Mini 980 - Trader Mafia (Game Over)

[Fishythefish]

NPAU and SPS both probably have rather a lot of money, having bought 1 cheapish action (in NPAU's case, he also bought NS's estate, but got money out of that). TBH, it seems unimportant which we lynch first.

[nopointinactingup]

God I hate accounting, and it's even haunted me to this game. But look at Fishy's financial statement

- Took out max loan day 1. Bid on a few abilities (Cop, Pickpocket, NK), but got none of them (was kinda screwed by all the action happening between 11pm and 5am).
- Repayed the loan that day.
- Did nothing until Day 3.
- Took out a loan to get to $300, and bid $300 for Masonise.
- Got Masonise.

It seems to me his first few days were red herrings and the only ability he ever said he bought was Masonise.

[nopointinactingup]

NPAU and SPS both probably have rather a lot of money, having bought 1 cheapish action (in NPAU's case, he also bought NS's estate, but got money out of that). TBH, it seems unimportant which we lynch first.

Wow scumslip. Ofcourse it's not important to you .

[Fishythefish]

Wait. In your fantasy world, I believe I'm SPS's scumbuddy, and between us we have Arsonist and are bidding on the NK? How would it not be important to me who got lynched first ?

[Fishythefish]

And as you well know, my accounts make total sense. Being real totally helps in that regard.

[nopointinactingup]

Alright I'm going to bed. As of right now, I have a few things hidden from the town ( what's the fun from knowing everything right? ). But I can state with absolute certainty that I'm a member of the Awesome Mafia A, which is what Andrius named it . Thus, lynch me = GG for town so good luck!

Unvote, Vote: SPS

[Fishythefish]

You forgot the "##"s.

[nopointinactingup]

Thanks for assisting in erradicating your partner

##Vote:SPS

[Steam-Powered Shovel]

Just fyi, Andrius only went after Investigation Immunity after I had failed to get Cop.

There is a problem with Nopoint being Scum B, though: SPS is definitely lying about what abilities he has. If he really was Mafia A and bought both the NK and the Bulletproof Vest, his BV should've gone to auction today, like Zang's Pickpocket did. SPS would've paid $294 for those two abilities, and the most money he can scrounge up in three days time to pay the debt off, including his starting funds, is $215. Therefore, since BV did not go to auction today, he definitely did not buy one of those abilities, and it has to be the NK. This means SPS is also Scum B.

No. Zang put it up for auction himself, that wasn't the mod's doing. I'll go bankrupt once we lynch today, that's how the timing works out. Feel free to check with the mod.

If he was really Mafia A, he would either have been very careful not to slip or counterclaim me right after I claimed.

I was careful, I made sure my first post of this day had my change of heart regarding SK in it. Sometimes stuff just slips your mind. And counterclaiming is a ridiculously bad idea.

[Fishythefish]

@mod: Suppose a player were to take out a loan day 1, and never repay it. When would their bankruptcy proceedings begin?

[SaintKerrigan]

No. Zang put it up for auction himself, that wasn't the mod's doing. I'll go bankrupt once we lynch today, that's how the timing works out. Feel free to check with the mod.

Actually, you're right. Checking with the mod about my own debt confirms that. And with that, I'm now entirely sure on who to lynch.

##Vote: Fishythefish

With SPS's announcement, I am now positive that he is the real Mafia A. I do not believe Nopoint at all when he says Andrius forgot to submit the protect on him N1. I am now positive that Nopoint is Mafia B. However, I doubt he's the one with the Arsonist. That means his partner is the one who has it.

Fishy is Nopoint's partner. He lied today about his report. How do I know? The fact that he says he has $84 dollars instead of $85 dollars after repaying his entire loan on D1. I was wrong earlier about the 5% being applied to the whole loan if you pay any amount of it back on the same day you borrowed it; the 5% interest actually applies to the amount you pay back. However, this mistake is irrelevant. The final outcome is not actually changed.

Fishy claims to have borrowed to the max ($300) on D1, bid on stuff but failed to get anything, and then repaid the entire loan on the same day. However, if he paid off his entire loan ($300), he would need to also pay 5% interest on what he paid back. In this case, $15 (since 15 is 5% of 300). That means he has to pay a total of $315 dollars back to the bank. When all's said and done, that leaves Fishy with $85 dollars.

Not

$84, as he claims.

Why is his number 1 integer off? Because he's not actually reporting what he actually had. He calculated, in his own way, how much money he should have based on the story he was telling, and used those calculations to back up his report. Unfortunately for him, he screwed up his calculations. Since there is no reason for a townie to lie about this report, that makes him scum. And since I believe SPS is the true Mafia A, that makes Fishy the other Mafia B. Which means he's the one with the Arsonist.

Therefore, we need to lynch Fishy first, and fast. Tomorrow we speed-lynch Nopoint, and the next day we speed-lynch SPS. Provided we get the Arsonist with our first shot, this will be a town win.

But we've gotta move fast. So vote now.

Everyone, vote FishytheFish!

