be scum

Tracker seems very suspicious to me.

From the beginning I saw the

questions as good for the game

but also as really good for tracker as it

provides a great cover for scum

.

He gives the appearance of being pro-town while at the same time

collecting valuable information on all of us and maybe even dividing us amongst ourselves

. His

second line of questions looked to me like someone trying to divert our attention away from the RPG/PE fiasco in PS# 29-33.

The questions themselves just seem weak and quickly put together, What is your favorite role?, C'mon. I am not quite quite ready to vote but I am


Seriously considering:tracker

Tracker-very suspicious, questions good way to start but also very scummy. Collecting valuable information about all of us, and dividing us among ourselves. Second bout of questions distraction questions.

This is an interesting piece of evidence here. I understand that

this could have been an innocent unintentional use of words but it also could be a Freudian slip

. If so it suggests that

(1)RPG is scum;
(2)RPG's scumpartner is one of the people he has not interacted with yet.

Ill do the research later on who RPG has and has not ben in contact with, unless someone else would like to.

If true, it would mean that tracker is not scum as he and RPG have communicated with each other

, or a deeper unrelated ruse could be at work. Perhaps RPG's scum strategy is to strongly accuse his partner right off the bat in order to throw the rest of us off.

Admittedly

I am speaking from a position that is already highly critical of tracker so I do not know how objective this actually is

,

but I do believe this new piece of evidence is something worth looking at

. Though

I am not even really completely sold on the idea that RPG is scum. Like I said it could just be a misuse of words.

RPG-Freudian Slip, RPG=scum, and RPG’s scum-buddy hasn’t been talked, says he’ll figure out who that is. This would mean tracker does not = scum so this probably is poor word choice.

New: NCJ why don't you ever take a solid position on anything?

I am not at all surprised that PE has voted me as he is one of the few people I have accused

, and from what

I understand some people make judgments in this game,just as in real life, based on personal feelings and not necessarily on facts

, which isn't always even a bad thing. It is interesting that you would react with a straight vote though.

I apologize for my post count I will start posting more.

PE claims my posts are not substantial enough and that I only reiterate points made by others. This is partly true, though I would argue that summary is analysis

as it allows people to analyze the events of the game in a condensed fashion and thorough another persons perspective. That is really what I was trying to provide was perspective, which I feel is a major part of this game.

At this point I am at an impasse.

My strongest suspicion is on tracker

though with the amount of votes on him already

I am hesitant to put one through.

Anyone want to discuss this

? If there is a

scumwagon on tracker that would suggest that TF, Commie X, or RPG are scum

. In another possibility,

perhaps the wisdom of the crowd is correct.

Maybe those three are all honest townsfolk who are right to vote tracker because he (as I agree) has been acting real scummy.

In any case I apologize for my lack of posts. I will read the game over again and try to post something else tomorrow.

Dismisses PE’s vote as personal feeling rather than, actual scum-tell.
Summary=analyzed, as it gives “perspective”
I want to vote Tracker, but only if somebody gives me permission, either tracker=town and his wagon is scum, or tracker=town and his wagon is right.

sorry about the delay. Neo-con John seems really scummy to me, and since he won't answer the questions asked of him, I'll

vote: NCJ

POST!

I'm really not worried about a quick-lynch, as anyone who quick-lynches anybody else, they would be almost guarnteed scum and i would gladly trade myself for a scum. (This goes for everything, try and wait before voting, give the other a chance to post, never hammer without giving the prospective lynchee a chance to talk after being put at L-1 and given a chance to defend himself.) However, if TCJ won't defend himself when given an oppurtunity, maybe a little incentive will help him along.

[tracker]

v/la till sunday sorry

[tracker]

ok. i did get on today, really didn't think i would.

Mod: Can we get a prod on NCJ please?

Whenever, he posts again I'm going to build a case on him. until then I'm going back and looking over the situation with Gayle.

[tracker]

Just checking in, I don't view Gayle as particulary scummy, still waiting for Neo-con John to respond. I might start looking at others but the day is starting to get late.

[tracker]

right, i said i would do a more detailed analysis of some of the players in this game and I will do that today and tommorow. For now I would just encourage CommieX to post. Toon Fighter and Canada need to post something a little deeper.

