Mafia 108 - Mafia With The Quickness - over!

[Haylen]

in reference to bogre.

[Haylen]

I mean Elli

[Incognito]

Vote Count #2 of Day 3

*Haylen (2) <-~ Bogre, Maemuki
Bogre (2) <-~ Yosarian2, Haylen
SaintKerrigan (2) <-~ Glork, Zachrulez

Not voting (2) <-~ SaintKerrigan, Ellibereth

With 8 alive, 5 votes will do it.

Note:

an asterisk by a player's name indicates said player would be lynched if Day were to end right this moment without a lynch majority.

Monday, January 18th at 5 P.M. EST

[Ellibereth]

Glork is town.
Haylen is most likely town.
Mae is most likely town.
Yos is town unless Zach is scum.
If there was a busser on Neto wagon it's most likely Zach.
At least one of {Yos, Kerri, Bogre} is scum.

Possible configurations:
Neto, Kerri, Bogre
Neto, Kerri, Zach
Neto, Bogre, Zach
Neto, Zach, Yos

[Ellibereth]

The first one is the most likely.

Vote: Kerri

[Glork]

I think SaintKerrigan is scum.

He spent a lot of time saying that Neto's bandwagon was unjustified, and a day 1 all over the place with wishy washy voting, most of which where he couldn't decide whether he wanted to vote for me, Haylen, or Netlava.

Day two consisted of him turning against Neto to an extent, saying that the pr flips made his claim less likely to be true, while conveniently never actually putting his vote on Netopolis and exploring other suspects. Maybe he didn't expect Netopolis to be lynched that quickly?

Also this

I don't like Zach's subtle attack on arguably the most pro-town player in this game (Maemuki). At least the most pro-town player on the Netlava wagon (well, besides me, but I have to say that ).

is standing out like a sore thumb to me, especially considering SK's current position on Mae. (What changed your read on her btw?)

Oh and of course rolefishing...

Vote: Saintkerrigan

A+++++++ would buy again





Elli's conclusions are basically exactly what mine have been since yesterday. We both thought Gayle was suspect, but Neto/SK is very likely, with Neto/Zach/Yos being a somewhat reasonable possibility. Bogre is an excellent third option for scums.


Please lynch Kerri posthaste.

[Bogre]

The first one is the most likely.

Vote: Kerri

Yet you listed Zach in 3/4 combinations, and Kerri only in 2/4.

[Ellibereth]

The first one is the most likely.

Vote: Kerri

Yet you listed Zach in 3/4 combinations, and Kerri only in 2/4.

Possibilities are not equally likely.

[Glork]

Your defense of StK is noted, though.

[Bogre]

Unvote, VOTE: STkerrigan.

In looking at his voting analysis, he did three things:

1.Stayed off the Neto wagon
2. Joined the Zach wagon when it looked to gain speed
3. Willingly joined the Netlava wagon afterwards.

The wavering stance on Haylen the entire game is also an issue, especially today's.

[Haylen]

I would like to avoid a quicklynch without a claim.

SK, please claim when you return from Cheese.

[Yosarian2]

So, Bogre, do you have any response to my attacks on you?

[Bogre]

So, Bogre, do you have any response to my attacks on you?

I believe the 'I was wrong about Neto' covers it. I had gotten town reads from Neto's frustrations with Ellibereth, and secondly I thought that the counterlynch of Netlava was driven by an effort to save Zach, not Neto.

I was the original one to push the Zach wagon, when Neto wasn't under consideration, I wasn't pushing the counterwagon.

[Glork]

I do believe that's Lynch -1, folks.


StKer, I look forward to your falseclaim.

[SaintKerrigan]

I'm a vanilla townie. My brain's shot right now, so a proper defense will have to wait until tomorrow.

[Glork]

Boring, but expected.




=========[]

[SaintKerrigan]

I can't wait to see the reaction on you guys' faces if you hammer me. Just because I defended a scum doesn't make me scum. Let this be today's lesson, children. Now, who wants milk and

cookies

donuts?

[Glork]

It's not so much as "I defended scum" as:
"I asked the known scum a few token questions which served to distance, then when push came to shove tried to force any lynch other than his.

