Open 177 (Monks and Masons) - Game Over.

[Maemuki]

The bottle of pepsi Vote count

Hewitt - ElectricBadger
Scien - Farside22
Farside22 - Scien
ODDin - Benmage

Not Voting: Nikanor, Hewitt, Maemuki, ODDin, XofElf

Lots of love
Haylxxx

V/LAish until 12nd of December. School is killing me.

I can post until then, just don't expect a post everyday. Or the posts to be helpful.

V/LA noted. Enjoy school! hahaha ~ Hayl

[farside22]

What point about ODDin? That he didn't jump at Scien's townie comments, or that he identified lack of votes/views as anti-town? That was the last comment about him I see. A weak tell and a null tell, imo, not the amazing insight you seem to bill your commentary as.

I see a person who just skimmed the post that benmage made. Are you hoping by writing this that you are discrediting all his comments he just made?

[ODDin]

Holy hell, this thing is growing like insanely fast. I'll do my best to catch up completely, but it will take me some time...

[Scien]

Scien how do you currently feel about Oddin. Did you happen to notice his point against farside wherein she gave a definition on how scum act, the opposite how she was acted so in a way subtly saying shes town. Yet Oddin made a definition of his own on how town should, which one could argue reflected subtly town onto himself. Double standard aye?

How about his clear statements of being against things like "I'm town" Which you've said, and which hes ignored.

Does seem like a double standard. Or an inconsistency might be a better way to word it, because I see no reason for him to hold me under a different standard. I definitely have been explicitly saying I was town and he did attack Farside in early game for just a slight hint that she might be implying she was town (which I didn't see).

Of course, I said earlier in the game that I thought he was buddying me as well.

post 474 stop dodging

[...]So far he was one not on the lynch for RBT he held back and his comment about RBT seemed to me like he knew RBT was going to flip town. [...] In this post he completely flips is reasoning and points it to what I said [...] Then pushes the vote. So far I see first trying to avoid what he knows to be a townie lynch to flip flopping to lynch said townie.

I have answered each of these time and time again. I am not dodging anything. But one more time for you.

I went back to try and explain why Fuzzy would have been the better info lynch. Halfway through making my case (I think I even dumped most of it out in my vote post before I changed my mind. I separated with a vertical bar where I switched my views. My changes came about due to thinking about the math of the m/m team, which by that time we knew Fuzzy was a member of. I then switched my vote, after I told you why even back then, and yes as deadline loomed I pushed for it.

As for the you saying I was afraid to lynch a townie, that is also something I have gone over and over again. IF I WAS AFRAID TO LYNCH A TOWNIE WHY WAS I PUSHING FOR A TOWNIE.

You guys saying that I am dodging this post is laughable. I have been answering it ad nausium. Stretch much? What exactly am I dodging Farside and Benmage? What point of yours have I not addressed? Would you list it out? I am trying my best to explain my thoughts. At this point I don't think its a fault of mine that you can't understand me.

Also what are you wanting me to do? Come up with more reasons why I changed my mind? There is only a small subset of reasons why I switched, I can't manufacture more... jesus.

It's around page 20 I'm questing how he goes back and forth on the RBT vote, doesn't vote on him and then once the lynch nears flips onto RBT.

Again. Thought that Fuzzy was the better lynch due to activity and the possibility that a M/M lynch might be good. Thought about it a bit more and thought otherwise of it. But you won't listen to that so meh. Heh, you will probably come back three posts from now and say I never answered this point.

[farside22]

Listen sir your the one who backtracked in the game.
You questioned RBT as you pointed out yourself. Changed your thoughts on it and then a post later lynch the guy on the very thing you found faulty. If that's not scummy I don't know what is.
Saying it was just a numbers thing or using some so called thought you may or may not have had is all WIFOM.
The final nail for me is your OMGUS vote on me. Again seeing Oddin ignoring you could either be someone buddying or a scum buddy. The fact he ignores everything you do completely screams scum buddy.

[Scien]

No... you claiming that I am scum when I could have had another motive for the change of mind, with no way to support that conclusion is WIFOM, lady.

