Mafia 104 - Revenge of the Crimson King - Game!

[Annachie]

PBPA ON MUH

xREC. Could you extend this to Swimmer as well? Since you did Muh, I'd like the consistancy of you doing Swimmer.

[Annachie]

Annachie's rough and ready PBPA on Raivann
(+) positive town, (N) neutral, (-) Negative town.
(Ratings and opinions mine only)

Post 0. RVS. (N)

Post 1. Asking about the hydra. Fair question at that point. (+)

Post 2. Didn't see CB's RVS comment as scummy, FOS Swimmer/Muh Opinion, but good opinions. (+)

Post 3. Fair Q to Swimmer/Muh. (+)

Post 4. Good Q to Exalt. Esp given Exalt being scum. Was seeking info on Glork though. (N)

Post 5. Pointless and contentless. But it was when Exalt was really mouthing off. (-N)

Post 6. More sillyness. Pointless and Contentless. But again in Exalt. (- N)

Post 7. Attack swimmer for lieing, antagonistic and not answering. No Swimmer lie though. Maybe swimmer missrep or BSing.
Quotes to support is 50:50
Quotes self.
Some content, more non-content. (N)

Post 8. Fair Q to Wicked & Merk. (+)

Post 9. Fair comment (+)

Post 10. Contentless, but fair enough. (N)

Post 11. Facitious comment (at best) and a silly question. (You should know what an accidental hammer is by now) (-)

Post 12. Facitious again. (-) Post 11 and 12 are borderline scummy imo.

Post 13. Newb Q that I would have thought Rav should be past needing to ask. (-N)

Post 14. Tunnel Vision, though believed CB's VT claim. (+N)

Post 15. (N)

Post 16. (+)

Post 17. Opinion. But good opinion. (+)

Post 18. Hammer vote on someone he believed to be town. Right vote though. (+)

Post 19. Opinion, but agree 100% (+)

Post 20. Tunnel Muh. (+N)

Post 21. Answered Q about who Muh replaced. (N)

Post 22. Fair comment. (+)

Post 23. (N)

Overall positive town feel, though a rather nasty tunnel vission on Swimmer/Muh. Some newbieness showing when un-expected judging by his join date.

Tar, I disagree with Raivann being mafia. With the newb type questions and the severe tunnel vission, I think your lyncher option is the correct one for him.

I really despise pretty much everything Devestation has posted in this game, and if he's not scum I'd eat his many many hats.
-VPB

Do you want sauce with that?
VPB, how do your thoughts or feelings about Devestation posts change with his role being revealed?


#900 EBWOP.
Please.

[xRECKONERx]

xREC. Could you extend this to Swimmer as well? Since you did Muh, I'd like the consistancy of you doing Swimmer.

Yeah, I guess. I'll do it when I get back from my stupid fucking exam.

[Xylthixlm]

Vote Count

muh316 -

1

(xRECKONERx)
Vaya -

1

(RayFrost)
Raivann -

1

(Tarhalindur)

Not voting: Socrates, Wickedestjr, muh316, Empking, Pads, Slicey, Vaya, Riceballtail, Raivann, Merkabah, Annachie, Kise, zoraster

With 16 alive it will take 9 to lynch.

[Empking]

Vote: Raivenn

Scummiest of the bunch.

[xRECKONERx]

Holy shit, Empking is in this game?

Let's policy lynch. -_-

@Empking: WHY is Raivenn the scummiest of the bunch? Examples, please.

I just kicked my Sociology exam's ass, so I'll get right on that swimmer pbpa.

[Annachie]

Holy shit, Empking is in this game?

Let's policy lynch. -_-

I wonder. Empking, why have you only made

6

posts total.

Here.

Unvote

Vote: Swimmer

I had a reason but I've forgotten it.

I think they either need to kill the noise, or become the D1 & D2 lynches.

Unvote, Vote: Kise

solely for the second half of that question. Two people who can't get along with each other is NOT a reason to lead two lynches. Makes me wonder if you're hoping someone will bite on the chance for a pair of early-game mislynches.

