Big Brother Mafia - Town wins!

[Crazy]

Yikes.

Llama has negative ties to both Sly and Ani, from his perspective.

I need to check pablito's connections with dead scum, I think.

And what's with this new pablito-hewitt buddying crap?

[Kmd4390]

I need to check pablito's connections with dead scum, I think.

After you do this, tell me what you think of his interactions with Animorph.

[hewitt]

I target you because a confirmed scum's posts (AM) implicate you as his buddy, and the inconsistencies in your suspicion list support this pairing (and don't make sense otherwise).

Your strong desire to remove the Coup from play is consistent with Hewitt as scum. Paired with a claim that you don't think the Coup holder is scum, and there is no reason for town-Hewitt to try and remove the Coup (plenty of reason for scum-Hewitt).

I'm not giving Crazy or Pablito or KMD a hard time because their actions thus far don't implicate them as scum. Your argument amounts to "why do you attack Hewitt for being scummy, but don't attack others for being pro-town". That makes no sense at all.

I don't understand how you get ties between animorpherv and I...at all. Please competently state them, thanks. And don't worry, I never cleared you as being a floater, so don't misquote me saying that I "don't think the Coup holder is scum". Especially if whoever is evicted flips floater. Then you're almost sure-fire scum in my opinion.

[hewitt]

I target you because a confirmed scum's posts (AM) implicate you as his buddy, and the inconsistencies in your suspicion list support this pairing (and don't make sense otherwise).

Your strong desire to remove the Coup from play is consistent with Hewitt as scum. Paired with a claim that you don't think the Coup holder is scum, and there is no reason for town-Hewitt to try and remove the Coup (plenty of reason for scum-Hewitt).

I'm not giving Crazy or Pablito or KMD a hard time because their actions thus far don't implicate them as scum. Your argument amounts to "why do you attack Hewitt for being scummy, but don't attack others for being pro-town". That makes no sense at all.

I don't understand how you get ties between animorpherv and I...at all. Please competently state them, thanks. And don't worry, I never cleared you as being a floater, so don't misquote me saying that I "don't think the Coup holder is scum". Especially if whoever is evicted flips floater. Then you're almost sure-fire scum in my opinion.

And what's with this new pablito-hewitt buddying crap?

I'm sorry I don't think pablito or Kmd are scum?

[pablito]

Even though both those votes are to save me, I think it's incredibly rash to still vote that early.

I was in the middle of my iso llama when I checked back to see that I'm nominated with llama. I will continue with writing it. May take an extra hour or two while I make phone calls during business hours.

Anyway, both these early votes mean nothing because the veto or coup could feasibly be used. Even though Kast has said he wouldn't use it. But KMD, if the veto were used on either nominee - any idea who would go up?

[pablito]

I need to check pablito's connections with dead scum, I think.

After you do this, tell me what you think of his interactions with Animorph.

This is a very reasonable request. Kmd has pointed out this connection long before ani flipped. And I have responded to it before (but not recently).

[Kmd4390]

I'm not completely sure what I'd do if the veto was used.

There's two ways I could go with this:
1) Put up Snow and watch her be evicted.
2) Put up someone else who probably won't be evicted to try and get either you (Pablito) or Llama evicted.

I'm a little worried because no one but me seems to suspect Pablito.

[hewitt]

Can you maybe outline your case on pablito? Because I really just don't see it.

[Kmd4390]

Can you maybe outline your case on pablito? Because I really just don't see it.

Gut and a connection to a dead scum.

[LlamaFluff]

Well I know im out now, but I will leave you with my list

Kast is scum, im completely sure of that one
kmd is either chenbot or town, im around 50/50 on this, but if you get into an endgame with him and still missing chen, its him
SB is probably scum, although you should lynch Kast first
bv I dont know, if one of the above three are town it leaves him as a slight read, but dont lynch him for a few days

pablito I have to lean town, although not too strong

crazy and hewitt are town

I would reccomend

Tomorrow - Kast (if possible) if not, SB
Day seven - Whichever one of those is alive
Eight - If chen still has one member, then kmd, if not, bv
nine - bv if alive, otherwise kmd/pablito
ten - kmd/pablito

Im just going to force Kast to use his thing tomorrow, just incase it either triggers something and to prove a point that he needs to be lynched.

