Mini 967 - Mafia War (Over)

[Empking]

Spy: Please quote where you said (before DJ said it) that Kat was trying to appear town.

[Snow_Bunny]

-Vote Count-

Amish_Charney (3) - Empking, Hrez, deadjoker
Hrezs (0)
Spyrex (0)
horrordude0215 (1) - Stef
Soundwish (2) - Amish_Charney, Spyrex
Katsuki (2) - Exemption, horrordude0215
Stef (0)
deadjoker (0)
Exemption (1) - Soundwish
Empking (1) - Katsuki

Not voting - No one.

With ten alive, it's six to lynch.

I'm checking if anyone needs a nice warm prod.

Deadline is on 18 June 2010.

[Exemption]

Hey empking just been looking through all your last posts and the last few don't include much more than just commenting on things and repeating questions. I know it's exam time (i'm having trouble finding time to post too) but your levels of lurking are really starting to make me wonder if you doing it on purpose?

FOS: empking

[Katsuki]

Update vote:

Unvote, Vote: Horror

[Hrezs]

AC hasn't done anything for me to feel better about him. His absense makes me feel that he is scum more than before.

[SpyreX]

Is this bizarro world thread?

Spy: Please quote where you said (before DJ said it) that Kat was trying to appear town.

Well, ya see, when I said I think Kat is scum that requires the above to happen. Asking dead his thoughts and watching him go "hey, that doesn't sound right" and going YES, and look at this why is...ya, know... the whole point of the game?

----

And, when I said tomorrow that refers to game day tomorrow but since no one wants to play the game well sure.

Everyone open up your ISO's and play along because I'm not going super detailed this time.

We've got 52 posts we're looking at. Sounds daunting but don't worry - quick count says half of them are three lines or less! So, we wont deal with those TOO much. Lets look at the big ones:

9: Defense.
10: Defense.
12: Defense.
13: Defense.
15: Defense.
21: Defense.
25: Not Defense! Lets actually look at this one closer:

Hmm.

I still like the idea of lynching me=weird the most.

I will not put him at L1 though.

Amish seems to be pman's biggest defender,

though a few others seem to think that defending those they perceive as town is ok (horror was one, do not remember who else). While I do not usually support players defending others as early in the game as pman did me, his arguments did not seem particularly scummy. For me, pman's response to empking in post 75 is what gives me a non-scum read for now.

Both Amish and Unsight seem to be brewing up sandstorms though. It feels that after their exchange, we really did not get anywhere. My problem with Amish was his initial reaction to unsight (post 114 in response to post 109). His subsequent skirmish with unsight did not help his case. I have a neutral read on them thus far, though amish is definately on my radar.

26: More not defense! This actually has a vote too! The third whole vote the whole game! For... AC! Because why?

I do not necessarily think he is more scummy than me=, but I do not wish to put me= at L1. However, imo a case can be better made on AC because he has more posts and substance for us to analyze, but as I said earlier, I have not liked me='s play. AC's last post trying to paint Unsight as a lurker has moved me to vote.

OHHHH, makes sense. Actually, it could make sense in a way, depending on how the cards fold out. That's a secret for now though.

32: Vote back on Empking. This time for analysis of the NK (which is awesome btw Emp++) no worries.

37: THIS IS THE ONE PAY ATTENTION TO REAL CLOSE:

Horror, how is this back and forth anti-town in any way? The only anti-town thing is using spyrex's statement to get out of the discussion between you two, especially with stef's last post. Nice job trying to avoid stef and divert attention to me.

Spyrex comes in and saves horror from being grilled further by stef.
FOS: Spyrex

Vote: horror

Look at this. Look at it real close.

If you've been playing along in ISO reading time you'll notice something really, really funny here.

This is the second time horrors name has even been mentioned.

Now, why is this soooo awesome?

Shh, it'll be there in a second.

39: Ohh, we get reasons for the vote now. After horror called it an OMGUS. Lets look at them real close:

@Horror: Erm, that was not exactly my reason for voting. Your vote means nothing to me.

Spyrex's comments and your willingness to go along with the stairs he provides for you to leave the stage is what led to my vote.

Hrrrm, you may say at this point:

Wouldn't the vote make more sense on me? I mean, in this scenario I'm truly the evil force aren't I?

