Mini 931: Supreme Court Mafia (Game Over post 682)

[Darox]

Jason flipping out at me for calling Jack cop confirmed, and according to you, Jason voting me is scum bussing.

I said Scum bussing in LYLO is retarded.

HOW DO YOU GET THE IDEA THAT I'M TALKING ABOUT JASON BUSSING JACK FROM THAT?

PLEASE EXPLAIN TO ME BECAUSE SADLY I AM LACKING IN MAJOR HEAD WOUNDS AND CANNOT UNDERSTAND YOUR POINT OF VIEW.

[camn]

I thought of that before. However, there is presumably still one townie out there who requires one less vote to lynch--and at 7 alive, 4 to lynch, if there are three mafia they could quicklynch.

^^This?
Darox, having intimate knowledge of the researcher role, explained this:

Researcher- Once a night, may send in a name to use your research on. Due to finding precedent, that person would require one less vote to be lynched.

Can not be used past Night 2

.

[Darox]

Actually it never says that the researchers targets don't retain their researched status, which seems to be what Jack is saying.

I never considered it working that way, but if so that means there are possibly two townies (one from Night 0) with research status.

[Jack]

The veto holder description specifies "for the rest of the day". So yeah.

[camn]

Please try to pay attention. Jack isn't even mentioned anywhere in 605, at all.

Jason flipping out at me for calling Jack cop confirmed, and according to you, Jason voting me is scum bussing.....<snip>

So you admit that Jack indeed WAS mentioned in post 605?

@Jack. That IS interesting. Do you think if that is NOT the case, that No-Lynch would be the right play?

MOD: Can you clarify the duration of Research?

UNVOTE

,

for now.

[Darox]

Yes, Jack was mentioned for a split second by someone else that was niether you or me and has no real relevance to the conversation.

Why don't you read the fine print in 625.

[Jack]

Anyway, I checked jason's meta and skimmed two ISO's and I'd put him over Darox. Darox had a town sounding post recently too, which I don't feel like pointing out.

I still like fishy as scum. camn I'm unsure about.

[camn]

Fishy? Really?
I get warm towniness from every one of his posts.


@Darox. Thank you for admitting your error.
And I read it, btw. kthnx.

[Fishythefish]

btw. The cop gets probable/not probable in his results. I didn't feel like pointing out the flaws in assuming that Yos had an innocent on me before, but it's relevant to the "how many scum" and thus "bussing in lylo" question. The reason I didn't see where he breadcrumbed when you said it was obvious earlier is because I don't think he did. It would only be a probable in any case.

Well. If we assume that Yos was consistent, we at least know that his result on you was the same as that on a confirmed town, making him sane or naive.

With virtually confirmed town, no lynch is a bad idea. We should save the no lynch for when it's useful.

I hadn't considered the possibility that people stay researched, and I kind of doubt it - it would be hugely strong.

@Jack: I've got no idea why you think I'm scum. What is it?

[Darox]

Fishy? Really?
I get warm towniness from every one of his posts.


@Darox. Thank you for admitting your error.
And I read it, btw. kthnx.

Are you going to answer it?

Or is this another one of my scum mind tricks, trying to get you to actually explain yourself. Fiendish.

[camn]

>sigh<
Ok.
But you need to understand.. your flawed assumptions start from the very beginning.
I humbly request NO RESPONSE from you (Darox) re: this, unless it is "Oh. I was wrong. Sorry"

SO..
I explained why Jack is town.
Even Darox can remember that.
Then, Jason said:

Wait... how the hell is Jack cop confirmed town? Have I missed something?

The truth is.. he HAD missed something. That is, my lengthy post re: Jack and Yosarian and GC.
(you see this has nothing to do with Darox)
So I say:

I actually explained it pretty clearly, I think.
No need to read posts when you already know who is who, right Jason?

I think one of the BIGGEST scumtells in the world is SKIMMING OVER LOGICAL ARGUMENTS.
Scum need not waste time trying to puzzle out who scum are. THEY ALREADY KNOW.
So I said as much.

Then Darox jumps in, assuming I am talking about he and Jason's cross-buss (that assumption is a scumtell in itself)

Isn't this at odds with your Jason/DryFit/Darox scumteam hypothesis?

Obv.. I don't see how Jason skimming is at odds with my hypothesis.
So I very reasonable answer:

I don't see how.
Care to explain?

Which.. in my view, is never answered.

Later, Darox claims THIS is the answer:

Why would the scum try to bus in Lylo?

Since that answer has nothing to do with Jason throwing Dirt on Jack. I missed it initially. But considering only Jack and Jason were in my original posts... I had to assume the 'bussing' he was talking about was Jason 'bussing' Jack. Not that I even cared.. I understand Darox's REAL answer is to sling as much crap around, and see what sticks.

--------------------

NOW..
If anyone

OTHER than Darox

finds any flaws in my recollection of events, I am interested.
If you, Darox, have anything else other than your admission of hardheaded wrongness.. I am not interested. This argument is anti-town.. just like MOST of your posting today.
I am personally a little bit ashamed that I have let it go on this long.


