Karma Mafia (Game Over!)

[Patrick]

Votecount

RichardGHP (7) -- Porochaz, Faraday, bv310, NickF227, Pomegranate, boberz, Albert B. Rampage
bv310 (5) -- Papa Zito, Seraphim, Espeonage, farside22, curiouskarmadog
Espeonage (1) -- Ojanen
dybeck (1) -- Sando
NickF227 (2) -- Jahudo, Anon
Seraphim (2) -- Amished, Javert
boberz (2) -- dybeck, RichardGHP

Not voting: Nobody
20 alive, 11 to lynch.

Deadline: April 8th, 11 pm GMT.

[Amished]

@Sera: From the tone of your posts lately it seems like you should be voting for boberz; and I don't know why you aren't given how much you talked about him. I don't see how

While bv has not done much to decrease his scumminess, I think he is more likely to be town than I originally thought. I think both the Espeonage and Nick wagons warrant further investigation.

someone who is more likely to be town (but still scum?)

Read the original quote again. Nice misrep, BTW. I said he was MORE LIKELY. Not LIKELY. I said MORE LIKELY. Big difference does that modifier make.

would be less scummy than somebody who's done pbpa's, made a critical defense of whom you were attacking to "derail the wagon" and from what you've said (or not said) hasn't really done anything pro-town.

Oh, and you still haven't explained this little gem:

Also:

-snip-

Second point: bv wagon = Papa Zito, Anon, Seraphim, Espeonage, farside22, curiouskarmadog, RichardGHP

hmmm...if we assume I'm town, I feel the town is the majority here.

Richard is VI, I think. That doesn't excuse his play but that's what I'm feeling right now. That's likely to change if he doesn't get off his lazy ass and post. Espeonage is most likely to be bussing scum...I don't get that feeling from Richard.

I'm not letting bv310 off the hook...I'm just ensuring that I'm not ignoring what else is happening in the game.

Also, I've been looking at the bv wagon and a lot of the scummier players in the game are on it.

This has caused me to doubt the wagon's validity.

Wait, what? This is the wagon on bv about 17 hours after Sera's post, and no votes or unvotes occurred during that period (early page 22 to first post page 23)

bv310 (7) -- Papa Zito, Anon, Seraphim, Espeonage, farside22, curiouskarmadog, RichardGHP

Finally: let me ask you: what motivation would boberz scum have in saying what he did if bv were his partner? Is he trying to protect a fake-claim with that? Something that no scum team ever sets up for day 1? I'm not buying it at all and that is the exact reason why I'm not voting for boberz. The more I think about it I'm getting less and less willing to vote for bv as well.

[bv310]

Hey guys, sorry for the lack of contributions. Life's been hectic lately, with no likelihood of getting better. I'm going to have to cut down my Mafia playing, so I'll be replacing out. Hopefully you guys will get someone who can be useful.

[bv310]

Didn't realize how close to deadline it was. I'll stick around for now, then try to replace over night.

[Ojanen]

Bouncing back from V/LA earlier than expected! Albert, thanks, working on it.

I'm going to have to cut down my Mafia playing, so I'll be replacing out.

Are you serious?! 5 minutes ago in Square Enix large theme sign ups:

/in

Daystart

Square ftw.

HoS bv

catching up the rest soon

[Seraphim]

Alright, come on people, if you weren't voting for bv now, I think this would be a great time to do so.

[bv310]

That game's not starting for another week or so at least, which is when exams are over.

[Seraphim]

Hey guys, sorry for the lack of contributions.

Life's been hectic lately, with no likelihood of getting better.

I'm going to have to cut down my Mafia playing, so I'll be replacing out. Hopefully you guys will get someone who can be useful.

That game's not starting for

another week or so at least, which is when exams are over.

Yep, yep, whatever.

[Ojanen]

Till deadline=3 days, night=about 3 days probably, almost a week. Why do you want out of this game during the night?

[dybeck]

Finally: let me ask you: what motivation would boberz scum have in saying what he did if bv were his partner? Is he trying to protect a fake-claim with that? Something that no scum team ever sets up for day 1? I'm not buying it at all and that is the exact reason why I'm not voting for boberz. The more I think about it I'm getting less and less willing to vote for bv as well.

