Why did I do this again.
Okay here's kinda a summary of the game thus far with my own analysis thrown in and tl;dr's at the end of each page for the lazy. And I linked every single post that I commented on for reference.
I’d go so far to say that it’s a
.
Page 1: RVS happens. There's, shockingly, nothing useful here since nobody's posting content. SSBF posts some
worthless, generic questions that are more of a distraction than anything.
+scumpoints SSBF (1)
Page 2: Andrius and Karma have a
non-game related discussion. This is something that should've been done in PMs IMO. Anyways, Andrius asks a
really weird RVS-esque question to TBM about his wagon... but I don't see how he's supposed to answer it. TBM wagon grows to L-2, and Karma asks the
infamous question. I
call him out based on a misunderstanding of this post, and he responds by
telling us that his question is hypocritical.
+scumpoints Karma (2)
Page 3:
Gamma joins in the Karma/Parama argument with goodlogic,
Karma OMGUS votes me, and a wagon forms on him. Argument continues, no point in restating it.
Kmd starts existing, calls Karma town, and votes SSBF who hasn't seen any pressure thus far, I agree with the second not with the first.
Andrius' response towards being 3rd on a scumlist seems like an overreaction IMO. Overreactions are good scumtells.
SSBF posts, votes Budja and states suspicion of Karma (FoS: Scumbuddy, Vote: Townie, anyone?) Not much else of interest happens on this page.
+scumpoints Karma (2)
+scumpoints Andrius (2)
+scumpoints SSBF (1)
Page 4: More of my Karma case, but then
Karma pulls a 180 and randomly calls me town which looks more like an appeal than anything. Also
SSBF talks about Karma posting IIoA but the posts he uses examples are 2 RVS posts and a helpful comment, plus singling out 3 posts of someone who has many more is silly. I don't think SSBF understands the case at all, he just wants to be on the most popular wagon. Kmd uses a
Content-O-Meter to give his reasoning as to why Andrius is scum; a severe lack of content. My issue with this is that the same could be said about several players at that point in the game: dramonic, MrSuave, Empking come to mind first, probably others that I'm missing.
Karma immediately jumps on the wagon with a blatant bandwagon.
Karma tells the town to ignore me. I don't think a townie would say that. Ever. I do find it odd that
Gamma holds off on a Karma vote even though he the second person to jump on Karma's case. Not sure what to think of that.
+scumpoints Karma (3)
+scumpoints SSBF (1)
Page 5:
RC uses win-logic, then the top half of page 5 turns into useless spam. Though we get a
reasonless scumlist from dramonic. Which is actually more content than half the game has posted, now that I think about it
. TBM is now
tunneling on Gamma without giving anything even close to content. Then there's more Me vs. Karma. Yeah there was a lot of spam here.
+scumpoints TBM (1)
+scumpoints Karma (1)
Page 6: Karma decides that the only way he can deal with me is by
calling me dumbtown. Which just looks like sour scum to me.
Kmd gives all his reads, not sure what to think of this as I hate when people give their town reads. Don't agree with his town reads on Karma or RC but the rest seems fine to me.
Gamma restates his Karma case which is IMO full of win. Also I missed this quote from TBM when I was reading through the first time: "His posting style may be an affront to elegance everywhere but he doesn't strike me as dumb." I love the way that's phrased, it's like perfect
ANYWAYS, Karma actually asks some useful questions after this, though his response to TBM is lackluster and useless.
Now I kinda want to break down this next post, it's important.
Andrius wrote:GG wrote:
Andrius-dramonic usually plays like that from my experience, and I'm not actually sure if Kmd even got prodded considering we don't have a votecount yet for today.
k' thanks.
Okay you're going to be that quick about accepting a meta defense? No questions asked?
Andrius wrote:kmd wrote:
Andrius, you ask why you are one of my suspects.
ISO 0: Joke vote on Gamma.
ISO 1: Comment on Suave's avatar.
2: Response to Smash Bro's questions aimed at everyone
3: More Time Zone and Avatar talk.
4: Avatar related comment
5: Avatar talk, response to joke wagon on button, and vote count preference.
