Big Brother Mafia - Town wins!

[animorpherv1]

If you've been hearing the site wide "saberwolf, you dick you self hammered" stuff, I think not. Otherwise, yes.

[farside22]

This is a really unnecessary conversation to be having in this game thanks.

Agreed can we cut out the chat about saber and morph bet please.

[animorpherv1]

It's over anyways.

[Snow_Bunny]

Why me, Kmd?

Bit busy now, will post something useful later, when I have time.

Because I have no idea who you'd nominate, so it would force you to either pick two players or let the town guide you. Either way, it helps town get a read on you.

Oh, I see. Don't worry, if I must put my effort on it, I will.

I also would completely back a Snow_Bunny nomination.

Why?

I had to sign up for every single game in the sign up thread that was currently open, and not flake from any of them. If I manged to not flake, and finish every game, I win and I get to change his avatar for 2 months. If I lose, he changes mine for two months. Luckily, Ani left lots of loopholes, so [bI've campaigned for my lynch in every game I'm in that I signed up for.[/b]

Hope that doesn't change things with us hewitt

This... I would ban you right away if I had the powers to do so. You are just admitting that whatever the game it is you are not playing to your win con.

Mod: How can you tolerate this? He IS ruining your game! At least he's ruining the experience for me.

I can't believe players like him are allowed to play. I consider this even worst than cheating! Mufasa was banned for cheating! Saber should just as well go for the same road!

/rant.

I didn't like the KMD vote as I got no scum vibe. Sens would have been my vote, as I suspect others' would have been. As has already been suggested, a policy lynch almost.

Its an anti-lynch, not a policy lynch. That is why its so wrong. People arent going to saying "sens cause he is scummy" but "sens because he isnt kmd"

With this I agree.

As for now, I want to evict Sly tomorrow. Other players have exposed the points for me to be parroting them again. But the thing that draws my attention the most is that he nominated whoever he wanted regardless of asking town for opinions, yet he insisted for those opinions. His nominations, as Llama said, won't give us more information.

Really bad. Really scummy.

[SlySly]

I wasn't in support of the kmd nomination before it occurred, but I'm not so sure that it was necessarily worthy of using one of the POVs at this point in the game. Without knowing anyone's alignment, it's hard to see why it was best case scenario to use POV.

QFT, that is why I didn't put Paltry on the block to test his POV. I felt it could be a valuable tool for the town later. It has been wasted now in a hasty panic.

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I do think that Kmd is a stronger player based on my own experiences with him and in this game especially I think it's important to evict stronger players who are likely to lead a scumteam and then weed out their weaker buddies after but NOT on Week 1.

You may not agree with the week but finally someone who can see reasoning behind evicting strong crafty scum.

I'm not sure if these were the correct nominations for this week. If I was HoH I personally would've nominated zwets and a floater pawn to ensure zwets eviction. Then if zwets flipped scum I would've found it very telling that Kmd is scum. However, if Kmd flips scum this week then I think his buddies can easily be found in zwets and Snow_Bunny. I think Kmd has a little mentorish vibe in his relations with SB.

The rest of the gang should take a lesson from you. This is what I was asking for from everyone, but everyone crying about my choices sure didn't offer up any analysis that compares with this. I wish you weren't on the block now. People like to say I nom'd Sens because I was pissed when they fail to accept the fact that he was trying to delay discussion and when I called him on it, he took his ball and went home.

I would definitely nominate zwets as the replacement nominee if I were SlySly. And as one of the nominees I have an added incentive to be placed against zwets because I think I would have much more of a contribution to this game and would be much more easily readable than zwets. I think there's some players in this game who can back up that my posting style/quantity does quite often leave a lot for players to dissect and analyze.

Nice. This actually gives me something to think about. You didn't jump on a bandwagon. You didn't state that your reason was a "gut feeling" and you actually provided some analysis. I really wish you had been Sens from the first. You are making me rethink a few things.

