Newbie 893 - Newbieland! (GAME OVER)

[Pomegranate]

On the other hand, VI = vapor, which is my current belief.

He' be a lynch I'd be fine with, but I'd prefer a lynch elsewhere, savvy?

He doesn't seen to fit my view of a village idiot.

I'd prefer a lynch on Vapor.

[Riza]

Fencesitting is scummy in that scum wish to keep their options open and not devote to a side until they know which side will "win" so to speak.

Backtracking is scummy as scum are less confident in their reads, which causes them to more easily change their viewpoints.

Okay, duly noted. I'll try to avoid doing such things in the future.

Vapor could be the village idiot but on the other hand, he could simply be newbie scum who doesn't know how to seem less scummy? XD

[Riza]

Whoops. Clicked on Submit instead of Preview. ><
Anyway, I think he really is scummy. My votes stays.
Also, VI is considered a mafia role, yes?

[RayFrost]

Vi is village idiot.

It's a term for townies that fail at doing anything useful.

[xRECKONERx]

D1 Vote Count #7

Pomegranate (1): Honest Abel
Riza (2): RayFrost, Vaporeonage
Vaporeonage (3): Pomegranate, JarcLovesCinn, Riza
RayFrost (1): Nikanor

Not Voting (2): chauchaudotcom, ThetaSigma

Deadline: January 29, 2010 at 2:00PM EST

[RayFrost]

VI is Village Idiot.

It's a term for townies that fail at doing anything useful.

Fixed.

Vi is a player that is certainly

not

a VI.

[Honest Abel]

If you voted for Vaporeonage, can you give me a

concise

explanation of your vote?

Anyone who didn't vote for him, can you give me your concise view on why others have voted for him and why you think they are wrong?

I know I could go back and read, but I often feel like my interpretations get muddled by the distance between posts and all the reasoning that goes on between them, and I hope this can generate some discussion about our L-2, here.

[Riza]

The explanation below will be a sum up of other posts I've made about Vapor.

Like I said, Vapor keeps on voting/unvoting for people with little to no reasoning. It's suspicious. When he first voted for Pom, he said it was because Frost was of more assistance. Both he and Frost posted little between his vote for Pom and Frost. Therefore, I don't understand how Vapor thinks Frost was of more assistance. Wow, that sounds pretty muddled to me. Sorry. e_e Anyway, that's pretty much what lead me to vote for him.
But what makes me keep my vote is because he unvotes a post later, maybe because he caught quite a bit of negative attention? And then votes for me, for a bad reason, which can be directed toward him as well.
He doesn't even defend himself, even when he's in L-2.

[chauchaudotcom]

Vapo - Can you explain your vote and reason for unvote on Pom? I'd like to know your defense on the accusation against you.

Abel - The case against Vapo is sketchy. I certainly don't like his activity yet at the same time I don't feel I can attribute it to scumminess. But I want to read Vapo's defense before I decide.

I still think it's Pom.

Vote: Pom

[RayFrost]

If you voted for Vaporeonage, can you give me a

concise

explanation of your vote?

Anyone who didn't vote for him, can you give me your concise view on why others have voted for him and why you think they are wrong?

I know I could go back and read, but I often feel like my interpretations get muddled by the distance between posts and all the reasoning that goes on between them, and I hope this can generate some discussion about our L-2, here.

Why don't you answer your own question?

Chauchau: reasoning with votes is tech.

[Pomegranate]

If you voted for Vaporeonage, can you give me a

concise

explanation of your vote?

Anyone who didn't vote for him, can you give me your concise view on why others have voted for him and why you think they are wrong?

I know I could go back and read, but I often feel like my interpretations get muddled by the distance between posts and all the reasoning that goes on between them, and I hope this can generate some discussion about our L-2, here.

So far this game, Vapor has made eight posts. A look at each one:

Post 1: Confirm and Random Vote.

Post 2: A confusing vote on RF-

Anyone says anything about him they're immediately scum, I think Ray is a little scummy

Post 3: Why bandwagons are good.

Post 4: A small defense from RF, about how his vote made very little sense, and had no reasoning attached.

Appearances can be deceived, Frost. Remember that.

Post 5: A sarcastic post.

Post 6: One sentence about RF and me, and a vote on me, which places me at L-1. I would think a post putting me at L-1, with a possibility oon being hammered at any time, would have more than one vague sentence of explanation. One sentence about lurkers (Ouch, hypocrisy!). A question to Hetemens that (not Vap's fault) is never answered.