6: Asking about Reap's joke vote.
7: Response to contentless post, response to suspicion against you.
Ok wow. You're getting on me for participating in the RVS. RVS is a widely accepted way of starting out any mafia game.
And pardon me if I-heaven forbid!- answer the questions posed to me and- even worse!- try to laugh a bit in the game and have some fun.
I actually kinda agree with this, but you really haven't posted much more content since being called out (I think this post is his first in a couple of pages? correct me if I'm wrong)
*irrelevant Kmd prod talk*
*irrelevant weather joke*
*irrelevant comment towards RC*
*irrelevant comment about RC's shot*
Andrius wrote:Temp. Town read on SSBF. Playing like he did in the other game I know him from. RC is acting like RC does.
lolmeta
That doesn't work IMO.
Andrius wrote:I was told that making these types of lists were anti-town, way back when I first began playing.
While this is true, was this necessary to post?
...yeaaah. After this post I could probably agree with the case, lots of useless fluff and little real content in here. But I want to finish this reread thing before I put down a vote.
MOVING ON,
dram calls out Karma for hypocrisy (he obviously understands my case),
RC screws around some more, and
SSBF thinks the Andrius wagon is bad and so continues to comment on Karma. The last line of that post is bugging me... it's either a super-townie reason for holding a vote or a potential FoS: Scumbuddy, Vote: Townie manuever. And I can't tell which. Empking then
asks a question without providing content himself. Um, dude. That's exactly what I called out Karma for originally.
+scumpoints Karma (1)
+scumpoints Andrius (3)
+scumpoints Empking (1)
Page 7:
Kmd post, not sure about the RVS thing since RVS ends at different times for different people, but his comment about the shot is all sorts of town. Also the same thing I got caught up on; SSBF-Andrius link is somewhat WIFOM. Also BOO meta.
Gamma asks this awesome question.
Kmd’s response – well I don’t agree with any of these, though the 2nd is the closest to being useful. And
Gamma’s responses basically say why I don’t agree with them. More of RC screwing around, *sigh*. Oh and TBM posts a useless post too.
The last line here is exactly what I said 0_o.
This is best described by
this. Or “WTF are you doing RC.”
Gamma makes a good point because I don’t see why Karma has completely dropped TBM suspicions completely.
+scumpoints RC (1)
+scumpoints Karma (1)
Page 8:
Bad answer IMO. Seems like a cop-out from Karma.
RC actually gives reads-ish but doesn't elaborate at all. Well,
he does and continues to not make sense at all because of it. The entire Karma-RC exchange is worthless IMO.
SSBF seems a little overcautious here and I don't like that at all.
This looks like LOLOMGUS.
This is LOLYES.
Oh Andrius posted again. Another wall. BREAKDOWN TIME!
Andrius wrote:Karma wrote:
Andrius, I think we're more suspicious of you because you've kind of been popping in and out, asking weak questions, but not contributing to the game and discussion.
You think?
Either present a case on me that is original, or just say that you're following kmd's case because you're going to wagon anyone as long as they aren't you. You're just looking for a suitable wagon that is not on yourself.
I agree with this, tbh.
Andrius wrote:SSBF wrote:
I'm also a little uncomfortable with ReaperCharlie. I'm getting a fairly scummy read on him, due to his lack of contents for the most part, however, I'm wondering if this is part of his play style, since people are giving him town reads.
I can't give him a town read because I don't know what he's like as scum. He reminds me of Jack, whose play is aslo similar and yet very confusing.
So that's a null on RC.
Null reads don't help at all. What's the point of this?
Andrius wrote:kmd wrote:
Hmm. I just looked at the "I'm lazy" in context and I'm really not seeing that coming from scum.
Whose "I'm lazy" was this?
^not reading the thread
Andrius wrote:Karma wrote:
Jesus, Gamma, you still care about that? That's soo 5 pages ago. Why would I care about the TBM wagon anymore when I think there's someone who I'm fairly confident is scum without a sizable wagon on him sitting around?
I'm pretty sure there are 2 people voting me. That's hardly a "sizeable wagon".
