Mini 964: Another Story - Over!

[Unsight]

Thief - Tracker
Vibebox - Vanilla Townsfolk
yabbaguy - Vanilla Townsfolk
Chevre - Vanilla Townsfolk
Jaylan - Doctor
ZeroFang - Vanilla Townsfolk
Unsight - Vanilla Townsfolk
PaltryExcuse -
Pie_is_good -

I'm a Townie (Vanilla Townsfolk). Nothing special, no redeeming qualities, vote to lynch, etc.

I'm fine with either PE or Pie going next. Whichever one of you gets here first.

[Unsight]

In popcorn claiming, you choose your best scum reads (or next scummiest) to claim next because

it's town's advantage to force scum to claim early

so they live in fear of being CC'd by townies who claim later. Incidentally,

that's why I put myself at the bottom of my chart

. I intend to claim last so the scum all have to claim before me.

Was that a scum slip? Thoughts on this as well would be appreciated.

And let's look at it again with different parts emphasized without the scum-o-vision...

In popcorn claiming, you choose your best scum reads (or next scummiest) to claim next because it's town's advantage to force scum to claim early

so they live in fear of being CC'd by townies who claim later

. Incidentally,

that's why I put myself at the bottom of my chart

. I intend to claim last so

the scum all have to claim before me

.

The thing here is that this isn't a quote with a mixed message. I'm very clear about what I'm saying above that I'm not scum and that it's in the town's best interest to make scum claim early. Now, either you're really that dense or you're scum grasping at straws to attack my credibility (which fits with my analysis of the Thief wagon).

[Unsight]

First, Unsight, Jalyn probably thought we were going to continue with you instead of her, but apparently:

In popcorn claiming, you choose your best scum reads (or next scummiest) to claim next because it's town's advantage to force scum to claim early so they live in fear of being CC'd by townies who claim later. Incidentally, that's why I put myself at the bottom of my chart. I intend to claim last so the scum all have to claim before me.

This is hypocritical. You seem to advocate popcorn claiming, yet demand that you claim last. If this was the strategy of popcorn claiming, then EVERYONE would want to claim last, scum or town.

You are apparently deeming yourself much more town in appearance than everyone else, which is definitely not the case.

I'm the only person in the game that I absolutely know is confirmed town so yeah, it is the case from my point of view and I'm not going to pretend otherwise.

[Unsight]

Side note: Would this be easier for everyone to read if I switched to linking to the posts as I've seen some of you do? If so, how do I do that? I personally prefer seeing the quotes in the text itself rather than having to click back to see what's being talked about, but I can do it either way.

Unless you're directly responding to a post, please switch to links if your post is going to be gigantic. It makes rereading the thread itself easier (for me anyway).

[Thief]

Unsight beat me to it. Chevre's reason for not choosing Zero to claim is such full of shit I almost want to WIFOM it and say she's just TRYING to set-up a Zero lynch when she flips scum.

Also if you're going to make claim lists it helps to have the actions listed.

We're really close to a Chevre lynch.

Jaylan is pretty townie and apparently a doctor (shame, this makes me wish I was a watcher).

[Pie_is_good]

I'm a vanilla townie.

Unvote, Vote: Chevre

I really dislike that VibeBox slipped the spotlight by lurking, but I would really dislike a no lynch even more.

[yabbaguy]

Vibe:

Here and here, cross-defends me from Emp.

Here protecting Cyanide from Emp. I conclude Unsight isn't Mafia.

This post is weak reasoning on Jag. That rationale is over playstyle. Good wagon, wrong reasons.

Here, Vibe talks to Thief almost as if in conversation. Again, defending me from Thief. Thanks, but you're also hopping right into the conclusion that I'm Town without considering my scumminess that's so apparent to everyone else. You're absolutely right, but you also sound absolutely informed.

I'm guilty of cheerleading posts like this one, but the particular tone of this one sounds insincere. Speculative, though, and I'm already batting .000 with my speculative tells this game.

