Newbie 893 - Newbieland! (GAME OVER)

[My Milked Eek]

That's just sad.

[Gayle]

I'm really loathe to go searching through your notes to pick out the details about Riza. Maybe I'll do it on another day, but not today and not now. From my (terrible) recollection, the case is that she hasn't posted much and that you don't like her votes. I'm not willing to lynch her over that.

[My Milked Eek]

It's not that.

I don't like her votes, her fosses, her non-committed play, her hypocrisy, etc.

There's no lurker case. At all.

[Gayle]

Why is Riza a better lynch than Pom?

[Pomegranate]

Why don't you agree with the case?

Rather than reading a case scattered across several posts, I just iso'd Riza, and I didn't find her particularly scummy.

But her timing is the key to her scumminess. For the sake of your laziness (come one, it's only 13 pages!), I'll quote the bits of case that are scattered. Inside the brackets is my own current explanation.

The reason I find Riza a bit scummy is because of hypocrisy. She jumped on my wagon and right before Vaporeonage without much reasoning. But later, she says that she finds Vapor very scummy, even though what he did was very similar to her own actions. She seems to be grasping for straws.

(Yes, I'm pretty sure that this was already pointed out.)

Actually,

Vote: Riza

.

- Riza contradicts herself about her random vote. It wasn't random at all, she was looking to bandwagon from the getgo.

- Riza is backtracking (#108) & Pome =/= scum (déja vu with TS on page 3)

- Riza in #121 : WIFOM and "I'd vote RF, but others won't, so I'm not voting him" (paraphrased)

The following is in chronological order!
- Pome votes Vap and FOSses Jarc
- Riza: "perhaps hetemens is scum" (paraphrased), which is a blatant lurker attack
- Jarc FoSses Vap
- Riza FoSses Vap

The odd thing about the fos from Riza is that she is just being a sheep again (cf. her RF opinion on the previous day), the obvious question is: why didn't she fos in her first post after Vap put pome at L-1? Why did she wait until Jarc fossed? I say it's trying to go with the flow.

I'm rereading the final pages, going to answer some posts directed at Vap/me:

>> Riza's

Cr

Vap Case

The explanation below will be a sum up of other posts I've made about Vapor.

Like I said, Vapor keeps on voting/unvoting for people with little to no reasoning. It's suspicious.

Is it really? And you're absolutely sure it doesn't fit in with him being a VI?

When he first voted for Pom, he said it was because Frost was of more assistance. Both he and Frost posted little between his vote for Pom and Frost. Therefore, I don't understand how Vapor thinks Frost was of more assistance.

Because Frost was, reread the thread, please. For real. And rewrite this quote, I can't understand it properly.

Wow, that sounds pretty muddled to me. Sorry. e_e Anyway, that's pretty much what lead me to vote for him.

Are you sure you're not forgetting to lie? The only reasons I see for your vote on Vap are:
1) he's an incredibly easy target (you explain this yourself later on)
2) others were already dogpiling onto him, I'm still in doubt about your FoS on Vap after Jarc did so (cf. previous big post)

But what makes me keep my vote is because he unvotes a post later, maybe because he caught quite a bit of negative attention?

Newbie player. VI. Make your pick. Seriously.

And then votes for me, for a bad reason, which can be directed toward him as well.

Bad play does not make a scum. But carry on.

He doesn't even defend himself, even when he's in L-2.

And this is indicative of any alignment in what way? If you're serious about this and I know you're not (you're only dogpiling and finding easy targets), explain it.

Page 8

- not much here lol, don't like Riza's attack on vap, it's really inane.

Page 9

- Riza builds crap case and builds up scumminess. Eggs on Vap and tries not to appear doing so (#213)
- TS excludes Riza from his mini-LoS (Line of Sight)

Page 10

- Riza's #238 contradicts itself, "Vap is newbie scum acting to be a VI". I don't think newbie scum is capable of doing that on purpose.