They're not

both

scum, so

neither

of them is scum?

[Amished]

@dybeck: That's the feeling that I'm getting

[Albert B. Rampage]

NEW POMEGRANATE CASE:

1) She hasn't expanded any of her suspicions since page 14, which was the last time she called someone scummy or said she'd vote for them:

Willing to vote for: BV, Richard, or Espeonage. After that, Anon.

These are based on about one point per person. I think it would be easier for scum to give stances earlier in the game, when its okay to only have minor points build up your case. Her inactivity (a valid non-tell) is not an excuse for not developing any reads with all this new information.

2) She's been asking questions but not giving analysis after the questions have been answered. She hasn't given follow-ups or pursued any leads on recent events. The little questions and comments look like a way for her to stay pro-active without ever finding anything. Examples of this are:
* Post 426 she asks ABR why he initially said he'd be up for any lynch but his, which he changes when he specifically wants to vote BV. Her question doesn't explain her opinion on him, and she has dropped that issue since then.
* Post 566 she asks Javert if his unvoting of Richard means he no longer finds Richard scummy. Again after her question is responded to, she drop the inquiry without giving an opinion on whether or not she found Javert's actions suspicious.
* Post 567 she asks Zito why he speculated BV might be town, when he was voting for BV.

Without Point #1, I wouldn't have a problem with Point #2 because I could believe she was letting go of dead end inquiries in favor of the good ones she was still pursuing. But Point #1 is about her not having any ongoing cases. She's been sitting on small, stale tells without finding anything new.

Which becomes a good scum strategy for day 1 because we're nearing deadline and she can safely push either Richard or BV without having had to make a case for them over the course of the day.

The scums: [Nick, Espy, Pom]

This, I like.

[boberz]

Sorry Jahudu I was talking about Nick not Jack (he is in another game I am in got them mixed up briefly). Nick is the one I dont really get and want to see more of.

Seraphim has now confused me more. He now says the crux of his agument against me is me trying to clear someone when I thought I had a point that cleared that person? I am struggling to take this attack seriously I am certainly struggling to find what I am meant to reply to.

More Later.

[farside22]

bobz made me feel better about him. Thank you for the reference and in short I see scum freek out more often then town.
I have lots of walls' of text to catch up on but after reading Richard's post and vote for bobz I just really want to vote him all over again.

[boberz]

I guess that is good for me in this game, but somehting I should address for future then farside. I will do my best.

[Seraphim]

Amished: I meant to say that there was a greater likelihood of him being town than I had originally accounted when I stated he was scum. I was

not

saying that I thought he was town like he you seem to be believe.

I don't think there's a contradiction there, the wagon posts. Both states are not mutually exclusive...Espeonage and Richard, some of the game's more anti-town/scummy players, and Anon to a degree, however, town is still in the majority of that wagon...I believe Papa Zito, farside, CKD, and myself to be town.

what motivation would boberz scum have in saying what he did if bv were his partner? Is he trying to protect a fake-claim with that? Something that no scum team ever sets up for day 1? I'm not buying it at all and that is the exact reason why I'm not voting for boberz. The more I think about it I'm getting less and less willing to vote for bv as well.

My argument was that boberz was trying to save his buddy, bv, from the gallows by citing a supposed "townslip". I don't see any deeper motivation than that...I think he made a newbscum mistake.

[boberz]

How much of a newbie do you think I am Sera. I accept I am a newbie, but the things you accuse me of are below even the most basic slips.

[Seraphim]

How much of a newbie do you think I am Sera. I accept I am a newbie, but the things you accuse me of are below even the most basic slips.

This is why I'm not voting you right now.

[farside22]

Once they're called on it, it's clear that their lurking is doing them no good, and is making them look scummier. What 'tactical' good would it do them in this instance to continue lurking?

\
What tactical good does it do for any allignment to be called out on lurker and continue to lurk? This question is just rediculous.

I seem to be a magnet for VT roles.

facepalm.jpg

I took this to mean "I'm always VT, and here I am yet again."