Post 7: No explanation for his vote on me, which a few people asked for. But he must have seen it, because he unvoted, and said that he was unsure of where to look next.

Post 8: Vapor ignores the increasing number of people who want an explantion from him. All we get is a one liner, in which he votes for Riza, stating that she is lurking, or possibly has just been inactive (while Vapor has made fewer posts than the player he is accusing of lurking).

If there is any more explanation necessary for my vote, please ask. I find it pretty clear.

[chauchaudotcom]

Frost - My reason for voting Pom has been the same from the beginning. 90 percent of her posts are game semantics. The other ten percent shows little to no scumhunting. When questioned about it, her response seemed as if she was trying to pass it off as a joke. Then followed with a long post of, again, no scum hunting. So far the most I've seen her do is pursue Vapo which is perhaps the most obvious/easiest target at the moment. All that jazz and my gut says so. For the record the only reason I unvoted was because she was L1 at the time and I wanted to do a re-read. My suspicions of her hasn't changed much since then.

I'm interested in Jarc's view of the game so far though.

[RayFrost]

If you feel that way about Pom but not me, would you disagree with nikanor's assessment, or have you not looked into me enough to determine for yourself?

Who else do you think is scum?

[Riza]

Post 7: No explanation for his vote on me, which a few people asked for. But he must have seen it, because he unvoted, and said that he was unsure of where to look next.

He also mentioned he would read more and gather in this post.
Then, on 8th post, voted for me. Is it a coincidence he voted for me after Frost? I highly doubt that he read through the thread and came to the same conclusion as Frost, right after. :B

[chauchaudotcom]

If you feel that way about Pom but not me, would you disagree with nikanor's assessment, or have you not looked into me enough to determine for yourself?

You've done far more scum hunting then Pom has. You press people for reactions and actively try to pursue information. The difference being Pom emphasized on scum hunting points but did not pursue it, then claimed she would scum hunt and did not deliver. As for Nika's saying you're lurking. I will admit after your Theta pursuit your active scum hunting decreased a bit, then rose again. But I figured it was real life more then anything, given your warning before about school.

Who else do you think is scum?

Hets for lurking. But with Nika's replace I'm in the process of re-evaluating.

And upon re-reading, Riza.

It could have been to put Pom out of L-1, but with little to no reasoning,

it's a little shady.

This was her reasoning for voting Vapo and L-2ing him. First she defends what he could have been doing and then votes him saying had little to no reason. Then in the next post she goes on to produce yet another possible wifom defense for him but stands by her vote with a...

*shrug* Still

a bit

suspicious. XD

Which makes it seem like she wants her vote on him but doesn't want to take responsibility for it until Vapo posts again (stupidly) and makes himself an even easier target.

That and her emoticons make me weary. The last scum I played with used emoticons like no other as an attempt to casually play off attacks against them which is how I see hers being used right now, laughing off attacks on her.

Also, my stances may change based off Vapo's next post.

Oh and can you answer this Frost?

And is Theta still your top?

[RayFrost]

Theta is a town read for me, atm.

[ThetaSigma]

brief update post:

V/LA: small extension

-- complications have arisen. I'll try to make some sort of sensible post very soon.

As for nonsense, if anyone wants to query on this little list, it'd help me organize my addled thoughts.

Currently very suspicious of:
Pom
Vapor (though he really does seem just like a dumb easy target -- that'd be village idiot, right?)

I find Pom to be more suspicious just because Vapor seems to be totally clueless, and the fact that Pom is all over him like bread on butter makes me suspect that unless (my earlier query regarding) self-sacrifice is true, then only one is scum.

As Unsuspicious As Possible:
Honest Abel
RayFrost
Chauchaudotcom

[RayFrost]

If you voted for Vaporeonage, can you give me a

concise

explanation of your vote?

Anyone who didn't vote for him, can you give me your concise view on why others have voted for him and why you think they are wrong?

I know I could go back and read, but I often feel like my interpretations get muddled by the distance between posts and all the reasoning that goes on between them, and I hope this can generate some discussion about our L-2, here.

Why don't you answer your own question?

Waiting on this.

The thread needs more nikanor as well.

[Nikanor]

Nikanor is too good for this thread.
Just kidding.
So what do you want?
I suppose you want a content post.
Well, too bad.
Here's a haiku instead:
I am Nikanor
I like to play mafia.
I am so pro-town!

[chauchaudotcom]

You accuse Frost of lurking so it's only fair we use the argument against you as well, no?

Aside from Frost, who else irks you?

[Honest Abel]

Why don't you answer your own question?