The combination of posts 522, 543, and 545 is also hella scummy, especially within the context of vote counts. You were on Zach, decided he was "more townie," then decided that "as much as you liked" him, he was more likely to be scum, then TWO POSTS LATER posted an lolcats that he was definitively scum. This is wishy-washy suspicions to the Nth degree.

As soon as Netlava was ahead of Neto, you went into "let's flood the thread with spam" mode, as if you were trying to keep people occupied, rather than letting them think "holy shit, somebody just orchestrated a speedwagon on a guy who isn't here to claim OR defend himself."

To start off D2, you acted as though your D1 suspicions of Zach NEVER EXISTED. You immediately voted Gayle, then went after Bogre. If you thought Zach was the second most reasonable lynch option from D1, why would that suddenly change overnight? I think you realized that Zach wasn't going to be a viable lynch candidate again, so you had to find the newest convenient person to go after. After my "can't wait to lynch the people who railed Lava to death" post, you probably even knew that you had to look at people who were on the Lavawagon. Why? Because there was definitely some degree of truth in my observation.

Post 689 also indicates that you were basically spewing inconsistent crap as it popped into your head. I managed to get you to admit that there was at least one scum on the Lavawagon. Neto was the token third person on your list, which is the best place for scums to put their buddies. Just enough to distance, yet not enough that you ever have to look at them.
**I will also ONCE AGAIN note that here, you just completely abandoned your "Zach is more suspicious than Neto" stance from earlier. Another flip-flop with no explanation or consistency. That is, another indication that you're throwing out suspicions as you go along.

There is also, of course, the Post 699/Post 716 combo, in which you accuse Zach of "subtlely" blatantly stating that he believes Neto to be scum. While not true chainsaw (since Zach has not been proven protown), you're clearly trying to undermine someone's stance against now-known Scum. Super duper minus points.

And here we are, today. Your behavior today is puzzling -- your most protown behavior of the day, I will admit. In a town which has obviously shown itself to be prone to speedlynching, you chose to back off of Haylen, after actually going back and reading some content.

So, a few things I'd like to know:
1) Why, on D2, did you suddenly abandon going after Zach?
2) With the current knowledge that Neto was scum, combined with the last-minute wagon on Lava from D1, who do you think saved Neto's ass from being lynched that first day? For your convenience, the relevant vote counts are here, and here (and they show you the order in which people moved to Netlava).
3) Did you have any reason to believe on D1 that Neto was protown, aside from (and I quote you directly) "the arguments against him have been crap"?
4) Who on your wagon do you think is scum, and why? (This answer may be related to your answer to question 2, or it may be for completely different reasons.)

Unvote

to prevent a hammer before you get a chance to answer these for me.

[Glork]

By the way, I want to hear much more from Yos today. Gayle looks like a vigging, but it's pretty easy for a Serial Killer to pose as a vig, and Yos would be my top SK suspect right now.

Neah. A SK posing as a vig, and killing people who are likely to be lynched, is a bad strategy, especially in a fast mafia game. If there was a SK, then especially after a mafia gets lynched, the right move would be to start killing people everyone thinks are confirmed town. I doubt there is a SK.

Do you think that every player in this game is experienced and meticulous enough to make "the right move" here? Just because you know it's a bad play doesn't mean that everybody does.

Anyway, what do you want to hear from me? I've been very active and aggressive in this game since I replaced in, I think.

It might just be that other people are drowning this thread with posts. But from my perspective:
A) You tried to throw me to the wolves at the very end of D1, heading into night. I already touched on this, but it shows that you had a very strong desire to not-be-killed. I think you were genuinely worried that if you were right, the scums would try to take you down, and that reads "SK" to me.
B) D2 didn't really last long, so my attitude from D1 still holds.
C) I didn't like Annachie very much. He read scum to me (though I'd honestly have to go back and remind myself why).

[Glork]

In completely unrelated news, I want Bogre to claim as well. And I won't hesitate to vote him to Lynch-1 to get that claim.

[Yosarian2]

By the way, I want to hear much more from Yos today. Gayle looks like a vigging, but it's pretty easy for a Serial Killer to pose as a vig, and Yos would be my top SK suspect right now.