[tracker]

still here, and I finished my reread of Gayle's posts. Something is striking a cord with me on here but I can't find anything that would be the cause of it. I don't view him as particulary scummy. Yes, he's wishy-washy and was an active lurker but he seems to be picking up on the activity and I can't find anything that tells me scum.

Not sure how much time I have left on here but I'm going to try and reread IKDs posts sometime day and post something tommorow.

[tracker]

Point 1: It was rolefishing. You blatantly asked for a cop claim. If you're town and you have some other motive, I can't see how it could make sense for the town as a whole. You asked for a power-role to claim when it wouldn't be advantageous to town.

It wouldn't be advantageous for the town if the REAL cop claimed to be the cop. But the real cop wouldn't claim that, because that would make no Amdequately explained sense(as you mentioned) I was hoping that the scum would claim it, because it would make sense to him. More importantly, Cop, a real cop wouldn't claim the role. I'm sure of it.

Hercule, this whole business with the cop makes zero sense to me and you come off looking a lot worse for it. What were you expecting for a vanilla town to fake-claim cop? The scum would have absolutely no reason, whatsoever to claim cop at this point. Why would they? Either of those 2 situations I'm going to consider impossible, because I just can not see either of them happening. The only one who might claim would be the real cop, hoping that you were a doc trying to slip in a soft claim.

Point 2: It's not about how concrete it was, it was that I thought you were misrepping him. Secondly, in the same post where you mentioned 'distracting', you also repeatedly mention defending.

Hmm let me try to make this clearer: I thought he used distraction as a way of defending NCJ without being too blatant.

He wasn't outright defending him, but was trying to do it without being noticed. Sorry if I didn't word this correctly.

I kind of agree with Hercule on this point as it does seem to me that TF is defending NCJ in the last stage.



[quote="HP]

Point 4: Isn't about how you changed personalities, but I can see the misinterpretation. (I'd expect you to, being two different people). What I was saying was that Canada was scummy to me, and you showed different behaviour, but it was still scummy to me. Just that Canada's transgressions due translate to your slot.

So you are basically saying, "my instinct tells me he is scum"? "Seems scumy" hardly seems a point, but rather the reason you would be looking for evidence. Again, it seems like you aren't basing your conclusion on facts, but rather you already chose your conclusion, and are looking for facts to support it.


I am going to go in about 30 minutes, have fencing practice today. I should probably still be able to get a post though before I go though, but sorry if I don't.[/quote]

As far as I'm concerned, a great part of this game is instinct. Also, how did he reach that conclusion?

I've never read any Sherlock Homes books. Can you explain to us what you were getting at here?

We need to be really careful about calling someone town just because they helped to lynch a scum on day one.

HP - since under your name it says that you joined Mafiascum today, can you please answer this one question for us, How much expierence do you have playing Mafiascum, in real life or elsewhere online?

IKD's review is coming thanks for being patient, I'm sorry for the delay.

[tracker]

K, I finished rereading IKDs, well I finished yesterday and spent most of today thinking about it and reread it again tonight, IKD's posts are radiating something and I determine what or anything concrete to use as a base for figuring out IKD's alignment.

To our new replacees, what are your opinions on the players in this game?

We should probably take a look at RPG's posts in great detail with the knowledge that he's confirmed town. I'm planning on reviewing his and NCJ's posts in the next few days and I would encourage everyone else to do the same.

I just have one last question, what's the deal with Sherlock Homes equaling an almost guarnteed win?

[tracker]

I'm sorry that I haven't found time to get on until now, it's great that the game is going so fast that being gone for a day gets you called upon to post but I do have troubles getting on everyday, still keep up the activity it's great!

vote: Gayle

I find Sirpent more scummy than Gayle but at this point I don't really think it matters which we lynch. We lynch Gayle and he's scum win for us. If we lynch Gayle and he's town then Sirpent is scum and another win for us. Same with Sirpent.


@IKD: i know I led up to it, I had thought I had found something but it wasn't what I thought it was when subjected to heavy scrutinizing. I always try and keep the ICs under a close watch as they lead most the newbie games I've seen and your playstyle seemed weird but it's inconclusive and a null-tell as far as I can tell.

Sirpent, PE does ask a good question, why did you stall with your guilty result?

[tracker]

sorry guys, i've been buried in homework, if i can't catch up by next Monday, i'll ask to be replaced.