This is a weak FOS on Thief. Could be distancing.

This is an explanation of why he lurked. A poor one, I've had the motivation to come in and post endlessly.

A false statement here, considering I don't think his FOS on Thief was a sincere one.

Sauciness here. Scum use it more than Town.

Unvotes here and squawks at me for L-1ing Thief. A different scenario, and hasn't mentioned Thief once since this post.

---

I also don't find a terrible amount of relations between Chevre and Vibe as I delve through, so I'm starting to veer away from Chevre being Mafia. Again, Chevre could be SK (Jalyn makes little sense for SK now), but I'd much rather have a Maf lynch, and I think Vibe and Thief would be the best bet. I think lynching Vibe, considering the relations between him and other players is what I'm most fascinated by, would be smartest. If I'm wrong, then I discard the Chevre-link theory, go for Thief, and then maybe her later.

And if the setup's 2/1/9 per chance, then my list is complete with 3 suspects listed. Considering how scarce the scumtells have been, I think that's plausible.

[Pie_is_good]

EBWOP: I'm going to be Limited Access for the next few days, which is why I wanted to switch over now. I would switch back to VibeBox if that wagon gains steam (and I get on the forums in time), but at this point I just want to see one of (Vibey, Chevre) lynched pre-deadline.

[yabbaguy]

Prod Paltry and Vibe regardless of how long ago their last post was, please.

Paltry, you need to claim NOW. The devil on my shoulder is nagging me.

Bah, deadline in 2 days. Unlikely that I can swing a Vibe wagon now, but presuming nobody switches, I'll hop to Chevre after MC concludes.

[Azelf]

Paltry and Vibe both required prods, so prods have been sent.

Deadline is

10-27

.

Chevre

- PaltryExcuse, Pie_is_good, Thief, Unsight (

L-1

)

Thief

- Chevre (

L-4

)

Vibebox

- yabbaguy (

L-4

)

Not voting

- Jalyn, Vibebox, ZeroFang

[Jalyn]

yabbaguy, given that I probably won't get a chance to get my ideas out tomorrow, could you also please wait until I finish my ISOs to vote? I only have two left & yours is almost done.

[Jalyn]

yabbaguy:

In this post, the first part is just silly, it's easy to enjoy answering questions but not think that they are helpful in the least in a game situation. There is a whole "Mafia Discussion" forum for people who like discussing such things. Point being, there's no contradiction. It seems like several people thought that the second part was suspicious so I'll let it slide, I suppose. The third bit though reads like "JJ is suspicious of me and that's suspicious!" which is BS.

Ugh SSBF had been put at L-1 an hour before this posting, I realize that the game had been dragging and that yabbaguy had been wanting to lynch him for a while, but I just hate quick hammers and they will almost always look scummy to me. When they're based off of arguments that I find troublesome in the first place (see above), it definitely reads bad to me.

This one doesn't make any sense to me. "If scum fake claim," what, they might claim scum instead? I mean, I'll give you points for opposing the massclaim, but your argument against it almost seems designed to push it forward by being so bad.

This is at least a better argument, though still not good. Having no "fake claims" as you think of them means that the only thing this exercise has done is out the power roles for the scum. Had there been that sort of fake claims, it would give a chance of cross claims giving us lynch targets and forced the claimer to explain night choices and such. It would also have meant that there would have been legitimate targets for the other team to try for and hit scum. (That is, if the SK claims cop the mafia doesn't know that he's lying and it makes him a valid night target.)

I don't understand where you are getting the idea that a tracker means a high weight in power roles for the town. When I first read that, I assumed that you were going to claim some sort of investigative role, because it doesn't make any sense otherwise.

Cooperation is not pro-town if you cooperate in doing something bad for the town. I'm not suggesting that you shouldn't have backed down regarding the mass claims if you couldn't get anyone to agree with you, mind, just that going along to get along isn't a great idea when it means jumping off a bridge.