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Sly said that he would use "good scumhunting" in his votes and noms. I really don't believe you did. I think you nommed KMD through weak linking with potential scum buddies and Sens because you got pissed with him. I see no evidence of you listening to the wishes of the town and pushing forward with your own agenda.

If I recall correctly, you were too lazy to give me a helpful summary for the reasoning behind your suggestions. That was the case for most of the players. I was forced to go with who I thought was the strongest scum because I wasn't going to go with reasonless bandwagon jumping or "gut feelings". Next time an HoH asks for reasoning behind your suggestions, provide some instead of criticizing after the fact.

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You made a self-centered move that strips the town of information. I could care less if you thought he was scum if no one else did.

We got information from my kmd nomination whether you want to admit it or not. You and Paltry panicked for no reason. Please don't make me repeat this again, tunneler. What reasons did you provide for your suggestions? Oh, that's right, you didn't give any.

Its an anti-lynch, not a policy lynch. That is why its so wrong. People arent going to saying "sens cause he is scummy" but "sens because he isnt kmd"

If it was town vs town, why weren't people going to vote kmd because he wasn't Sens? What made kmd the preferred townie to save over Sens? Was there maybe some actual basis about what I was saying about Sens?

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But the thing that draws my attention the most is that he nominated whoever he wanted regardless of asking town for opinions, yet he insisted for those opinions. His nominations, as Llama said, won't give us more information.

1. We got information from the kmd nomination. Paltry and Llama panicked over the nomination.
2. You were 1 of 2 people that gave reasons for their suggestions that wasn't "gut feeling"
3. Quote where I said I would go with the votes. I said the ratio of town/scum was too close at this point in the game to rely on votes. Until we get rid of some scum, that fact remains. I have played enough games on this site to have witnessed some really crafty scum that have steered the town WAY wrong.

[SlySly]

Just my 2 cents on the saber/animo debacle.

I feel they should be replaced/modkilled/banned for bringing their stupid bet over an avatar into a game that others were looking very forward to playing. saber playing as a suicidal idiot from the very start changed the entire complexion of this game. Neither saber or animo will be accepted into any game I mod.

[pablito]

Why do I have to be nominated for you to ask questions?

Because I find myself very unmotivated to ask these questions now. And I feel my priorities at the moment need to be on other things. You don't have to be, but it sure helps.

So far I like what hewitt says. I also liked a few things that sens said.

While a lot of people may be criticising slysly for his choices (I can't say I completely agreed with them either), but I would like to ask sly how he imagined a kmd vs. sens discussion period may have gone. Specifically, if you see a connection between players and put them up together - would you expect them to start bussing - and then - do you think that a survivor of the group would be seen more pro-town for surviving then.

Honestly, for the ani vs. saber thing, I read it and I don't care. It's a distraction. But if I remember correctly, for those of you angry at saber...well that was one reason why sens wanted out. So I'm going to look at who is angry at saber but would still want sens/hewitt out.

Also I like that snow bunny is posting. I wish Sironigous and Discode would come back as well.

Thinking more and more about the whole pov thing, I was thinking paltry as town, but it makes me thing of him more as scummy now. There was a bit too much willingness to use it, even before kmd went up. As for llama's reaction, I'd have to think harder on that one.

I sure don't want zwet appointing the next HoH, I would rather any one of my other suspects, including you, do that as they have at least contributed a little to this game.

@Sly - every single time a scum is lynched, the scum chooses the next HoH. So please explain more why you don't want zwet choosing next HoH - and when it would be appropriate for zwet to choose a HoH (if ever). Because I'm not sure a fear of choice of next HoH is going to be helpful for scumhunting if we think too far in advance.

[hewitt]

Why?

