Mini 961: Insane Asylum II: GAME OVER :O!

[StrangerCoug]

Haylen's had a lot of convenient problems lately. As much as I hate to find such RL situations scummy, it is a pretty consistent and reliable scumtell. As such, I demand she put this game as her top priority in mafia related things and post her thoughts asap.

Convienient my arse. Get this. I failed first year Psychology because during the exams I was going back and forward through police interviews and they wont accept that as evidence for mitigating circumstances. Now, I've just tried to get on a Social Work course but that's full too, my uni fails to realise that UCAS applications are void now because they deadline has past. Now I'm going have to wait for clearing, so I'll end up on a stupid course that I have no wish to complete or get a job from. Either that or I'm going to have to quit Uni for a year and take a gap year and get a full time job, which will totally ruin mine and Jordan's lives because we wont be able to keep up with rent AND council tax. On top of that, I'm suffering with problems with my heart, the guy I gave evidence for at the police station has expressed desires to kill me and I have every wish in the world to kill myself. Great and now my mother thinks I'm a worthless, useless pile of shit - not really any change there, usually she doesn't tell me though. Yes, I am crying right now, I apologise for any incorrect spelling or grammer. So no, my problems arent convienient. Kindly, fuck off.

And modding my newbie games is my top priority of MS. So you can fuck off on that one too.

Have a nice day.

Gee whiz, Haylen makes me look like I'm in seventh heaven...

I'm noting these two posts for later. I think this exchange more sensibly hurts magnus_orion because real life events are not a tell (and I'm pretty gosh darn sure we can verify whether Haylen's presence is iffy in general or just in this thread), but for me to be sure I have to give a lot more thought to this than I am right now.

[Corvuus]

I didn't know that if you used your global ability that you can't use your other abilities.

Did you ever state that before? I was under the impression that you could use your third 'global 1 time' ability and your normal ability. Tar: is this true for you?
---

Suggestion to your plan not helpful? That is an interesting thing to say since I didn't fully know your abilities. I will also note that you said you have "each of the abilities on that list" but according to your claim (and your global 1-shot ability not working at same time) you couldn't possibly be a murderer/vig right?

Maybe I don't fully 'get' your role yet, but it is your entire role overall that I don't find balanced. Haylen is a 1-time roleblock decided at the beginning of the game. Tar just flips cop insanities where cop sanities are already fairly useless. You flip everything (which could affect mafia kills, turn doc into vigs, plus cop sanity, etc.) plus jack of all 1 shots. I still have no idea what miller to kill ability will actually even do.


-------

As for the "plan". You didn't convince me of why I would choose to kill anyone but SC-SK first.
Humor me for a moment but let's say we are 100% certain of scum somehow since your plan seems to imply this. (lynch Dramonic, Vig SP. You seem certain about at least 1 of them is scum right?).

1. Lynch SC, the almost certain SK first, then lynch 100% mafia scum.

2. Lynch Mafia (100% certainty) then lynch SK.

In 1: We lynch SC-SK. 2 mafia, 3 townies left if only mafia night kill action go through. If Tar vigs/protects, blah blah, then it could be even better but if we know 100% who mafia is, we lynch/vig them to get worst case 3-4 player lylo with 1 mafia left. This doesn't involve any "reliance" on power roles/sanities, etc.

2. If we lynch 100% mafia first; we have 1 SK, 1 mafia and town-aligned left. Depending on various night actions by players, this could result with the same 3-4 player lylo situation (2 town, 1 mafia) or it could end up in several other permutations such as kingmaker, etc. mainly based on the fact that if we lynch the "100%" mafia, we obviously can't vig them, we "shouldn't" be able to vig SC-SK (so would we try?) so if we lynch mafia and THEN vig mafia (not SC-SK) we would win by lynching SC-SK in lylo .... if things go 'wrong' somehow we get kingmaker/auto-town lose permutations.

So why would I go with a plan that has holes(I have to believe and trust you and your role)/probability of failure and gives me lots of uneasiness, when the lynch SC-SK plan has no "instant lose" (unless you do global, Tar vigs a townie and mafia kill?) and town can still win lylo without relying on power roles at all.

