Mini 967 - Mafia War (Over)

[Hrezs]

Spyre - What makes you say that Horror is town?
At this point I'm feelin Stef as town, but I don't get the same vibes from horror.

Also, I'm not gonna lie, was a bit confused when Spyre started posting since I glazed over that line in Snow Bunny's post >_>

[Exemption]

Sorry will be away for the weekend. Will be back late sunday.

Noted. Have fun!

[Snow_Bunny]

-Vote Count-

Amish_Charney (3) - Empking, Hrez, deadjoker
Hrezs (0)
Spyrex (0)
horrordude0215 (1) - Stef
Soundwish (2) - Amish_Charney, Spyrex
Katsuki (1) - Exemption
Stef (1) - horrordude0215
deadjoker (0)
Exemption (1) - Soundwish
Empking (1) - Katsuki

Not voting - No one.

With ten alive, it's six to lynch.

Deadline is on 18 June 2010.

[Stef]

1 (Post 259): Oh no, a self vote!
2 (Post 251): Why should Me= try to claim and save himself if need be?
3 (Post 237): I think he's more of a noob than scum.

Give quotes, not interpretations considering you have been on me for misrepping.

1. It wasn't a "Oh no" it was a "meh". Are they the same thing to you? If they are you are probably a cheerleader.

2. Is that what I said? Quote me saying that. I dare you.

3. More noob

THAN

scum? Quote me saying that as well.

I, however, will bring quotes:

My Scumdar atm is set around:
1. Unsight

2. Me=Weird

I'll wait till tomorrow to see if the Unsight case gets enough heat for a lynch. If not, I'll go for Me=Weird but please weigh in both options.

Oh.. yeah.. wait. You stopped mentioning my posts right before the one above where I said clearly that I'd vote for Me=Weird if the wagon didn't turn towards Unsight. You doing this is manipulative like hell and that is scummy. Your vote for me based on absolutely nothing is just a scummy cry for getting voted.

-------------------

Welcome SpyreX! Long time no play Very long time actually... still remember that game with you, camn, kmd ... hehe. Thank you for replacing in I know you to be an active player so hopefully this game will pick up more and become more interesting. Welcome!

Back to business... you telling us who is town is helpful... why? I see no way that is helpful for the town. If anything it can only help the mafia in a couple of ways. You have enough games under your belt to know that and you can't invoke the argument of helping the town's discussion by telling me and horror to stop considering that if we were both town we would have no reason to trust you.

Also, I will have to ask you to give me a summary with why you think Sound is scummy. Not that I don't agree with you, it's just that some of us have been expressing our suspicion of him lately and your vote, without reasons, would seem opportunistic which it does appear to be.

Also, Me=Weird's move of selfvoting was a town move? lol. It was equal to 0 both ways. If it were town he would do this out of frustration, if it were scum there would be nothing else left to do so why not try this? Either way, not an indicator of town.

I think you're a little scummy Didn't think pman was town either but there's no connection to what I thought about him and you, just coincides and makes the opinion stronger.

Please don't forget to explain why you voted for Soundwish.

Also, why can't they be scum together?

--------------------------------

P.S. "Why is X town" kind of discussions are horrible. Let's turn to "Who is scum", shall we?

[SpyreX]

I'll get to specific reasons when I have more time about Sound. Hopefully later today.

And, yes, I do have another couple strong reads. The difference? You two are gnawing at each other like cats and dogs and that isn't helpful. Deer, sure, is a bit different but pointing that out and getting you chuckleheads to agree on it becomes a very, very powerful tool.

At that point with Weird him acknowledging of his own volition that the majority was required and voting for the sole purpose of guaranteeing a lynch, even on himself, is pretty town. Not that I'd ever say that is an AWESOME MOVE but it was a town one.

Together doesn't make sense with the way they've been sniping at each other. I can explain that in detail if I must as well. Sheeeeesh.

[Stef]

He didn't really vote for himself. He didn't unvote. He could have known it, he could have not. We'll never know.