Isn't that pretty weak?

Wysp is still the scummiest player.

Glork: Did you say why you FOS's me? (In a later post you acted like everybony knew why but I can't find the actual reason.)

Dev: Vote worthy?

Vote: Raivenn

Scummiest of the bunch.

Are you a Jester of some kind?

Seriously Empking. You throw around votes with no reason given. Lurk like the king of lurkers. Ok, exageration. You lurked a lot. I don't think there's any actual content in anything you've posted. and considering how both you and Raivann have both been hung up on Muh/Swimmer for so long, to vote Raivenn now looks like a crappy bus.

Or have I totally mis-understood something.

[Raivann]

If theres one, theres no reason why there isn't another one... maybe its just the way the game is set up (we have trackers instead of cops or something).

And it's also guessable that we have a mafia and either a serial killer or a cult, judging by the theme behind the kills.

Given these posts and the way you acted last night, Devestation, I think I'm going to claim this part of my role now.

Devestation is my unconfirmed mason partner. That's not the only aspect of my role, but it's the one that's most important right now.

Important word here is UNCONFIRMED - I don't trust him one bit right now. (He was a) not talking much and b) talking about using a shared aspect of our role in a manner I consider very antitown in what is likely a multiscum setup - both behaviors I would associate with a scum mason.)

What was scummy about Devs posts you quoted?
In first Devestation quote I think that it makes sense.
I could see 2 town trackers and 2 town Jail guards only if there is no cops.
Or it could also be that
Town tracker= Sensfan / Scum tracker= RF
Town Jail Guard= Devestation / Scum Jail Guard = Tar
Are Jail Guards normally of same alignment?
You out and setup your fellow Jail Guardsman for not talking then you bring up the multiscum setup as a reason.

Unless we can prove that there is a second Mafia, given that at least TWO Jupiter Mafiosos were on the early swimmer wagon I have trouble believing that muh is actually scum in spite how damn scummy his play is. (And by "damn scummy" I mean "if I had a dayvig you'd be a cooling corpse on the ground.)

Not so worried about multiscum setup here.

[Socrates]

I need to catch up, I have fallen behind too much.

Just right now, I still like Vaya as scum. Post more tomorrow.

[RayFrost]

My thoughts on who needs to die:

vaya

empking

pads

muh (assuming the others aren't viable)

my keyboard for an annoying "a" key that repeatedly gets stuck.

Willing to say why if asked.

Socrates:

If you think vaya is scum, why are you not voting for 'im?

[Annachie]

Ok RayFrost. Why?

[RayFrost]

see earlier posts on vaya

empking is somebody I hate playing with, and he's lurking even more than usual (which is nearly impossible)

pads has all but vanished from posting despite his high activity earlier

Mod: prod pads

[Pads]

I'm typing.

[RayFrost]

Why, how nice of the magnificent pads to grace us with is presence after his multi-day absence.

[Annachie]

Within 6 minutes too.

[Pads]

Vaya has only made three posts. None of them have been that helpful. However, having said that, I don't think Vaya would have come out of nowhere to jump on the most popular bandwagon if she was scum.

Isn't that exactly what a scum would do?

Sometimes maybe.

Then it certainly begs the question why you think Vaya is not scum for doing something that a scum sometimes maybe does. I'll tell you what I think, though. I think this comment looks unnatural.



This

I'll unvote in light of the claim.

and about ten posts later, this

Plus, it makes you obv scum for claiming early - nervous scum

just in case my vote isn't on monkeyman...

unvote, vote: monkeyman

...does not read like a town tracker reacting to someone (MonkeyMan) claim his (RayFrost's) role. If it made MonkeyMan obvscum to RayFrost for claiming early, then certainly it would have made him obvscum for claiming early with the same role that RayFrost had. So why the unvote? Because RayFrost is not the town tracker.

