Mini 904 - Narnia: LWW Mafia (Game Over)

[dybeck]

I'm just going to post my brief notes and observations from my readthrough. I did feel that there was way too much distraction with the whole L-3 debacle that Starbuck initiated, so I'm really going to avoid commenting on it much. Starbuck is very overdefencive. I find that to be a common scumtell (I know many people may disagree, but meh).
Her Vote against Dybeck in 158 is so OMGUS it hurts. Don't like the weak attempt to distract with Sibelius just a few posts later. That name came out of nowhere and had nothing in the post to make me want to look at him. It really seems like she's grasping at straws.
It was a horrible claim by Starbuck. She really needed to put out more flavour rather than stringing it along. It did feel a little like she was trying to guage how the wind was blowing before giving any more details. Especially considering it was a vanilla role, I don't see what value there is for a townie to hold back.

Overall Starbuck seems a little too stubborn about the L-3 debate for it to be a real scumtell, but there have been enough other things to warrant the wagon in my opinion. I'm a little leery about how aggressively her wagon has been pressed by Papa Zito, then Dybeck, and Kiku.

I think that Starbuck overshadowed much of the other players. I'm not really going to go into my town reads yet, because I want to focus on who to lynch before we hit deadline. There are two others that really caught my eye and I also need to comment on Manho.

BV310 also caught my eye. Crawdad made a good catch (post 72) on BV310's Starbuck inconsistency.

BV310's scumlist has two potential scum on opposite ends of the spectrum. That said, I could see Papa Zito
bussing a scum Starbuck as hard as he did. I wouldn't say that PZ has been leading at this point. He's just been pushing the Starbuck wagon very hard. That's aggressive, but not really leading as I would define it.
I'm obviously concerned about his lack of desire to vote. He sure seemed to find Starbuck scummy, but he doesn't throw down a vote until he decides to "trust Dybeck". If Starbuck turns town, I could easily see BV310 trying to setup Dybeck for a fall tomorrow. When he gets called out for parroting, his response still seems like he's parroting various themes that have already been brought up and then brings up a new suspect.



Riceball is scum. He spends most of his time arguing about irrelevant facts and doesn't really bother to look for scum. It may be more obvious to look at his posts in iso, but I noticed it just reading through. Look at 144 (iso 10). He's just trying to fit in and make conversation without really scumhunting. Riceball is still scummy in 194 (iso 13).
I'm not really going along with the town here, but I really think this guy is scum. You guys should really join me.

Vote: Riceball

i think starbuck is town, but she is today's lynch.

Really? Why would you want to lynch someone you think is town? I had to reread him in iso to really figure this out, but I think I understand where he's coming from now. I do actually think Dybeck is townier than Starbuck, but I did like what Manho pointed out in post 254. I'm not sure that scum would be so ballsy as to make that statement this early on day one anyway (like I don't think they'd jump on someone to quicklynch at L-3.) I get some of the suspicion on Manho, but I'd really like to understand why he's singling out Dybeck for the "shit wagon" on Starbuck. Papa Zito was also aggressively pushing for her lynch as is Kiku. Why is Dybeck so important?

This is a great post. I'm not sure that there's any real appetite for a Riceball lynch here, though. I know he's not someone I've found scummy.

[Starbuck]

On bv310

Reading bv310 in iso....


I do not like how he was so quick to parrot me when it came to the quick wagon on Kiku...

He states in his ISO Post 1:

J.R., why would you put kiku at L-3 this early? A quick-wagon is not the best way to start this day.

I don't believe the above is fearful as dybeck was trying to say in Post #, especially because as soon as he's questioned about agreeing with me. he backpedals to say that he suspected me (as seen below).



And in his very next post he states that he found me suspicious (but never states it prior to this post)

Honestly, the people posting frequently so far have been relatively good with their styles, and although I did find Starbuck suspicious before, I find the quick L-3 move less odd now.

Now, why would he question J.R. about putting Kiku at L-3 if he was suspicious of me unvoting?

Does not compute.

Also, he's suspicious of me, but he NEVER directs any questions towards me.


In his ISO Post 3:

Honestly, the people posting frequently so far have been relatively good with their styles, and although I did find Starbuck suspicious before, I find the quick L-3 move less odd now.

When did you find Starbuck suspicious? Initially you agreed with her.

Regarding the quick L-3 move, what would you say changed your mind?