Perhaps I should ask this: You want to lynch Dramonic and vig Sociopath. Would you lynch Sociopath, vig dramonic? Would you lynch SC-SK, vig one of those two? Can you guarantee me that your non-SC-SK lynch is scum?

----

Which question do you mean from a few posts ago?

Corvuus

[Corvuus]

Have a great weekend. Officially on VLA for a few days.

C

[magnus_orion]

Haylen's had a lot of convenient problems lately. As much as I hate to find such RL situations scummy, it is a pretty consistent and reliable scumtell. As such, I demand she put this game as her top priority in mafia related things and post her thoughts asap.

Convienient my arse. Get this. I failed first year Psychology because during the exams I was going back and forward through police interviews and they wont accept that as evidence for mitigating circumstances. Now, I've just tried to get on a Social Work course but that's full too, my uni fails to realise that UCAS applications are void now because they deadline has past. Now I'm going have to wait for clearing, so I'll end up on a stupid course that I have no wish to complete or get a job from. Either that or I'm going to have to quit Uni for a year and take a gap year and get a full time job, which will totally ruin mine and Jordan's lives because we wont be able to keep up with rent AND council tax. On top of that, I'm suffering with problems with my heart, the guy I gave evidence for at the police station has expressed desires to kill me and I have every wish in the world to kill myself. Great and now my mother thinks I'm a worthless, useless pile of shit - not really any change there, usually she doesn't tell me though. Yes, I am crying right now, I apologise for any incorrect spelling or grammer. So no, my problems arent convienient. Kindly, fuck off.

And modding my newbie games is my top priority of MS. So you can fuck off on that one too.

Have a nice day.

Gee whiz, Haylen makes me look like I'm in seventh heaven...

I'm noting these two posts for later. I think this exchange more sensibly hurts magnus_orion because real life events are not a tell (and I'm pretty gosh darn sure we can verify whether Haylen's presence is iffy in general or just in this thread), but for me to be sure I have to give a lot more thought to this than I am right now.

My desire to have Haylen post content is not unusual, nor is scum using RL issues to justify not posting. While Haylen has claimed to have RL issues, there are two things to consider:
1. Is Haylen lying (honestly, I find this slightly unlikely. The amount of effort for the benefits of just one game is at the very least frustrating for someone to deal with)
2. Haylen is having RL issues, but this is not necessarily interfering to the degree she cannot comment. Rather she is using it as a personal and in-game excuse to avoid the game, for fear of becoming suspicious (this is more likely, and pretty commonplace)

If you honestly don't believe this type of thing is a scumtell, I can link a game, but its pretty widely accepted that not posting content when posting = scummy.

I didn't know that if you used your global ability that you can't use your other abilities.

Did you ever state that before? I was under the impression that you could use your third 'global 1 time' ability and your normal ability. Tar: is this true for you?
---

Suggestion to your plan not helpful? That is an interesting thing to say since I didn't fully know your abilities. I will also note that you said you have "each of the abilities on that list" but according to your claim (and your global 1-shot ability not working at same time) you couldn't possibly be a murderer/vig right?

Maybe I don't fully 'get' your role yet, but it is your entire role overall that I don't find balanced. Haylen is a 1-time roleblock decided at the beginning of the game. Tar just flips cop insanities where cop sanities are already fairly useless. You flip everything (which could affect mafia kills, turn doc into vigs, plus cop sanity, etc.) plus jack of all 1 shots. I still have no idea what miller to kill ability will actually even do.


-------

As for the "plan". You didn't convince me of why I would choose to kill anyone but SC-SK first.
Humor me for a moment but let's say we are 100% certain of scum somehow since your plan seems to imply this. (lynch Dramonic, Vig SP. You seem certain about at least 1 of them is scum right?).