Flaking is a null tell. I've replaced in as mafia, scum, power roles & town. Even flaking on a game when pressured is more of an "inexperienced" tell than anything else as far as I've seen.

[Jalyn]

Er, EBWOP *sigh*

I've replaced in as mafia, SK, power role & town.

[Jalyn]

ZeroFang (Replaced MrSandman who replaced sorasgoof):

Of course my play is awful. I can't go getting night killed as a tracker now can I?

Just as an FYI, you can't go getting yourself lynched either. I really doubt the mafia will kill you because you're so suspicious, but right now you're in serious danger of being lynched. That's not good either. As a side note, you can stop playing awfully now that you've claimed. Feel free to actually contribute. Your lack of contribution after your claim (in which you apparently had to play badly) makes me suspect you even more.

QFT

sorasgoof didn't do anything. MrSandman didn't do anything interesting and nothing ZeroFang said struck me as off (again, up to the point I replaced in).

[PaltryExcuse]

Sorry about the slight absence. Just started a new job and needed to get settled.

I've read up, but don't have much time for a post. Lynch Chevre now!

Claim: Vanilla Townie

Thief's claim stands (and considering the lack of PR claims I'd wager that generally clears him).

[ZeroFang]

That's fine that Thief's claim stands, but I still want to know why he tracked Deer (the guy you replaced).

[Jalyn]

Since I replaced in:
I already said that this post was the reason that I wanted Unsight to claim next, I probably should have clarified that that was because I found the comment to be inherently scummy, not just because I thought it was arrogant. Not, as I noted to ZeroFang, a scum slip, just scummy.

Unsight, why go with Chevre? You state here, that everyone on the Thief wagon is scum, yes, but why her over ZeroFang?

I don't get this. Could you explain, ZeroFang?

I find a couple of things interesting about this. First, Pie_is_good comments on my posting regarding him but ignores the one thing that I said really bothered me about him, instead looking at something I said was "amusing." Second, you really think that Thief putting someone as less suspicious to HIM than himself was a good indicator that he got a result back on Deer? I tend to agree, at this point, that Thief's claim is looking good, obv, but that's just silly. EBWOPreview - and with PaltryExcuse's claim, it's looking a heck of a lot better than "good."

OK, given everything I noticed doing these, I am going to

vote:Pie_is_good

. In his very first post that had content, he accused JJ of jumping around trying to start bandwagons when JJ only made two votes. Everything SSBF said was condensed to "It's not fair that I'm getting lynched for Jag's actions!" when SSBF actually had quite a bit more to say. He gives town points to EmpKing for something that Elias had actually done. Then he links VibeBox to Red Star indicating that VB was defending RS but VB was actually defending yabbaguy in the early posts. He accuses VB of "misrepresenting his opinion" when he really didn't, he simply chose to latch on to a post that could spark discussion one way or the other. He asked everyone to comment on it and then pointed out holes in what RS had done. And then, when responding to my ISO of him, he completely ignored the one thing that I said I found suspicious to clarify something that I found moderately amusing. As a final note, given that he was welcomed into the game by someone telling him that we weren't doing a mass claim, I'm assuming that the push for it is a null tell for him. I realize that I'm not going to get this lynch today, but I didn't find much that concerned me with Chevre and yabbaguy has already indicated that he'll hammer so we won't lose a lynch for me not going there.

Other than Pie_is_good, I also suspect yabbaguy and, maybe, ZeroFang for things that happened after I replaced in. The post I linked above was strange to me, almost like he thought that we'd had enough talking for the day and should just lynch the claimed investigative role as well as jumping off the Thief wagon as soon as Unsight said it was suspicious twigged hard.

[ZeroFang]

I never jumped off the Thief wagon.

I can't speak for Chevre, but I believe I've made my case against Thief quite clear. However, I'm not unwilling to budge, and I'm not set in my thinking.