[horrordude0215]

Stef, I'm not going to continue this mindless back and forth. Like Spy pointed out, it's extremely anti-town.

Unvote, Vote: Katsuki

Post 257 really messes with me. You actually go as far as to acknowledge that it's a majority lynch, but you neglect to hammer. Tell me how that's not scummy and how it's not someone hoping for a no lynch.

[horrordude0215]

@Empking: Could you please get an avatar? Thanks!

[Katsuki]

Horror, how is this back and forth anti-town in any way? The only anti-town thing is using spyrex's statement to get out of the discussion between you two, especially with stef's last post. Nice job trying to avoid stef and divert attention to me.

Spyrex comes in and saves horror from being grilled further by stef.

FOS: Spyrex

Vote: horror

[horrordude0215]

It's back and forth because it could very well be Town V. Town, and it's letting people like you do nothing but sit in the background and lurk.

Nice OMGUS, by the way.

[Katsuki]

Once again, how is the back and forth anti-town? We also have no idea as to your alignments, so how can you assume that it is Town v. Town?

Also, how is it OMGUS?
Seems like you are trying to degrade my vote.

[horrordude0215]

How is it OMGUS? Hmm, let's look at your ISO shall we? Nope, you've never expressed any suspicion on me, yet when I vote for you you immediately vote me back.

And the back and forth is anti-town because even if it IS Town V. Scum, it allows others to sit in the background and lurk, much like you were doing before I voted you.

[Amish_Charney]

Yeah, that's some pretty substantial OMGUS there, my 'dar is twitching. For what it's worth, I'm getting town vibes from both Stef and horrordude, either that or I'm just easily impressed by debating .

Soundwish, I thought was newbscummy because it has all the hallmarks of the things new scum players are guilty of- short, uninvolved posts, tunnelvisions on lynching, you've been banging the opportunism drum since the start of the game and get visibly bitchy when people don't jump on your wagon. You're scummy, and it doesn't entirely matter what prefixes I attach to it, you pompous ass.

Please refrain from using such prefixes. I REALLY dislike this kind of things. You've been warned.

[Katsuki]

Funny how the scummiest person left from D1 is siding with horror.

@Horror: Erm, that was not exactly my reason for voting. Your vote means nothing to me. Spyrex's comments and your willingness to go along with the stairs he provides for you to leave the stage is what led to my vote.

You also still haven't responded to what stef said about your misrep of quotes.

Furthermore, when there is good discussion happening, why would we step in and derail it?

[Soundwish]

AC, I will respond to the content of your post tomorrow when I have more time, but I haven't insulted you and so I'm a little hurt that you decided to insult me. I don't play mafia for that.

Mod:

please note AC's post 337.

[horrordude0215]

Funny how the scummiest person left from D1 is siding with horror.

Chainsaw defenses only work if there's a scum flip. Nice try, though!

@Horror: Erm, that was not exactly my reason for voting. Your vote means nothing to me. Spyrex's comments and your willingness to go along with the stairs he provides for you to leave the stage is what led to my vote.

You haven't even MENTIONED me until after I voted for you... how is that not outright and blatant OMGUS?

You also still haven't responded to what stef said about your misrep of quotes.

If he wants, I will address them.

Furthermore, when there is good discussion happening, why would we step in and derail it?

Did you seriously just ask why you should talk? LOL. I never said to derail the discussion, I just said that comments of any sort would be good.

And what about you, kat? You never commented on why you specifically avoided hammering after acknowledging that there would be a no lynch if Me= wasn't hammered... hypocrisy much?

[Katsuki]

@Lack of vote:

I thought he put himself at L1, and I was not going to hammer right after he self-voted. I would have been able to get online before day ended to hammer if needed but I wanted to give others a chance to react.


@Vote: How does me not having mentioned you before have anything to do with this? It means nothing. I looked at what spyrex wrote, then the things you said and did after, and voted you for it. This is not OMGUS. Nice attempt at strawman though.
If I feel that you are scummy, am I not allowed to vote for you? I really think that you are trying to use my vote as a distraction, not to mention using "OMGUS" degrade my vote.