He said it
wasn't
a sizeable wagon. Again, not reading.
Andrius wrote:RC wrote:
Also, if you're both town, I'd rather lynch you because he'll be more useful later on.
How so?
You expect a straight answer?
Andrius wrote:Karma wrote:
I don't get why people aren't seeing the case on Andrius.
Because they think you're the better lynch.
And only 2 players, yourself included, think I'm the best lynch for today.
Subject to change with the attitude you present here.
Oookay. Not as much fluff this time and some good points. But now it's evident that Andrius isn't putting in much true effort because of his lack of attention to detail.
Um, this post. That's scummy as all hell. *snicker* And
this post is true as all hell. *snicker*
Hey RC, care to point out some places where Andrius is being useful?
+scumpoints Karma (2) (you sick of seeing this yet?
)
+scumpoints RC (1)
+scumpoints SSBF (1)
+scumpoints TBM (1)
+scumpoints Andrius (1)
Page 9:
This post response time: Agree, said that earlier in this post, Gamma's right though, yup.
Good.
HOLY CRAP THIS POST IS FULL OF WIN.
This one is stupid however. If he's acting scummy then he may well be scum, there's no need to involve gambits in this mess. Um RC,
this contradicts
this pretty blatantly. If he's being useless in this game, why does lolmeta make you feel he COULD be useful? If he's scum, wouldn't he continue to stay useless?
On this post, the one who did the scumhunting originally was Kmd and you just followed on. But I guess you brought up good winpoints later.
Please shut up.
3-part response: 1. lolmeta, 2. lurking is a nulltell, 3. active lurking is a scumtell. And if these are your top 3, why is your vote still on Gamma? It's been there since RVS hasn't it? 0_o
3-part response, the sequel: 1. Captain Obvious, 2. waiting with bated breath, 3. I love you for hating meta.
Empking's post is full of 1. useless, 2. wishy-washy, 3. good question. Wow Empking actually posted something slightly useful, though it's still only a single question.
+scumpoints RC (1)
+scumpoints Andrius (1)
+scumpoints Empking (1)
Page 10:
Lol random much, Empking?.
The second part here is what I said
Why must people make good points before I can point them out myself?
Also waiting with bated breath. Sounds like I have fun times coming up in the next few pages.
Whoa MrSuave is in this game? I jest, I jest. First paragraph: wishy-washy as hell. Second: you probably need more than a gut feeling at page 10. Fourth: not an excuse. I find it funny that one lurker is calling out another based solely on gut. Maybe MrSuave realizes that the only thing he could call out dramonic for was lurking but then that would be hypocritical so he had to go with "gut" instead.
More good logic here from Karma, except the TBM thing, since Andrius makes lotsa long posts and TBM makes lotsa little ones.
Good question here as well from RC.
Dramonic's in this game? Screwing around again. Anyways, line about himself not posting content reads as town, TBM thing is bad meta, he brings up good points about both Karma and Andrius, newbcard on SSBF sucks, and I don't like him giving 4 town reads without giving any real scum reads. Not sure what to think about this post, rather ambivalent; some parts read as town, others are scummy.
Don't think Karma quite understands IIoA, since unless I'm the one who is misunderstanding it, dram did more analysis than infodump, so I don't see how the term applies.
I want RC to stop posting unless he has a real reason to post because I'm sick of his spam. Hey TBM
"the active players" are the players who are actually playing, unlike you. Bad excuse, since you said in this same post that you like the wagon. But you just want there to be a second wagon so you stay off it. What? Um. I mean. What?
This is worthless posting, Karma.
TBM you really need to tell us what your issues with Gamma are because I haven't seen any and I think you're being either lazy, scummy, or both. Also wow my post you quoted is terribly worded x_x. Add a "that" after "so", otherwise it looks like something completely different. *grammarfail*. And look more RC spam. Ugh.
+scumpoints MrSuave (2)
+shut the hell up points RC (9999)
+scumpoints TBM (2)
Page 11:
Hey Gamma stop giving town reads. Also your dram thing is lolmeta and the TBM thing I don't agree with. Also
conditional scumreads are bad.