My vote was not an OMGUS. Just as I said in the vote, you are either actively lying at this point, or you have such a blind tunnel vision at this point that you can't see anything I do having non-scum motives. Which means you are totally unhelpful, because everything I do has no scum motives. Both of which is a good target for a vote for me.

I try and point out my motives, you ignore them. I try and get you to back up your conclusion, you won't/can't. I point this out, you claim I am the one introducing the WIFOM here. Arguing with you is pointless. You aren't objective, you are emotional, you are opinionated in a concrete manner. I'm not trying to insult you here, in some places those traits are fine. But if you are going to have a hard core argument with me, and ignore everything I say, you will never catch scum.

---

If indeed you guys are going to lynch me over this crap (and it is crap, you don't have points as much as you have possible motives with no backing), I urge you to take a good look around you. Oddin is not cleared by my flip. Farside isn't either. It is common from what I have seen to get into a 'Well she pushed that townie so hard... she wouldn't do that as scum'. You make sure you really believe that statement if you are going to let her slide for this.

[Benmage]

You guys saying that I am dodging this post is laughable. I have been answering it ad nausium. Stretch much? What exactly am I dodging Farside and Benmage? What point of yours have I not addressed? Would you list it out? I am trying my best to explain my thoughts. At this point I don't think its a fault of mine that you can't understand me.

Nonono...Noone is saying your dodging the post or the question. That is an obvious misconception. Even sidestepping may be inccorrectly inferred. You aren't sidestepping the post, you are sidestepping the issue by writing it off as wifom.

I answer this is in the bottom of post 569. Its pointless to keep at this. You and Farside need to stop beating points over and over.

[farside22]

No... you claiming that I am scum when I could have had another motive for the change of mind, with no way to support that conclusion is WIFOM, lady.

No one can say what is in anyone's mind but the person themselves. You can lie it's not hard for scum to do.

My vote was not an OMGUS. Just as I said in the vote, you are either actively lying at this point, or you have such a blind tunnel vision at this point that you can't see anything I do having non-scum motives. Which means you are totally unhelpful, because everything I do has no scum motives. Both of which is a good target for a vote for me.

I pointed out your backtracking and stated that you questioned RBT but decided it wasn't what you thought then flipped again and lynched him how is that lying?

My vote was not an OMGUS. Just as I said in the vote, you are either actively lying at this point, or you have such a blind tunnel vision at this point that you can't see anything I do having non-scum motives. Which means you are totally unhelpful, because everything I do has no scum motives. Both of which is a good target for a vote for me.

Now who is lying. How many times do I have to point out that no one can say what you were thinking. Reading your comments about RBT and your sudden reversal is scummy. You seem to think that yelling at the top of your lungs that you were thing about numbers and why you did what you did is justified but it's still backtracking.
Also this is the second time you attack me for finding fault and now you follow it up with a vote that is indeed OMGUS I see it all as someone that is overly panicked at being caught.

If indeed you guys are going to lynch me over this crap (and it is crap, you don't have points as much as you have possible motives with no backing),

I showed the quotes in which you stated your thoughts on RBT and your post after that lynching him how is that not backing up a case?
So far all your doing is whining about my case and throwing it up as WIFOM and aTe.
If you were truely not scum you would show more comments on everyone and I find it funny that until someone brings up Oddin you ignore him as well.

[Scien]

Yep. Not a word got through. Moving on.

[Benmage]

If indeed you guys are going to lynch me over this crap (and it is crap, you don't have points as much as you have possible motives with no backing), I urge you to take a good look around you. Oddin is not cleared by my flip. Farside isn't either. It is common from what I have seen to get into a 'Well she pushed that townie so hard... she wouldn't do that as scum'. You make sure you really believe that statement if you are going to let her slide for this.

This is true. This is why I think a post from everyone listing all the players ranging from scummiest to town may be in order.

Theres 2 scum teams. I'm damn certain there is 2 scum in Oddin, Scien, and EB...hell i think i pinned it well enough that all 3 could be. SO who am I looking at for the 4th? Well yeah thats a tougher one...but atleast we have a start to start eliminating some, and nk's will maybe clear up some other things. A policy lynch may be in order.