1. Lynch SC, the almost certain SK first, then lynch 100% mafia scum.

2. Lynch Mafia (100% certainty) then lynch SK.

In 1: We lynch SC-SK. 2 mafia, 3 townies left if only mafia night kill action go through. If Tar vigs/protects, blah blah, then it could be even better but if we know 100% who mafia is, we lynch/vig them to get worst case 3-4 player lylo with 1 mafia left. This doesn't involve any "reliance" on power roles/sanities, etc.

2. If we lynch 100% mafia first; we have 1 SK, 1 mafia and town-aligned left. Depending on various night actions by players, this could result with the same 3-4 player lylo situation (2 town, 1 mafia) or it could end up in several other permutations such as kingmaker, etc. mainly based on the fact that if we lynch the "100%" mafia, we obviously can't vig them, we "shouldn't" be able to vig SC-SK (so would we try?) so if we lynch mafia and THEN vig mafia (not SC-SK) we would win by lynching SC-SK in lylo .... if things go 'wrong' somehow we get kingmaker/auto-town lose permutations.

So why would I go with a plan that has holes(I have to believe and trust you and your role)/probability of failure and gives me lots of uneasiness, when the lynch SC-SK plan has no "instant lose" (unless you do global, Tar vigs a townie and mafia kill?) and town can still win lylo without relying on power roles at all.

Perhaps I should ask this: You want to lynch Dramonic and vig Sociopath. Would you lynch Sociopath, vig dramonic? Would you lynch SC-SK, vig one of those two? Can you guarantee me that your non-SC-SK lynch is scum?

----

Which question do you mean from a few posts ago?

Corvuus

I said I have a series of one shot abilities. I'm a jack of all trades. I can use one ability a night. I don't believe I said it, but I'm pretty sure it applies to everyone in the game, unless they are told otherwise, with the possible exception of mafia kills (which may be given separate status). Although its not stated in my role pm, I verified I can only use one ability a night.

As for the "plan". You didn't convince me of why I would choose to kill anyone but SC-SK first.

Because I have doubts SC is actually an SK and if this works out nobody but town should be left, or SC + town, so we lynch SC then.
To be perfectly frank, I don't need to convince you, though. You'll note that your cooperation in this is completely unnecessary.

So why would I go with a plan that has holes(I have to believe and trust you and your role)/probability of failure and gives me lots of uneasiness, when the lynch SC-SK plan has no "instant lose" (unless you do global, Tar vigs a townie and mafia kill?) and town can still win lylo without relying on power roles at all.

Yes you do have to believe me. Guess what happens if I'm lying. A bunch of protections go through and one mafia kill.
Big risk in my lying eh?
More people die if I'm telling the truth.
Plus, if I were scum, it would reveal me instantly, wouldn't it?

Suggestion to your plan not helpful? That is an interesting thing to say since I didn't fully know your abilities. I will also note that you said you have "each of the abilities on that list" but according to your claim (and your global 1-shot ability not working at same time) you couldn't possibly be a murderer/vig right?

Ok, whatever.
Right. I can't kill anyone without sociopath's help.
And then not in the same night phase as I use my ability letting tar and haylen kill.

You want to lynch Dramonic and vig Sociopath. Would you lynch Sociopath, vig dramonic? Would you lynch SC-SK, vig one of those two? Can you guarantee me that your non-SC-SK lynch is scum?

In order:
Yes, but preference goes to lynching Dramonic.
No
Only as much as you can guarantee that SC is an SK.

Which question do you mean from a few posts ago?

ugh. serious setup hatred. how could this be so much worse than insane asylum 1???!!!!!!!

When I levelled up and took more class levels in Mod, I also maxed my ranks in bastardery

explain precisely what about the setup spurned this statement, corvuus

this one. I suppose its more of a request, than a question, but the net result is the same.
Could you please fulfill the request?

Anyway, to address your concerns:

Possible results:
Worst case scenario (as I see it)
SC=SK
Haylen lives (and is scum)
...
Tar
Coorvus
SC
Haylen

are alive

Action by town: Lynch Haylen
Night phase: No kills (SC can't kill, Mafia are dead)
Next day:
Action by town: Lynch SC
Town wins.

