Open 189~Trouble@Warren State Mental Hosp (Over)

[crywolf20084]

Sorry about missing out on the first couple of pages, time to start posting:

vote: vi

Easiest name to type, plus I feel Xdaamno needs some support, not more votes.

I see that the majority of you all seem to know each other quite well. As such i am hoping that you don't all have pre-game prejudiced when playing. Maybe xdaamno is scum looking at his posts where he's afraid to come across as scummy, but town can have that worry too. Could maybe those of you who know him best explain whether or not this is typical behaviour for him? Only when i see more posts or good explanations from other players will i consider changing my vote. Please jdodge, if you will, can you tell me what good we would get out of xdaamno's lynch, as in obvscum lynch, iioa lynch, etc?

VP, what's your opinion on this post? I think it's obvtown.

/pre-emptive preview edit: stop bothering me

I really do not think this post is obv town.

[Xdaamno]

Even though I do - though not that strongly - the point of that post was quite obviously to learn more about VP's character, which is unclear to me at this point. Cheers for shitting on that.

[VP Baltar]

I assure you daamno, I'm a lad cut from the most upstanding cloth. If I ever took your daughter on a date, I'd be sure to pull her chair out and everything.

In seriousness, I'll actually catch up in this thread today after some scrambled eggs and coffee.

[Otto Ulbreicht]

EBWOP: If your vote on me is more for the short-name factor than for the unspoken Xdefensemno, then you're saying that the best you can do for finding scum after one hundred posts is a random vote, which means you don't have enough of an opinion on anyone to put down a reasoned vote... which I would find as suspect, as each player has offered a response to the Xdaamno wagon along with their reasoning.

Just look at it like this.

I realised I forgot to put this game on my watched topics list, and stumbled across it while searching for another game. I hastily went into the game, and noticing a couple of names on the page before posting, I RVS voted the name that was easiest to remember and spell. I also read hastily the last bits of the game to get an idea of who is suspect, and to be honest I don't see that great of a case on Xdammno. I don't wish to be opportunistic and just come straight out of the gate with another vote on him. I need to see some definite cases before I make that move. Meta just doesn't cut it.

[Otto Ulbreicht]

Cat, tajo, Qoog, Otto, and anyone else who hasn't really commented, what do you think of the daamno wagon?

I’ll be completely honest, this game has been pretty hard to follow because I am not sure how much is serious and how much isn’t. I’m not used this sort of pace. Correct me if I’m wrong but the Xdaamno wagon started with this:

/checks in

We're lynching you. Discuss.

I guess it’s hard for me to understand that you can you can get a really accurate read off someone by starting a discussion like this. It seems to me like an abstract question is going to get an abstract answer (that is the way I read Vi’s remark, an abstract way to try and scumhunt). I guess I just don’t see the logic in attaching a lot of meaning to the response. Of course you can try to catch someone in their words and make them squirm later on, but where did the line of questioning begin?

Right now I’d like to reserve judgment on Xdaamno. Post 60 obviously concerns me because I agree with Vi's logic about it (post 68), but I’m not convinced he’s scummy yet. I’m reading Vi town right now though, if it means anything.

This post right here sums up my feelings on the subject as well.

[Otto Ulbreicht]

Tajo: I have played at least 20-30 games on this site to date, and that's just this site.

[VP Baltar]

Vi's pushing it here. It sounds plausable that your mini-fallacies are because you're biased.

Why do you think she'd be biased? I don't see anything from her posts that suggest that, so please elaborate on this.

I can't remember much about how I played in that game. I'm probably thinking things through more, but the dominating feeling that stopped me playing mafia - people never being willing, for one reason or another, to accept my logic - is still here.

Actually, I think I've been giving you the benefit of the doubt a great deal. These kind of pity party posts don't make me want to continue, however.

I'm not going to manufacture comments for your benefit, because it's not nessecary at this stage. I'm going to post about what interests me and make a point to go out of my way to sometimes ask probing questions, as I have been doing.

I haven't seen probing questions from you at all, actually. I don't even know who your suspects are really other than a pretty obvious OMGUS on Vi.

Although it has already been addressed for the most part, do you mind clarifying exactly where I said I was confident that Vi was town, VPB?

As I already answered, because you said it. Why say you have a town read if you aren't very confident in it? What purpose does that serve?

I really dislike Howard's 96:

You should vote him. He's obv scum and apparently I'm the only one who sees it.

Does Dizzy always play like this?

I'd like to hear this from people with experience as well. She's intentionally playing to be unreadable and I don't like it.

(Happy B-day, btw, Dizzy!)