Most of Vaporeon's posts slipped under my nose because of how short they were, so I never really paid much attention to them. Then I noticed he/she was L-2, so my first response was to ask everyone "Why?" because it was quicker than re-reading the whole day in light of Vaporeon's contributions. Then I went to NYC for a couple days, which I probably should have mentioned beforehand. I found some of the responses quite helpful (obviously not yours, since you completely avoided the question) and found some faults with others (sorry, Pom, I think I disagree on some of your points) and I will explain my thoughts on Vaporeon and the responses I got as soon as I go over his/her posts myself, which should happen before the end of the night.

[Honest Abel]

All right, looking at Vaporeon's posts, I can see why some people have chosen to vote for him/her. I, however, do not find his posts representative of scummy behavior; unhelpful, sure, but his confusion seldom struck me as scummy. I think there is much more sinister behavior afoot and focusing on an inexperienced player's tribulations as if they were scummy seems plenty sinister to me.

Pom, I don't believe his/her vote on RayFrost was confusing at all; he mentioned that RayFrost attacks anyone who suspects him. I can't personally agree with this since I don't think RayFrost has done this in every case and because he's certainly attacked more people than have suspected him. However, I think Vaporeon picked up on RayFrost's unconcentrated attacks and a bit of defensiveness and decided to cast a vote his way. I don't think that's scummy.

I also think, Pom, that you and others may be reading a little too much into Vaporeon's L-1 vote. I hadn't been keeping track of the votes up to that point and I wouldn't have realized you were at L-1 if not for chau's following post and the fuss that ensued. My guess is that Vaporeon didn't realize he/she would be placing you a vote away from lynch or that doing so would cause such a ruckus.

I did notice, though, how quick you were to OMGUS-vote Vaporeon back. Covered by a seemingly good amount of reason, sure, but please don't try to tell us that you would have voted for Vaporeon at that point anyway if he/she hadn't voted for you.

I also find your lengthy and detailed (and colored?) summary of your target's posts at my humble request another link in your suspicious chain of actions. Too often I find you trying to placate others as you have attempted to placate me here so completely: I asked for a concise statement of your personal feelings, and you gave me a comprehensive list of Vapor's posts. I just don't find the arguments founded enough to consider it an attempt to help the town; it seems you are merely trying to help me as you have tried to help so many others without hunting or saying too much to offend anyone who could possibly defend his or her actions.

Again, I leave my vote on you, Pom.

[RayFrost]

Why don't you answer your own question?

Most of Vaporeon's posts slipped under my nose because of how short they were, so I never really paid much attention to them. Then I noticed he/she was L-2, so my first response was to ask everyone "Why?" because it was quicker than re-reading the whole day in light of Vaporeon's contributions. Then I went to NYC for a couple days, which I probably should have mentioned beforehand. I found some of the responses quite helpful (obviously not yours, since you completely avoided the question) and found some faults with others (sorry, Pom, I think I disagree on some of your points) and I will explain my thoughts on Vaporeon and the responses I got as soon as I go over his/her posts myself, which should happen before the end of the night.

My reason for not voting is due to the fact every [pokemon]age I've played with has been fail in epic proportions.

They are a bunch of VIs, which makes it hard as fook to read them.

Thus, I've chalked vap to VI, not scum, ftm.

[Riza]

It could have been to put Pom out of L-1, but with little to no reasoning,

it's a little shady.

This was her reasoning for voting Vapo and L-2ing him. First she defends what he could have been doing and then votes him saying had little to no reason. Then in the next post she goes on to produce yet another possible wifom defense for him but stands by her vote with a...

*shrug* Still

a bit

suspicious. XD

Which makes it seem like she wants her vote on him but doesn't want to take responsibility for it until Vapo posts again (stupidly) and makes himself an even easier target.

That and her emoticons make me weary. The last scum I played with used emoticons like no other as an attempt to casually play off attacks against them which is how I see hers being used right now, laughing off attacks on her.

I really need to watch out how I type when playing mafia, huh? I never realized how it can affect other people's views on whether I'm scum or not. Alrighty then, noted.
Also, I use emoticons a lot in other forums and message boards. I've actually strained myself from using too many here, but I guess that's obviously not working. I will try not to use any more, sorry.

Question. Is VI a given role?

[chauchaudotcom]

Using emoticons normally is fine. Doesn't bother me. It's when you use laughing emoticons to play off attacks against you that makes me wonder.

I've actually strained myself from using too many here, but I guess that's obviously not working.

Why? Why did you feel the need to use more then normal? Trying to hide your scumminess behind your emoticons?! I see through you scum.