I didn't like that she called it scummy to have an L-3, but I didn't like having anyone at L-3 this early, especially in RVS. It just seemed that there was too much opportunity for it to go bad, but Starbuck whiteknight-ing the cause seemed like an attempt to build town cred without having to do anything all that pro-town.

My first question is: where before this post did I say L-3 was scummy? Oh that's right, I NEVER DID.

My second question is: how can you be suspicious of me for not being comfortable having someone at L-3 for so early and then say that you didn't like it either? How can you be suspicious of me when you feel the same way?

I'd also like to point out that the above quote is the first time that the word "whiteknight" is brought into the game.


It strikes me as odd that he suspects me but he turns around and votes manho for no reason.


He goes back and re-reads me in this post and it seems like he's trying to redeem himself, especially from his fence-sitting.

I'd like to see Star's answers to some questions that have been posed to her before I make up my mind.

This bothers me because besides his re-read of me, he never directs anything to me.

and from the same post...

I think my opinion of Starbuck right now is more just based on eveybody else's reactions to her.

So he admits that he has absolutely no case of his own.

He also says he finds Papa Zito scummy for...

PZ on the other hand, seems really scummy by trying to lead the town. It's annoying to play with someone who always tries to lead the game, and most players that lead are usually scum.

Care to provide examples of this?


After this, I ask him if he has anything to bring to the table and replies with

I don't have anything new to bring because I haven't seen anything new to bring. The last couple pages have been rehashing the same basic points. The only new thing in the last two pages has been Dybeck's point on PZ's following, which is good, but not really a whole lot to go on, until PZ responds.

and also

As for the voting, I haven't voted because I was waiting for a real case to be made. As it is, the case against Starbuck is pretty good, but I think there's a good chance that she's actually just a very lazy townie.

He wants everyone else to do his work for him. I'm not sure if this is more scum or lazy townie approach.

I also think it's funny at this point that he calls me a lazy townie when at least (at this point of the game) I've provided substance and my own opinions, rather than mindlessly following everyone else.

I think I trust Dybeck here. Star's play has just been going down over the course of this day.

Again, he thinks he trusts dybeck and still brings nothing new to the table before voting.

Manho, if you want Starbuck lynched why haven't you switched your vote yet? You defended her, then abruptly switch to "we need to lynch her", so why hasn't your vote changed? Trying to bus from your scumbuddy without putting her back at L-1?

These are some pretty aggressive words for someone who jumped on my bandwagon at L-2 and has provided absolutely nothing substance wise.



So he finally answers some questions here...

I originally got a vibe off her Rumblebuffin claim of possible power role trying to vanilla claim in order to avoid a lynch.

Now, I can see where others wouldn't believe my VT claim and that's fine, but why would you put me at L-1 if you believe me to be a POWER ROLE of some kind?

Her trying to deflect onto the source, and trying to justify the weakest vanilla claim I've seen in any game I've played on this site are what made me more willing to vote.

You've been a member of the site since 14 Nov 2009. How is it the WEAKEST claim you've seen?

I'd also like to take this chance to point out my suspicions against Manho.

First, he nearly whiteknights her cause (I snipped this post, but the whole thing is valid in my argument.

His use of the word "whiteknight" in this game is a little too much for me.


Overall, bv310 has done nothing but follow dybeck's lead and not really provide any of his own points. It very much feels like coaching.

[Starbuck]

@HackerHuck - My comment about Sibelius did not come out of no where. If you go back and look at the mod's last vote count prior to my post, you will see that I was prodded as well as Sibelius. So I was wondering why Sibelius wasn't being given the same courtesies as I was. If you need me to provide links to the mod's vote count at that point and where my post is that I mention why no one is questioning Sibelious I will do so.

But you are about the 3rd person now who has misrepresented me as saying I brought Sibelius's name out of no where at that point, when I did not. I also have explained this more than once.

[Narninian]

On bv310

Reading bv310 in iso....


I do not like how he was so quick to parrot me when it came to the quick wagon on Kiku...

He states in his ISO Post 1:

J.R., why would you put kiku at L-3 this early? A quick-wagon is not the best way to start this day.

I don't believe the above is fearful as dybeck was trying to say in Post #, especially because as soon as he's questioned about agreeing with me. he backpedals to say that he suspected me (as seen below).



And in his very next post he states that he found me suspicious (but never states it prior to this post)

Honestly, the people posting frequently so far have been relatively good with their styles, and although I did find Starbuck suspicious before, I find the quick L-3 move less odd now.