Do you believe him?
I didn't see this as a claim by the way just an answer to your meta question.

Nick post 678 And the name calling comes out.
Really your contrabutions this game or horrid.

Richard post 685 I have looked and their useless drivel. Nothing protown or scum hunting in them. I've seen players replace for any number of reason's allignment means nothing.

@amished: What is your views of Richard and bv so far?

Pom post 704 this constant following I'm getting is bothering me. Last time someone followed me like Pom has they were scum.

unvote:
vote: Pomegranate

What are your own views, oppinions and thoughts on the players in the game so far?

@sera: I have done PBPA's town and scum. Not sure what your point at all or why your against them. I use them as town to help me narrow down scum.

@dybekc: Why do you think bobz should be lynched?

I havent even read the wallotexting this thread is evolving into.

But seriously, this wagon has a lot of scummy people its not even funny.

RichardGHP (6) -- Porochaz, Faraday, bv310, NickF227, Pomegranate, boberz

I think if richardscum bussers should have already gone to other viable choices. Just only analyzing tis wagon, we have richard likely town.

I agree but is it wrong to wish him gone/shot/vigged/lynched just for being anti-town?
Just saying.

Can you show examples of what BV's "scum slip and fakeclaim" posts would look like if they got the same information across but were made by town? (The posts are where he doesn't consider the possibility of PZ as town, and where he says he's a magnet for VT roles.) I currently feel that these two posts are more about him having trouble getting his meaning across than they are slips and fakeclaims. So I believe his defense and don't see the rationale for a BV lynch.

I never thought he was sliping anything. I thought he was asked for meta on where he was scum and was saying he hasn't had anything but VT or light power roles.


My scum suspects: Pom, dybeck, Nick, bv (would go back in a heartbeat there too)
I like Pom better because I caught scum budding me in another game and I correctly found it and got them lynched day 2. I'm not going to miss a day on noting and voting on this classic tell.

[Amished]

@farside: I replaced into that game with ckd and richard on day 3 or so, and from replacing in here, the feel of Richard seems really similar. I haven't done any extensive meta or anything of him, but his overreactions that seem over the top for anybody else and sulking fit what I know of him. Other than that, I haven't seen anything that just jumps out as scummy to me.

How much do you think you get buddied overall by town and/or scum? (town that just get a good read on you and scum that know you're town in one form or another)

I need to look over pom for once cause from my limited experience with her I've been rather successful in determining her alignment with very little to go on.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Unvote, vote Pom

[farside22]

@farside: I replaced into that game with ckd and richard on day 3 or so, and from replacing in here, the feel of Richard seems really similar. I haven't done any extensive meta or anything of him, but his overreactions that seem over the top for anybody else and sulking fit what I know of him. Other than that, I haven't seen anything that just jumps out as scummy to me.

How much do you think you get buddied overall by town and/or scum? (town that just get a good read on you and scum that know you're town in one form or another)

I need to look over pom for once cause from my limited experience with her I've been rather successful in determining her alignment with very little to go on.

Funny enough I don't always notice it. It was something I just hit on recently. Both games I have looked at those following and one I was dead on about the player being scum. The other is on going and as well and I they are not dead but I am. So no sure results there.
I notice that others get buddied in a game tend to come from scum towards a player that speaks out as town and get good senergy from.
Most recently this was when I saw Iam play up to Fate in a game that ended where Iam was scum if you want that link.
So I'm more super aware of watching players that buddy without reason and just following then I was before.

[Amished]

Pom wouldn't be my first choice now that I've read her in ISO, but I'd switch to her to get a lynch done. Cause there's no half the number required to lynch or anything like that. It's a full majority or nothing.

[Amished]

@farside: Now that you mention it, I'm much more likely to buddy as scum than as town; so I see where you're coming from.

One more question: how much have you played with Pom?

[farside22]

@farside: Now that you mention it, I'm much more likely to buddy as scum than as town; so I see where you're coming from.

One more question: how much have you played with Pom?

I believe this is our 5th game together. The one time I thought she was town, she was scum.
She actually tried to get a case together and seemed to scum hunt in that game where as typically she has foot in mouth and comes off scummy and unmotivated.