[horrordude0215]

@Lack of vote:

I thought he put himself at L1, and I was not going to hammer right after he self-voted. I would have been able to get online before day ended to hammer if needed but I wanted to give others a chance to react.

The lynch scene was posted over 24 hours after your "Well then, I'm not gonna hammer even though I should" post, and you didn't make another post after... why is that?

@Vote: How does me not having mentioned you before have anything to do with this? It means nothing. I looked at what spyrex wrote, then the things you said and did after, and voted you for it. This is not OMGUS. Nice attempt at strawman though.
If I feel that you are scummy, am I not allowed to vote for you? I really think that you are trying to use my vote as a distraction, not to mention using "OMGUS" degrade my vote.

I never said you couldn't vote for me. I just pointed out that HOW you did it (without previously even acknowledging I was really in the game) was very scummy.

And something I just noticed:

Funny how the scummiest person left from D1 is siding with horror.

Hmm... let's look a certain post, shall we?

Reasons given for AC vote are totally based on WIFOM. Either AC is indeed scum, or mafia NK'ed unsight to frame AC. Convenient way for mafia to frame a scummy-looking AC, and seems more like the later of the two possibilities I stated.

It looks to me like you thought that AC wasn't very likely to be scum, but all of a sudden now you decide to throw in the fact that AC was defending me? Why the sudden contradiction? Oh wait, I know... to help build a non-existant case on me!

[Katsuki]

@Lack of vote:

I thought he put himself at L1, and I was not going to hammer right after he self-voted. I would have been able to get online before day ended to hammer if needed but I wanted to give others a chance to react.

The lynch scene was posted over 24 hours after your "Well then, I'm not gonna hammer even though I should" post, and you didn't make another post after... why is that?

Now why should I have hammered? I'm quite curious of the thoughts behind YOUR reasoning.

@Vote: How does me not having mentioned you before have anything to do with this? It means nothing. I looked at what spyrex wrote, then the things you said and did after, and voted you for it. This is not OMGUS. Nice attempt at strawman though.
If I feel that you are scummy, am I not allowed to vote for you? I really think that you are trying to use my vote as a distraction, not to mention using "OMGUS" degrade my vote.

I never said you couldn't vote for me. I just pointed out that HOW you did it (without previously even acknowledging I was really in the game) was very scummy.

Yes because spyrex was in the game before. Really, this is quite laughable. You refuse to acknowledge that my vote came as a result of what spyrex said, and THEN how YOU reacted to it.

And something I just noticed:

Funny how the scummiest person left from D1 is siding with horror.

Hmm... let's look a certain post, shall we?

Reasons given for AC vote are totally based on WIFOM. Either AC is indeed scum, or mafia NK'ed unsight to frame AC. Convenient way for mafia to frame a scummy-looking AC, and seems more like the later of the two possibilities I stated.

It looks to me like you thought that AC wasn't very likely to be scum, but all of a sudden now you decide to throw in the fact that AC was defending me? Why the sudden contradiction? Oh wait, I know... to help build a non-existant case on me!

How and when did I say anything about AC not being likely scum? The whole point of WIFOM is that both possibilities are equally probable... It was in response to empking's insta-vote. You did it to stef too, but stop mis-reping what people say. It doesn't help your argument at all.

Furthermore, what does what I said about AC have to do with your defence? Nothing.

[horrordude0215]

@Lack of vote:

I thought he put himself at L1, and I was not going to hammer right after he self-voted. I would have been able to get online before day ended to hammer if needed but I wanted to give others a chance to react.

The lynch scene was posted over 24 hours after your "Well then, I'm not gonna hammer even though I should" post, and you didn't make another post after... why is that?

Now why should I have hammered? I'm quite curious of the thoughts behind YOUR reasoning.

Yeah... Lynches are pro-town. No-Lynches aren't. You decided to not hammer, thus creating the potential for no lynch. Thus, that's scummy.

