Open 201 - Fire & Ice Mafia ~Over~

[CSL]

Votecount 1.2 (As of Post 50)

Kmd4390 -1- farside22
animorpherv1 -1- DTMaster
DTMaster -1- kmd4390

Not Voting, everyone else

I remember talking to xofelf the other day, saying she has classes. As a result, I'm giving her another day. Nicodemus has until 8:00pm EST tonight before I get frustrated with him, and have to choose someone to take his place

[Kmd4390]

Unvote

I agree with Saint.

Vote mavsfan

You confirmed after the day started, but didn't add anything else.

I'd appreciate an explanation from Slaxx for the same thing.

[The Quintastic One]

Because Person A could be Ice Mafia, so the kill by Fire Mafia wouldn't work anyways, so it wouldn't confirm Person A. Am I misunderstanding what you're asking Quintastic?

I think I just misunderstand the example put forth in the first place. lol. Sorry for adding confusion.

Either way the Doctor as far as I know isn't told what he successfully protected against and like someone else said if there's a crosskill to Person A then the Doc won't know if that guy was Mafia or Town in the first place. So I still don't see how the Doc acts as a tool for catching Mafia.

But I'm still fairly new with only about 2 games on here under my belt, one ongoing (including this one) and one game completed on another website so I could be missing some super experienced logic that only elite players can understand from countless hours of Mafia gaming.

[Kmd4390]

Hmm.

Two deaths, doc learns nothing. Their target wasn't targeted by scum, so no info.

One death, doc successfully protected or scum targeted the same player as the doc and that player was scum so the kill didn't go through. Doc still learns nothing, but it's not due to the rule because it would be the same in any other game.

No deaths, basically anything could have happened.

The doc is basically useless information-wise in this game. The only thing the doc can do is maybe stop a kill, but we won't learn anything from it.

Let's not let this discussion drag out though. It distracts from scumhunting.

[CSL]

Less than eight hours remain until the daily Activity Check!

[farside22]

Although the mafia could use the doc with no kill and leading to WIFOM.

If the doc protects someone and a player dies. That player is either town or scum. However depending on if fire or ice killed one player it will at least confirm for the doc that the player they saved wasn't part of that mafia group.
So I disagree a kmd that it's completely useless.

[farside22]

Although the mafia could use the doc with no kill and leading to WIFOM.

If the doc protects someone and a player

lives

. That player is either town or scum. However depending on if fire or ice killed one player it will at least confirm for the doc that the player they saved wasn't part of that mafia group.
So I disagree a kmd that it's completely useless.

Sorry bolded the error I made.

[Kmd4390]

I don't understand what you are saying.

[CSL]

FYI, if you do ask me to fix something, it will be fixed as soon as I see it

[Pomegranate]

I do not see how DTM was scummy in the first place. Pointing out information that could be vital later in the game isn't scummy.

--

I don't understand what you are saying.

This, referring to farside's most recent post.

[farside22]

If the doc protects someone and a player lives. That player is either town or scum. However depending on if fire or ice killed one player it will at least confirm for the doc that the player they saved wasn't part of that mafia group.
So I disagree a kmd that it's completely useless.

What did you not understand from the above?
doc protects player
one player is dead instead of two come morning.
doc knows based on type of kill that player is not part of that mafia.

[Kmd4390]

Pom, it looked like he was looking at things that are more important to scum than to town, but after his explanation, I see I was mistaken.

Wait, we know which scum group made which kill?

[farside22]

Pom, it looked like he was looking at things that are more important to scum than to town, but after his explanation, I see I was mistaken.

Wait, we know which scum group made which kill?

did you read the set up?

CSLMod wrote:
Welcome to Open 201, Player! You, and (XXX) are here to end the town very peacefully arctic style!

You are a member of the Ice Mafia. Your QT is here. You have one shared ability to Night Freeze ONCE PER NIGHT!

You win if all opposing forces are dead, or your faction has them by their deathbed (50% of population) Confirm IN THREAD

CSLMod wrote:
Welcome to Open 201, Player! You, along with (XXX) are here to burn them to ashes.

You are a member of the Fire Mafia. You have a QT, here. You have a shared ability to Night Burn once per night.

You win if you cover half of the population, or nothing can prevent this. Confirm in thread.

[Kmd4390]

Hmm ok. That could be helpful then. Maybe.