OK, I dislike playing with Xdaamno because of what's going on right now. Yes, he's definitely scummy, but he's almost always scummy acting.

citation needed.

Also, the collision of veterans and newer people makes this game slightly more difficult.

Why? I don't see the attacks falling along those lines at all actually.

How would stating your stance on the wagon earlier have compromised this information? Especially since a few other players had identical views to your own.

How would nay-saying a wagon help it build? And I don't control what other players do, but I'd say that if they had the same intentions as me (which I'm not sure of), then saying something early wasn't a bright move.

Why do you think I'm scum again? Just a bullet list is fine.

What are your thoughts on HowardRoark?

If I had to lynch someone other than VBP it would Izzy, only because I'm the least fond of her play-style.

Playstyle lynches = scum tactic.

Correct me if i'm wrong, but i smell someone that'll prob be replaced leaving us with nothing from her.

That's pretty much skitzer's MO, isn't it?

@JDodge: Check in, please--

+1

I want to talk about this. I agree that I play better on scumchat, but... this is just how I am here. Certainly moreso as town than as scum, if you read any of the games I've played in the last year or so.

links please.

VP, what's your opinion on this post? I think it's obvtown.

I don't think it's obvtown or a great post tbh. The Vi vote is pretty pointless (and if Otto really is an alt of someone with experience, then I'd expect a hell of a lot better than that). Asking for an explanation of your behaviour from players who know you is a slightly better effort. The last line of it is pretty nonsensical.

I also read hastily the last bits of the game to get an idea of who is suspect, and to be honest I don't see that great of a case on Xdammno.

So how are you actually making a value judgement on the case if you haven't even really read the thread? Why not wait until you're fully caught up before you comment?

---

Sorry for the long post. I'm caught up now. More commenting from people who aren't Vi and Xdaamno would be nice.

[VP Baltar]

Tajo: I have played at least 20-30 games on this site to date, and that's just this site.

So, are you intentionally playing aloof as part of your alt? If you don't care about revealing who you are, I'd be interested to know what your main account is.

[Otto Ulbreicht]

Otto Ulbreicht: What has Xdaamno done that would make you want to support? I'm not saying stuff like that isn't out there but I sure do want to see it if it is. (<--ew nasty four 2-letter words that start with "i" in a row...)

The support is mainly me not voting for him. I understand where xdaamno is coming from. A plan to try to lynch him before the game even starts unfolds, and then he's gotta try to carefully word his phrases so that he doesn't encourage some of the stupid players [possibly like myself], from jumping onto his BW for the lulz. I will admit a couple of his posts are a littlesuspect in wording, but from a town perspective I can just see it as aguy who simply wants to live, and rather not go out via the bs wagon that's been made. I can guarantee that if xdaamno is not scum, there is definitely one scum on it right now.

[Otto Ulbreicht]

Further, Mafia is

not a game of logic

and it is scummy to try to frame it as one.

I have to disagree with this. I have won quite a few mafia games in the endgame stage using just pure logic. Having the right amount of knowledge of roles and plotting out all of the possible scenarios helps narrow down stupid decisions considerably.

[Otto Ulbreicht]

Tajo: I have played at least 20-30 games on this site to date, and that's just this site.

So, are you intentionally playing aloof as part of your alt? If you don't care about revealing who you are, I'd be interested to know what your main account is.

I bet if I revealed myself, I'd have two automatic votes on me, just for being me

I'll think about it, for now I'm just gonna play the game.

VP: Let's assume xdaamno is town for the moment. Let's also assume vi is town too. Do you think there is any chance at all of scum trying to push a competing BW for the sake of confusion, or should we be analyzing the xdaamno BW? It's just that I notice a small group of people [mainly the scumchatters] hitting xdaamno hard, while the others seem to be in their own flurry of people hunting.

[crywolf20084]

That's pretty much skitzer's MO, isn't it?

Forgot it was skitz, and it kinda is... Know this from mish mash games.

[Xdaamno]

Not a great deal of time, so I'll just address mine:

Vi's pushing it here. It sounds plausable that your mini-fallacies are because you're biased.

Why do you think she'd be biased? I don't see anything from her posts that suggest that, so please elaborate on this.

I used bias in the sense that Vi could be looking to attack me as a strategy rather than out of honesty. I didn't find it particularly hard to believe that this wasn't the case, but it was plausable and so worth a vote at this point. I also wanted to see if he would back off when I pushed back.

I can't remember much about how I played in that game. I'm probably thinking things through more, but the dominating feeling that stopped me playing mafia - people never being willing, for one reason or another, to accept my logic - is still here.