Stating that he did not have a result on someone from Night 2 before he was told that he was roleblocked is a solid point in the column of RayFrost being a tracker, but there's something else to consider. While a town tracker might have countered MonkeyMan on Day 2, a scum tracker definitely would have. Given that and the above quotes I'm leaning towards the latter.

I'm going to assume that Tar is town, as a scum mason outting and asking for the lynch of his partner to gain sole control of the PR is rather too obvious for me to consider a scum tell. Tar strikes me as far more likely to milk the relationship for all its worth before settling into the power role. Although I fail to see his case on Raivann. I keep reading the quoted post in Post 891 and waiting for the 'BAM!' moment to hit me, and it never hits me.

Pads is Jupiter Mafia BTW.

Hurray, that was easy!


Reckoner looks much better after the Cyberbob town flip, but his muh case fails to incite me to reconsider swimmer4lyfe. There were a couple issues.

7: Says not posting content is NOT a scumtell. Also says he thinks Merk vs Exalt was a bus.

He did say that, but that was clearly not his conclusion.

And I think that maybe Merk vs Exalt was done on purpose because people would not suspect Merk. but it does seem like Exalt's nerves popped out on page 12 so I think I should eliminate that.

Granted, it's like some naively tender proto-thought, but it's there. Analysis. He thinks that the Merk/Exalt exchange was not a bus due to Exalt's emotional response.

His most recent post:

Whoa! I missed you guys let day 2 go on without most of the players. And great job on the kill yesterday. But how many mafia members could there be. We already have two down. Could there be three member in the Jupiter mafia.

To which Reckoner analyzed:

10: Newbscum post I quoted at the top of this. NO CONTENT.

A reasonble judgement on the surface. But is the super-demure, heart on his sleeve tone of that post any different from any of the other posts muh has made in this game? Are we not talking about someone with a Naruto/Dragonball Z avatar and a big brother that's young enough to pester him when he's on the computer? We're clearly not dealing with a 40 year old guy here, nor are we dealing with a 21 year old college student. 10, 12 years old maybe? There's no reason to expect more than what we're getting.

I might go in on a policy lynch later on if he continues to post like this, but an obvscum he is not. And we can do better today.

Why, how nice of the magnificent pads to grace us with is presence after his multi-day absence.

Pssst, this kind of attack will seem more genuine if you choose an inactive player who has not been suspected by others previous in the day. If you truly wanted to attack the inactive, you'd attack Slicey, but you didn't, you attacked me. So perhaps you could expand a little on your attack for me. As is, it, and your suspicions of Vaya and Empking just look like you're trying to fit in.

Speaking of which, I don't know what the issue with Empking is all about. I don't find his contentless votes scummy at all. I'm far more suspicious of people who are highly concerned with what other people think of their votes, and ostentatiously make sure they have a pre-existing suspicion and a stated reason before they join a wagon.

Can't see straight anymore. I"ve got some more Day1/Day2 thoughts to post and a vote coming up, but they get to wait until after I've slept.

[Wickedestjr]

Wicked, if you had actually paid attention to the fact that Glork's kill flavor has not shown up either night, then perhaps you are trying to downplay the likelihood of your scumfaction showing up and being hunted?

I also expect a report from Ray.

Oh I didn't see this:

Wicked, what do you mean "temporarily replaced"? By whom? What scumfaction are you a part of?

I am going to be leaving for two weeks starting on the 18th, and I will be replaced by a player named Percy. I'm not scum.


Even though I don't like the muh scrutiny, the lynch would be slightly telling based on swimmer's posts.



Tar, I don't understand your second reason for voting Raivaan. Can you explain it again? I do like the first reason though.

Shit... okay first of all, not bandwagoning. I didn't know Tar posted/voted also.

If you are town then what does it matter?

While I'm here, may as well mention 1: my suspicion of Wicked is lifted. 2: Pads is Jupiter Mafia BTW.

1: Why? Care to respond to my post directed at you?

2: Why?



So, whatsup Pads? Did you forget your case on me or what?