---------------

Everyone else:
I am totally willing to support a Darox lynch. I will hammer him if possible.. but FOR NOW, I am going to pretend he doesn't exist. We can lynch him tomorrow.

If you guys really think no-lynch is no good, (and you may be right)..Lets get started on Jason.

VOTE: JASON

For skimming, first off. General scumminess second.

[jasonT1981]

did a very quick read-through on jason

his switch from major Jack tunneling to suspicion of DLA because of DLA's suspicion of Jack is bad, his fos on bud is worse, he seems like he is trying to blend into the town. Will most likely vote him once I get a chance to do a detailed read-through

The reason I was suspicious of DLA and his jack is scum suspicion is because all DLA did was scream

LETS LYNCH Jack
JACK is SK
WHY HAVEN'T WE LYNCHED JACK

And other things to that effect.

AND made no effort to make any substancial case on Jack. I still feel Jack is possible scum. But the way DLA went about his suspicions were off to me.

Also yea, I missed that about the confirmed cop thing but I still dont think it is confirmed he had an innocent on Jack.. Jack himself even admits that.

[Netopalis]

I'm a little concerned with how quickly Camn was willing to move over to the Jason wagon. However, I think that our more important suspect is Dry-Fit. Dry-Fit's play this game has defined active lurking in a way that I didn't think was possible. Seriously, look at his ISO - There is

nothing

of substance in there. Nothing! Also, on both days, he cast early throwaway votes on wagons that didn't look like they were going anywhere. Was he trying to avoid pinning himself down to a mislynch? It's possible.

Quite simply, I cannot see a town motivation for his posts. They seem like they're almost designed to create the general impression of a non-scummy lurker in order to avoid suspicion. The more I think about it, the more convinced I become that he is scum.

[jasonT1981]

did a very quick read-through on jason

his switch from major Jack tunneling to suspicion of DLA because of DLA's suspicion of Jack is bad, his fos on bud is worse, he seems like he is trying to blend into the town. Will most likely vote him once I get a chance to do a detailed read-through

The reason I was suspicious of DLA and his jack is scum suspicion is because all DLA did was scream

LETS LYNCH Jack
JACK is SK
WHY HAVEN'T WE LYNCHED JACK

And other things to that effect.

AND made no effort to make any substancial case on Jack. I still feel Jack is possible scum. But the way DLA went about his suspicions were off to me.

Also yea, I missed that about the confirmed cop thing but I still dont think it is confirmed he had an innocent on Jack.. Jack himself even admits that.

[jasonT1981]

Bah, it told me error and it didnt post, when I resubmnit after leaving for a bit its posted twice... geez

[Darox]

You need to understand.. my flawed assumptions start from the very beginning.
SO..
I explained why Jack is town.
Even Darox can remember that.
Then, Jason said in response to Darox:

Wait... how the hell is Jack cop confirmed town? Have I missed something?

Jason then voted Darox. (you see this is directly related to Darox)
The truth is.. Jason HAD missed something. That is, my lengthy post re: Jack and Yosarian and GC.
So I say:

I actually explained it pretty clearly, I think.
No need to read posts when you already know who is who, right Jason?

I think one of the BIGGEST scumtells in the world is SKIMMING OVER LOGICAL ARGUMENTS.
Scum need not waste time trying to puzzle out who scum are. THEY ALREADY KNOW.

Then Darox comments, and I assume he's talking about Jason skimming (that assumption is a scumtell in itself)

Isn't this at odds with your Jason/DryFit/Darox scumteam hypothesis?

Obv.. I don't read anything that doesn't directly mention me.
So I ask:

I don't see how.
Care to explain?

I ignore Daroxs response.

Later, Darox claims THIS is the answer:

Why would the scum try to bus in Lylo?

Since that answer has nothing to do with Jason throwing Dirt on Jack, I was confused for a moment, because this answer didn't revolve around my perfect little world. But then my reality filters kicked in, and I assumed the 'bussing' he was talking about was Jason 'bussing' Jack. Not that I even cared, I'm always right and Darox is trying to confuse me with scum mind tricks.

FTFY.
I'm glad we got that cleared up.



In other news, Jason, surely you can see that lynching the person with a cop innocent on them in LYLO is a bad idea? Do you have any secondary suspects or are you adamant about sticking to Jack?

[Jack]

Darox is scum again.

Jason has been voting you for quite some time (since right after he pointed out it was lylo).

You obviously just read the part of his post where he was quoting DLA. Skimming = scummy

[pman5595]

did a very quick read-through on jason

his switch from major Jack tunneling to suspicion of DLA because of DLA's suspicion of Jack is bad, his fos on bud is worse, he seems like he is trying to blend into the town. Will most likely vote him once I get a chance to do a detailed read-through

The reason I was suspicious of DLA and his jack is scum suspicion is because all DLA did was scream

LETS LYNCH Jack
JACK is SK
WHY HAVEN'T WE LYNCHED JACK

And other things to that effect.