Now, why would he question J.R. about putting Kiku at L-3 if he was suspicious of me unvoting?

Does not compute.

Also, he's suspicious of me, but he NEVER directs any questions towards me.


In his ISO Post 3:

Honestly, the people posting frequently so far have been relatively good with their styles, and although I did find Starbuck suspicious before, I find the quick L-3 move less odd now.

When did you find Starbuck suspicious? Initially you agreed with her.

Regarding the quick L-3 move, what would you say changed your mind?

I didn't like that she called it scummy to have an L-3, but I didn't like having anyone at L-3 this early, especially in RVS. It just seemed that there was too much opportunity for it to go bad, but Starbuck whiteknight-ing the cause seemed like an attempt to build town cred without having to do anything all that pro-town.

My first question is: where before this post did I say L-3 was scummy? Oh that's right, I NEVER DID.

My second question is: how can you be suspicious of me for not being comfortable having someone at L-3 for so early and then say that you didn't like it either? How can you be suspicious of me when you feel the same way?

I'd also like to point out that the above quote is the first time that the word "whiteknight" is brought into the game.


It strikes me as odd that he suspects me but he turns around and votes manho for no reason.


He goes back and re-reads me in this post and it seems like he's trying to redeem himself, especially from his fence-sitting.

I'd like to see Star's answers to some questions that have been posed to her before I make up my mind.

This bothers me because besides his re-read of me, he never directs anything to me.

and from the same post...

I think my opinion of Starbuck right now is more just based on eveybody else's reactions to her.

So he admits that he has absolutely no case of his own.

He also says he finds Papa Zito scummy for...

PZ on the other hand, seems really scummy by trying to lead the town. It's annoying to play with someone who always tries to lead the game, and most players that lead are usually scum.

Care to provide examples of this?


After this, I ask him if he has anything to bring to the table and replies with

I don't have anything new to bring because I haven't seen anything new to bring. The last couple pages have been rehashing the same basic points. The only new thing in the last two pages has been Dybeck's point on PZ's following, which is good, but not really a whole lot to go on, until PZ responds.

and also

As for the voting, I haven't voted because I was waiting for a real case to be made. As it is, the case against Starbuck is pretty good, but I think there's a good chance that she's actually just a very lazy townie.

He wants everyone else to do his work for him. I'm not sure if this is more scum or lazy townie approach.

I also think it's funny at this point that he calls me a lazy townie when at least (at this point of the game) I've provided substance and my own opinions, rather than mindlessly following everyone else.

I think I trust Dybeck here. Star's play has just been going down over the course of this day.

Again, he thinks he trusts dybeck and still brings nothing new to the table before voting.

Manho, if you want Starbuck lynched why haven't you switched your vote yet? You defended her, then abruptly switch to "we need to lynch her", so why hasn't your vote changed? Trying to bus from your scumbuddy without putting her back at L-1?

These are some pretty aggressive words for someone who jumped on my bandwagon at L-2 and has provided absolutely nothing substance wise.



So he finally answers some questions here...

I originally got a vibe off her Rumblebuffin claim of possible power role trying to vanilla claim in order to avoid a lynch.

Now, I can see where others wouldn't believe my VT claim and that's fine, but why would you put me at L-1 if you believe me to be a POWER ROLE of some kind?

Her trying to deflect onto the source, and trying to justify the weakest vanilla claim I've seen in any game I've played on this site are what made me more willing to vote.

You've been a member of the site since 14 Nov 2009. How is it the WEAKEST claim you've seen?

I'd also like to take this chance to point out my suspicions against Manho.

First, he nearly whiteknights her cause (I snipped this post, but the whole thing is valid in my argument.

His use of the word "whiteknight" in this game is a little too much for me.


Overall, bv310 has done nothing but follow dybeck's lead and not really provide any of his own points. It very much feels like coaching.

The same thing I was getting at when I decided to vote for bv310. You asked the very same question starbuck did immediately after her vote - and then in your very next post you said you found her suspicious for it. Any way to explain this inconsistency bv310?

[wolframnhart]

i think starbuck is town, but she is today's lynch.

Oh yea, my vote stays.

[Starbuck]

Actually, Starbuck, I have a question for you.

Now, presumably, even you'll admit that your claim is not a strong one. I'm sure that you would have felt far more comfortable if you'd been able to tell us that you were Aslan or Lucy, for example.