[SocioPath]

Are there any problems with this? I sort of just ran it off the top of my head, so I'm not positive it totally checks out.

I've spotted a problem.

Problem:
SP has claimed sanity changer.
Plan involves Tar NKing SP.
If SP is scum than obviously he wouldn't no target.
He would switch Tar's sanity, and therefor still be alive and likely eat a lynch.

Solution:
Haylen and Tar have both claimed doc.
Both are in the Cabal.
Their choices for who "protects" Haylen and SP should be made in the QT.
Which minimizes potential scum hampering, from either stated or unstated sanity changing abilities.

Plan should now be more solid.

[StrangerCoug]

My desire to have Haylen post content is not unusual, nor is scum using RL issues to justify not posting. While Haylen has claimed to have RL issues, there are two things to consider:
1. Is Haylen lying (honestly, I find this slightly unlikely. The amount of effort for the benefits of just one game is at the very least frustrating for someone to deal with)
2. Haylen is having RL issues, but this is not necessarily interfering to the degree she cannot comment. Rather she is using it as a personal and in-game excuse to avoid the game, for fear of becoming suspicious (this is more likely, and pretty commonplace)

If you honestly don't believe this type of thing is a scumtell, I can link a game, but its pretty widely accepted that not posting content when posting = scummy.

You are free to post a link if you feel it is important to my understanding of your opinion. I don't automatically think scum lie about RL issues, but I must admit that I've done it as that alignment. It's too late at night for me to grab my own link, but it's the open game I got complaints about throwing. I agree that contentless posts are a scumtell.

[magnus_orion]

@SC: then I really don't understand what your problem is.

@SP: Thanks I'll take that as your tacit approval and agreement.

I still need agreement from tar and haylen though.

[StrangerCoug]

@SC: then I really don't understand what your problem is.

It's largely my preconception.

[Tarhalindur]

And what is it you want now MO?
Also, the votecount seems incorrect.

No it isn't.

Your opinions. On everything. You to scumhunt. To make an effort in this game.

SC is definitely not a good lynch choice... I really don't think he's mafia. And if he's an SK, I really don't care.

I still believe Dramonic is scum.

How about this.
We lynch dramonic. I use my ability tonight. SP doesn't do anything, Haylen targets herself, and Tar targets SP. That leaves Coorvus, Tar, Me, and SC.
I think Coorvus is town, I know Tar is town, I know I'm town. Because of those reads, I don't believe there is a result under this where two mafia make it to tomorrow, or mafia equal or outnumber the town tomorrow. If haylen doesn't target herself, we should lynch her. If both haylen and SP live, we lynch SP.

Scum will try to kill me or tar because of my using my ability.
If we haven't won by then, it will be a 3-way lylo between myself or tar, corvuus, and SC.
And then we'll probably lynch SC.

Are there any problems with this? I sort of just ran it off the top of my head, so I'm not positive it totally checks out.

While I approve of you using your infectious (note to self: infectious is likely the "former sex worker" ability) to set me up for a kill tonight, I don't see how we can rely on this as a plan UNLESS we lynch SocioPath today (and that carries a risk that we wind up with me taking a 50/50 chance on the nightkill between dramonic and Haylen with failure resulting in a town loss).

[magnus_orion]

I'm fairly certain at this point that SP is town and Haylen and Dramonic are scum anyway.
Actually, if you target haylen and haylen targets SP we have a better chance of eliminating both. If either lives then we lynch the one who did, but we have less chance of both living.

Basically, you're worried that this plan will fail if both SP and Haylen are scum. But I doubt that is the case, as socipath doesn't buy Haylen's claim. Also, Sociopath was the first on the DGB wagon, long before anyone else. So he basically lead the lynch against DGB. Combined with the near universal suspicion he has suffered, I'm pretty sure he's not scum, and certainly not with Haylen. I'm just forwarding a plan to eliminate him on the off chance that Haylen is town and SP is scum.