I have a concert tommorow so probably won't get on then, pep-band and possible b-party friday, so no guarntees on anything more until Saturday or Sunday. That being said, I think our only (and probably best anyways) option at this point is to lynch Sirpent, his vote on me seems to me as a desparation vote, but, we have the entire day ahead of us and I'm personally not a fan of quick-lynches, however, I am very inclined to make do with one here,

Sirpent: any reason why we shouldn't lynch your scummy anti-town persona right now?

[tracker]

no, i think he got lynched because the idea of a townie claiming cop on another individual on the complete basis of "I don't like you" was ridiculous. I personally didn't even think of that as a possibility. It's complete and utter madness and you know what, I don't think any townie would even try this, so

vote: Sirpent

[tracker]

Hello qax42! Thanks for replacing in.

I agree with you IKD that extended days are beneficial to the town, but the discussion here is dragging, so after qax42 catches up we need to make a desicion.

However, I disagree about cop roleclaiming, if there is a cop out there, a real cop, if you are a vanilla townie don't claim cop, it never works out. I think now would be a good time to step forward, and actually it's probably the only time to step forward. Cops claiming in lylo are highly suspicious and must be taken with a grain of salt. However, a cop claiming now will have 2 investigation results that will be highly beneficial and even if a scum does claim cop his partner is dead so whoever he claims to have investigated will be a true townie. Therefore if there is a cop out there I am under the opinion that he should claim now.

more coming on this tommorow, I feel the need now to think over every possibility before action arrises.

[tracker]

unvote

qax i think you did the right thing on both occasions, I still can't figure out why Sirpent claimed cop to begin with, and it's made me reconsider how I play the game, I've hinted that I've found IKD scummy the whole game but I after the fake cop claim I've gotten sidetracked.

however, after Sirpent's actions I must ask you this;

Are you 100% serious about you claim and results?

there are two reasons I find myself needing to ask this, the first of which is that I've hinted that I've found IKD scummy, you could be a scum hoping to come in at this point and play off of the suspicions I have announced and slip by with a win in lylo tommorow, the second of which is Sirpents claim.

After you answer, I will place my vote

[tracker]

I was planning on hammering today except that I really didn't get on and I suppose TF is right and we should at least give him a chance to post something. IKD either defend yourself against these overwhelming charges and die honorably or we'll have to lynch while you lurk.

[tracker]

All right, I actually read the this whole thing, and IKD, you haven't convinced me otherwise yet, my responces in red.

because I dislike WOT, I'm going to try and shorten this one.

Responses in green.

Someone please unvote SirPent because imkingdavid will hammer and SirPent will flip town.

Actually, everyone had had ample opportunity, including myself, to hammer and haven't. I am trying to keep the day going instead of end discussion. Also, it's not only in my power to hammer.

Hammering this early in the day is suspicious, even with Sirpent's previous actions, we were giving him a chance to defend himself, like we're giving you chance to defend yourself.

I claim Cop. I get one investigation a night, am sane and can be roleblocked. I'm not 100% sure if that ensures a mafia roleblocker or not. Mod-confirmed sanity check.

Only way to confirm a roleblocker is to lynch one. Mods usually like to cover all their bases whether or not there actually is a certain role.

actually we can confirm the presence of a roleblocker, if qax is cop, and a doctor appears that confirms the presence of a roleblocker, come on IKD don't you know the set-up?

N1 Canada investigated tracker, who is confirmed town, but nothing on his role. N2 Hercule Poirot never submitted an action, so the Mod randomly picked imkingdavid and returned a positive result.

And why should we believe you? We already see what happened last time we listened to a claimed cop.

So what are you suggesting here IKD? My thoughts on it further down

#83/19: Votes Toon Fighter for lurking. Another weak vote.

Pressure votes encourage activity. I did not foresee a lynch at that time, so there was no cause for concern. Had a wagon built up based on his inactivity, I would have unvoted, simply because I am against Lynch All Lurkers.

then why not ask the mod to replace him?

#84/20:

So are you admitting to talking to your scum buddy this time around?

That is

extremely

scummy. Holy crap. The line of logic is absolutely flawed, and as it stands that is just putting words in RPG's mouth. Furthermore, any experienced played should know this.

I was clarifying his wording in his post.

