Mini 980 - Trader Mafia (Game Over)

[Andrius]

I think everyone but Kerrigan's had the chance to claim NK. So if he/she doesn't have it then I think its safe to say its in the hands of a scum faction.

Should we start claiming at L-2, to prevent a quick hammer by Jack?

Definitely. We can't just ignore the mechanics at play in this game. Come D2, if not sooner, we're going to have some new stuff on the market, so that'll need a look over and we'll have to see how it plays in with the current powers.

@ Jack: Why the games earlier, when you were trying to convince me the doublevoter was Zang? Do you have something to hide?

[Steam-Powered Shovel]

@SPS: Why NS?

Because he is an infidel waiting to be purged from our lands with fire!

Andrius, this is just how Jack plays.

Jack does have a valid point about Andrius-Zang, albeit a not particularly significant one.

[Zang]

You're zang's scumbuddy, and that's why you instantly knew he wasn't the double voter.

why am I scum if I don't have the doublevote?

@Jack/Zang: Why buy double voter?

I didn't

@Zang: I don't see what you mean by "because you knew something was wrong", in the context of your post about unvoting. Could you try to rephrase that?

I didn't think you all couldn't misread the rules so I knew that something was wrong.

[Jack]

VV is scum. When I played with him as town he was very active to start, discussed the mechanics, requested and

read

meta's. This game he's lurking but pops in when mentioned, with a comment that shows he hasn't been reading that carefully (one of zang/jack is the DV). Fishy makes a good point about how the abilities matter. I don't see why a townie would be not interested in buying a role.

@Fishy: I don't like to make cases often. The above is about as lengthy as I go.

[Fishythefish]

Link to that VV town game, Jack or VV? (Unlike VV, I sometimes don't get round to reading meta I request, but I'll try)

[Jack]

Link to that VV town game, Jack or VV? (Unlike VV, I sometimes don't get round to reading meta I request, but I'll try)

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 45&start=0

[Zajnet]

So Jack, why did you buy the doublevote?

[Zang]

And why did you say I have it?

[Jack]

So Jack, why did you buy the doublevote?

I already answered that.

[NavyCherub]

@Zajnet: in my experience, you don't want to drown in the setup. Scumhunting isn't affected much by all these abilities in unknown places - and it's not really inherently any more confusing than a closed setup. There'll almost certainly be some points where the game mechanic is critical, but until then you'd be well advised not to think too much about it.

I wholeheartedly disagree. I mean, look at the effects that the setup has had so far. We had more discussion in pregame than a lot of games have in the two or three (or more) pages of RVS that usually happen. Speaking of RVS, we almost didn't really have one at all, and people are calling each other out based on things said about the setup, the abilities, and the marketplace. Normal scumhunting can happen alongside the focus that is necessary based on the very different kind of setup. Why, Fishy, would you try to tell the town not to scumhunt in a way that has proved to provide plenty of discussion so far?

[Fishythefish]

Zajnet was expressing that he was finding scumhunting difficult

because

of the unusual setup. My experience is that in unusual/confusing setups setup speculation is done too much, to the detriment of "normal" scumhunting.

While the marketplace has provided plenty of discussion so far, I'd say there is a lot less alignment related stuff flying around than at this stage of a typical game.

The setup is obviously important, and when it is useful to form strategies and/or find scum, of course it matters. But talking about the setup isn't a substitute for scumhunting, and I think towns tend to talk about the setup too much way more than they talk about it too little.

[Zang]

So Jack, why did you buy the doublevote?

I already answered that.

Are my posts invisible to you?

[VasudeVa]

@Fish: I don't get the FoS. Soo, I'm suspicious because I don't want to talk about who won the NK/bulletproof/whatever but am willing to talk about the DV which was obviously bought by Jack? What desperate defensiveness hm?

@Jack: Cool. There is such a thing called life wherein sometimes, when you least expect it, your schedule changes and you have less time for internet mafia. It happens.