Also was xofelf proded/with us? I know nothing of her nor that slot other than a little bit of crap from Zazier....Kinda really reallly reallllly bad.

Oddin is todays lynch. Mayyyybe EB. That case hew made against him is dead on, and my whole read the guy screamed scum.

[Benmage]

Scien

what do you think of EB.

[farside22]

Yep. Not a word got through. Moving on.

Ignores everything says I'm not paying attention and blows it off.
Nice how are you not scum again and what have you done that is town?
Also why is it you completely ignore oddin or even scum huntting till someone calls you out or it's close to day end?

[Scien]

No one can say what is in anyone's mind but the person themselves. You can lie it's not hard for scum to do.

That's exactly why using what I might have been thinking as a main point in your case is WIFOM, unless you can back it up.

I pointed out your backtracking and stated that you questioned RBT but decided it wasn't what you thought then flipped again and lynched him how is that lying?

The part where you said, "He never said a word about RBT before the vote". Seems like a lie to me.

Reading your comments about RBT and your sudden reversal is scummy

Or an honest change of mind. Support your WIFOM.

that is indeed OMGUS

I have reasons for my vote. Not OMGUS.

I showed the quotes in which you stated your thoughts on RBT and your post after that lynching him how is that not backing up a case?
So far all your doing is whining about my case and throwing it up as WIFOM and aTe.
If you were truely not scum you would show more comments on everyone and I find it funny that until someone brings up Oddin you ignore him as well.

It's not backing up the case because it doesn't explain how the switch was more likely to be scum motivated over town. Not that you will listen.

So far all YOU are doing is throwing WIFOM my way, then crying when I call you out on it.

Pointless.

[Scien]

Also why is it you completely ignore oddin or even scum huntting till someone calls you out or it's close to day end?

Lynch me then. I'm done arguing with you. At this point my lynch might give you more information over others anyway. I think you should start with ODDin... but if you are so freaking sure your view is right that you won't even listen to me, then meh.

[Benmage]

Not much of a corner, tbh, when even you aren't voting me. And not much of a dodge. More than one scum team here even if you were right - but you're not really looking for scum anyways, I think, just trolling for what people will jump at.

Lol, this is bad attempt to ignore everything i've said/done. Whats the point of sayin "more than one scum team here even if you were right"??

I'd sure be worried if I was scum coasting in a game with a couple in active players and a replacements comes blazzing in and lists me in the top 3 scum suspects, especially when you have a great case already laid out on you the day before. (And yeah thats right, i said you've been coasting...active lurking, call it what you want its scummy and so are you.)

What point about ODDin? That he didn't jump at Scien's townie comments, or that he identified lack of votes/views as anti-town? That was the last comment about him I see. A weak tell and a null tell, imo, not the amazing insight you seem to bill your commentary as.

Massive inconsistencies and double standard. What stronger things do you see to go on for today? Who are your top suspects?

WHY have you ignored the sooo obvious lurkers

, when you went on that lynch all lurkers rant. This was obvious bullshit to write off some quick excuse for your goddawful 2nd vote.

[Benmage]

Also why is it you completely ignore oddin or even scum huntting till someone calls you out or it's close to day end?

Lynch me then. I'm done arguing with you. At this point my lynch might give you more information over others anyway. I think you should start with ODDin... but if you are so freaking sure your view is right that you won't even listen to me, then meh.

YEs, Oddin or EB will be better....you two to your own corners!

[Benmage]

@Mod

its been 7 days since xofelf has posted please prod.

Also I think Nik warrants a prod in about an hr, so please note.

[farside22]

That's exactly why using what I might have been thinking as a main point in your case is WIFOM, unless you can back it up.

I showed your quotes where you posted RBT in one way and then voting for him in the next post. That's pretty solid evidence.
How do you back up what your thinking as fact? How can you say it's not backtracking when you agree with me in your second post when voting for RBT but in the post prior didn't think as much.

The part where you said, "He never said a word about RBT before the vote". Seems like a lie to me.