This isn't the only instance of putting words in people's mouths, I do believe I re-call this happening at least once more, with over-exaggerating my policy on lurkers, maybe more but I have under 5 minutes to complete this entire responce so I'll find this out for sure later

This is later followed by:

This is an interesting piece of evidence here. I understand that this could have been an innocent unintentional use of words but it also could be a Freudian slip. If so it suggests that

(1)RPG is scum;
(2)RPG's scumpartner is one of the people he has not interacted with yet.

This is one confirmed scum riding on the back of a weak argument by his partner and giving it apparent merit.

So because the confirmed scum supported what I said, I must be scum? Sounds more like a newbie scum player trying to look pro-town by supporting the more experienced players. Doesn't make me scum.

true, this alone doesn't make you scum

#98/21: Unvote the wrong person. More evidence of throwing the vote around in an anti-town way.

As I have said, I have performed just as erratically in other games in which I am now seen as town. One of my flaws is that I don't pay attention sometimes, or I forget when I change a vote sometimes. I've done it as town, and I think I did it as scum the one time I was scum (if my memory serves me right).

links?

#103/22:

To be entirely truthful, it is mostly instinctual gut feelings based on what I remember from your meta. like I said above, I'll take some time to actually compare the two games. Sorry if it's a null tell. But it did get some discussion, did it not?

So you admit to making a hasty vote, but then it almost seems like you try to justify it by saying it got discussion?

Yep.

Speaks for itself.

Yes, it was a rather hasty vote, and it got discussion. So?

I think the point he's trying to make here is that you sowed confusion

#104/23: Re-votes TF. More voting confusion.

See above. I've done worse in other games just because I didn't pay enough attention. I really am trying to work on that.

more links please?

#125/28: More misunderstandings. This one in particular is not scummy by itself, but together with the general play, it is more scummy than not.

As I said in that post, it was a misunderstanding, since I misread what he said. It wasn't a difficult mistake to make.

#142/31, 156/32: Begins to distance himself from Neo-con John after strong arguments put forth primarily by PaltryExcuse and tracker. Note how #142/31 just piggy-backs on existing arguments, and #156/32 seems to be an expansion on the "NCJ is not there anymore"-argument. The post is filled primarily with speculative observation.

Kind of hard to add all new material sometimes. However, rather than go inactive, I decided it best to at least show my support. And what's wrong with the expansion?
Also, since when are speculating and observing scummy?

another possible way to show support is by writing it out, best way to add material is to wait for the lynch canidate to post something, and if he doesn't till his replacement posts something

There is this:

But we still have a good amount of time until deadline and discussion is still going.

Pressuring people to avoid the hammer until he can mount a defense, or buying time to let NCJ do so? Or it could be that he's working on trying to push someone else, probably tracker, back into the limelight and save his scumbuddy.

Looking back, I can see how that might appear that I was just trying to buy time. However, I had my vote on NCJ, not tracker. If I had found tracker more scummy than NCJ, I would have had my vote on him.

more scummy or until I became a threat?

It ends with:

As a side note, I, by policy, do not like to try and look for scum partners and links between people until we know who one of the scum is. In order to not detract from the current discussion, I will refrain from posting why, unless someone doesn't understand how it can be a bad thing.

Reads a bit like an IC using his experience to try further distancing himself from the target, again.

So you disagree with my thought process? If so, by all means let me know why I'm wrong and then I will present why I think I'm right. Like I said sometime near the start of the game, I'm not God. I have my own opinions of how the game is run. If someone disagrees, they are more than welcome to let me know and we can discuss it. That's the point of a newbie game; to let people figure out what they do and do not agree is good gameplay.
So if you disagree, let me know. If you agree, then why is this post a problem?

watch for my responce to this below, I will have it in blue

#175/35:

This post sounds like a lot of "I don't really care much about who gets lynched, I just want the day to end, but I don't want to draw attention to myself by ending after someone points out that it might not be beneficial to do so." Which is definitely NOT pro-town.

I don't think it reads like that at all. It reads like someone who, with a combination of advice from an IC, a mod mistake and general inexperience got confused. Not that hammering tracker is a good idea in hindsight, but he did play quite a scummy game if you remove imkingdavid and Neo-con John from the game.