While town should be interested in buying abilities, scum would be a lot more interested in them. Just sayin.

[Jack]

willing to talk about the DV which was

obviously

bought by Jack?

Looking at the vote counts, one of Zang/Jack is the DV. It'll be kind of silly for Jack to lie about being the double voter, but that'll be easily apparent soon enough.

@Jack: Cool. There is

such a thing called life

wherein sometimes, when you least expect it, your schedule changes and you have less time for internet mafia. It happens.

I'm here.

Not really interested in talking about mechanics that don't really matter/apply yet.

Spot the changes in story.

[VasudeVa]

1. I wasn't sure yet until now.
2. So because I'm here now and posting, I'm suddenly lying?

[Zang]

Vote: Jack

[farside22]

Last time VV was that back and forth in responses he flipped scum. I may join that wagon. I'm still waiting to see anything town from SK who is posting nothing at all this game. Actively lurking is a big flag I'm not letting go of.

[Fishythefish]

@Fish: I don't get the FoS. Soo, I'm suspicious because I don't want to talk about who won the NK/bulletproof/whatever but am willing to talk about the DV which was obviously bought by Jack? What desperate defensiveness hm?

The desperate defense I refer to: when attacked for not contributing during the marketplace stage, your defense was that you were "not really interested in talking about mechanics that don't really matter/apply yet". Whatever alignment you are, this is totally untrue. The mechanics clearly matter and apply already. The only reason I can see for saying this is trying to discredit that point against you, and not caring about the truth of your arguments while doing so.

I do

not

suspect you for failing to talk about the NK/BP/whatever. I suspect you because of that post.

While town should be interested in buying abilities, scum would be a lot more interested in them. Just sayin.

Why?

##vote: VV

[Andrius]

FoS: VV

I've only playing in one other game with him, so I'd have to meta him to see if he's like this when he's scum.

Actively lurking is a big flag I'm not letting go of.

THIS. Can you like, go post this in every game I'm in? lol

[Zang]

##Vote:Jack

[VasudeVa]

@Fish: 1. No one is claiming whatever they bought(yet), so any discussion is theory and also moot. You yourself agree that we should not drown ourselves in speculation and that was what I was talking about.

2. Because without the powers, scum are NK-less, not to mention weak. Also if they didn't get it, some one else got it and they'll fear for their necks. Shouldn't that make them more interested in buying/finding out who got the powers hm?

@Andrius: Well, I know how you act when you're scum .

[farside22]

Zang why did you vote on Jack?

I think several abilities here are scumtells. Most obviously investigation immunity and the unclaimed NK, but also double vote. The reason for my focus on that is that we can find out who they are.

This doesn't explain why only someone scum would buy a double vote.

[zoraster]

Day 1 Vote Count

Nobody Special ( 2 ) Andrius, Steam-Powered Shovel,
farside22 ( 0 )
Zang ( 0 )
Jack ( 2 ) VasudeVa, Zang,
SaintKerrigan ( 1 ) farside22,
Zajnet ( 0 )
NavyCherub ( 0 )
VasudeVa ( 3 ) Jack, Fishythefish,
Andrius ( 0 )
Fishythefish ( 1 ) NavyCherub,
Steam-Powered Shovel ( 0 )
flashstorm ( 1 ) SaintKerrigan,
Not Voting ( 3 ) Nobody Special, Zajnet, flashstorm,
Total Votes ( 13 )
Deadline: June 14th at 23:00 EDT
With 13 total votes, 7 needed to lynch.

This vote count had an error that has been fixed.

[Steam-Powered Shovel]

*hops*

Unvote, vote: Andrius

[Jack]

SPS, you're the only one on that wagon (me and fishy are on VV). Also, there is no unvoting. Also, that vote doesn't count.

fos:SPS

@zor: I think your vote counter is missing the votes for "VV" and "Vas".

##vote:VasudeVa