Add to that the fact that, unlike Haylen and Dramonic's playerslots have contributed almost absolutely nothing to the game, and that POE points to them as well. Finally, they've been after an SC lynch for awhile. Since SC claimed NK-immune, he's problematic to scum, and since he's scummy, Dram, DGB, and Haylen all pushed for his lynch day 2. This makes the probability high that since DGB is scum, Haylen and Dramonic are scum as well. Add to this the fact that it wouldn't be hard to justify a switch from DGB to SC, but nobody on the DGB wagon did, and DGB was

deadline lynched

, with fewer than the necessary votes to lynch. If scum had been on the DGB wagon, they had every justification and ability to switch to SC and force a Haiku off. If there are 3 scum, then at least one had to be between Haylen and Dramonic because of the above, because if the 2 other scum weren't on the SC wagon as deadline approached, they could have gotten an SC lynch for sure.They would gain almost no suspicion for doing this because of the myriad of excuses to vote SC. Hell, as I talk about it, the more convinced I am. DGB was not bussed. If she was being bussed, she would not have been deadline lynched. Since I believe both farside and Tar are town, it follows that Haylen and Dramonic are the scum.


In summary,

I'm nearly certain Dramonic is scum, and fairly confident Haylen is dram's scum partner. This plan addresses the small possibility that SP is actually Dram's scum partner, but I find it highly unlikely.

[magnus_orion]

Ebwop: Add to that the fact that,

unlike

Haylen and Dramonic's playerslots have contributed almost absolutely nothing to the game, ...

[dramonic]

Your opinions. On everything. You to scumhunt. To make an effort in this game.

My current opinion is that if you are town, you're not playing to your wincon. You guys are completely and utterly ignoring that if SC is SK and we mislynch once town loses. Meanwhile, if he flips town we still have a chance for victory

I am not particularely open to the concept of playing blatantly against my win condition, therefore I will not be unvoting SC. Scumhunting will have to wait for his death.

[StrangerCoug]

Your opinions. On everything. You to scumhunt. To make an effort in this game.

My current opinion is that if you are town, you're not playing to your wincon. You guys are completely and utterly ignoring that if SC is SK and we mislynch once town loses. Meanwhile, if he flips town we still have a chance for victory

I am not particularely open to the concept of playing blatantly against my win condition, therefore I will not be unvoting SC. Scumhunting will have to wait for his death.

I'm sorry, but regardless of my alignment, scumhunting does not have to come to a halt. It's fine to think I am the SK if you can back up such, but who is scum? I don't know what you're thinking other than you want me dead, and your last sentence pursues an anti-discussion route. I can see how it's to town's benefit to get rid of a kill at this point in case we're at 4:2:1, but trading one way to ensure a loss for another does not make me happy.

[magnus_orion]

Your opinions. On everything. You to scumhunt. To make an effort in this game.

My current opinion is that if you are town, you're not playing to your wincon. You guys are completely and utterly ignoring that if SC is SK and we mislynch once town loses. Meanwhile, if he flips town we still have a chance for victory

I am not particularely open to the concept of playing blatantly against my win condition, therefore I will not be unvoting SC. Scumhunting will have to wait for his death.

So... you refuse to find scum until we lynch SC? Yeah, you're scum. Sorry, but town would still make an effort to look for scum, even if we were going to lynch SC anyway.
Basically, this post tells me that you are treating the day phase as a period where it is determined who will be lynched, and not a period wherein one looks for scum.
Town would be still trying to gather information during the day, even if we already had decided who would be lynched.

Your treatment of the day phase is clearly indicative of scum. You're not scumhunting because you already have a lynch choice picked out, so your job for today is done. Since you know everyone's alignments already, there is no point in putting any extra effort in to find scum.

[dramonic]

wonder what's scummier, my lack of scumhunting or your reticence to lynch the one player who can doom the town...

[magnus_orion]

That's pretty easy. Your lack of scumhunting.
Because every player has the possibility of dooming the town. Do you remember my rant on possibility, day 1? Your arguments are equally valid if any other player was an SK.
Back up your statements with evidence that proves SC is an SK.
Because otherwise your argument goes like this:
We should lynch SC because he might be an SK, and if he isn't we don't suffer a great loss.