UNVOTE: Thief

Thief: If you can tell me why the hell you thought it was a good idea to track Deer as opposed to somebody who's actually important and active, this vote will stay off. I'd really like to discuss this. If you truly thought it was the best course of action, then please explain yourself because I'm really at a loss as to how this helped anyone.

I was attempting to pressure unvote him so he'd actually explain himself. He still hasn't responded to this, nor has he responded to any of the many points I've brought up on page 14. I'd link to em, but I can't seem to figure out how. The post numbers aren't anywhere in the new setup.

I do believe I've explained my reason for voting Thief several times, and I've explained why It's really hard to believe his claim, yes?

[Thief]

My ISO isn't that hard to read, is it Zero?

You not believing my claim because of target choice is bullshit.

I don't know if you think you can keep riding your vote on me until I "answer" because I already did.

[Thief]

I was attempting to pressure unvote him

What is this, by the way?

[yabbaguy]

Yeah, my devil's right on this one; Thief's cleared. And massclaim actually did something useful.

I'll have to think about this one overnight. That just threw a huge wrench in just about every theory I had.

@Jalyn:

"In this post..."- the third part is not OMGUS. Notice he hadn't stated one suspicion about me all game. Then I land second on the list. Baseless.

"Ugh..."- I hammered having full suspicions on both SSBF and Jag. My reasoning is fine, and aside from it resulting in a mislynch, Town suffered nothing from that hammer. Absolutely patently ridiculous that this keeps getting dragged out of the gutter.

Tracker < Cop. I thought there would be more than a Doctor on the Town side considering the PR had lesser weight. It made perfect sense to me, but on that, I deserve the insults for piss-poor setup analysis.

---

Unvote, Vote: Chevre

to hammer as promised. No time zone given, so I really haven't a choice here- it's just unnecessary to squeeze that extra day in the Day and risk the No Lynch on what really is a randomly timestamped deadline, if you get my drift.

On multiple counts, good night.

[Azelf]

Paltry and Vibe both required prods, so prods have been sent.

Deadline is

10-27

.

Chevre

- PaltryExcuse, Pie_is_good, Thief, Unsight, yabbaguy (

Hammer

)

Thief

- Chevre (

L-4

)

Not voting

- Jalyn, Vibebox, ZeroFang

The town marched off to the gallows, and discovered they were out of rope.

As they pondered what to do, yabbaguy noticed Chevre was running for it, so he hit Chevre with a giant hammer, killing him instantly.

Chevre

was a

Mafia Goon

, lynched Day 2.

Night 2

has started! You know the deal.

Night 2 ends at exactly

8:00 AM, 6-29-2010

. (In Universal Time. That's 12:00 AM for Pacific Time users like me, and 3:00 AM MafiaScum Forum Time.)
By the way, why did I say the deadline was October 27th? That's a bit much leverage.

[Azelf]

At midnight, a massive rumbling noise shook the town. Rushing outside, the town discovered that the house of the good doctor Jalyn had been flattened by a giant satellite!

Jalyn

was a

Doctor

, Killed Night 2.

Distressed by this development (Who would give out Band-Aids now?) the town headed over to the Krispy Kreme, and discovered that Unsight was already there, evidently for a midnight snack. Judging from the ninja star-like donut embedded in his throat, it hadn't ended well.

Unsight

was a

Townie

, Killed Night 2.

Day 3

has begun! Who'll drop out of the game today?

With

6 players

left alive, it'll take

4 votes

to lynch.

[yabbaguy]

Azelf

: Are the respective kills necessarily done by the same factions?

i.e. You've listed RealityFan and Jalyn as the first kill in their respective death scenes and Empking and Unsight as the second kill. Does that suggest that one faction/person killed RF/Jalyn and the other faction/person killed Emp/Unsight, or is that not necessarily true?

More later when I get home.

[Pie_is_good]

Thiefey, what do we got?

Barring a Breaking Development from Thief, I have no good reason to be done wanting Vibebox dead. Azelf, did he ever respond to his prod?