Actually, I think I've been giving you the benefit of the doubt a great deal. These kind of pity party posts don't make me want to continue, however.

I think you're looking for a reason behind that post that wasn't there. I was trying to be transparent.

I'm not going to manufacture comments for your benefit, because it's not nessecary at this stage. I'm going to post about what interests me and make a point to go out of my way to sometimes ask probing questions, as I have been doing.

I haven't seen probing questions from you at all, actually. I don't even know who your suspects are really other than a pretty obvious OMGUS on Vi.

Yes, the vote was partly because he was voting me - as I said, I wanted to see if he would abate. But that's certainly nothing to do with the literal definition of OMGUS - do you stand by this?

I want to talk about this. I agree that I play better on scumchat, but... this is just how I am here. Certainly moreso as town than as scum, if you read any of the games I've played in the last year or so.

links please.

Kay, I'll do this later.

[VP Baltar]

I bet if I revealed myself, I'd have two automatic votes on me, just for being me

I'll think about it, for now I'm just gonna play the game.

Don't feel obligated to. I appreciate a good alt. I think you stating you have 20-30 games on site is sufficient for my understanding.

Do you think there is any chance at all of scum trying to push a competing BW for the sake of confusion, or should we be analyzing the xdaamno BW?

Well, I think there are merits to both. If you feel the Xdaamno wagon is scum driven, then of course we should be analyzing there. However, if you think it's town driven, then I don't see it as completely unlikely that scum would stay off and mildly poke at an opposing wagon and garner town points if daamno flipped town.

Yes, the vote was partly because he was voting me - as I said, I wanted to see if he would abate. But that's certainly nothing to do with the literal definition of OMGUS - do you stand by this?

Depends if I believe your motive. Jury's out at the moment. This might help me decide though: do you think your wagon is scum or town driven? If the former, who do you think is most likely to be scum on it?

[Xdaamno]

I don't know if someone could find my games via the mafiascum logs - I haven't played many lately - the only one in 2008/2009 I could find was this one:

http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... c&&start=0

Where I certainly remember having the same feeling, although I avoided being lynched for quite a while with a gambit.

[Xdaamno]

Depends if I believe your motive. Jury's out at the moment. This might help me decide though: do you think your wagon is scum or town driven? If the former, who do you think is most likely to be scum on it?

This is something I expect to be saying a lot this game, and it's "Read my lips: I don't know". Maybe I could give you a guess if you pushed me, but I don't think it's a good idea with such low certainty.

[Xdaamno]

EBWOP for post 164: meant to say that I found that through google searching

[crywolf20084]

Why are you pushing your meta?
Why are you asking us to go look through past games.
Sorry but I'm one who thinks this game is the one that should matter. not your history

[Vi]

(...)to be honest I don't see that great of a case on Xdammno. I don't wish to be opportunistic and just come straight out of the gate with another vote on him. I need to see some definite cases before I make that move. Meta just doesn't cut it.

There is no dilemma of "make a random vote" and "vote Xdaamno", and the case for at least two people on Xd is not "meta".
Incidentally, you appear to be caught up now. Any thoughts?

I have to disagree with this. I have won quite a few mafia games in the endgame stage using just pure logic. Having the right amount of knowledge of roles and plotting out all of the possible scenarios helps narrow down stupid decisions considerably.

Not relevant to this game at all.

----

Cayke: Less shooting down everything Xd says, more of just about anything else please.

[Vi]

EBWOP:

Incidentally, you appear to be caught up now. Any thoughts

on the nine players other than yourself, me, or Xd

?

Rather than say "should we investigate the wagon" after you got done saying that you can guarantee one scum on Xd-Town's wagon, you should probably go ahead and do it.

[Xdaamno]

Why are you pushing your meta?
Why are you asking us to go look through past games.
Sorry but I'm one who thinks this game is the one that should matter. not your history

Uhm, you brought it up.

Yeah i am pretty happy with my vote on Daamno. through what i know of him in scumchat games, he doesn't play so scattered brained and scummy ever. And IMO, and i am pretty sure in others too, he IS playing very scattered brained.

Definitely happy with my vote.

[crywolf20084]

many posts before you mentioned your meta thnx

[Xdaamno]

Oh, I did.

You know this is my meta JD >: /

That was addressed only to JD, because it was something we once had a talk about in scumchat. I agree that it's not very useful to the rest of you.

[Vi]

Unvote: Xdaamno
Vote: crywolf20084 (henceforth: Cayke)

(L-6)

[DizzyIzzyB13]

you didnt answer the question, are you going to play serious or what?

You didn't ask this question. And, I am playing seriously.