Is this scum giving up? Hello, hypocrisy! Hello, worthlessness! Hello, more useless spam! *sigh* Oh, this game.
BTW Kmd if you have a town read on someone you should never vote them regardless of the circumstances.
Hey did you hear me? <.< Getting the feeling that Kmd may have voted Karma just to get him to claim; don't like that at all.
This makes me even more uneasy since it fits in with that theory perfectly. And
he switches right after the claim. UGH. DO NOT LIKE.
OH YAY IT'S SSBF'S ANALYSIS.
Super Smash Bros. Fan wrote:Karma wrote:I hate how you're town.
Don't miss this people. Karma said he hated that Parama was town. This could indicate that he knows what alignment Parama is part of. Either they're masons, or more likely, scums. I'm leaning toward the latter.
Wait, so you think I'm scum with Karma and I've been bussing him all D1 for lulz? *headdesk*
Super Smash Bros. Fan wrote:TheButtonmen wrote:Every vote I make is serious.
What about RVS votes? I thought RVS votes weren't serious. Also, your vote on Dramonic didn't look serious, so that contradicts your statement.
*headdesk* *headdesk*
Super Smash Bros. Fan wrote:TheButtonmen wrote:Gamma needs more POWERFUL VOTES people.
Like seroiusly, random comments while we're actually scum hunting? Absolutely ridiculous.
Yup, TBM is best described as "ridiculous." Which could be scum or town. Thanks for lack of a stance.
Super Smash Bros. Fan wrote:dramonic wrote:SSBF's play isn't exactly what I'd call protown, but arguably he's a newb and my gut is writing a giant "TOWN!" on him
Let me just say that I am not a newbie. I may not be the best player in Mafiascum, but I don't want anyone to pull the "newbie" card with me (I won't be doing it either). I've been here almost long enough to mod.
^do like
Super Smash Bros. Fan wrote:TheButtonmen wrote:This game has too many lurkers, this saddens me.
Uhhh, this makes you look really hypocritical. You haven't really provided much contents either.
Dammit, there goes another of my points. Again, do like^
Super Smash Bros. Fan wrote:Just needed to comment on some stuff. I already have my scum reads ready and I will explain them before midnight today.
Waiting with bated breath!
Just sayin SSBF but "fairly scummy" is way nicer than you make TBM sound from your analysis.
+scumpoints Gamma (1)
+scumpoints Karma (1)
+scumpoints TBM (1)
+scumpoints Kmd (1)
Page 12:
Unnecessary softclaim is unnecessary. Gamma what was the point of that?
Oh my god TBM it's not scummy it's just stupid. Yeah there was no town reason, but sometimes townies can do stupid things. Your tunneling is also stupid but it's scummy as well.
Pretty sure I've already been over this and why I disapprove of the plan.
TBM you're almost as annoying as RC.
TBM: why would a scum? Huh? HUUUH?
I mean Karma's basically got it right here.
Did you have a good reason not to vote Andrius, TBM? Don't think you've been doing much all game except screaming "VOTE GAMMA" tbh.
Also Gamma is a ninja.
SHUT UP. FFS TBM YOU'RE JUST SPAMMING NOW.
Wait, what? Have you ever talked about him, Karma?
Okay this actually makes more sense but then it's still pretty risky IMO.
Um TBM dude you started it. Oh great RC's back to spamming.
+scumpoints Gamma (1)
+scumpoints TBM (3)
+scumpoints Karma (1)
Page 13:
This is the most irrational tunneling ever, TBM..
Even my top scumpick agrees. Gamma being the #2 supporter of the Karma wagon. Yep.
TBM: Or you're scum and don't want apprentices to jump on a townie.
TBM: it's because Karma's tunneling on Andrius, but his tunneling is backed by a case and by sanity, which yours lacks. Not saying that Gamma hasn't done scummy things but in comparison to Karma, Andrius, YOU, it's fairly minimal.
Also what Kmd said - if Gamma wanted apprentices he would've outed his school, don't you think?
TBM: But he DIDN'T claim his school and it doesn't look like he was or is planning to.