I think in this game particularly it's important to put early pressure on players who have made no impressionable impact on the game. Everybody who watches Big Brother knows that the dangerous ones in the game are the ones who fly under the radar. That'll be especially true in this game as well, we've already got people stating they'd like to evict SlySly tomorrow because he's in a position of power and has made an impressionable impact leaving those who want to slide under the radar, like yourself, safe. All you have to do is avoid nomination by not being memorable enough to warrant a nomination, and that's definitely a strategy I think a lot of scum will be employing.

Basically half of the time you're jabbering about how you don't know how to play this game and the other half of the time you're echoing sentiments made by others.

Honestly, for the ani vs. saber thing, I read it and I don't care. It's a distraction. But if I remember correctly, for those of you angry at saber...well that was one reason why sens wanted out. So I'm going to look at who is angry at saber but would still want sens/hewitt out.

I think those players who have expressed anger at saber yet still want me out are most likely scum players who are scared to keep me in the game.

[saberwolf]

If you wanna look at the real scum/hypocrites, just simply look at everyone who suddenly has spoken up and said I ruined the game, but before then never once mentioned me ruining anything, just that I'm scum and there's no other way of thinking about it.

[hewitt]

saber can you specifically point players out who have echoed that sentiment?

I think we should start voting for a replacement nominee just so that it's known to the HoH and everybody who the majority would like to see on the block. I personally would feel most comfortable with a zwets or saber nomination. zwets because I think he is absolutely useless and will not benefit the floaters in this game in any way and saber partially as a policy eviction and partially because I also do not think he will be very helpful.

Replacement nominee: saberwolf

[saberwolf]

mr finch and snowbunny stand out, if you wish to look at them. Snowbunny more than finch though.

[hewitt]

mr finch and snowbunny stand out, if you wish to look at them. Snowbunny more than finch though.

Stand out in what way?

[Mr Finch]

If you wanna look at the real scum/hypocrites, just simply look at everyone who suddenly has spoken up and said I ruined the game, but before then never once mentioned me ruining anything, just that I'm scum and there's no other way of thinking about it.

See, if you were concentrating I actually said that I didn't care if you were scum or not, I wanted you gone pretty much from the start of the game with your dumb posts about not reading the rules etc.

There's no "suddenly" about it from me pal. For the record, I don't think you are scum, just a really shitty player (now I know why, with that whole stupid bet thing) and if you start playing properly, which as yet I still see no evidence of, then I am happy to oblige you.

Hewitt - do you reckon he'll bother listening or will he just put up another town player to try and achieve his previous goals?

As we're only looking at one right now, I want to give Saber the benefit of the doubt and keep him in the game.

I will nominate zwets, just like I did before. Similarly to hewitt I think that not only is he useless but he's not making any effort. I cannot figure out (and he has not said) why he was "disappointed and angry at not being nominated". Perhaps he is also playing VI...

[LlamaFluff]

Ani, zwet, saber. One of those need to go up.

Ani/saber need to be replaced forceably though for the crap they pulled here. But hey, my mod/player blacklist hasnt grown for a while.

[hewitt]

Hewitt - do you reckon he'll bother listening or will he just put up another town player to try and achieve his previous goals?

I almost don't think it matters because we can't really control what the HoH is going to do. I think it's more important that it's out there for everybody to see who the majority believes should be nominated so that we have a sort of record, similar to how we have a record of how everybody wanted nominated.

Ani, zwet, saber. One of those need to go up.

I would agree with all three of these.

[farside22]

replacement nominee vote count:

saberwolf (1) hewitt

Mod: How can you tolerate this? He IS ruining your game! At least he's ruining the experience for me.

I gave him a warning. He has just the one then it's off with his head.

[Crazy]

Okay, the Kmd/Sens nominations were pretty bad. I'm glad Paltry used the POV; I don't see how it's scummy (like pablito pointed out.) Pretty much, it puts a possibility of someone other than Sens being evicted.

Saber - I want clarification - were you actually trying to get evicted earlier today? It seems that's what people were assuming, but this quote seems to suggest otherwise.