[Fishythefish]

I know you are wrong.

##Vote: SPS

[Zang]

Thanks for assisting in erradicating your partner

##Vote:SPS

Vote for fishy! He's the one with the nightkill.

[Fishythefish]

That was a hammer. A deliberate hammer.

There was a real risk you went with SK's crazy strategy before the mod could answer the following:

@mod: Suppose a player takes out a loan of $300. How much do they repay if they repay it the same day?

[Zang]

SK, do you still have the doctor? If so protect nopoint.

[Fishythefish]

If SPS is Mafia A, obviously I'm going to look pretty terrible here, and I probably just threw the game. But I don't think that's the case. I think SPS is lying about how bankruptcy works, to put us off the lynch long enough to get the NK.

FMPOV, I think my hammer is justified. SK is mistaken about the loan repayment system (as the mod will confirm when he ends the day). A quicklynch on me could have happened, particularly with one or more of our CONFIRMED SCUM quickhammering.

[Fishythefish]

SK: the 5% isn't charged on 300 dollars. The 5% is charged on your

whole repayment

of

315 dollars

. So the amount you actually repay is:
0.95*315=299.25 dollars.
And you need a little less than $316 to repay the whole capital.

[SaintKerrigan]

SK, do you still have the doctor? If so protect nopoint.

Thanks, but I'm protecting someone that I think is town.

Fishy is getting speedlynched tomorrow. He has the Arsonist. I'm also pretty certain he's the one outbidding AGM for the other NK. He needs to die ASAP.

@ Fishy: Except the $315 comes from adding the 5% interest ($15) of $300. You're advocating that someone would have to pay 5% on the whole amount, and then pay 5% again on the new amount. Which is absolutely ridiculous and not how the system works.

You're scum. You're dead tomorrow. Accept it. I have.

[Fishythefish]

That IS how the system works.

Let us postpone this argument until I am proved right about the $316.

If the mod says repaying $300 costs $315, naturally you should lynch me immediately, whatever breed of scum SPS is. Luckily, he won't.

[SaintKerrigan]

3. You may pay off your debt at any point.

However, any debt you pay off in the first day is charged a 5% service fee. So for example if you take out a $100 loan and pay off $50 of that debt, you will only have paid off $47.5 of the debt, leaving you with a debt of $52.5.

Bzzt!

[AlmasterGM]

Well, hammer came down so I guess it doesn't matter anyway until tomorrow.

Hopefully we can get the second lynch in REALLY quickly ... before bidding ends on the NK so we deny scum the opportunity to shoot.

[Fishythefish]

Um... you might want to think about that some more. It precisely support

my argument

. You know, like I told you a few posts ago.

You pay $50. How much is paid off?

$50*0.95=$47.5

In your system, how much does it cost to pay off 47.5?
$47.5*1.05=49.875.

Learn to read. Either other players posts, or the mod's pms, or the rules.

[SaintKerrigan]

Um... you might want to think about that some more. It precisely support

my argument

. You know, like I told you a few posts ago.

You pay $50. How much is paid off?

$50*0.95=$47.5

In your system, how much does it cost to pay off 47.5?
$47.5*1.05=49.875.

Learn to read. Either other players posts, or the mod's pms, or the rules.

You are completely misrepresenting my system and Zoraster's.

This is how it works: You have a debt of $100. You make a payment of $50 on the same day you borrowed. According to the rules, a 5% service fee is charged on what you pay. This is deducted from what you are paying. Since you're paying $50, 5% of 50 is 2.5, and 50 - 2.5 = $47.5, which is the amount of debt you've actually paid off.

Multiplying by 0.95 is not the same thing as Zoraster's system, nor is it even correct mathematics. And adding 5% twice is definitely not accurate.

Regardless, our arguing doesn't really matter. Zoraster should answer your question when he resolves the lynch, and then your lies will be confirmed to be lies.

[Fishythefish]

Yes.

"Since you're paying $50, 5% of 50 is 2.5, and 50 - 2.5 = $47.5, which is the amount of debt you've actually paid off."
"Since you're paying $315, 5% of 315 is 15.75, and 315 - 15.75 = $299.25, which is the amount of debt you've actually paid off."

TAKING 5% OFF A NUMBER IS THE SAME AS MULTIPLYING BY 0.95.

I'm only having this argument because I'm fairly pissed off about this. I agree that the argument really doesn't matter.

[Fishythefish]

I'm going to bed now.

SPS is going to flip soon. If he flips Mafia A,

don't quicklynch me

. Please bear in mind that SK was claiming information from the mod which confirmed me as scum. He was doing so wrongly, in error or on purpose (probably in error), but he was claiming I was 100% scum. Zajnet has been tunnelled on me for the whole of today, and would have voted for me at the drop of a hat. Zang and SK were already voting for me. At least one SPS and NPAU would both obviously be happy to vote for me to save their own skin - both if they are scumbuddies. We probably weren't going to get mod intervention before deadline. A quickhammer was my only option in that situation.