Last Will Mafia (Over)

[CryMeARiver]

Yeah that's kinda what I thought too, but the problem is now we're getting into technical things.

Mod: would a RB'ed player still visit?

I doubt it. I thinking SK or scum has special abilities possibly. Has anyone ever heard of a role that bypasses protection? I will research it.

[LlamaFluff]

Vote Count

ortolan (2) - fishythefish
sorasgoof (1) - Elscouta

Not Voting (22) - sorasgoof, Shotty to the Body, nachomamma8, danakillsu, DocPotter, CryMeARiver, raider1869, Ojanen, ortolan, hp [leaves], Steam-Powered Shovel, Parama

~I will not answer any questions about interactions between any roles

[CryMeARiver]

Vote Count

ortolan (2) - fishythefish
sorasgoof (1) - Elscouta

Not Voting (22) - sorasgoof, Shotty to the Body, nachomamma8, danakillsu, DocPotter, CryMeARiver, raider1869, Ojanen, ortolan, hp [leaves], Steam-Powered Shovel, Parama

~I will not answer any questions about interactions between any roles

Awww
So he could have been roleblocked.

[DocPotter]

Tate flipped scum and passed to Cmar.

Tate flipped scum and passed to Cmar.

I'd call this a null tell. Scum could've just as easily given thir votes to town to make it look like scum are giving their votes to scum. Good overall analysis, though.

Tate flipped scum and passed to Cmar.

I'd call this a null tell. Scum could've just as easily given thir votes to town to make it look like scum are giving their votes to scum. Good overall analysis, though.

I have to agree with this. it would be to obvious if the player who receives your vote in case your scum is your scum partner. BUT, could be very obvious that town would think it would be obvious, and therefore gambiting and passing the vote to your partner, right in top of the list.

So, a null tell is the way to go with the vote thing, at least early on

Amished and Fifi both flipped scum, and both called TTTT (scum) passing his vote to CMAR a null tell.
AMished even came in later with a theory about vote passing being a null tell.

Can we lynch the obv scum now please.

CMAR, you're tracking report sucks. If Amsihed got blocked there would be no track. If Fifi got jailed, there would have been a track but Fifi wouldn't have been NK'ed. So Amished protected someone else. Someone who has been obv scum since the start of D1.
You.

Vote CMAR

[Parama]

Holy crap DP, that's awesome.

[Fishythefish]

It's very standard to have no track from roleblockers (my impression is that anything else would be serious diverging from the norm). So options:

- SK (or other) has kill that can't be stopped
- Two kills on Amished (unlikely)
- Some kind of redirection
- CMAR is lying

I think the first and last explanations are the best. Most likely an unblockable kill would be a SK. I actually think this set of results is likely to be genuine (and hence CMAR is tracker, either town or mafia).
- First one is convenient, but plausible
- Second one - why would you make it up? He makes it clear he knows that it's a fairly unlikely result.
- Third one - assuming soras doesn't cc, he'd need to get lucky.

[Elscouta]

Vote: CMAR

[hp [leaves]]

Yay we found all scum (I love how CMAR only "tracked" his scumbuddies)

Vote CMAR

Finally we can lynch him.

[Steam-Powered Shovel]

DP, if their strategy was to frame CMAR, would they really want to make it that obvious? I'm not sure how important them calling it a null tell is.

That said, Amished is pretty much the only person he could claim to have a result on at this point without any negative consequences.

CMAR, why did you decide to track Amished?

[ortolan]

wording of claim is scummy as is failure to die last night

I thought of this exact idea that Amished was a mafia doctor

Really? You openly considered that he was a mafia doctor? Hah. That's kind of weird because that's not a remotely obvious conclusion to draw.

Vote: CMAR

[raider8169]

Vote CMAR

This is the most compelling argument thus far. To me is seems that CMAR has been planing this for a while but missed out on a few things. I dislike the idea of lynching someone with so many votes but I think it will help us in the long run.

[DocPotter]

Raider, do you realise that that is your only vote since D0 ended?

[Steam-Powered Shovel]

I was going to vote for him if he couldn't justify targetting Amished, but then I vaguely remembered something and looked it up:

CMAR: Did your N2 target target someone who died that night?

No, if it had i would have outted it at the risk of it being a town vig...

He's scum. No doubt about it.

Vote: CMAR

, that's 10 votes.

[raider8169]

Raider, do you realise that that is your only vote since D0 ended?