With this in mind, may I ask you to please consider this post from wolframnhart?

I believe Starbucks' claim. Again I am not going to try and out guess the mod on which characters he put in the game, but her role makes sense to me.

He appears to genuinely accept your claim wholly, even though you're able to offer us a character that has little more than a cameo role in the book.

Now we know you're claiming to be pro-town. I've made it very clear that I don't believe you. But that aside for a sec.

Purely for argument's sake, let's say that you're telling the truth. Do you take his post at face value, and that he genuinely believes your (presumably vanilla) claim without question? Or do you think he's scum trying to bolster his pro-town credentials if you get lynched today and flip town?

First, I'm not a fan of trying to outguess the mod and I'm very tired of your assumptions of what I would be comfortable with. The role PM I received says that I am Rumblebuffin and a Vanilla Townie.

Characters that have little more than cameo roles are perfect vanilla townies imho.

But on wolframnhart, I haven't gotten to complete my iso on him yet and honestly your repeat of quoting of this post multiple times has grown rather old.

I am doing as requested and providing cases on those I find scummy. Having played with Wolf before, he hasn't done anything that has set off my scumdar. Until I can iso him, my read on him is null right now.

[Starbuck]

On dybeck

I'm not a fan of dybeck's WIFOM, as illustrated in the following:

Also... L-3 is MILES from a lynch. I'd be exceptionally comfortable with seeing three more people pile on to this wagon to get a hugely early Day 1 lynch because

we could be fairly certain that these hypothetical quicklynchers were scum.

Seriously - you need to stop making like there was ever a danger of a quicklynch.

L-3 on Page 2 has never, ever led to a quicklynch in the history of mafia.

This is a lie because of the link of that Newbie game that was provided. My point here is that it has happened, which directly contradicts what dybeck is saying here.

He also is trying to say that there couldn't have been a chance of a quicklynch. There is always THE CHANCE. It might not have happened here, but the possibility is always there. That's all I was trying to say.

But even still later on, he won't back down from this supposed "fact":

It couldn't happen. It never has happened in any of your 30+ games and it won't happen in any of your future games.

It's a distracting topic, yes, I realize this, but it's still something that bothers me.

You may think you're showing yourself to be the saviour of the town, but you're just misrepresenting this entire situation and it's creating a sideshow.

The whole situation was blown WAY OUT OF PROPORTION by people who were not me.

The situation didn't get misrepresented by myself either, it was misrepresented by those who blew it out of proportion.


Also dybeck, I see something now and I want to correct it. Look at your Post 56, and the second quote where I ASK you how I misrepresented you. I thought that you were saying that I had and I wanted you to clarify. Now that I re-read your original quote within there, I see that you didn't mean yourself. I apologize for the mix-up. I wasn't trying to twist your words. I had read it wrong and thought you were trying to say that I misrepresented you in some way. That's what I had a question mark at the end of

Wait, how did I misrepresent you again?

and why I asked for clarification.

So I never twisted your words as you blatantly go out of your way to say. I don't understand how asking for clarification (i.e. the question mark at the end of the sentence) could lead to you saying that I was twisting your words.

The same goes for the top quote because I asked you a question, which means I was asking for your response. Now, if I blatantly said "dybeck is pushing for a quicklynch" there, THAT would be misrepresentation, not the asking of a question.

dybeck on my claiming early

Seeing as how we're deadlined, would you consider claiming now - to save the town the time it would take to build a wagon all the way to L-1?

The thing that bothers me the most here is that EVERY GAME is deadlined. It also feels like it wouldn't have mattered to him (as well as Kiku) if I claimed when they asked or not because they both would have had the same reaction as when I claimed at L-1.

No. But the rate of contribution is such that it will take a while to get you there. And we're deadlined.

In the unlikely event that you're town, your claim will show it. And the more time we have remaining in the day after your claim, the better. You could really help the town by sharing what you know now, rather than later.

Face it, you've now been caught in a massive lie, in addition to the misdemeanours that were already casting a spotlight upon you.

Thought you might bring yourself to do SOMETHING to help the town?

I don't like his continued emphasis on "deadlined".

I still believe as I said above that it wouldn't have mattered if I claimed then. It felt to me that he and Kiku were trying to cut off the information that the town would gain by people jumping on my bandwagon.

To him and Kiku, there is no possible way that I can be town. They are both victims of tunneling and there is a significant connection between them.

I also don't like the threatening tone in the last line of this post. Kiku has also taken the same threatening tone with me.