AND made no effort to make any substancial case on Jack. I still feel Jack is possible scum. But the way DLA went about his suspicions were off to me.

Also yea, I missed that about the confirmed cop thing but I still dont think it is confirmed he had an innocent on Jack.. Jack himself even admits that.

So you felt at the time that DLA was bussing? I don't think anyone would think scum would bus like that. Didyour opinion on Jack change when DLA flipped town? And Jack IS basically cop-confirmed town, there were 2 people that Yosarian described as obv-town, one of them for each night he could have made an investigation, and one flipped town.

[camn]

Darox is scum again.

Jason has been voting you for quite some time (since right after he pointed out it was lylo).

You obviously just read the part of his post where he was quoting DLA. Skimming = scummy

Shall we lynch him then?
I would be very interested to see how Jason behaves with Darox at L-1.

If Jason's vote sticks.. we have him, you, me.... and we need 2 more, right?

Fishy says he is 'not ready'..
Pman has suspiciously not commented on Darox.
Netopolis is softening toward him, I feel.. but had some decent Darox-hate a couple posts back.
and Dry fit can't be relied on to lynch anyone, I dont think.

Pman

.. your opinion of Darox?

Netopolis

... do you retain enough hate to lynch?

Fishy

.. what would it take to get you ready?

Dry-fit

.. are you willing to bus your buddy to look more townie tomorrow?

[Darox]

Jason has been voting you for quite some time (since right after he pointed out it was lylo).

You obviously just read the part of his post where he was quoting DLA. Skimming = scummy

I still feel Jack is possible scum.

But the way DLA went about his suspicions were off to me.

Also yea, I missed that about the confirmed cop thing but I still dont think it is confirmed he had an innocent on Jack.. Jack himself even admits that.

No, I didn't just read the part of his post where he was quoting DLA.

I did forget he was voting me though. I got too caught up in camns crazy 'Darox is evil scum' cries to remember about Jasons 'Darox is evil scum' cries.

[Netopalis]

Camn - If it came down to Darox vs. Deadline, I'd vote Darox, but I think we can do better. Still, I'll review the case and think about it some more.

[pman5595]

Pman

.. your opinion of Darox?

Darox is Null to slight town right now. The argument is gaining both of you town points, you both seems to be trying to uncover the truth but are disagreeing on what the truth exactly is.

Right now, Jason is scum. ooh, that reminds me, I forgot to do this:

Vote: Jason

. Dry-fit is the most likely out of the rest to be scum. Assuming there is a third, I am really torn. I really don't think it is fishy or Netopolis, they seem very town to me. Jack is very likely cop-confirmed. I am not scum. That leaves you and Darox. Both of you seem like town so one of you is playing a really good game, and right now I cannot decide between you two.

[Dry-fit]

Also, on both days, he cast early throwaway votes on wagons that didn't look like they were going anywhere. Was he trying to avoid pinning himself down to a mislynch? It's possible.

On day 1 I threw away my vote by putting it on the biggest wagon at the time? I really thought a camn/pwnman wagon might get traction at some point. Several people voiced suspicion of her.

Dry-fit.. are you willing to bus your buddy to look more townie tomorrow?

Well I've already said jason is my top suspect, so I guess so.

[Battousai]

Vote Count:

jasonT1981 -2- camn, pman5595
Darox -1- jasonT1981

Not Voting:

Netopalis, Dry-fit, Darox, Fishythefish, Jack

With 8 alive, it takes 5 to lynch!

[Fishythefish]

Fishy says he is 'not ready'..
Pman has suspiciously not commented on Darox.
Netopolis is softening toward him, I feel.. but had some decent Darox-hate a couple posts back.
and Dry fit can't be relied on to lynch anyone, I dont think.

Pman

.. your opinion of Darox?

Netopolis

... do you retain enough hate to lynch?

Fishy

.. what would it take to get you ready?

Dry-fit

.. are you willing to bus your buddy to look more townie tomorrow?

By "not ready", I mean that I don't think Darox is sufficiently scummy to merit lynching. To get me ready, someone would have to provide a much better case against Darox than I've seen so far.

Rereading D-F on a content hunt (almost entirely from his iso):
- pwnman attacks early day 1 are fine.
- Not much else for a while. Equivocal stance on jason's attitude on Jack. Commenting on DLA's tunnelling without calling him scummy.
- camn vote early D2 is fine - for lack of content/suspicions. Decides that DLA's tunnelling has become scummy - a reasonable point of view. Attacks for Yos for a dodgy townread on GC - which is fair enough (in fact, it was a breadcrumb).
- Since then, less content. Declared a strong townread on me. jason has crept up his suspicions for no obvious reason.
@Neto: I'm not really seeing active lurking here. There's content there, and reads, and he hasn't posted that much. I get a feeling he's trying to hedge his bets at some points (on jason and DLA, primarily), but nothing screams scum.