. Don't worry, I only have jungle republic, kingdom hearts and friends and enemies mafia left [and this game]. All the games I wasn't interested in I have managed to get myself lynched. [I tried, but for some reason ppl thought I was scum...go figure]. All the games of which the flavours I am interested in, I have played reasonably well. The only exception is this one, but that's for a totally different reason altogether. That is not important though, what is important is catching scum. I'd like to see hewitt lynched today and kmd put back up later for info lynch if anything.

I also blame anyone that's looking for a saber policy lynch, including hewitt. That's too much of an easy out for scum, plus I have no real reason to see saber as scum.

I also don't care for hewitt's defense of Sly basically because he's caused an impact on the game and we need to vote out the people that aren't saying much, because they're bigger threats to win because they often win in BB. Sensfan said it before - this is NOT Big Brother; this is mafia with BB themes. I'd lynch an active person that did something scummy before I'd lynch a somewhat less active person that didn't do anything scummy.

And

nominate: animorph

, still because of the Sens vote 'cuz he asked for replacement.

[hewitt]

I also blame anyone that's looking for a saber policy lynch, including hewitt. That's too much of an easy out for scum, plus I have no real reason to see saber as scum.

I also don't care for hewitt's defense of Sly basically because he's caused an impact on the game and we need to vote out the people that aren't saying much, because they're bigger threats to win because they often win in BB. Sensfan said it before - this is NOT Big Brother; this is mafia with BB themes. I'd lynch an active person that did something scummy before I'd lynch a somewhat less active person that didn't do anything scummy.

And

nominate: animorph

, still because of the Sens vote 'cuz he asked for replacement.

Either way it's an easy out for scum which is what I don't think you're understanding. Scum are going to back evictions of weaker players because it's an easy eviction. Scum are also going to be evictions of stronger players because it eliminates a strong player to oppose them. It's a nulltell, ultimately it comes down to which nominee would best be evicted from the game.

I have no defense for SlySly. I think would SlySly did was a move that would've been best pulled on a Week that's not Week 1. I actually opposed what SlySly did so I'm not sure why you're trying to twist that around without expecting me to point that out.

An animorpherv replacement nominee would be great but your reasoning is questionable. I don't even know what that means lol can you formulate a real reason here?

[SlySly]

Specifically, if you see a connection between players and put them up together - would you expect them to start bussing - and then - do you think that a survivor of the group would be seen more pro-town for surviving then.

I didn't see a connection between kmd and Sens. I wanted to put someone up from each scum team as I suspected them. I was hoping discussion would arise that showed each nominee to be scummy and even possibly having a close vote arise. As it is, Paltry panicked and took kmd off the block after a strong lobby to do so from Llama while kmd had 0 votes against him. I feel that brought forth some information about a possible kmd/Paltry/Llama connection, so it was not a total loss.

Thinking more and more about the whole pov thing, I was thinking paltry as town, but it makes me thing of him more as scummy now. There was a bit too much willingness to use it, even before kmd went up.

QFT

@Sly - every single time a scum is lynched, the scum chooses the next HoH. So please explain more why you don't want zwet choosing next HoH - and when it would be appropriate for zwet to choose a HoH (if ever). Because I'm not sure a fear of choice of next HoH is going to be helpful for scumhunting if we think too far in advance.

My main reason for not wanting zwet to appoint the HoH is that he has not participated in this game very much at all. If he is put on the block and evicted, he may not even come back to nominate someone and if he did, going on what he has contributed so far, I don't think he would put much effort into deciding on who would be the best next HoH. I feel evicting zwet now may just put farside in the position to replace zwet just so the replacement can pick the next HoH. If I don't put him up now, zwet could easily be replaced soon due to lack of participation and could be replaced by a more active person. Lurking is a null tell and that is what zwet has been doing. A replacement could change everyone's perspective about him. You and hewitt coming into the game has totally changed my perspective about the roles you two are playing. The same could ring true for a zwet replacement.