And that can be said of any player.

You need to prove that its likely that he is an SK, which, frankly, while he's been scummy, I have my doubts that there is a Serial Killer in this game. I can outline the reasons if you like, but I want to hear why you think what you think first.

[Corvuus]

back from con but still VLAish due to fireworks.

Magnus:
I don't agree with your comments about how you dont need my approval or anything. Yes, you and Tar technically are the only ones who need to agree for your night action plan. You should still try for my approval for your lynch plan if you want my vote on a Non-SC-SK player.

Having said that... If Dramonic hadn't posted, and you hadn't elaborated on SP, other views, etc.; I'd probably still consider SC-SK the safest lynch for town endgame.... part of me still does.

However, I'm willing for a vote on Dramonic. I still believe SC is SK, but I'll accept this course of action. Ironic that you said you don't need to convince me and then you post and convince me. I will note: I still believe Haylen's roleblock ability, existence of superkill and SC is SK. Haylen's alignment i'm not sure of but I can see your logic for Haylen-scum. Perhaps I am optimizing/assuming best plays possible too much so I worry. haylen-scum: claims global roleblock, kill goes through; must be from SK, SK has superkill, scum want to kill SK. Haylen-Dram want to kill SK. Haylen-town: claims, expects global to work. kill goes through. uncertain, hedges.

unvote.

.

Dram: convince us.

Mag: I won't answer your question in full at this time. If you and Tar feel you *need* to know, then I'll agree. There are hints from farside/me throughout the thread. I won't elaborate further at this time since it is a back-up plan if your plan fails.

Corvuus

[dramonic]

However, I'm willing for a vote on Dramonic. I still believe SC is SK.

Make up your mind, because those two lines of thinking are in blatant contradiction.

[StrangerCoug]

However, I'm willing for a vote on Dramonic. I still believe SC is SK.

Make up your mind, because those two lines of thinking are in blatant contradiction.

That is only true if Corvuus thinks you are a serial killer. Assuming an SK even exists in the first place, the worst I foresee happening if we lynch Mafia like you is opening Day 4 with 2:1:1, and even so, everybody playing correctly can still result in a town win. Too bad, so sad.

[Corvuus]

how is it a blatant contradiction? It would be nice if you could post evidence, reasoning, etc.
i.e. SC is solo-SK. I don't see how his bearing/alignment/etc. has anything to do with yours or my interpretation of 2 mafia + 1 SK. What you should be doing (and have been asked to do for a while) is post your thoughts on claims, etc. that is going on.

To tell me to "make up my mind" just sounds bitter that I didn't come to the conclusion that you were hoping for. If this is going to be a game-losing lynch for whatever your win condition is, then put in some effort. Moreso if you are town.

----

I won't even get into it with SC regarding 2:1:1 and 'correct' play that still results in a town win. Kingmaker is not something to be happy about.

C

[StrangerCoug]

I won't even get into it with SC regarding 2:1:1 and 'correct' play that still results in a town win. Kingmaker is not something to be happy about.

I was not planning on going into detail anyway. We both win that.

[dramonic]

Well, if you're as convinced about me being mafia as you are about SC being SK, suit yourself, but I'm town, so... yeah.

[magnus_orion]

Haylen has been posting elsewhere the last 3 days. Including in GD.

Mod: Prod haylen please

[Corvuus]

Dramonic: Seriously, put in some more effort. You haven't even tried to defend/convince me of ANYTHING.

I replaced in and in my initial post, I had SC and you as the ones to pressure. You thanked me for my SC-lynch view but didn't say anything else at all. Even when I later said that I had you listed as potential scum just by process of elimination (PoE) and asked you (and Haylen) to post more with your thoughts, etc. you still didn't say much. There is a lot of "claims, plan, content, etc" that you could say something/anything about and yet you don't. I don't quite understand your thinking.