Then it certainly begs the question why you think Vaya is not scum for doing something that a scum sometimes maybe does. I'll tell you what I think, though. I think this comment looks unnatural.

It is something that scum may do, but I don't think Vaya is the kind of player that would do it as scum. I also have a gut read that Vaya is town, and the many of the reasons being used against her could apply to others.

I'm going to assume that Tar is town, as a scum mason outting and asking for the lynch of his partner to gain sole control of the PR is rather too obvious for me to consider a scum tell.

Why wouldn't this be a scumtell? I don't understand.


I've decided I'm not going to cast a vote until I return, because I am just going to get replaced, and my replacement may have different ideas, but my main suspect is probably Tar still. Mostly because of the reasons before, but I also don't understand his reason for choosing RayFrost to use his ability on last night. What's the point of keeping him alive if it means he can't use his ability any way? That doesn't make much sense to me. Also, odds are if there really are two investigative roles (which Tar obviously believes) then there could be another protective role to protect RayFrost.

I also still suspect Kise from the reasons before and the post where he made a big deal about his vote following Tar's.

[xRECKONERx]

@Pads: Look at the game RF posted a link to. Muh's play in that game is diametrically opposed to his playstyle here (as in, he did actual scumhunting in that game).

[Annachie]

Annapacquin fos'd the monkey when he was obvscum, asking that he full claims. Pfft!

Do you mean me?

[Merkabah]

I was intending to give SnowBunny a proper looking at though I couldn't have said scummy or not due to mostly skimming the early parts of day 1, but the name was on my 'watch' list.

Why was she on your "watch list"?

If not for the fact that the Jupiter Mafia jumped on your predecessor's wagon D1 and "brutally murdered" sounds like an SK kill method, I'd be happy to lynch you for this post alone - it's so newbscum it hurts.

I mean, seriously... talking about how well or poorly something went for town then going straight into setup speculation without scumhunting at ALL? It's hard to get scummier than that.

Why bring it up if you don't think he's scum?

Anybody notice a running trend throughout this PBPA?

I notice you attacking a player who two dead scums tried to lynch yesterday.

We shoulda lynched Muh D1.
I wouldn't say a Muh lynch would provide no info either

So, you think we should have lynched a player that two dead scums were trying to lynch on crappy reasons as opposed to Cyberbob, who had in thread connections to a confirmed scum?

Shit... okay first of all, not bandwagoning. I didn't know Tar posted/voted also.

Why are you concerned about appearing to be bandwagoning this early in a large game?

Pads is Jupiter Mafia BTW.

Explain.

The fluff tells us, ok strongly implies, that there is an SK (I finally read it properly).

Do people think that the night 0 killer and the killer of Devestation & Snow_Bunny is the same person?

Better question: how does this find scum?

No - in my opinion, the N0 killer (who we're hunting) hasn't night-killed yet. I don't think a careful mod like Seraph would put that in there by mistake.

So, potentially, we're looking at two scumteams, and a SK who hasn't killed yet? Otherwise, I don't know what to make of the N0 kill flavor.

How does this find scum?

VPB, how do your thoughts or feelings about Devestation posts change with his role being revealed?

No. Why should it?

Annachie's post 906 is useless and a continuation of how he is jumping on everyone else's thoughts without anything original coming from him.

Within 6 minutes too.

And again. Lynch please.

I'll unvote in light of the claim.

and about ten posts later, this

Plus, it makes you obv scum for claiming early - nervous scum

just in case my vote isn't on monkeyman...

unvote, vote: monkeyman

...does not read like a town tracker reacting to someone (MonkeyMan) claim his (RayFrost's) role. If it made MonkeyMan obvscum to RayFrost for claiming early, then certainly it would have made him obvscum for claiming early with the same role that RayFrost had. So why the unvote? Because RayFrost is not the town tracker.

Now, this is scumhunting. Pads is prob town.