Page 11

- Pome Votes Riza for good reasons

My conclusions

Riza is scum.
TS is most likely scum.

--

Why is Riza a better lynch than Pom?

What, did you not have time to read the past few pages about Riza, but you had time to compose a case on me? Or are you jumping on the "backup" bandwagon on me?

[Gayle]

[Riza Case]

I actually looked it over before my last post. I don't think she is more worthy of a lynch than you, and I don't find many of those points to be scum tells.

For instance:
-I couldn't care less about her 'hypocrisy'
-I don't think she contradicted herself after her random vote.
-I don't find wifom in a newbie game particularly scummy
-I don't mind that she pointed out a lurker

In essence, I love Riza and forgive her for any mistake she may make. I know that it saddens MME when people don't agree with him, but that is how life is sometimes.

Despite what you two seem to think, I actually did read the entire thread. I still think you are the better lynch.


Also, I've noted that you were willing to do the summary as soon as my offer of friendship was of the table. You are a very cruel person and should feel bad.

[xRECKONERx]

You may only type in default font, italics, bold, underline, etc. Do not increase or decrease default font size, do not change font colors, etc.

This is your only warning.

[Pomegranate]

[Riza Case]

I actually looked it over before my last post. I don't think she is more worthy of a lynch than you, and I don't find many of those points to be scum tells.

For instance:
-I couldn't care less about her 'hypocrisy'
-I don't think she contradicted herself after her random vote.
-I don't find wifom in a newbie game particularly scummy
-I don't mind that she pointed out a lurker

In essence, I love Riza and forgive her for any mistake she may make.

I know that it saddens MME when people don't agree with him, but that is how life is sometimes.

Despite what you two seem to think, I actually did read the entire thread. I still think you are the better lynch.

Buddying much? (The bolded seems to show that whatever Riza does, you'll forgive her, no matter what.)

Could you explain why you think I'm a better lynch?

[Gayle]

Let me ask you something. Are you serious with that buddying claim?

[Pomegranate]

I'm just trying to show you that you can't turn a blind eye on everything she's done, and will do. It doesn't work.

Also this:

Could you explain why you think I'm a better lynch?

[Gayle]

I'm just trying to show you that you can't turn a blind eye on everything she's done, and will do. It doesn't work.

Because when one player claims to love another and will therefore forgive everything they do, that claim should be taken seriously.

[Pomegranate]

I'm just trying to show you that you can't turn a blind eye on everything she's done, and will do. It doesn't work.

Because when one player claims to love another and will therefore forgive everything they do, that claim should be taken seriously.

There has been no night yet, so I can't keep in mind the theory that you're a cop with an innocent.

FoS: Gayle

. Come on, things can't be so obvious, can they? I'm trying to rationalize an alternative.

(But I'm having trouble.)

[Gayle]

I'm just trying to show you that you can't turn a blind eye on everything she's done, and will do. It doesn't work.

Because when one player claims to love another and will therefore forgive everything they do, that claim should be taken seriously.

There has been no night yet, so I can't keep in mind the theory that you're a cop with an innocent.

FoS: Gayle

. Come on, things can't be so obvious, can they? I'm trying to rationalize an alternative.

(But I'm having trouble.)

I'm having trouble understanding what you mean here. Can you reword it or something?

[Pomegranate]

I'm just trying to show you that you can't turn a blind eye on everything she's done, and will do. It doesn't work.

Because when one player claims to love another and will therefore forgive everything they do, that claim should be taken seriously.

There has been no night yet, so I can't keep in mind the theory that you're a cop with an innocent.

FoS: Gayle

. Come on, things can't be so obvious, can they? I'm trying to rationalize an alternative.

(But I'm having trouble.)

I'm having trouble understanding what you mean here. Can you reword it or something?

It's impossible that you're a cop who has already gotten an innocent on Riza. I can't think of any other reason why you'd be so sure that Riza is town. (Unless the bolded sentence is meant to be read sarcastically- forgive me if it was, I sometimes find it hard to figure out what's sarcasm over the internet.)