What's the mod mistake you are referring to? o.O And that's how the post read for me, so that's what I posted. If you see it as something different, that's your opinion, and you're welcome to point it out.

here i think, don't actually remember exactly what I had in mind, will return to this when I have more time

Post ends with a FoS on Gayle. I guess now that the town is committed to voting Neo-con John, it's too late to throw the vote around like earlier.

Vote = I want him lynched. FoS = there are two scum in the game, so lets keep an eye on more than just the one. No need to change my vote because I'm happy with it.

but didn't you say that we shouldn't look for scum partners until after the fact?

#192/36:
#200/38:

Having 3 different votes and 2 different FoS's by page 8 is hardly a reason for suspicion. It shows that I'm looking around and weighing possible options. If I had, say, 5 or 6 different baseless votes by now and was throwing suspicion at every person without much consistency, then there might be a cause of concern.

Actually, this is a cause for concern. There have been 5 people you've thrown suspicion on, almost all of which was done via very little analysis or others' analyis. Cause Of Concern.

Actually, I think I've shown suspicion for almost everyone in the game. That's because as a town, we don't know who is the remaining scum, and by focusing on one person, we let them slip by if that's not the right person. No "Cause Of Concern."

town tunnel, scum spread, ever heard of it? It goes against some people's opinion but it's something I've kind of noticed on this site.

OK, we're at the point where the shit hits the fan.

#268: SirPent just fakeclaimed cop and voted Gayle. In my reading I assumed this was a joke vote for quite a few posts. I can't believe anybody took this seriously. Every single one of his posts after that until the most recent has been of a troll (Gayle caught that one: #283). One that ruined the game, I'm afraid.

#284: tracker voted Gayle, which, as a semi-experienced player, blows my mind. I can't believe that anyone would fall from that. If there were three guaranteed scum, I didn't have a guaranteed town confirmation and tomorrow wasn't LyLo, I'd be pushing hard for back-to-back imkingdavid and tracker lynches.

So if we just decided that both tracker and I are scummy for it but we only have 1 remaining scum, why are you still using it as "evidence"? It shows that even town players can do something that may seem scummy.

However, I'm confirmed town now, and you're still up in the air, scum do scummy things too

In any case, when someone makes a role claim, I try to take it seriously. Yes, it's regrettable that SP has basically screwed up the game for us with his fake cop claim, but at the time I provided my reasoning behind the vote, and I voted. I did what I thought was best. And as I pointed out, now realize that a much better choice would have been to lynch SP instead of Gayle. But hindsight is 20/20, and we can't go back, now can we?

So your're saying we should lynch Qax42?

#285/45: One hour after tracker, imkingdavid swoops in to vote Gayle. Looks like less of a muppet now that he's followed tracker. No IC should ever put a vote on such a terrible claim.

I had had no time to really post anything until then. If you will notice my other posts,

I pointed out that I found the claim scummy,

and it just happened that I had voted after tracker. It wasn't as a piggy back. If tracker hadn't voted before me, I would have still voted. Also, as you'll notice, I even then did not wish to push the lynch just yet so that we could get some discussion. But then Gayle decided to screw us over and self-hammer (which you should never do, btw).

if the claim was scummy then why did you vote?

I probably wouldn't have joined the game if I had read this far before I got my confirmation PM. Or, well, if I knew that I was going to be a cop with a confirmed hit on the last mafia member already. Too easy.

Mighty convenient to join in and have "the answer" to the game, eh? And you try build on the current confusion caused by the previous cop claim with your own claim. I see no reason to believe you and more than I now see to have believed SP. I hope we don't as a town make the same mistake again.

so again you're saying that we should lynch qax42 instead of you

#300/47: imkingdavid tries to explain his actions. Very scummy explanation with a lot of apologies because of poor judgement, a recurring theme. Especially with:

Sorry. Oh wait, I just apologized. = scum. Ok, read this post, and this post (not the whole thing, since it's rather long). They are both me as town. So apologies aren't inherently scummy. I try to apologize when I screw up, which is more than I can say about some people.

will do this when I have more time, promise

s far as SP is concerned, here's my take on it. It would be complete idiocy to make such a claim that early on in the game as scum. On the same token, it would but just as stupid to make the claim as cop, especially since we just found out that he was lying if he was either scum or cop. So either he just doesn't care about the game and is screwing us over to give the scum an easy win, or he's being overly scummy on purpose to make us think he's not scum

Why is this being presented now, after you were responsible for getting Gayle lynched?