Yes because spyrex was in the game before. Really, this is quite laughable. You refuse to acknowledge that my vote came as a result of what spyrex said, and THEN how YOU reacted to it.

Spyrex said something, so I'm scum? Explain.

And something I just noticed:

Funny how the scummiest person left from D1 is siding with horror.

Hmm... let's look a certain post, shall we?

Reasons given for AC vote are totally based on WIFOM. Either AC is indeed scum, or mafia NK'ed unsight to frame AC. Convenient way for mafia to frame a scummy-looking AC, and seems more like the later of the two possibilities I stated.

It looks to me like you thought that AC wasn't very likely to be scum, but all of a sudden now you decide to throw in the fact that AC was defending me? Why the sudden contradiction? Oh wait, I know... to help build a non-existant case on me!

How and when did I say anything about AC not being likely scum? The whole point of WIFOM is that both possibilities are equally probable... It was in response to empking's insta-vote. You did it to stef too, but stop mis-reping what people say. It doesn't help your argument at all.[/quote]You said that you thought mafia was trying to frame AC was more likely... that means you think he's town. There was no "Equally probable" with your post/

Furthermore, what does what I said about AC have to do with your defence? Nothing.

The only reason you included it in your post was because you thought it would help your case by labeling me as receiving aide from a scummy player. It didn't work when I noticed the contradiction in your posts.

[SpyreX]

He didn't really vote for himself. He didn't unvote. He could have known it, he could have not. We'll never know.

....god I hate unvoting rules. Innnteresting though.

BUT, looks like a few things to take care of.

Unos: Soundwish

You know that guy that wants to lay it out without actually committing to what he's saying? Yea. He's that guy.

We're gonna play a game of qualifying language and tenativeness that gives those good old fashioned scumitchies.

I do not know why you would interpret it as a random vote. For one thing, I had already made a random vote, and making second ones is flat-out anti-town, and for another thing, my post clearly does not read like a random vote at all. Your post really did rub me up the wrong way, and it still makes me angry every time I read it. I find it strange that you assumed it was random.

I should clarify that I think the case that Empking is making against you is not a very good one,

and I will probably move my vote when I get a chance to thoroughly read the thread (weekend access is a little restricted).

Note, he has a stance...ish. See the announcement and the probably. Futher, and this is pretty important, he needs to wait until he

rereads the thread thoroughly

.

This is on page 3.

MOVING ON

unvote, vote: Me=Weird for bringing up the idea of a policy lynch on page 3.

Welll...that's sure moving the vote. Maybe this is fine but lets look at after the vote:

I

am getting the impression

that Me=Weird is

drifting a little.

The whole thing about checking out pman

seemed like

it was only said so he could be seen to be doing something, especially as he didn't really provide any real thoughts on pman. I am happy with my vote.

More awesome qualitative language. Still hedging the bets. Its early though, rite?

So, first thoughts upon looking over the Me=Weird wagon, considering he is closest to lynch with 3 days to go, is that while I still have issues with the policy lynch post and the empty promise of a pman investigation, Exemption and deadjoker's positions on the wagon look scummy.

Mod: I would like to fourth the request for a deadline extension. If it is granted, I will move my vote to either Exemption or deadjoker (have not decided which one I dislike more yet). If it is not, then I would not object to a Me=Weird deadline lynch.

I really hope I dont have to go into detail on this. The wagon is scummy. The wagoners are scummy (but not sure which one "yet" and only if there is an extension). If not he wouldn't object to the lynch? The one he was a proponent of?

Sup my name is distancing from a bad lynch how are you today?

Thanks Hrezs for replacing and Mod for the deadline extension.

unvote, vote: Exemption for post 89. Looks like an opportunistic jump on my Me=Weird vote.

Well, this is not cognitively dissonant, at least. However, multiple posts with only the one right previous mentioning Exemption? Woooodoggy.

SUPER NOTE: Sound scum increases exemption scum by a margin.

