Newbie 843 (Game Over)

[Zachrulez]

Yeah, I have a confession to make. I've been waivering on my scum read of Cookie. In a situation where scum needs any other lynch to survive, him changing his vote from me doesn't really make any sense as scum.

At the moment, the fact that Starbuck is not voting is sticking out like a sore thumb to me, so yeah, with the deadline fast approaching why haven't you found it important to fully catch up and take a firm stance?

Unvote: Vote: Starbuck

[Starbuck]

I was reading through and finishing up, but nice try on that, Zach.

I'm suspicious of both manho (even with his cop claim), but I'm not willing to lynch a claimed cop.

So I'm going with

Vote: EtherealCookie

[Zachrulez]

You might want to re-read that claim Starbuck.

[tubby216]

You might want to re-read that claim Starbuck.

indeed

[EtherealCookie]

I'm amazed the highest vote count is on me when there around 2/3 player saying I seem extremely pro-town. Honestly, why would I place myself in this position if I was scum? I'd try to stay hidden. Your vote is silly, Starbuck. Kyiv, please switch to Tubby. I know you don't like the vibes you're getting from Manho, but Tubby is scummy too. I feel more confident on Tubby than Manho at the moment. However, if our votes are just going to be spread out, well, I'm getting lynched, given I have the highest votes ATM.

I'm suspicious of both manho (even with his cop claim), but I'm not willing to lynch a claimed cop.

So I'm going with

Vote: EtherealCookie

Because, y'know, I'm the most suspicious right after Manho. Not the guy he's defended consistently. Lol.

[manho]

@kyiv: the bjl-cookie-scum-interaction has nothing with cookie setting up mislynch. and cookie is not scum for setting up mislynch solely, and the bolded "town" is to show cookie knew wrath would flip town,

You never ever said why you thought this. You just said it. No one else provided it as a reason, nor did anyone provide any thoughts relating to this. So I ignored it, with good reason.

you should read my case first.

cookie set up two future lynches after wrath was lynched, tubby if town and crazy if scum. but i (and tubby?) am pushing for two lynches at the same time, and am happy to lynch both of them today, even before one of them is lynched.

That sounds even scummier than before! Now you don't care if they flip town or not? You just want them dead. It's okay to state a suspicion of someone if another person flips a certain alignment, but to lynch two people regardless of alignment is pretty off-putting to me.

no, setting up future lynch based on alignment flip is scummier than setting up two lynches at the same time. i have reasons to vote for both of them, but cookie don't.

that's different. the thing that i was tempted to claim is true, and i remember there is a post between bjl's and my posts by crazy(?) saying the doc shouldn't claim.

I'm still finding it hard to believe since you were soooo convinced that it was "congratulating the doc", you argued against it until Ojanen herself cleared it, even when Cookie and myself both fought against it.

you are not me, so you don't know my thought.

I don't like either lynch wagons at this point. I'm finding Manho the scummiest even with his doc claim (or perhaps even especially because of it). Both Zach and Cookie seem town to me, especially since Cookie is not riding the rival wagon to his own safety, that screams town to me. I also can't find any arguments to why Cookie is scum, just blank accusations that I don't agree with and have fought to death over. Zach is still voting Cookie and he hasn't exactly given reasons why recently, just that he's unsure of Cookie's defense of Bjl (which was way way back). With all that said, I'm not buying Manho's doc claim, nor am I buying anyone's arguments that Cookie is scum. So for now:

Vote: Manho

and the reasons?

[manho]

so short, my biggest reasons to vote cookie is that, he is pushing hard for warth's lynch, but he know wrath will flip town in twilight.

Just remember, if Wrath shows scum, look straight to crazypianist right afterwards. If he doesn't, which I highly doubt will happen, look to the Wrath bandwagon.

I like how you want people to look at us if you show town (Quite unlikely, by the way), yet you don't defend yourself at all. You're just saying you will show town, trying to convince people that they're making a wrong lynch, yet there's actually no real effort to defend yourself against any claims, is there?

Wow.
Well, if Wrath shows townie, I'll know who to look at next.

He'll be lynched by deadline anyway...

Now if this doesn't sound like complete scum crap to me then nothing does.

And while I did come out with what side I am/was on this whole time, few seem to trust that so we'll have to wait until deadline to for ya'll to find out for sure

Well, if you're really town, I fail to see why you didn't put any effort into defending yourself at the end, and instead gave up.

those post is before Wrath flips town, but cookie had already known Wrath will flip town. i really can't see a town pushing the lynch hard to do so.

[PaltryExcuse]

Those quotes show EC saying he thought Wrath will show scum, not town. Huh?

[hohum]

Final Vote Count:

EtherealCookie(3): tubby216, manho, Starbuck

tubby216(2): EtherealCookie, PaltryExcuse
Zachrulez(1):, Ojanen
manho(1): Kyiv
Starbuck(1): Zachrulez

Not Voting(1):

With 8 Alive it takes 5 to lynch

EtherealCookie,

Vanilla Townie

, Lynched, D2

umoms: night actions due in 72 hours.

[hohum]

Ojanen

bjl

yernab

,

Vanilla Townie

, Killed, N2

It is now Day 3. With 6 Alive it takes 4 to lynch. Good luck!