You can't put all the blame on me, although I do admit I did misjudge when I voted. However, tracker and gayle and SP were also responsible for his lynch. I'm not trying to shift all the blame, but I'm just finding it odd that you find it necessary to focus on one person. Maybe my blunder is more significant because I'm IC, but you can't disregard the others.

i'm ok with tunneling you until you either A, refute everything, or B, are lynched

Alright, there's my defense. I tried to respond to everything that begged a response, and I think my points are sound, so I would appreciate it if you would respond to all of it (no picking and choosing, please).

k, tried to respond to as much of it as possible in 5minutes, and cut the rest, (actually I went over and am eating out here too). Will make a decision tommorow or later tonight when I have more time,

Mod: Any info on why Sirpent was banned?

[tracker]

The reason I was being so hasty with that post is that when I make promises I try my hardest to keep them. So when I said I'll post more tommorow, I posted more tommorow, I only had five minutes to analyze and comment on that post, so I did the best I could in five minutes, actually I went overtime and ate supper by the computer, I almost got in trouble for it. I know I haven't been the most prompt player in the past and I know that some of you resent that, but I'm making it my goal on here to always keep the deadlines I set for myself.

As I don't have much time on here, and the amount of time I'll have for the rest of the week is up in the air, I'm not going to post anything oversized until this weekend, that said I'll try and comment on at least a couple major points every day, starting with two of the biggest in my opinion

IKD, I'm confirmed town, there is only one scum left, and that's either you or Qax, if Qax is a cop then he's got an innocent on me, if he's scum, then it doesn't matter who he points the finger of innocence at because his scum-buddies dead. The only remaining possibility left is that I'm town.

A minor point that bothered me, IKD, as an IC, I find it hard to believe that you're ignorant of the set-up. The mod said in his opening post it was F11, and it's the same in all newbie set-ups.

Also, we don't have to lynch both a cop, and a doctor, or lynch a role-blocker before knowing the exact set-up. A doctor's night protection can show his presence and there may even be more, I'll have to think on this matter more.

that's just about all I have time for until tommorow, except for one other thing,

hmmm... I rewording/retracting what I said about self-lynching, if your town, and it's not lylo, and another player claims to have a guilt read on you (making sure first that there's no possibility of millers). Then it would be acceptable and probably even a good sacrifice to self-lynch as you win with the town who will then procede to lynch the lying scum who claimed a guilty on you.

So IKD, if your not ready to be a maytr to die for the cause, then what do you suppose we do?

[tracker]

yes, i get it, and I suppose that the scum could also tell the mod nokill or something of the sort, but the set-up is pretty much irrelevant at this time, as there are only two canidates for lynch at this moment, (or at least there is only two in my eyes) and those are IKD and Qax. One of them has to be town, which brings up another thought, springing from the talk about talking one for the team,

@Qax, since you're the cop, then would you be willing to be lynched today knowing that tommorow after seeing you flip cop, we would then proceed to lynch IKD, as he would have to be guilty?

@IKD, you say that your not the scum and Qax must be scum because he's reporting a guilty on you, correct?

Sirpent and TF, what are your thoughts on this matter? please don't flak out now, when we're so close to the end.

[tracker]

PE, you skipped me

IKD, I thought there was something wrong with you the whole game, but I couldn't put my finger on it so as to build a case.

TF

Just try and be more active

qax

that was a solid case and I really wanted to lynch IKD ever since you posted it, but he did deserve at least a small chance of defence.

nicodemus

Sorry for mistaking you with SirPent

PE

Found you town since D1 and thought you played an excellent game throughout, and even if you hadn't been suspicious of IKD, I as scum would have nked you anyways just because you were so pro-town

Gayle

Actually in a situation like that where you are town and there's no possibility of millers, (this situation) self-lynching is semi-acceptable(outside of mylo and lylo) as it (should) automatically finds scum. It's just due to SirPent's idiocy that it didn't work this time

RPG

fun to have you

NCJ

don't give up

IKD

do(would) you enjoy opening questions as town?

If anyone is looking for a quick start into another game, I'm back-up modding Cults of Darkness and Shadow and I really need a replacement for Discord, Day 2, 20 Pages, it's a fun and pretty quick game. Could really use some help