While a town tracker might have countered MonkeyMan on Day 2, a scum tracker definitely would have. Given that and the above quotes I'm leaning towards the latter.

But he didn't counter him...which I think a scum tracker would be less likely to do actually. He might have thought that MM WAS the town tracker and didn't want to counter because a mislynch at that time would have been certain death.

I am going to be leaving for two weeks starting on the 18th, and I will be replaced by a player named Percy.

Sweet! Pre-emptive hi to Percy! (though I'm pretty sure he's on V/LA until the 20th).

I also don't understand his reason for choosing RayFrost to use his ability on last night. What's the point of keeping him alive if it means he can't use his ability any way?

preventing a nightkill is probably a better result than a track that likely won't turn up anything.

---

Caught up. Our hydra is currently thinking along the lines of an Annachie or Reckoner vote I'm pretty sure. Amished is around, but has a lot of RL stuff going on atm, so I'm just going to go ahead and

Vote:Annachie

for us.

[Annachie]

VPB.

How about you check your facts.

Also, you say that you are damn certain that Dev is scum, he turns out to be town but you are still damn certain he's scum. Do you care to explain this?

How can trying to work out if we are looking for one or two scum groups help find scum? Please explain.

How can looking at a lurker who got brought to my attention be not helpful? (Yes, Vaya is next for that treatment from me)

What is wrong with commenting on Pads extreemly fortuitious timing? (Which lead me to iso him for a good town read if your interested.)

Will continue

[Merkabah]

How about you check your facts.

*checks*

Yep, you're scum.

you say that you are damn certain that Dev is scum, he turns out to be town but you are still damn certain he's scum. Do you care to explain this?

Where did I say I'm "damn certain he's scum" after he's flipped? I said I stood by what I said yesterday, which is that he was acting scummy.

Clearly I was correct or he wouldn't have drawn a NK. He certainly didn't get killed because he was playing the game well.

How can trying to work out if we are looking for one or two scum groups help find scum? Please explain.

I don't know, I'm not the one that is doing it. That is why I asked you.

How can looking at a lurker who got brought to my attention be not helpful? (Yes, Vaya is next for that treatment from me)

My point is that you aren't trying to find scum, but rather pushing other peoples' suspects, which is a pretty typical move for scum trying to get a mislynch.

What is wrong with commenting on Pads extreemly fortuitious timing? (Which lead me to iso him for a good town read if your interested.)

What is wrong with calling out your "extremely fortuitous timing" of attack? Also, it's pretty convenient that you got a town read from this supposed iso after I called you out for a bullshit attack. What exactly from this iso makes you think he's town?

Feel free to answer my questions posed in the previous post. They weren't rhetorical.

-VPB

[Kise]

Lol @ saying Pads is town off of 1 post.

MMan and Exalt are pretty clearly scum together.

Then again... maybe you're right.

Rai, thanks for pointing that out.

Wicked, bring up that post you need me to answer. Please? Pretty please?

Anna, yes you. You pointed the finger at Monkey and said you'd wait for a full claim before doing anything else. The fullclaim never came, only more votes on monkey. You tacked on a vote -- I'm guessing just to later say you lynched scum -- and you didn't even leave any meaty comment to explain why you voted without getting the full claim you asked for.

Pads is Jupiter Mafia for the casual convos/tips he gave to MM D1 (probably later), as well as attempting to tackle Wicked's attacks when he went at it with Exalt. To me it says Wick likely isn't Jupiter, so maybe I shouldn't drop it all together.

Believing there to be a serial killer > another scum group is silly. MM and Exalt are labeled Jupiter for a reason.

[Annachie]

Anna, yes you. You pointed the finger at Monkey and said you'd wait for a full claim before doing anything else. The fullclaim never came, only more votes on monkey. You tacked on a vote -- I'm guessing just to later say you lynched scum -- and you didn't even leave any meaty comment to explain why you voted without getting the full claim you asked for.

Wow, mis-representation much.

Post 798
Oh look, my vote plus the reason.