[pablito]

I skimmed Llama. There's nothing that really pulled me either in favour or against him. When he said he'd been aiming for ani's lynch for a while, I couldn't see in previous posts that there was strong frustration for it not happening. But I am quite tired and maybe didn't see it.

As for Kmd, I'm quite annoyed that he's going for "more difficult" as a qualifier during this stage. Last time I heard that logic, it was Sly putting up Kmd.

Even though they've already voted, I welcome questions from Kast and hewitt for me.

[LlamaFluff]

I guess I should explain what makes kmd a high pick for chen scum

First is what went down during the day one HoH election. Sly went after me for trying to nominate kmd, saying that me chosing him was something that was scummy. The only way that trying hard to get someone pushed could be viewed as a scumtell, is if they are scum. Sly-kmd scumteam would know that eachother was scum, which is an explaination for the attack.

A different thing that nags at me is the fact that Sly only suspects kmd if zwet/kast is scum. I know that trying to set up "oh my partner is scummy if XYZ" is something I try and work for, especially if XYZ is improbable/impossible, but appears to town to be of high likelyhood. Its quite a bit more blatant then I normally go with, but its there.

When it gets to noms, Sly puts up kmd who will never be evicted day one. He also again puts him up under similar premices to the zwet connection, but this time its through me. He now has "if zwet or llama is scum, kmd is scum"* then kmd is scum. He now is in a situation where he has up a partner who wont get lynched, and if either of them flip scum, earn major points for this interaction, even though there never was danger.

Day two, despite the arguements from kmd over Sly being anti-town, he doesnt vote Sly to be nomed, he doesnt vote sly. After the Snow vote, Sly almost appears to get upset at kmd for not voting him, which makes a lot of sense if they are both scum, since the early bussing that was done disappears on someone doing a VC-iso.