Along with the call for my claim to be early, he also starts calling for a massclaim

I'd like nobody to state reasons in favour of a massclaim. But I'd like anyone AGAINST a massclaim to say so, with a full argument why they think it would be a bad idea.

dybeck outguesses the mod!

Everyone else - we're looking at no more than a town of nine people here. Beyond a shadow of a doubt we have Peter, Lucy and Susan Pevensie. No mod would omit Aslan. No mod would omit Tumnus, and we have Mr. and Mrs. Beaver.

The remaining two will be some permutation of Professor Kirke, Father Christmas and Edmund Pevensie.

Not freaking Rumblebuffin. Let's lynch this phoney already.

Why would he try to do this other than still be on the warpath of discrediting me?

The Kiku-bv310-dybeck connection

Kiku's and bv310's unrelentless trust in dybeck is very weird. It very much feels to me that they are following his lead and that he's trying to protect them. He never mentions either of them in a negative light.


I see this in things such as...

This post, which is just pure coaching.

BTW Bv310 is not the scum you're looking for.

One thing I want to point out real quick is that Kiku goes on and on about how I'm scum and that Rumblebuffin is my safeclaim, but when I claim, dybeck says in Post 29 that

Rumblebuffin! Wicked... we found a scum Day 1!

And they don't have safe claims! Awesome!

So which is it? You guys obviously have some things mixed up in the mafia QT .


This post rubs me the wrong way because he points out that Papa Zito was following him, but not anyone else.

[Starbuck]

Also for the record, according to the rules on the front page, a player only needs a majority of votes to be lynched.

Just a reminder.

[dybeck]

One thing I want to point out real quick is that Kiku goes on and on about how I'm scum and that Rumblebuffin is my safeclaim, but when I claim, dybeck says in Post 29 that

Rumblebuffin! Wicked... we found a scum Day 1!

And they don't have safe claims! Awesome!

So which is it? You guys obviously have some things mixed up in the mafia QT .

To get this straight - your Rumblebuffin claim is terrible. You must realise this. You've claimed a walk-on cameo role from the book who has absolutely no bearing on the plot of the story, which even your most ardent supporters must admit is a tremendously weak claim.

I don't believe anybody is suggesting that this is a safeclaim provided by the mod. There are some (like Narninian) who believe your claim. The rest of us believe it is a poor attempt at a claim that you scraped together from wikipedia.

[MadCrawdad]

I see that lots went on yesterday. I won't be able to read up and post, however, until late tomorrow night, at the earliest.

[kikuchiyo]

So which is it? You guys obviously have some things mixed up in the mafia QT

Daytalking scum is a rare commodity. Why on earth would you imply that the mechanic exists in this game?

Most of your arguments seem of a semantic nature. I agree with you. You didn't get Sibelius' name out of "nowhere", but your reasoning for pointing him out is terrible so you might as well have gotten him from "nowhere". The issue was not your lurking. The issue was you avoiding pressure and then lieing about your whereabouts and your ability to post. PZ seems to want to give you a pass here. I get that and I will consider another lynch. However, you are also correct in your belief that I am convinced you are scum. That is why I "need" your lynch. I want to be able to adjust my reads accordingly if necessary. The reference to daytalking scum reads like a slip. Sorry, but you're not changing my mind. I'm only moving my vote if necessary. If I have to move, I'd go to bv310 because I think he is one of your partners.

[dybeck]

I'm just going to post my brief notes and observations from my readthrough. I did feel that there was way too much distraction with the whole L-3 debacle that Starbuck initiated, so I'm really going to avoid commenting on it much. Starbuck is very overdefencive. I find that to be a common scumtell (I know many people may disagree, but meh).
Her Vote against Dybeck in 158 is so OMGUS it hurts. Don't like the weak attempt to distract with Sibelius just a few posts later. That name came out of nowhere and had nothing in the post to make me want to look at him. It really seems like she's grasping at straws.
It was a horrible claim by Starbuck. She really needed to put out more flavour rather than stringing it along. It did feel a little like she was trying to guage how the wind was blowing before giving any more details. Especially considering it was a vanilla role, I don't see what value there is for a townie to hold back.

Overall Starbuck seems a little too stubborn about the L-3 debate for it to be a real scumtell, but there have been enough other things to warrant the wagon in my opinion. I'm a little leery about how aggressively her wagon has been pressed by Papa Zito, then Dybeck, and Kiku.