Post #802 where I comment that I don't think we've had a full claim yet. BTW, we hadn't as it turned out.

Post #824 and Post#828. Unvote, reason for it, and the request for the full claim.

Post#836 and Post#840 Merkabah and I both realising that we'd made mistakes on the vote count leading to Post#841 me placing the vote back on.

Leading to Post#869

So Kise, I ask again

Que?

You FOS me for being cautious about the speed of the MM bandwagon, and then express caution about it yourself?

Would you care to explain why you FOS'd me?


btw, Merkabah you make mention of Cyberbob being linked to two scum by both being on the swimmer vote which is fair enough. But did you consider that those two scum only voted swimmer because Tar and Empking did, and as a desperate attempt to get attention off of MM (Who had attracted votes at the time) and that Tar and Emp might have more influenced CB than MM and Exalt did?

Where did you say you were damn certain that Dev was scum. I would hope that offering to eat his hat if he wasn't scum counts as damn certain, and strangely that would be a "thought or feeling" that hasn't changed because you said yourself that your thoughts and feelings hadn't changed.

Clearly [[Dev was acting scummy]] or he wouldn't have drawn a NK.

How many town vigilante's do you think there are if he was killed for acting scummy?
For that matter, how do you know he

was

actually killed for acting scummy? The only people who would actually know is/are the one/ones who killed him.

Merk, Kise. Why when I start expressing interest in Muh do I get an attack from you both?
Merk, Kise, why when Reckoner starts investigating Muh do you attack him?

I'm starting to think that the two of you are trying to distract me from inestigating Muh, and if so there can't be many reasons for that can there?
So, are you trying to distract me?


Oh, yes. Snow_Bunny. In my original read/skim Snow-Bunny's name stuck in my head, probably from being referenced by other people, which is why I had her on my watch list. But with death during N1 I never got around to it to lock down what actually attracted my attention.

Kise.

Lol @ saying Pads is town off of 1 post.

Do you mean me again? If so Misrepresentation much again.

Which lead me to iso him for a good town read if you're interested.

If you do mean me, how can you read the second part of a sentence and not the first? Or do you assume that reading someone in isolation means reading only one post? (But I will go back and specifically heck the interactions with MM again. Would you care to link me to a specific post or two to make it easier?)

Oh, and btw Kise. What does "Negro please" mean? Yet something else I've asked that you never answered.

[Merkabah]

But did you consider that those two scum only voted swimmer because Tar and Empking did, and as a desperate attempt to get attention off of MM (Who had attracted votes at the time) and that Tar and Emp might have more influenced CB than MM and Exalt did?

So, you are suggesting that the scum were trying to bus swimmer to save Monkeyman? I don't understand what you are getting at here that makes swimmer more likely to be scum than town.

Where did you say you were damn certain that Dev was scum. I would hope that offering to eat his hat if he wasn't scum counts as damn certain, and strangely that would be a "thought or feeling" that hasn't changed because you said yourself that your thoughts and feelings hadn't changed.

Yes, my feelings that he acted scummy did not change just because he flipped town. What are you not understanding? You trying to argue that I think he's scum after he's flipped town is beyond nonsensical.

How many town vigilante's do you think there are if he was killed for acting scummy?

Who said a vig killed him? The vig is dead in case you haven't noticed. You do realize that if we have multiple scum factions (which is likely) that they are trying to kill each other, right? There can be only one winner.

For that matter, how do you know he was actually killed for acting scummy? The only people who would actually know is/are the one/ones who killed him.

OMG, you are so good at scum hunting. You caught me. I killed Devestation. His hats just looked too delicious to pass up.

Merk, Kise. Why when I start expressing interest in Muh do I get an attack from you both?

Hint: They aren't related.

Merk, Kise, why when Reckoner starts investigating Muh do you attack him?

Cause it's a shitty attack on an easy target, leading me to believe that Reck is scum. Also, we still have a town read on muh/swimmer.

Still waiting for you to answer the rest of my questions Annachie.