Hang on, what is the AC case? Seems to have sprung up out of nowhere. At this point I would go back to Me=Weird for a deadline lynch, but I would really much rather go for Exemption or deadjoker, as I have mentioned before.

Now, this is the beginning of AC probably not a partner. With a mini with two given factions you're looking at 2:2:8 setup. Defending a partner at ALL day one? Noo way.

Now, Exemption? Makes a lot more sense. I mean its not like he's been "pushing" for his lynch by not really doing anything right?

I probably will not have access again later today, so unvote, vote: Me=Weird. This is a pretty frustrating lynch for me, though, as Exemption opportunistically jumped on my original Me=Weird vote and deadjoker's shift from being fine about Me=Weird to damning him for V/LA basically seemed feigned to sound like the majority opinion.

Ohh HAY LOOK AT THAT. Tsk, tsking the wagon he jumps on? Check. Calling out Exemption again? Check.

And thus it ends. New day, new business right?

Vote: Exemption

I still think his jump on Me=Weird was highly indicative of opportunist scum.

OHH SNAP nevermind. Same tune.

In fact. That is the story of all of day two except for defending Emp and /feelings on AC.

And, really, look at this iso. Look at it. And then look at the simple:

Nearly 24 hours without actual posts. Well played guys.

@deadjoker - what do you think of Exemption attacking the circumstances of my point against him rather than the point itself?

Actually, if everyone could answer that it would be great.

Ohh hay I'm going to call everyone out for lurking AND then ask a question about one of my scumbrolinas about the OTHER one?

Wooosh.

And, one last little bit. The reason I think stef is town?

Things like this:

I am surprised that nobody noticed the fact that there was only one kill although the first post says there are two factions.

And the tech reply?

Noticed, sure, but there is nothing productive to say about it at this time. It's not like it's totally inconceivable that with two factions there can be only one kill. Speculation about last night's kills should be nipped in the bud right now.

"Yea sure its says two factions but that doesn't MEAN they both can kill?? P.S. don't talk about it."

Yee-haw?

Chances it wasn't his mafier' kill that went through? High.

Tomorrow I'll deal with Kat. That one is much simplerer and I DONT WANT TO HAVE TO USE THIS MANY WORDS AGAIN:

Look at the function of activity as a function of suspicion.

Yep.

[Katsuki]

Oh god...

Re: No Hammer

I am not going to hammer someone right after a self-vote. I would have been able to get online to lynch if need be. Why would you want cut off discussion asap? I was quite curious about the self vote, considering town needed majority, meaning that an immediate hammer was definately not favorable in that situation considering his move. There was no need for me to hammer right away.

Re: Spyrex

- I really do not need to explain that one.

The only reason you included it in your post was because you thought it would help your case by labeling me as receiving aide from a scummy player. It didn't work when I noticed the contradiction in your posts.

Where was the contradiction. You claim to have "noticed" a contradiction, yet you do not say what nor where it was? Please stop stating all these things without proof. It seems that every post of yours thus far has included a strawman.

[horrordude0215]

What part of "I think this person is being framed by the mafia" and then later "Hmm... scummy person is defending horror" is NOT a contradiction to you?

[Katsuki]

WOW. More misrep?

I said that it is a

"possibility"

. What part of that word do you not get? Here is the exact post.

@Exemption: I thought I had already talked about the WIFOM. If AC is scum, I doubt he would kill off unsight, as that would make him seem even more suspicious. As such, scum might kill unsight to try and make AC look guilty so that town continues lynching AC, who we already had suspicions about D1, on D2. However, scum can conversely carry out the kill to create the situation described above in order for us to

not

kill AC.
Hence, this is a WIFOM situation. I did not like empking voting AC right off the bat considering the "discussion" unsight and AC has yesterday, and to me, it seemed like he wanted to try and start a bandwagon on AC. I do not like being so hasty considering what the situation is.

You seem to enjoy taking parts of posts out of context to fit your own arguments.

[Katsuki]

*For reference, ISO#35