Yes I do, It wasn't intentional until day 3 though. The first two days I was busy and didn't like the lynches and though I tried to be vocal about it, I don't think it made a difference. What changed my thought is that if I manage to stay alive at some point someone would drop a mess load of votes on me and then the game might not be able to move forward. Plus I started thinking that was not in the spirit of the game.

CMAR's case it solid and compelling so at least when I voted its not for a stupid reason or just because.

[Parama]

vote: CMAR

L-1 people.

[Parama]

EBWOP: Changed my mind,

unvote

I still think Amished's ISO is too anti-CMAR for them to be buddies together. Meh.

[Steam-Powered Shovel]

Did you see my post? He's clearly a lying scumbag.

And he could still be a SK or opposing scum if he's not Egyptian.

[Parama]

Did you see my post? He's clearly a lying scumbag.

And he could still be a SK or opposing scum if he's not Egyptian.

No, I think it makes sense. He tracked someone who visited Fifi - it could've been a town vig before he knew the flip.
The wagon building so fast on CMAR should be setting of some major red flags, anyways.

[Ojanen]

I've been super slow/lazy with this but should be done in a couple of hours with finishing reading up. Would appreciate no hammer before that.

[Elscouta]

Vote CMAR

This is the most compelling argument thus far. To me is seems that CMAR has been planing this for a while but missed out on a few things.

I dislike the idea of lynching someone with so many votes but I think it will help us in the long run.

Italicized sentence made alarm bells ding in my head. I can't see a townie saying that when voting for someone with a very fishy claim. Also, I don't remember getting good vibes from raider before.

So, until proper explanation,

Unvote, Vote: raider8169

It hurts to unvote probably-scum CMAR though, but as long as we have another reasonable lynch, i'm ready to let him one more chance to confirm his claim (or be Nk'ed).

[raider8169]

Vote CMAR

This is the most compelling argument thus far. To me is seems that CMAR has been planing this for a while but missed out on a few things.

I dislike the idea of lynching someone with so many votes but I think it will help us in the long run.

Italicized sentence made alarm bells ding in my head. I can't see a townie saying that when voting for someone with a very fishy claim. Also, I don't remember getting good vibes from raider before.

You are aware that scum with many votes is what is going to cause us to lose the game extremely quickly right? I think you misunderstood what I was saying otherwise please explain your reasoning more.

[Parama]

Vote CMAR

This is the most compelling argument thus far. To me is seems that CMAR has been planing this for a while but missed out on a few things.

I dislike the idea of lynching someone with so many votes but I think it will help us in the long run.

Italicized sentence made alarm bells ding in my head. I can't see a townie saying that when voting for someone with a very fishy claim. Also, I don't remember getting good vibes from raider before.

So, until proper explanation,

Unvote, Vote: raider8169

It hurts to unvote probably-scum CMAR though, but as long as we have another reasonable lynch, i'm ready to let him one more chance to confirm his claim (or be Nk'ed).

Hello, you're scum with CMAR in the event of a CMAR scumflip!

[Elscouta]

Vote CMAR

This is the most compelling argument thus far. To me is seems that CMAR has been planing this for a while but missed out on a few things.

I dislike the idea of lynching someone with so many votes but I think it will help us in the long run.

Italicized sentence made alarm bells ding in my head. I can't see a townie saying that when voting for someone with a very fishy claim. Also, I don't remember getting good vibes from raider before.

You are aware that scum with many votes is what is going to cause us to lose the game extremely quickly right? I think you misunderstood what I was saying otherwise please explain your reasoning more.

It's the "and it's going to help us in the long run" that's looking extremely strange to me. If you believe he is scum, you should be just willing to lynch him and there is nothing relating to a "long run". If he is scum, it's just good

now

, if he is town, it's just bad. Planning ahead and considering immediate reward/future risk is also a common scum tell.

@Parama : care to explain why i'd be CMAR buddy (assuming scum-flip) for leaving the wagon with a valid reason while you just did the same without a reason?

[Parama]

Distancing!
You were bussing him because everybody else was voting him, but then you jumped of at the nearest opportunity.

[Elscouta]

Oh, right, because scum usually vote for their buddy when they start getting suspicion and unvote only when the lynch is inevitable.

Anyway, I don't want to argue on something based on a flip we haven't already seen. For now, I'd like raider to explain why he believed lynching CMAR will only help us in the long run.