Neah. A SK posing as a vig, and killing people who are likely to be lynched, is a bad strategy, especially in a fast mafia game. If there was a SK, then especially after a mafia gets lynched, the right move would be to start killing people everyone thinks are confirmed town. I doubt there is a SK.

Do you think that every player in this game is experienced and meticulous enough to make "the right move" here? Just because you know it's a bad play doesn't mean that everybody does.

Eh, that's possible.

ALso, though, there is that missing kill from night 1. Considering our roleblocker was already dead at the time, it dosn't seem all that likely that a kill was blocked that night.

Anyway, what do you want to hear from me? I've been very active and aggressive in this game since I replaced in, I think.

It might just be that other people are drowning this thread with posts. But from my perspective:
A) You tried to throw me to the wolves at the very end of D1, heading into night. [/quote[

Eh, I really didn't think of it that way. I wasn't really worried that it was that likely you'd get nightkilled after attacking me at the end of the day like that; I figured scum would probably not be interested in killing you while you were "pointed" at me, unless they were going to kill me.

I already touched on this, but it shows that you had a very strong desire to not-be-killed. I think you were genuinely worried that if you were right, the scums would try to take you down, and that reads "SK" to me.

(shrug) I thought I was likely to be right, thought I was likely to get killed, and so wanted to share all my thoughts before I died. Again, I didn't really think the scum would kill you just because I said "Glork is town".

C) I didn't like Annachie very much. He read scum to me (though I'd honestly have to go back and remind myself why).

He seems like a pretty typical "cautious noob who got caught up in a fast game and dosn't really know how to deal with it" to me. Pretty much what happened to Malyss in that lynch all lurkers game I ran, if you read that one.

[Maemuki]

Kerri, what posts made you think that Hayl is pro-town? What's your opinion on Bogre?

I think that with that vote, Bogre was bussing, so the scumteam is either SK/Hayl or SK/Bogre. Either one, really. Since Hayl has done nothing since D1, my vote remains on her. And I want SK to answer my questions.

[Glork]

I've entertained the idea that Ellibereth went over the top bussing Neto. I don't find it super duper likely right now, but it's on my radar. I'd definitely be cautious about assuming him to be protown.

[SaintKerrigan]

1) Why, on D2, did you suddenly abandon going after Zach?

Basically, I found Bogre more suspicious at the time than Zach. It was partially me forgetting about him (Zach), though. And then Neto got hammered before I could come back and fully analyze everybody.

2) With the current knowledge that Neto was scum, combined with the last-minute wagon on Lava from D1, who do you think saved Neto's ass from being lynched that first day? For your convenience, the relevant vote counts are here, and here (and they show you the order in which people moved to Netlava).

Well, Haylen looks the most suspect (Maemuki could be scum, but she stayed on the Netlava wagon from the beginning so she doesn't count) because of her statement earlier that she would rather have a Neto lynch. My

current

(susceptible to change!) read on Haylen is town, though.

3) Did you have any reason to believe on D1 that Neto was protown, aside from (and I quote you directly) "the arguments against him have been crap"?

I thought the way he responded to the crap arguments made against him were sensible and not scummy. Again, I was obviously wrong. And with Gayle (the other person who had stated that Neto was likely town) dead, guess who's taking the fall...just a thought.

4) Who on your wagon do you think is scum, and why? (This answer may be related to your answer to question 2, or it may be for completely different reasons.)

Without having reread anyone...Bogre. I forgot about Bogre at the start of today in my sudden change of heart about Maemuki, but my suspicion of him from Day 2 still lingers.

Kerri, what posts made you think that Hayl is pro-town? What's your opinion on Bogre?

Hayl is protown right now because of her stance on Neto at the beginning of Day 1. My opinion on Bogre is possible scum, but I have to go back and reread him to make sure. Probably won't have time for that for awhile.

I'm curious to know what it is about asking why Haylen doesn't want to claim that is considered rolefishing...

[Glork]

I'm curious to know what it is about asking why Haylen doesn't want to claim that is considered rolefishing...

To give a proper answer, she'd essentially have to give away important information anyway.