WHOA WHOA WHOA bad buddying alert DO NOT WANT.
LOL TBM's accusing me of being scum by association which doesn't work when 1. your target hasn't flipped yet and 2. your target is townier than the one making this accusation.
THE TRUTH. Okay then dramonic thanks for that softclaim. Why do you think that? This is totally random and unnecessary and gives me bad vibes.
+scumpoints TBM (3)
+scumpoints Gamma (1)
+scumpoints dramonic (1)
Page 14:
Hey TBM did you realize that Mod-WIFOM was how Karma picked Divination? I highly doubt any of the schools alone will tell us alignment.
This is goodposting. TBM is assuming here since Gamma didn't specifically say that he didn't have a 0 apprentice spell, he might just have one that isn't useful. Or he may not have one, period. But you're trying to outguess the mod, which you just said was a bad thing. Um, hello?
Karma tells TBM to shut up which is the right move, since TBM is spamming.
Yes you have, TBM, and it's been quite irrational throughout the game.
TBM, he asked you a question, and you chose to ignore it. And this is
the same thing you accused Gamma of earlier. So chalk up hypocrisy yet again!
We'd all love to know, Gamma. Oh how I wish I knew what the hell TBM's problem is.
I approve of this post.
This is the truth.
No, complaining about spam knocks some sense into you people.
+scumpoints TBM (3)
Page 15:
I approve of this except claims should always come at L-2.
Karma stop trying to outguess the mod.
LONG ANDRIUS WALL IS LONG.
Andrius wrote:RC wrote:
Alliances are not as great of an idea in mini-games, I've found out. There aren't as large of a pool of players, and there usually aren't competing scum factions. Scum presence in the alliance would be devastating to the town, whereas in a large game, it actually works out to a pro-town benefit quite well.
Now that my other huge game's over (longest one I've ever played), I'll be a lot more active and useful in this one.
Be afraid, scum.
*useless*
*useless*
You calling me scum? Without voting me? Odd.
Where the hell did that come from? He wasn't singling out anyone there. Overreact moare.
Andrius wrote:GG wrote:
Andrius- Noooot really who I was expecting. So why aren't you voting...any of them?
What were you expecting then?
I'm still puzzled over RC's play, though I could vote him.
Bujda isn't playing. Simple as that. Lynching lurkers only goes so far. Since its not actual scumhunting in and of itself.
pre-post edit: So yeah. He's evidentially on V/LA.
Lol not reading.
Andrius wrote:Karma wrote:
So, Andrius, no comment on my last post?
What last post? *searches* Oh. That one. Idk how I missed it. Bored_Andrius failed at seeing your post.
Lol not reading.
Andrius wrote:Karma wrote:
And you're essentially doing the same thing. Following gamma/Parama's case on me. You hypocrite.
I am not a hypocrite. If I followed their case on you, I would be voting you, or campaigning for your lynch. I am doing neither. I am looking into getting the lurkers to play, since we have an incomplete town within a couple days of the deadline.
This suggestion is pro-town IMO.
Andrius wrote:Karma wrote:
So you only play by meta? Why not analyze his posts if you want to make a read on him?
No. I do not play by meta. It does have its uses though. I am analyxing his posts, but more knowledge is more knowledge. I am fairly certain that SSBF is town, so it might help me down the line somewhere.
All you've been using as evidence thus far is meta, though.
Andrius wrote:Karma wrote:
You misunderstood what I said. There's someone who I'm fairly confident is scum (you) sitting around without a sizable wagon on him. In layman's terms, I want more votes on you.
Oh. Perhaps I misread the line? :/
Yeah, you did. Lol not reading.
Andrius wrote:Karma wrote:
This reads exactly like arrogant scum.
Bored, VI_Andrius has an infamous sarcastic sense of humor.
Bad excuse.
Andrius wrote:I am very lazy, I admit.
Also bad excuse.
*RC-related fluff*
Andrius wrote:TBM wrote:
This game has too many lurkers, this saddens me.
Name them. (Dram and Budja are givens.) I'm not really lurking, persay. I'm posting consistently. Not as active as others, granted.
Not even gonna call him out for his uber-hypocrisy?