Yet, alas.

40: More interesting on the plate:

@Lack of vote:

I thought he put himself at L1, and I was not going to hammer right after he self-voted. I would have been able to get online before day ended to hammer if needed but I wanted to give others a chance to react.

@Vote: How does me not having mentioned you before have anything to do with this? It means nothing. I looked at what spyrex wrote, then the things you said and did after, and voted you for it. This is not OMGUS. Nice attempt at strawman though.
If I feel that you are scummy, am I not allowed to vote for you? I really think that you are trying to use my vote as a distraction, not to mention using "OMGUS" degrade my vote.

More defense of the epic day that was day one but that isn't the fun part. The fun part is pretty much every word of the last one. Again:

Admitting that horror had never been mentioned? Check.
Declaration of "strawman"? Check.
Still not actually saying what horror did that was actually scummy? Check. This actually gets two checks because of later.
Horror being scummy still

for what I did

? Check.

Woohoo.

We're almost done, I promise.

46: Now, I know its been a struggle but you're this far so think about everything you've read and let this one sink in:

@Spyrex: If you are gonna accuse me of something, instead of taking what others say, please post your own case. I would love to hear what YOU have to say, not you using what someone else had to say.

Lets look back at all the "cases" and "voting" there have been. Lets really look at how many references to stef there has been in voting horror.

Yes.

47: More defense. Morseo, defense that doesn't make sense with what is in the thread considering the opinions on me=weird and the not voting was only to not place him at L-1. Why? No one knows. Was that wagon going to change? No way.

The rest of this is more of the same white noise defense we saw early on that I swear if I have to respond to in detail I'll rip my hair out.

This whole game has been reflexive - you know, when Kat has actually been around. The day 1 garbage was just that and that absolute avoidance of a wagon on someone they said were scummy is junk. Day 2? Not more of the same but a different segue into f--.

The vote analysis is hilarious and that alone would be enough to lynch in a normal game but no I got to spend a million words on it THANKS.

Actually, hell, I've convinced myself.

Unvote, Vote: Katsuki

-----

TL;DR

*White noise and defense take up the majority of posts
*The poorly done distancing from the day 1 lynch.
*Severe cognitive dissonance issues later on especially in regards to me and my ABSOLUTE BURNING NEED to make a case when,well, yea.
*The horror vote is based

on what I did.

Well, that and stef (see later posts for why THAT is awesome).
*The pair of awesome Empking votes (which is like half the total votes this game)
*Additionally (and this is true speculation) the weird "why are you looking at two factions???" business really gives me that itch there are two factions soo.

[Katsuki]

The horror vote is based on him continuously misreping, and playing along with you. Hence, the vote on horror and the FOS on you.
Is that really difficult?

I also like how you answered empking's statement. Except, you completely didn't.

Furthermore, how have I distanced myself from D1 lynch? The only thing I have done to this point is explain why I didn't hammer. That =/= distancing myself from D1 lynch.

You label my vote on horror as OMGUS only because I hadn't mentioned him before? I never knew you had to mention someone's name before you vote for them. Especially when a part of the reason is how they responded to someone who had just entered the game a day earlier.

[SpyreX]

I didn't "quote" it because it is inherent in saying you are scum: I think you are scum then, in fact, you are playing like you are trying to LOOK town and not, in fact, town.

Which, yes, I've clearly said before. SOoo.

If he's "playing along" with me are we scum together? Is that what you are saying?

Yes, in fact, going I could get behind this lynch and then not manning up because ooohhhh nooess L-1 is distancing from a lynch.

And, yea, for all that make cases you just happen to vote him without mentioning him based on other interaction after he votes you because of how he interacted with me.

HUZZAH

[Stef]

Mod: Please prod Soundwish and AC, both haven't been posting in the last 4 days and I find that to be.. not ok

Now:

I agree that Spyre made a wonderful door for horror to use to get out of the argument with me which he was losing badly. Funny thing is most players in the game agreed that horror was losing the argument and was looking scummier for it but spyre said that horror is most likely town. Considering I've looked over all of his posts I deff don't agree.

Horror uses the Spyre post to drop everything against me although he never admits to have been proven wrong. He had me as FIRST suspect considering he voted for me and THEN, after I brought the heat to him, he completely forgets about his suspicions about me and moves to.... Kat! His 3'rd suspect while forgetting about Empking.