*side note, him not putting up Kast here is why I think kast is chen-scum. You dont have player X is scum because Y is, then put up X because Z is scum. Him not putting up zwet after PoV almost solidifies it.

~~~~

Dead serious though, Kast or kmd are chen. I would put a huge bet on this.

I know im going to be voted out here as soon as snow posts, but you guys need to get Kast out of here ASAP.

[Kmd4390]

Dead serious though, Kast or kmd are chen. I would put a huge bet on this.

Hmm. Kast is one of my town reads, so I'll take that bet. Avatar bet. If either Kast or myself is a chen bot, you choose my avatar for a month. If neither Kast or myself is a chen bot, I choose your avatar for a month. Deal?

[farside22]

Nominate Llama and Pablito

Llama (2) Hewitt, Kast
Pablito (0)

Not voting

bunny
bv
crazy

[pablito]

I just can't get rid of the nagging thought in the back of my mind that kmd is scum right now. I really really hate the justfication regarding "wanting to get rid of harder to get scum". Fact is, we want to lynch scum no matter what. At this point in the game, I think there's enough information out there that we don't have to worry about who's harder to get. We have mislynches available, and we can use them later if we can get through and lynch known scum - who I'm pretty sure is snowbunny.

[bv310]

I'm still not convinced on either nom. Pablito was a strong town read before, but he's moved towards scummy, while Llama did the exact opposite. I have the feeling right now that neither is scum.

@MOD: When is our deadline?

[Kast]

Will be travelling all day tomorrow and won't be around the weekend.

This will have to be a short post.

@Hewitt-
AMs posts implicating you as a buddy are obvious and you even admitted thinking SF and AM were buddies in your re-read. Claiming that you don't see that is ridiculous.

Your voting and suspicion lists show that you only "suspected" AM when he was clearly not in danger of being nominated, and each time when he would be in danger, you either dropped him from your list, or emphasized that Saber was more scummy.

@Mod's earlier question-
It wouldn't be fair to change the deadlines during this day. If mod wants to change deadlines on D6, that is fine provided there is adequate notice ahead of time.

@Pablito-
No questions atm. Hewitt and Llama are probable producer scum. Saber/BV is probable Chenbot (if not, it could be SB, but this is less directly supported).

[farside22]

@MOD: When is our deadline?

Deadline is next Thursday Jan 29th, lets say 3:00pm PST

HOUSEGUEST PLEASE NOTE:

If you are going to use the POV or coup today just post in thread the following by this Sunday (Jan 24, 3:00pm PST)

I (player name) am using the Coup/POV today.

Then say how you will use it. I see no need for a PM to me in regards to using it.
POV holder if you are not using the POV please remember to PM a name of a player you wish to give the POV to.

[hewitt]

I'm still not convinced on either nom. Pablito was a strong town read before, but he's moved towards scummy, while Llama did the exact opposite. I have the feeling right now that neither is scum.

I think the likelihood of that being the case is growing extremely higher and higher. I certainly don't see any damning evidence of either of them being a part of a scumteam.

@Hewitt-
AMs posts implicating you as a buddy are obvious and you even admitted thinking SF and AM were buddies in your re-read. Claiming that you don't see that is ridiculous.

Your voting and suspicion lists show that you only "suspected" AM when he was clearly not in danger of being nominated, and each time when he would be in danger, you either dropped him from your list, or emphasized that Saber was more scummy.

Huh, it's so obvious that I'm on a scumteam with animorpherv that you can't post proof. Got it.

[Crazy]

Eh, I'll make sure to post later tonight.

[farside22]

prodding snow bunny

[Crazy]

I'm going to

Vote: pablito

. Whether he's likely to be scum I'm really not sure, but in my eyes he's certainly more likely to be scum than LlamaFluff.

I assume LlamaFluff's association with ani was based off of ani saying Llama was pro-town a few times? Bleh. Rarely do scumbuddies even do that in the first place. Llama's early open attacks against ani speak much more loudly, I think.

Pablito is much more likely to be producer-scum. When I searched him in iso, a couple of his posts seem a bit vague in regards to ani, especially considering that pablito is hardly ever vague:

There was some question before about my thoughts on ani. Honestly, at the moment, my thoughts on ani rely mostly on everyone else's thoughts. I have not looked at him in isolation and therefore cannot confidently put my own statement on anything from him. The fact that I can't probably means that he hasn't done anything to outright catch my attention, but his actions and his votes have made me aware of him and I put him in the back of my mind. If I were to look at ani (and I have at some point in the past, maybe last game week), I sensed he's not on my deffo town list, but he's somewhere in the middle for me. But I have not found a single instance that I can put down as him being scummy right now.

Hrm. I mean ani contributes and does a lot, but in this search, I can't pick up anything scummy because ani's posts are very short and I can't see any nuances in them. I'd have to look at all the posts in context to see what he does in actions and timing. It is significant however that ani pushes replacements to give immediate thoughts upon coming into the game though.

As for not nomming animorph. I have suspected him a lot of the game, and it wasn't until I read my own posts that I've actually seen that I have FOSed him or whatnot, but when I list out my suspicion lists, he's never there, because he always slips my mind. In fact, I mentioned as such in my last post where you did ask me to look at him. So while I've pointed out scummy things he's done, I guess I never took hard value in those points. And looking at the reasons I've pointed out before, ani continues to slip under my radar. It's just that players like Mr Finch and Sironigous have piqued my interest as of late. My failure to ever nominate or suggest animorph is based on my failure to synthesize all of the data I have poked at and realize that ani is on all those lists. I've been focusing on so many of the more interesting nuances in isolation that I hadn't seen the big picture.

[LlamaFluff]

Well im still dead either way unless someone uses PoV on me, which would be a very good thing here, especially considering Kast is going to be HoH regardless tomorrow and we know who he is putting up.

I would love seing a PoV and then Kast getting thrown up, actually... PoV on pablito, then putting Kast up would be amazingly interesting.

[hewitt]

Well im still dead either way unless someone uses PoV on me, which would be a very good thing here, especially considering Kast is going to be HoH regardless tomorrow and we know who he is putting up.

I would love seing a PoV and then Kast getting thrown up, actually... PoV on pablito, then putting Kast up would be amazingly interesting.

Well considering I would rather see Snow Bunny, bv, or Kast evicted over either of these two. I would love a PoV usage too, but I'm guessing one of those three has it.

[pablito]

Well I would hope KMD puts up snowbunny, bv or Kast if the POV is used. He has said before that he might put someone up just to make sure that either Llama or I get evicted.