Also I just realized this now but TBM started spamming after he got called out for lurking.
*fluff about claiming*
*fluff directed towards Karma*
*modquestion about apprentices*
Andrius wrote:As for schools, I'm going to side with Karma. Divination makes me think of Professor Trelawney, so maybe its Cop/Foresight, both of which would be highly beneficial.
VOTE: TheButtonMen So, what exactly are you basing your vote on Gamma on anyway? The softclaiming a PR?
Wait. So here Andrius says Divination is probably coplike. Will come back to this later, awesome point to make when then time comes, hahaha this is awesome.
Also the TBM vote is buddying Gamma more than anything.
CONTINUING,
Budja's only town read that he doesn't elaborate on is TBM who happens to be pretty scummy. Urgh. Not likin' that, at least give a reason if you're going to do it for everyone else too.
More Gamma buddying, bad. Calling out lurkers I like though.
Empking's not reading either considering Gamma just gave his stance on Budja in his previous post 6 hours earlier. Okay so back to Andrius, he claimed Diviner. His spells:
0 Apprentices: I target someone and see if they cast a spell or not. So that's basically a Watcher.
1 Apprentice: I target someone and see all the spells they can cast.
2 Apprentices: I become a TOWN NEIGHBORIZER. So I pick someone, and we share a QT for the rest of the game.
3 Apprentices: The person I target's spells are "empowered" and "hostile magic" is null against them for a night.
Guild Mark: I see all the night actions and who they target.
So why did you say
Andrius wrote:Divination makes me think of Professor Trelawney, so maybe its Cop/Foresight, both of which would be highly beneficial.
this earlier, if you knew Divination had nothing to do with cops? (though it's other investigative roles, if that's what you meant by "cop".) Still think this could be a slip from Andrius.
Lol. trying to outguess the mod again, TBM?.
TBM, why does a wagon having active players make it bad? Because the people TRYING are leading a wagon = the wagon is scummy? Also Andrius,
stupid setup speculation is stupid.
+scumpoints Andrius (2)
+scumpoints Budja (1)
+scumpoints Gamma (1)
+scumpoints TBM (1)
Page 16:
Hey dramonic are you planning on actually doing something? Also TBM is just completely missing the point of this wall, though that's not necessarily scummy.
+scumpoints dramonic (1)
OH GOD I'M DONE.
Time to add up those scumpoints... *drum roll please*
...
SSBF has racked up 4 scumpoints.
Karma has earned himself 14 scumpoints.
Andrius has a grand total of 9 scumpoints.
TBM has accumulated 12 scumpoints.
Empking has garnered 2 scumpoints.
RC has spammed his way to 3 scumpoints.
MrSuave has lurked his way to 2 scumpoints.
Gamma's got himself 4 scumpoints.
Kmd picked up 1 scumpoint.
dramonic finds himself with 2 scumpoints.
Budja brought back 1 scumpoint.
Problem is I don't think this is an efficient way of building my scumlist - I want to say there's scum among the lurkers, and I'm positive that Karma and Andrius can't be buddies anyways.
Plus, the breakdown of scumminess: Karma had the most during the first half of the thread, Andrius had a lot in the middle third, and in the last quarter or so TBM has completely exploded and become really scummy. Andrius has a lower posting rate though so there's less to analyze than there is from the other two.
I also feel that TBM doesn't know how to bus, because he doesn't seem to want to pressure either of the top 2 wagons of the day, which probably contains a scum regardless of their claims.
Karma also doesn't seem to be pressuring TBM whereas Andrius is currently voting him (albeit with weak or no reasoning.)
I think a good scumlist would look like this:
TBM
[Lurker] (Empking/MrSuave are the worst and the most likely to be scum)
Karma
But I'm wary because Andrius' claim is more likely to come from scum than Karma's claim. Either way TBM is probably my top scumpick because the issues I have with him are more recent ones and Karma has improved a lot since the earlier pages. Having two lurkerscum would suck, I'd have to say.
Anyways the best place for a vote:
Vote: TheButtonmen
. I find it hilarious that we RVSed scum.