Funny thing happened next. Spyre, the one who had been defending Horror starts picking on Kat and now votes for him while continuing to defend Horror. Hey, I can understand defenses D2 in some cases but this one is absurd and just building a case against the person who attacked the person who you're defending is just wrong and scummy. Also, it's too much like Pman's play which I considered to be scummy as well.

Another thing, spyre came into the game and started saying X is town, Y is town, Z is town.. W IS SCUM!!!. I find that to be horribly scummy. Saying people are town is one of the oldest scum moves in the book. Gets you friends and crap don't you agree?

Scum:
Horror
Spyre
Emp
Sound


My vote is well placed for now. Really not liking Spyre, Empking, what have you helped the town with so far? Sound, post your thoughts when you get prodded.

AC: Come on, don't be shi now, all that suspicion against you won't disappear if you don't post.

Horror: I'm gonna ask you to go back to my last post in our one on one and answer it. I'm not done with that conversation just because spyre wants us to stop talking.

[Empking]

Hey empking just been looking through all your last posts and the last few don't include much more than just commenting on things and repeating questions. I know it's exam time (i'm having trouble finding time to post too) but your levels of lurking are really starting to make me wonder if you doing it on purpose?

FOS: empking

AC is still miles ahead in the scummy stakes but he hasn't voted for ages.

[Empking]

I meant.


AC is still miles ahead in the scummy stakes but he hasn't posted for ages.

Stef: I've started all the bandwagons on scum, so far this game. (If memory serves.)

[SpyreX]

Another thing, spyre came into the game and started saying X is town, Y is town, Z is town.. W IS SCUM!!!. I find that to be horribly scummy. Saying people are town is one of the oldest scum moves in the book. Gets you friends and crap don't you agree?

Ohh nelly.

Saying people are town is awesome when, in fact, they're playing slapfighting and are probably town.

Real question though that the grand you keep skirting around is: am I scum with horror?

[deadjoker]

Funny thing happened next. Spyre, the one who had been defending Horror starts picking on Kat and now votes for him while continuing to defend Horror. Hey, I can understand defenses D2 in some cases but this one is absurd and just building a case against the person who attacked the person who you're defending is just wrong and scummy. Also, it's too much like Pman's play which I considered to be scummy as well.

I will submit it is very unlikely that two scum would defend each other so blatantly. You can try to throw WIFOM at me if you want, but the fact is two scum would much rather ignore each other or distance each other then ever risk being brought into the spotlight together and getting caught up in a bandwagon against them. The risk is too high, the reward is way too low. There is a much better explanation anyway:

Strike 1:

In this case, I would submit Spyrex to be more scummy than Horror. Spyrex called you both town in a bid to gain a buddy. Horror bit, line and sinker. He thinks he has a town friend in Spyrex, when in fact Spyrex knew Horror was feeling the heat and took advantage. Plus, Horror's misquote of Stef plus him taking the easy out Spyrex offered screams laziness rather than scumminess. Horror is simply not thinking and more anti-town rather than scum.

Strike 2:

Spyrex has been buddying up to me as well. It is disgusting, and I let it happen, but it served its purpose. He was fishing for a case on Katsuki and waited for me to explain it to him.

Strike 3:

Spyrex's case and ISO against Katsuki was terrible, forced, and it screamed "OH NOES THEY CALLED ME OUT". Not saying Katsuki is exonerated, and I still do think he could be trying to be town instead of town, the difference is I HAD NO EVIDENCE. Spyrex created that evidence.

Yeeeeeeeeer out!

I am making myself a target, which is awesome. I am about to get a ton of reads, from nearly every player in the game. I am announcing I will be sitting back and watching for responses to this post, and after that, I will follow up with my assessments.

unvote; vote Spyrex

[SpyreX]

Whaaattt

So, by saying the activity is a function of attention before you said anything I, somehow fabricated it?

After, in fact, saying I would post that -tomorrow- in gameday world?

[horrordude0215]

1 (Post 259): Oh no, a self vote!
2 (Post 251): Why should Me= try to claim and save himself if need be?
3 (Post 237): I think he's more of a noob than scum.

Give quotes, not interpretations considering you have been on me for misrepping.