Is the contradiction because you think I am someone who will only vote for a player who I think is 100% scum? Are you giving up because you think that I think you are 100% scum? Is Haylen thinking along the same lines?

This is the only way I can make sense of you/your posts but quite frankly, that is a really bad point of view for any player to take. We can't let you "slide" since that could just be rewarding lazy scum. The odds of us just "giving up" and looking elsewhere... it isn't going to happen at this point. We need to hear from you to make a "informed" decision and if we don't hear anything from you, it is unreasonable of you to expect us to not lynch you.

So here is some catch-up for you to think about and post on:
SP thinks Haylen is scum, I don't think he has made a comment yet regarding what else he thinks; SC thinks Haylen and Dramonic are scum, Magnus thinks Dramonic is scum, with a toss up between Haylen and SP (vig plan to cover all bases); Tar seems to think Dramonic is scum, but I think it is more PoE for him, He also seems flipping between SP/Haylen, maybe SC in terms of scum. I'm not sure what Haylen thinks... we are waiting for Haylen to post as well.

The only ones who you could even consider to be really 'convinced' you are scum are SC and Magnus. SC's points mainly seem to be PoE and that you are 'lazy scum' and that he doesn't see anything to show how you are not lazy scum. Thankfully, Magnus has more reasoning/logic than SC and you can read it yourself in his above posts. In terms of my unvote, it is Magnus' post plus my own view of the game, that convinced me of two things:

1. I've voted SC for a while now. At this point, I don't think I'll be able to get 4 votes to lynch him. Tar seems somewhat open to it but even then, maybe only to avoid no lynch. Magnus and SP have both said that they couldn't careless about SC lynch, even if he is an SK. SC will almost certainly not self-vote. So I will have to get Haylen, Myself, Tar and Dramonic to vote to lynch SC. So while I would love to lynch SC-SK (for reasons you could see my other posts but it is still the safest optimal town endgame to me), it is just not that likely to happen and no one seems to want to deal with SC, roleblock, superkill. So... move on to the next best possible endgame scenario for town. Lynching mafia today to not autolose to mafia/SK.

2. As stated before, I have you (Dramonic) as PoE scum. Haylen I thought was likely town but the possibility of scum is there to consider. Everyone thinks Tar is town (well, I think Haylen said tar could be scum at some point). If you listen to what each person has been saying about who they think is town, then you should be able to see what their PoE/who is scum thoughts are. The only people who we have little to no idea on who they think is town and scum (or why?) are Dramonic and Haylen. This is enough (PoE, pressure, probability of Haylen-Dramonic team, etc.) to convince me to pressure you by un-voting SC and potentially ultimately lynch you.

By no means are you the 100% certain lynch for today; I unvoted. I did not vote you YET.

We will listen to what you say but for that to happen... you need to say SOMETHING.

Trying to lynch SC-SK is beating a dead horse that refuses to die. It just isn't going to happen so we don't need to hear anything about SC right now. So put in some effort: tell us who you think scum is, who you think town is, etc. etc.

I'm putting in effort for this game, so I consider it extremely reasonable for me to want you to put some effort into this game as well. Just saying you are "town... yeah" is not enough. This applies to Haylen as well.

Corv

[Haylen]

This applies to Haylen as well.

Lol, I can be voted up to L-1 in games and not bat an eyelid. I've been in 2 hour long meetings for the past few days trying to get them to retake me course and I think I may have just grabbed my university by the balls and force them to let me retake the year. Oh doesn't having a great knowledge of the law help >.<

Haylen has been posting elsewhere the last 3 days. Including in GD.

If I have posted in my newbie games it because I am the mod or the IC. If I have posted in the queue, it's cause of mod stuff. If I have posted in GD, it's because it really requires minimum thought. Work takes a lot out of me at the weekends, thats why im on constant weekend V/LA. This is an explanation that I have been using in games for nearly a year if you want to look it up.

Who's scum?
I'm actually thinking SC as Serial Killer and Dram and Magnus as scum.

I'll explain why after another 2 hr meeting.

Haylen-out.