[Gayle]

...Er, I think you misunderstood what I was saying.
This

In essence, I love Riza and forgive her for any mistake she may make.

and this

Because when one player claims to love another and will therefore forgive everything they do, that claim should be taken seriously.

were both sarcastic. I don't know why you would believe otherwise.

[Pomegranate]

Okay, great. Now back to business.

Could you explain why you think I'm a better lynch?

(This whole back-and-forth is great for my PPD, by the way.)

[Gayle]

The biggest and most obvious reason is that you have not done even an ounce of scum hunting the entire game. No, discussing theory is not scum hunting. You vote TS for some odd reason. When you are put at L-1, you switch your vote to the easy lynch in Vaporeonage. You then jump on the Riza bandwagon and call her a hypocrite. I don't think you've played any better than Riza. What reason makes her a hypocrite that doesn't also apply to you?

The formatting of this post may be messed up, because I was white screened several times and gave up on previewing.

[My Milked Eek]

For instance:
-I couldn't care less about her 'hypocrisy'
-I don't think she contradicted herself after her random vote.
-I don't find wifom in a newbie game particularly scummy
-I don't mind that she pointed out a lurker

There's more to my case than that. Does that mean you agree with the other points I'm making? Which are, imo, worse than the ones you took out. Also your refuting of those points is rather inane.

In essence, I love Riza and forgive her for any mistake she may make. I know that it saddens MME when people don't agree with him, but that is how life is sometimes.

What saddened me on top of the page is that you were unable to read 2-3 pages.

[chauchaudotcom]

We have four days till deadline. I still think Pom is scum but if it comes down to it I am willing to hammer to prevent a no lynch.

I'd like to know Frost and Theta's updated opinion.

And now that the weekend is over can you do a catch up and comment Nika?

Also, Riza, what are your thoughts on the case against you?

[Nikanor]

Feel free to suspect me as I am just as likely to be scum as any of you.

Scummy.

This is extremely scummy, as Chau already pointed out. One sentence of reasoning to put me at L-1. Especially when you realize that scum probably want me dead- I'm sure that one of the scumbags is on my wagon, if not both. And I think Vap is one of them.

Why would scum want you dead at this point? You're not even scumhunting.

My claim is Vanilla Townie.

Your claim or your role? Hmmmmm?

I'm still not caught up. I'm a really, really slow reader. Sorry.

[Gayle]

There's more to my case than that. Does that mean you agree with the other points I'm making? Which are, imo, worse than the ones you took out. Also your refuting of those points is rather inane.

No, it doesn't mean I agree with the other points and I have no intention of going into a full blown defense of Riza. If you want to know what I think about a specific point, ask me.

Also, I don't have to refute your case. I am not a defense lawyer. I only have to say why I'm not on board.

[Pomegranate]

This is extremely scummy, as Chau already pointed out. One sentence of reasoning to put me at L-1. Especially when you realize that scum probably want me dead- I'm sure that one of the scumbags is on my wagon, if not both. And I think Vap is one of them.

Why would scum want you dead at this point? You're not even scumhunting.

My claim is Vanilla Townie.

Your claim or your role? Hmmmmm?

I'm still not caught up. I'm a really, really slow reader. Sorry.

Are you?

(Anyway, newbie scum just want to lynch town so that they can kill.)

Both.

[Pomegranate]

Also, I don't have to refute your case. I am not a defense lawyer. I only have to say why I'm not on board.

I actually agree with this. It's Riza's job to defend herself.

[Gayle]

@Pom: You threw my question back in my face earlier. Now it is your turn to answer.

Why is Riza the best possible lynch for town right now?

[Pomegranate]

Because she's the scummiest. See post 304. (Now if she would only stop lurking once there was a wagon on her...)

@Gayle: You said that you read the entire thread. Who is/are your top scum pick(s)?