[hewitt]

My main reason for not wanting zwet to appoint the HoH is that he has not participated in this game very much at all. If he is put on the block and evicted, he may not even come back to nominate someone and if he did, going on what he has contributed so far, I don't think he would put much effort into deciding on who would be the best next HoH. I feel evicting zwet now may just put farside in the position to replace zwet just so the replacement can pick the next HoH. If I don't put him up now, zwet could easily be replaced soon due to lack of participation and could be replaced by a more active person. Lurking is a null tell and that is what zwet has been doing. A replacement could change everyone's perspective about him. You and hewitt coming into the game has totally changed my perspective about the roles you two are playing. The same could ring true for a zwet replacement.

I disagree with this. I think that zwets getting evicted and having to choose the following HoH will most likely result in a player who never would be picked as HoH to be picked. Although he sucks at basically everything Mafia related he's refreshingly naive and if he is a floater he most likely will pick an HoH that will bring an interesting aspect to the game. I have the feeling that as stronger players get evicted there will most likely be a cycle back and forth between two to four players being nominated as HoH over and over. I think zwets will break that early so that scum don't control HoH for the duration of the game.

[SlySly]

hewitt, fair enough. Can you give me some reasons, other than lurking, why you might think zwet is scum at this point?

[hewitt]

hewitt, fair enough. Can you give me some reasons, other than lurking, why you might think zwet is scum at this point?

I feel like he's playing really out of character for what I'm normally used to seeing from him. I feel like he's purposely trying to stay out of people's minds and slide under the radar it's bizarre seeing him play this way I don't understand it.

[SlySly]

hewitt, fair enough. Can you give me some reasons, other than lurking, why you might think zwet is scum at this point?

I feel like he's playing really out of character for what I'm normally used to seeing from him. I feel like he's purposely trying to stay out of people's minds and slide under the radar it's bizarre seeing him play this way I don't understand it.

He is playing exactly like I have seen him play before, but lurking more. I think putting zwet up now would be punishing him for non-participation - null tell. I think putting saber up now would be punishing him for being an ass and trying to win a bet by trying to get evicted - null tell. I would prefer to put Llama up, but I am not sure he would be evicted over you, even though he should be. He has pretty much spent his entire game tunneled on me, where since joining, you have contributed pretty much more than anyone else, though Pablito is coming on strong now too. I have seen a little support for putting animo up, but my main reason for wanting him put up was that I saw a connection to your predecessor but I am beginning to think you are town. He was a part of the stupid avatar bet with saber but that is a null tell as well. Snow and Finch have seen a little support too, but the only reasons I would have to put them up from my perspective is their hypocrisy saying I should have listened to the everyone about my nominees while it is obvious there weren't many actually helping in the process. I would put Paltry up for wasting the POV if I could, but I can't. I do find it very interesting that he and kmd have pretty much disappeared since all that went down.

[SlySly]

I don't see how it's scummy (like pablito pointed out.)

You may want to give pablito's thoughts on the topic a reread.

[Crazy]

Hewitt - What I was referring to is this:

I think in this game particularly it's important to put early pressure on players who have made no impressionable impact on the game. Everybody who watches Big Brother knows that the dangerous ones in the game are the ones who fly under the radar. That'll be especially true in this game as well, we've already got people stating they'd like to evict SlySly tomorrow because he's in a position of power and has made an impressionable impact leaving those who want to slide under the radar, like yourself, safe. All you have to do is avoid nomination by not being memorable enough to warrant a nomination, and that's definitely a strategy I think a lot of scum will be employing.

That might not have been intended as a defense, but it comes across as one.

An animorpherv replacement nominee would be great but your reasoning is questionable. I don't even know what that means lol can you formulate a real reason here?

He voted for Sens basically because he requested replacement. I don't like that.