[SaintKerrigan]

Setup speculation isn't helping us find scum, methinks.

Vote: Farside22.

[TheLonging]

Either way the Doctor as far as I know isn't told what he successfully protected against and like someone else said if there's a crosskill to Person A then the Doc won't know if that guy was Mafia or Town in the first place. So I still don't see how the Doc acts as a tool for catching Mafia.

But I'm still fairly new with only about 2 games on here under my belt, one ongoing (including this one) and one game completed on another website so I could be missing some super experienced logic that only elite players can understand from countless hours of Mafia gaming.

Right, Doc isn't told what faction he's protecting in any game (from my knowledge), whether they're townies, mafia, or 3rd Party. Doc isn't really good as far as finding information in this current game (though maybe it'll help in later days?) Don't worry, you're not missing anything.

What did you not understand from the above?
doc protects player
one player is dead instead of two come morning.
doc knows based on type of kill that player is not part of that mafia.

no no, I don't think that's how it goes.

Jim is Fire Mafia. Tom is Ice Mafia. Bob is Doctor. Jill is random townie.

Jim targets Jill. Tom targets Jim. Bob protects Jim.
Jill dies. Jim doesn't die because he was targeted by Ice Mafia. Therefore the doctor was null and void in this case and we learn nothing.

Or let's say Bob protects Jill. We don't know if Jill is townie or mafia because no one died. Even if doctor claimed that he protected Jill, Jill could probably be mafia. Am I missing the point you're making? In your latest point you're just speculating. We might know we don't know, and speculating will get us nowhere.

[xofelf]

/conform


CSL, i'm glad you remembered that i had classes. i didn't know this game was starting so soon, also i was babysitting all day yesterday.

but i'm here now... and i agree that setup speculation really doesn't get you anywheres... particularly with a mod like CSL(and i mean that in the best possible way)

[animorpherv1]

One death, doc successfully protected or scum targeted the same player as the doc and that player was scum so the kill didn't go through. Doc still learns nothing, but it's not due to the rule because it would be the same in any other game.

Also, if Fire scum hit Ice scum (or vice-versa) then there kill doesn't die. S, if your Doc and 1 person didn't die,

DO NOT TELL US, as there is no confirmed townies from 2 kill!

[DTMaster]

@Farside
It's more effective it there is 1 mafia group. A doctor can work like a reverse cop when there hasn't been a kill. That said, there are flaws in it. It's understandable.

@TQO
Just because the doctor isn't told who he protected, we can infer based on the results that gets announced.

Note in the PMs on the first page of Night Freeze and Night Burn. You can figure out what happens from that.

@KMD
1. If both scum hit the same target, nothing happens according to that quote. So there is more then one explanation for why there could be a failed kill. Its more beneficial for scum to try and get that person lynched since it could be the opposing scum faction.

@Sarah
That's quite a false leap of logic here. How can farside speculate the setup when

this is an open game

. It's more accurate to say: farside is speculating on how to analyze the night actions once it occurs.

You should also be attacking KMD and me for running with it and starting this conversation.

Your one liners are far less helpful then trying to figure out scum based on night results.

@Town
While we are on that topic, we should move on to other topics. This night action speculation has a high chance of derailment, so for your own personal notes it's best to note your ideas privately.

[Pomegranate]

DTM, I get confused when you refer to SaintKerrigan as Sarah.

[CSL]

/conform


CSL, i'm glad you remembered that i had classes. i didn't know this game was starting so soon, also i was babysitting all day yesterday.

but i'm here now... and i agree that

setup speculation really doesn't get you anywheres... particularly with a mod like CSL

(and i mean that in the best possible way)

Hey, xofelf is indeed correct. Please get back to hunting scum, or mislead lynches (whatever your role says). Setup Speculation goes against the unwritten rule of "Don't try to outgess the mod. It WILL get you nowhere." And will lead to public humiliation.

[DTMaster]

Sarah Kerrigan :p

[CSL]

Nicodemus is being replaced NOW, as I likely won't be on at 8. If he posts before I announce a replacement, he can keep his spot.

[CSL]

Gheb replaces Necodemus!

[Gheb]

Right, I'm the replacement. I've played plenty of Forummafia before and I know about the Fire & Ice set-up so it's all cool, no need to go easy on me or something :p

I'll read what happened so far and come up with something.