Who's lying again? Please quote where I said this because all I found was this:

vote: scien

So far he was one not on the lynch for RBT he held back and his comment about RBT seemed to me like he knew RBT was going to flip town.

Or an honest change of mind. Support your WIFOM.

Again I showed what you wrote it's backtracking plain and simple in those 2 quotes. How is that all WIFOM? Again can you really prove you were thinking about it one way over another?

I have reasons for my vote. Not OMGUS.

So far all you said was I was a liar. That's not a case it's a bunch of quotes in which you questioned RBT but held back from voting on him. Again I said you held back on your comments. You questioned him, no doubt but did any of that say you were finding him scummy during that exchange?
How is your vote nothing more then someone who is panicked at being under scuritney?

It's not backing up the case because it doesn't explain how the switch was more likely to be scum motivated over town. Not that you will listen.

How is it considered a town action to backtrack your comments and switch to a BW vote?

Lynch me then. I'm done arguing with you. At this point my lynch might give you more information over others anyway. I think you should start with ODDin... but if you are so freaking sure your view is right that you won't even listen to me, then meh.

*Cough* AtE again?

[Scien]

Hah. Whatever.

[Benmage]

Holy hell, this thing is growing like insanely fast. I'll do my best to catch up completely, but it will take me some time...

You were caught up through pg 22. Just focus on comments revolving you, and that glaring issue i brought up.

If i did the whole thread as extensively as illustrated in 3 1/2 days i'm sure you can manage a page or 2.

This excuse wont buy you much time.

[ElectricBadger]

Blazing? Zounds. The theme of this game has been godawful cases in long walls of text that are very *yawn*. I'm keeping up, but there's not much worth commenting on, and what is gets lost in the sea of inanity. It's hard NOT to be sidelined in this monstrosity, and continuing to press lurkers would be hypocritical at this point. I'm letting the current trolling run its course with the hope we can resume proper scum hunting tomorrow. Isn't Hewitt's case against me, which you jumped aboard, based on the fact I commented on the farside/scien dispute? ...though it seems to be going on fine without me, so not sure how I manipulated that.

Intrigued by all your recent injunctions for players to comment on one another. I thought I was supposed to be the manipulator?

[Benmage]

Hah. Whatever.

Your guys comments are both bad for this game. Its going nowhere, and is flooding the thread causing continual inactivity/difficult to catch and allows others, namely EB to get by with active coasting.

So both just stop talking to one another. Pause, let others weigh in on the issues at hand. Talk about some other issue, and come back to one another in a day or 2...its only a little into D2 right....

[Scien]

That would be why I didn't respond to her points. Just so you know.

[Benmage]

Blazing? Zounds. The theme of this game has been godawful cases in long walls of text that are very *yawn*. I'm keeping up, but there's not much worth commenting on, and what is gets lost in the sea of inanity. It's hard NOT to be sidelined in this monstrosity, and continuing to press lurkers would be hypocritical at this point. I'm letting the current trolling run its course with the hope we can resume proper scum hunting tomorrow. Isn't Hewitt's case against me, which you jumped aboard, based on the fact I commented on the farside/scien dispute? ...though it seems to be going on fine without me, so not sure how I manipulated that.

This is a pathetic excuse to write off your actions. You can skim my posts, and focus on what was about you, but it sounds like you read em anyways. I agree scien/farside interactions can push others away from the thread, and my posts certainly didnt help in that spectrum. But you are actively lurking, if not just down right lurkin beforehand. And yeah pressing lurkers would be hypocritical of you. Because it would be the pot callin the kettle black, i.e. you are just as guilty(if not more guilty, because you claimed to hate this) .

And no the points from Hew that I liked had nothing too majorly concerned with commenting on the far/scien dispute, but the way in which you carried yourself/basically played the game.

Intrigued by all your recent injunctions for players to comment on one another. I thought I was supposed to be the manipulator?

Asking peoples opinions directly on issues is manipulation? Man have you guys got this game turned upside down.

[Benmage]

That would be why I didn't respond to her points. Just so you know.

I know, good. Post 585, occurred in the mush...what do you think of EB?