Mini 892 - Mayor Mafia (GAME OVER)

[charter]

Oops, I had a big tirade typed up but then deleted it since it wasn't very nice, that second sentence was part of it I forgot to delete. That bit was under a monkey town scenario.

[Socrates]

*Sigh*

What is with it with newbies and their absolute hatred of claiming? Its like they heard somewhere that knowing power roles helps scum and decided that they should never claim, ever, and anybody who does is probably scum.

Someone really needs to write a good detailed article about the logic and timing of roleclaiming and post it on the wiki so that new players can be pointed towards it. Does such a thing already exist? It would really cut down on this kind of thing and make it easier to pick out scum using this terrible logic.

The next step here is to do a thorough meta of Kyle to see if this is the kind of stance he would plausibly take as town. If, in other games, I find that Kyle has a thorough grasp of claiming mechanics and that he isn't apt to take such weird stances, I will be parking my vote here for the rest of the day. If I find that this is consistent with townKyle play, then I will consider letting him live, for now.

Also, now that finals are over and I have more time, I plan to do a scum meta of SerialClergyman, because I have only seen his town play while looking around the site.

I also need to do more meta-ing of Monkey, and he knows why.

[Socrates]

Just saying that Hoopla and Monkey are at L2 and Socrates is at M1.

What a useful post, I mean it wasn't like there was a vote count posted just a few posts ago or anything that anyone could clearly read. Tell me Kyle, are you afraid of posting much because I'll compare your play here with the newbie game we just got out of?

Well, this is interesting. Can you link to this game? What is your interpretation of Kyle so far?

[MonkeyMan576]

I think it's a bit conceded to presume that someone bases their whole posting style based off of "being afraid" of one player. But I'm also interested in seeing what he has to say.

[kyle99]

Just saying that Hoopla and Monkey are at L2 and Socrates is at M1.

What a useful post, I mean it wasn't like there was a vote count posted just a few posts ago or anything that anyone could clearly read. Tell me Kyle, are you afraid of posting much because I'll compare your play here with the newbie game we just got out of?

Well, this is interesting. Can you link to this game? What is your interpretation of Kyle so far?

All of my games are in my wiki page, and the one he's referring to is the game furthest on the bottom of the table.

[MonkeyMan576]

Just saying that Hoopla and Monkey are at L2 and Socrates is at M1.

What a useful post, I mean it wasn't like there was a vote count posted just a few posts ago or anything that anyone could clearly read. Tell me Kyle, are you afraid of posting much because I'll compare your play here with the newbie game we just got out of?

Well, this is interesting. Can you link to this game? What is your interpretation of Kyle so far?

All of my games are in my wiki page, and the one he's referring to is the game furthest on the bottom of the table.

That makes anything he has to say not relevant?

[kyle99]

Just saying that Hoopla and Monkey are at L2 and Socrates is at M1.

What a useful post, I mean it wasn't like there was a vote count posted just a few posts ago or anything that anyone could clearly read. Tell me Kyle, are you afraid of posting much because I'll compare your play here with the newbie game we just got out of?

Well, this is interesting. Can you link to this game? What is your interpretation of Kyle so far?

All of my games are in my wiki page, and the one he's referring to is the game furthest on the bottom of the table.

That makes anything he has to say not relevant?

Anything who says? I'm confused about your statement.

[MonkeyMan576]

Just saying that Hoopla and Monkey are at L2 and Socrates is at M1.

What a useful post, I mean it wasn't like there was a vote count posted just a few posts ago or anything that anyone could clearly read. Tell me Kyle, are you afraid of posting much because I'll compare your play here with the newbie game we just got out of?

Well, this is interesting. Can you link to this game? What is your interpretation of Kyle so far?

All of my games are in my wiki page, and the one he's referring to is the game furthest on the bottom of the table.

That makes anything he has to say not relevant?

Anything who says? I'm confused about your statement.

DDD, your pointing out that your game is "on the bottom of the list" looks like a preemptive excuse to disregard his comments.

[charter]

So, we can lynch Monkeyman now?

[MichelSableheart]

Thirteenth support count of day 1:

charter (0)

kyle99 (1)

Hoopla

Moai Interceptor Cannons (0)

Debonair Danny DiPietro (0)

SerialClergyman (0)

Hoopla (1)

SerialClergyman

* Socrates (6)

Socrates, charter, Col.Cathart, kyle99, Moai Interceptor Cannons, MonkeyMan576

MonkeyMan576 (1)

Debonair Danny DiPietro

xRECKONERx (0)

nhammen (2)

nhammen, xRECKONERx

Col.Cathart (0)

SaintKerrigan (0)

Not supporting anyone (1)

SaintKerrigan

With 12 players alive, it takes 7 votes to elect someone as mayor.