I think that Starbuck overshadowed much of the other players. I'm not really going to go into my town reads yet, because I want to focus on who to lynch before we hit deadline. There are two others that really caught my eye and I also need to comment on Manho.

BV310 also caught my eye. Crawdad made a good catch (post 72) on BV310's Starbuck inconsistency.

BV310's scumlist has two potential scum on opposite ends of the spectrum. That said, I could see Papa Zito
bussing a scum Starbuck as hard as he did. I wouldn't say that PZ has been leading at this point. He's just been pushing the Starbuck wagon very hard. That's aggressive, but not really leading as I would define it.
I'm obviously concerned about his lack of desire to vote. He sure seemed to find Starbuck scummy, but he doesn't throw down a vote until he decides to "trust Dybeck". If Starbuck turns town, I could easily see BV310 trying to setup Dybeck for a fall tomorrow. When he gets called out for parroting, his response still seems like he's parroting various themes that have already been brought up and then brings up a new suspect.



Riceball is scum. He spends most of his time arguing about irrelevant facts and doesn't really bother to look for scum. It may be more obvious to look at his posts in iso, but I noticed it just reading through. Look at 144 (iso 10). He's just trying to fit in and make conversation without really scumhunting. Riceball is still scummy in 194 (iso 13).
I'm not really going along with the town here, but I really think this guy is scum. You guys should really join me.

Vote: Riceball

i think starbuck is town, but she is today's lynch.

Really? Why would you want to lynch someone you think is town? I had to reread him in iso to really figure this out, but I think I understand where he's coming from now. I do actually think Dybeck is townier than Starbuck, but I did like what Manho pointed out in post 254. I'm not sure that scum would be so ballsy as to make that statement this early on day one anyway (like I don't think they'd jump on someone to quicklynch at L-3.) I get some of the suspicion on Manho, but I'd really like to understand why he's singling out Dybeck for the "shit wagon" on Starbuck. Papa Zito was also aggressively pushing for her lynch as is Kiku. Why is Dybeck so important?

This is a great post. I'm not sure that there's any real appetite for a Riceball lynch here, though. I know he's not someone I've found scummy.

I should probably clarify this. I think it's a great post because I like the level of detail and I think more contributions like this would really help the town - even though I don't 100% agree with all the conclusions.

[Kdub]

Vote Count

Starbuck (4)

- dybeck, kikuchiyo, bv310, manho

Riceballtail (1)

- HackerHuck

bv310 (2)

- MadCrawdad, Narninian

MadCrawdad (0)

-

kikuchiyo (0)

-

HackerHuck (0)

-

Papa Zito (1)

- Sibelius

wolframnhart (0)

-

Narninian (0)

-

manho (3)

- wolframnhart, Riceballtail, Papa Zito

dybeck (0)

-

Sibelius (0)

-

No Lynch (0)

-

Not Voting (1)

- Starbuck

12 votes available, 7 votes needed to lynch.

Deadline is January 26, ~ 12:30 am MST.

Deadline is less than 3 days away.

[manho]

so everyone is starting new cases when deadline is just 3 days away? lynching the claimed vanilla townie is almost a standard procedure

there is no way we can do the following things: settling into another wagon, getting a claim from the lynchee, unvoting after the lynchee claim a powerrole, getting to another wagon and repeating the same procedure, and finally lynching someone, in 3 days.

so please get back to starbuck's lynch.

[Starbuck]

Actually we can manho.

Vote: manho

Now they are even.


I'm gonna go read you in iso now. There are others who have questions for you that you need to respond to.

[Kdub]

Sibelius has picked up his prod but has not posted. I have prodded him again and have given him a warning that he will be replaced if he does not post soon.

[Papa Zito]

I see that lots went on yesterday. I won't be able to read up and post, however, until late tomorrow night, at the earliest.

Vote manho, vote often!

[wolframnhart]

so everyone is starting new cases when deadline is just 3 days away? lynching the claimed vanilla townie is almost a standard procedure

there is no way we can do the following things: settling into another wagon, getting a claim from the lynchee, unvoting after the lynchee claim a powerrole, getting to another wagon and repeating the same procedure, and finally lynching someone, in 3 days.

so please get back to starbuck's lynch.

if the new case seems better then the old one, who cares if it is three days away? Stop trying to convince people to vote you because of time restraints.

We can do the following things:
Settle onto another wagon - we are doing so with you right now.