1. It wasn't a "Oh no" it was a "meh". Are they the same thing to you? If they are you are probably a cheerleader.

TT means "Oh no" wouldn't you agree?

2. Is that what I said? Quote me saying that. I dare you.

"Even if he were a power role, how would it be helpful for the town for him to claim?"

That reads to me as "He may claim PR, which would mean he wouldn't be lynched... that'd be bad"

3. More noob THAN scum? Quote me saying that as well.

I'll admit, that one was a misinterpret, sorry.


Stef, FTR I didn't "forget about you" or Emp, for that matter... I found Kat's actions to be the scummiest at the time, and that deserved my attention.

And I don't like that everyone's assuming that Spyrex's actions on me were blatant buddying and that I fell for it hook, line, and sinker. I CAN think for myself and I CAN decide for myself if something is buddying. Thanks.

And I know that somewhere someone mentioned that my vote on Stef was a bad reaction to being voted (Or something along those lines, can't find the post now ><) Check again... IIRC, I voted him first.


Expect some serious LA until after Thursday... Finals and such. You know how it is.

[Snow_Bunny]

-Vote Count-

Amish_Charney (2) - Empking, Hrez
Hrezs (0)
Spyrex (1) - deadjoker
horrordude0215 (2) - Stef, Katsuki
Soundwish (1) - Amish_Charney
Katsuki (3) - Exemption, horrordude0215, Spyrex
Stef (0)
deadjoker (0)
Exemption (1) - Soundwish
Empking (0)

Not voting - No one.

With ten alive, it's six to lynch.

AC and Soundwish have been prodded. I know I usually only post one vote count per page, but I was soooo bored... Here, enjoy some good music as you read this post: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6DcfXVL0mh0.

Deadline is on 18 June 2010.

[Katsuki]

Come to think about it, the point that scum would not so blatently come out to defend another. It does not change the fact that horror's arguments have been downright terrible though. In this case, spyrex may in fact be more likely scum than horror.

I must be losing it for forgetting to remember such a basic principal.

[SpyreX]

So now I'm not scum with horror *SHOCK*
Yet no vote although the buildup is starting.

So, the next question is:
If I'm not scum with horror, WHY would I derail a mislynch like that?

As an aside I see I get to play break down the foundations of f-- play with things like "buddying" being bantered around since the single most powerful tool is a strong town alliance moving in a unified direction so lets continue.

[Katsuki]

Not really. It just means I have to go back and think about it more when I have time. I doubt that both you and horror are town though.

[Soundwish]

Hey, sorry for needing a prod, I kind of got into a huff about this game after reading AC's post at a bad time. I'm catching up.

[Exemption]

@ Empking: I will agree your not the most scummiest, that is why I didn't vote for you. Just wondering if your hiding on purpose or not.

What bandwagons on scum would those be?
Also do you think horror, Spyrex, both or nether of them are scum?


tbh I don't like post 391 Seems quite a lot like 'hey who is it gonna be easier to get lynched?'

loving the music by the way, pity it's going to be in my head while I'm trying to revise in Library all day.

[Empking]

@ Empking: I will agree your not the most scummiest, that is why I didn't vote for you. Just wondering if your hiding on purpose or not.

What bandwagons on scum would those be?

AC

Also do you think horror, Spyrex, both or nether of them are scum?

Neither.

[SpyreX]

Not really isn't an answer to if I'm the scum and not scum with horror WHY would I do that at all fyi.

[horrordude0215]

Come to think about it, the point that scum would not so blatently come out to defend another. It does not change the fact that horror's arguments have been downright terrible though. In this case, spyrex may in fact be more likely scum than horror.

So why the fuck are you still voting for me? Seriously, you just hop from wagon to wagon in hopes that a lynch will eventually occur. Obv scum is obv... next time, try not to make it so obvious

[Exemption]

Come to think about it, the point that scum would not so blatently come out to defend another. It does not change the fact that horror's arguments have been downright terrible though. In this case, spyrex may in fact be more likely scum than horror.

So why the fuck are you still voting for me? Seriously, you just hop from wagon to wagon in hopes that a lynch will eventually occur. Obv scum is obv... next time, try not to make it so obvious

Yes Katsuki that really doesn't make much sense at all.

oh and @empking any chance i could ask for a few reasons.