an * marks who would become mayor if the day ended right now.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Thirteenth vote count of day 1:

charter (0)

kyle99 (2)

xRECKONERx, Socrates

Moai Interceptor Cannons (0)

Debonair Danny DiPietro (0)

SerialClergyman (1)

Hoopla

Hoopla (4)

SerialClergyman, nhammen, Moai Interceptor Cannons, MonkeyMan576

Socrates (0)

MonkeyMan576 (5)

Col.Cathart, kyle99, SaintKerrigan, Debonair Danny DiPietro, charter

xRECKONERx (0)

nhammen (0)

Col.Cathart (0)

SaintKerrigan (0)

Not voting anyone (0)

With 13 votes available, it takes 7 votes to lynch someone. However, noone can be lynched before a mayor is elected.

[Moai Interceptor Cannons]

This day is becoming stagnant.

[SerialClergyman]

Mod - is your post saying there are 13 votes available there a typo?

[Hoopla]

This day is becoming stagnant.

I'm prepared to compromise out of self-preservation and switch to monkey, because I doubt anyone will want to lynch SerialClergyman.

[MichelSableheart]

Again I would like to remind everyone that I prefer to have questions asked through pm.

Mod - is your post saying there are 13 votes available there a typo?

No, it's not.

A mayor will be elected before a lynch is decided. The mayor would be a double voter, because both 12 and 13 votes require a mayority of 7.

So 12 players alive + 1 extra vote from the mayor makes a total of 13 votes available.

[SerialClergyman]

Sorry mate, you are quite correct. My apologies.

Saint Kerrigan, why monkey over hoopla?

May I ask what the harm in allowing monkey one night to try to grab a result?

[Col.Cathart]

Work, work, work, Anti-Prod, work, work, work.

I'll be back evening, to post something more.

[Hoopla]

Sorry mate, you are quite correct. My apologies.

Saint Kerrigan, why monkey over hoopla?

May I ask what the harm in allowing monkey one night to try to grab a result?

The argument I think is that if he is scum, he can just claim a guilty first thing tomorrow, and yay, we've mislynched back to back, and we're on Day 3 (with a not very informative Day 2).

[SerialClergyman]

We don't need to lynch the guilty tomorrow either.

Moving aside the possibility of leaving both alive, we could lynch monkey tomorrow. Then if we're wrong about him, we have scum on a platter. I'd give up a day on lynching possible scum for a confirmable result or two.

[Hoopla]

A cop is a signifigantly weaker role when it's been outed - especially Day 1. The benefit in keeping him alive is if he is the cop, he will likely draw a nightkill (meaning we get a different lynch today).

Lynching him tomorrow is the worse choice out of everything suggested. If Monkey gets an innocent tonight, we get one confirmable result in exchange for a mislynch. I don't see this as a good scenario.

[SerialClergyman]

I'm not suggesting that's a necessary course of action.

I asked what the problem with keeping him alive was. You said that he could claim a guilty and we'd have a 'second' mislynch. I'm merely pointing out that we could lynch monkey and avoid that scenario.

N1 lynch monkeycop N2 mislynch = 2 townies down + NKs
N1 mislynch N2 lynch monkey with claimed guilty = 2 townies down + NKs but WITH confirmed guilty on a player.

A cop's power is that he can find scum and confirm innocents. Him being outed doesn't reduce his power except in that he is exposed to and draws kills and blocks - both of which can only been drawn if he's not lynched.

[Hoopla]

A cop's power to confirm innocents and find scum is almost completely removed when he is outed. As he is either scum, lying, or will be night killed/blocked. The nightkill scenario is good - but is dependant on him being truthful. If this is the best result we can hope for if he is town, isn't it more worthwhile to take the gamble he's scum?

What percentage do you put Monkey as scum? More than me?

[SerialClergyman]

Maybe a little bit. Less than directly after his claim, I think.

There's no need to take a gamble that he's scum at all. Lynching him one day earlier barely benefits us. It won't draw a kill, won't draw a block, won't stop a kill. It'll inform tomorrow's lynch, but so would any lynch whether scum or town.

[SerialClergyman]

Do you think he's scum? Do you think in an ideal world he shoudl be lynched or are you essentially playing devil's advocate for self-preservation?

[MichelSableheart]

xRECKONERx will be prodded.

[Hoopla]

Do you think he's scum? Do you think in an ideal world he shoudl be lynched or are you essentially playing devil's advocate for self-preservation?

He's likelier than random to be scum - I'm genuinely on the fence when it comes to lynching a claimed cop on Day 1. Everytime I make a definitive stance, I persuade myself out of it with other logic.

Self preservation comes into it a bit this time too. I know I am town, so if it came down to me vs. Monkey, then obviously it is the right call. If I was looking pro-town it's possible I would try and organise a lynch elsewhere, but I can't say without bias.