Getting a claim from the lynchee - Not sure I understand this one but Starbuck did claim if thats what you mean.

Unvoting after a lynchee claims power role - Depends on role and if people find it believable

Getting onto another wagon and going through same procedure - looks like that might be happening here.

Finally lynching someone - How is this not going to happen?

Your reasons are horrible, you have no real case, and your posts are just scummy as hell.

[dybeck]

so everyone is starting new cases when deadline is just 3 days away? lynching the claimed vanilla townie is almost a standard procedure

there is no way we can do the following things: settling into another wagon, getting a claim from the lynchee, unvoting after the lynchee claim a powerrole, getting to another wagon and repeating the same procedure, and finally lynching someone, in 3 days.

so please get back to starbuck's lynch.

@Manho: People who hint at the fact that they have a power-role, without saying anything committal or counterclaimable, always get my back up. Claim, or claim not. There is no try.

@HackerHuck, Sibelius: Who's scum? Starbuck, Manho, both or neither?

[manho]

so everyone is starting new cases when deadline is just 3 days away? lynching the claimed vanilla townie is almost a standard procedure

there is no way we can do the following things: settling into another wagon, getting a claim from the lynchee, unvoting after the lynchee claim a powerrole, getting to another wagon and repeating the same procedure, and finally lynching someone, in 3 days.

so please get back to starbuck's lynch.

if the new case seems better then the old one, who cares if it is three days away? Stop trying to convince people to vote you because of time restraints.

so where is the new case and how is it better than the old one?

We can do the following things:
Settle onto another wagon - we are doing so with you right now.

yes

Getting a claim from the lynchee - Not sure I understand this one but Starbuck did claim if thats what you mean.

getting another claim from the another lynchee, that's me currently, and you need two more votes on me to get a claim from me.

Unvoting after a lynchee claims power role - Depends on role and if people find it believable

sure, but you also need some time for everyone to have a chance to counter role claim.

Getting onto another wagon and going through same procedure - looks like that might be happening here.

yes, but this procedure need to repeat for sometime if you find each claim believable. and if you are finding the *insert the name starbuck claimed and i forgotten* claim believable, most claims are believable.

Finally lynching someone - How is this not going to happen?

you need 7 votes to get a lynch, and given that some player post only once a day, you probably can't get that in this little time.

Your reasons are horrible, you have no real case, and your posts are just scummy as hell.

i have given my case and reason why it is useless to try to get another wagon this late, especially after we spent so much time to pressure starbuck and get a vanilla claim. and why is my post scummy?

[Starbuck]

you need 7 votes to get a lynch, and given that some player post only once a day, you probably can't get that in this little time.

This is true prior to deadline.

At deadline, majority wins.

[Starbuck]

You also didn't put any time in on pressuring me. You actually started off defending me and backpedaled rather quickly.

[manho]

RULES

Voting

B1) Votes must be bolded like this:

Vote: Playername

.
B2) You may

Unvote

, but it is not required before voting someone else.
B3) A lynch will occur when one player has the majority of votes for the day.
B4) Once a player has the majority of votes needed for a lynch, the lynch is final and further votes and unvotes will not count.
B5) You may

Vote: No lynch

. A no-lynch will occur when the majority of votes for the day are for no lynch.
B6) If a lynch is not reached by the time the deadline arrives, there will be no lynch.

if my understanding is right, we need 7 votes to lynch even at deadline.

You also didn't put any time in on pressuring me. You actually started off defending me and backpedaled rather quickly.

i'm saying the other people, such as dybeck-the-scum, that pressure you.

i think you are townie, but it is almost standard procedure to lynch claimed VT and there is no use starting another wagon now.

we really should end the day after starbuck gives her case. any more information given is a benefit to the scum, and that's why dybeck-the-scum are trying so hard to get claims from others.

[Starbuck]

Then this...

B3) A lynch will occur when one player has the majority of votes for the day.

And this...

B6) If a lynch is not reached by the time the deadline arrives, there will be no lynch.

Rather contradict each other when it comes to the deadline, but I see what the mod did here.

[kikuchiyo]

Seven = majority of twelve.

Seven is needed for lynch.

Unvote, Vote: Manho

This is obviously going to stalemate if we don't do it. We have two days left for discussion. Let's get a claim from manho and decide between the two. I still prefer the Starbuck lynch, but stalling this close to deadline helps noone but scum. Somebody else move. We can always go back.