[tubby216]

ok so I am your cop

bread crum #1

interesting

i'll have to look into that

ash.

but we need moar posts please

bread crum #2

Why yes, yes he did.

meh someone had to do it might as well be me,

i'll have some answers and cool stuff for you tomorrow

n1 i tried to invest crazypianist- but was role blocked no result
n2 i investigated Zach- result guilty

so

vote Zach

[Starbuck]

Nice work, Tubby.

Vote: Zach

[Kyiv]

You're missing one thing: Why did you investigate CP and Zach? Now that you've claimed, you haven't a reason to keep anything from us. Also, there are very big chances that town will lose if we mislynch. Please don't rush into a Zach lynch.

I'd like to hear from Starbuck... your vote on EC came from nowhere (or at least that's what it looked like), and you seem to be missing very big parts of the game, though you are quick to jump in as soon as someone mentions your name.

[tubby216]

with CP it was something they said at the end of the day,

and i diddn't like zach's play at all yesterday and the case brough agianst him to me at least warranted an investigation.

[Kyiv]

By "they", you mean CP, right?

What in particular about Zach's play yesterday struck you as scummy?

[Starbuck]

Instead of analyzing the last bit of the read through (because every time I started the power would go out on me), so I gave up trying to analyze and I just read it.

The first bit I read of the game I got a very pro-town read of EC, but as I read through farther, he got very scummy to me, which is why I felt my vote was better placed with him.

With Zach, I was feeling rather null with him. I've had experience with him in past games and his rather lurkiness is not uncommon. He really didn't sway me either way as scum or town. He's had more scummy points against him, but for me, there were others that were scummier than him.

I was actually finishing up reading when Zach posted that. It seemed to me that he was trying to move focus off of him and onto someone else with his post and vote on me.

[PaltryExcuse]

Well, we all know how I feel about Zach... but I'm tentative to vote due to wrong quicklynch = deathness.
Here's what I'm thinking right now:
Option 1: We lynch Zach. Part of me is really up for this... as yesterday I wanted him lynched and nothing has changed. Me mind and gut think he's scum.
Option 2: We have goons, one of the two is lying... but this is too obscure to tell (and unlikely in my mind). In this case, tubby would be lying as he's claiming to have been roleblock'd. I guess in this case we lynch tubby.
Option 3: manho thought he was going to be lynched, claimed, and now fellow mafia tubby knows the cop claim is feasible without a counter. We lynch tubby or manho. Again, due to my suspicions on Zach, I'm leaning towards lynching him... but if tubby is full of crap we insta-lose.
Option 4: No-lynch. We could be left in the same situation... but we'd lose a member. If tubby is telling the truth, he's roleblocked. Otherwise, he claims roleblocked. I don't see much gained there.

This probably reads like newbish thinking... because it is. This type of situation is very new to me and I feel like I'm missing something obvious here. Either way, lynching Zach before his response is too hasty for my liking. No more votes on him until we see a response, please. Right now, in my mind, we lynch Zach or tubby... but I'm gonna say it's going to take convincing to make me lynch tubby.

Starbuck: I know you to be a thinking player, so why the quick-vote of Zach?

[Zachrulez]

Vote: Tubby216

I'm vanilla town.

One more mislynch is a town loss at this point.

The lynch for today is obviously either me or Tubby.

Best bet is standard scum hunting to determine which of us has played scummier over the course of the game.

Not sure how much I can do to guide you guys to the right answer beyond that. (I wasn't really suspicious of Tubby before, so anything I bring forth now is tainted by confirmation bias.)

[Starbuck]

Zach, you do realize you are voting for a claimed cop right?

[Starbuck]

Unvote

Longer days are better for the town.

Paltry brings some interesting ideas to light that I didn't even consider.

I've been suspicious of tubby as well, and the only thing we can hope for to prove him wrong is a counterclaim.

[Zachrulez]

Zach, you do realize you are voting for a claimed cop right?

Who claimed a guilty on me. Which is impossible because I am town.

[PaltryExcuse]

So, either Zach or tubby is scum, but probably not both as I doubt mutual bussing is what is happening here.
I think Kyiv is town, as I've said before... although I don't like manho's play per se, I think it makes sense there was a night kill N1 and without a counter-claim I'm saying he's doc... and I'm town...
That leaves Starbuck as a possible third person to lynch today for me as I truly believe she is scum partner with one of you. Possibly, we even find the roleblocker and get a free investigation.
This is very much based on who I think is town, rather than gameplay though, so I don't put too much faith in this strategy. I think I need to re-read irregardless.

So in case it wasn't clear, I'm

FOS'ing: Starbuck

.

[PaltryExcuse]

I just realized, if right, on the unlikely possibility Starbuck is lynched today, there is no need for any more investigations.
The lynch should be either Zach or tubby.

[Kyiv]

Manho, who did you protect last night?

[PaltryExcuse]

Definitely rereading.

To the doctor: Don't reveal yourself at the moment.

Upon re-reading I forgot about this post. CrazyPianist seems to KNOW there is a doctor. Kyiv is not as townie as I once led myself to believe. Why was this post ignored when it came out when bjl and EC were getting flak for their doctor comments?

@Tubby: What posts in particular by CrazyPianist made you investigate her?

@Zach: Your vote of Starbuck at the end of day 2 confuses me as to the timing. It could be read as you did find Starbuck suspicious at that time, or was just mafia fleeing off a lynch. Problem: Why change your vote when pointing it out would have sufficed, and did you think that the town would have switched to a Starbuck lynch?