Mini 1005: Mafiaphobes! (Game over)

[quadz08]

How it would change our lynch choice for today? I don't think it really would; I and vezok are pretty clearly suspects 1 and 2 (in whatever order you wish).

[xvart]

How it would change our lynch choice for today? I don't think it really would; I and vezok are pretty clearly suspects 1 and 2 (in whatever order you wish).

How would it change your vote?

xvart.

[quadz08]

oh! In that case, I would go back SSBF.

[Super Smash Bros. Fan]

@xvart: You seem to be absolutely certain that quadz08 is scum regardless of circumstances. What if quadz08 flips town? What will you say?

@SSBF - Read the information below. Do you really feel that your suspicions of vezok outweigh quadz's logic for his lynch preferences?

Yes I do. quadz08's logic for lynch preference, while doesn't make much sense, isn't enough for me to lynch him, although his scummy actions makes him a decent lynch candidate.

If you think quadz is justified in his preference, why do you think quadz believes vezok is more suspicious than me?

I personally don't think that quadz08's lynch choices (At least you and me) makes much sense. He's added little to both cases formentioned. But to answer your question, this could be because he pushed vezokpiraka harder then you overall.

Also, why is your case stronger than what I have outlined?

vezokpiraka seems to not care about the game and goes to active lurk with nearly every post he's done. His posts has been completely void of contents and show no willingness to scum hunt. Lynching him will heavily reflect on Oso who stated numerous times that he doesn't want vezokpiraka lynched. If you want a larger summerization of vezokpiraka's scumminess, I'll provide it.

What are the differences? Specifically? And in games where he is just simply anti-town town, how is he dealt with there?

1. He is very active as a town. Here, he started out very active, but then drops to inactive level. I have not seen this out of town vezokpiraka.

2. He simply doesn't do much as a town when he is town. Here, his agenda has been more malicious in nature.

To answer your second question, they get annoyed at his anti-town play, but doesn't push for his lynch due to meta. He is explicitly anti-town but not explicitly scummy.

It still doesn't sound like you are too confident in vezok flipping scum. How about you look for those connections now? Or, even better, if vezok and quadz are likely scumbuddies, why don't you join the quadz bandwagon which has an actual case on him instead of just anti-town vs. scum rhetoric to support it?

The reason why I'm not looking at connections right now is because you have no knowledge of quadz08's alignment if you are a townie. If I were to do that now, had my big post about connections between quadz08 and other people and quadz08 flips town, that's a project down the drain. It's best to wait until a flip happens to decide whenever or not to look at connections.

However, quadz08 is likely scum as you have pointed out numerous times. Since he is at L-1, I am still willing to hammer if it becomes certain that quadz08 is the play for ToDay. However, this is not guarateen as quadz08 is at L-1 while vezokpiraka is at L-3. That is enough time to get vezokpiraka lynched.

(I know, I know, I can hear the shouts of "hypocrite!" already.)

Why are you so concerned about commiting a scum tell? A town would be more focused on finding scums then avoiding suspicion.

[xvart]

@xvart: You seem to be absolutely certain that quadz08 is scum regardless of circumstances. What if quadz08 flips town? What will you say?

I'll eat my hat.

xvart.

[Super Smash Bros. Fan]

@xvart: Going deeper into "what if quadz08 flips town scenario":

1. What would that say about me and diddin, since we're considered by you quadz08's scum partners?
2. Who would be your third lynch candidate?
3. Would you analyze the bandwagon that you've created for scums?

[quadz08]

I'll eat my hat.

Hope you have a tasty headpiece.

Why are you so concerned about commiting a scum tell? A town would be more focused on finding scums then avoiding suspicion.

I disagree with this. I think townies are very much concerned with avoiding suspicion, because if they play scummily, then they get mislynched, wasting time and helping the scum. I have very clearly failed in this regard.

Also, I'm pretty sure vezok is at L-2, unless there was an unvote I missed. I currently have myself, KageLord, Tasky, sotty, and SSBF voting for vezok, jay voting for Humble, and everyone else voting for me.

[vezokpiraka]

I am waiting for a VC. Then I will claim.
I am stil active. Problem is you are all asleep when I am not sleeping. I post everytime I check something here but I can't respond to my own posts. That would be too dumb.

[totallynotmafia]

Sorry guys, I was busy with my assignment.

Vote count 1.9

Oso (0)
Tasky (0)
KageLord (0)
Humble Poirot (1) jayfl383
q21 (0)
jayfl383 (0)
xvart (0)
quadz08 (6) Humble Poirot, xvart, vezokpiraka, q21, Oso, diddin
diddin (1) Sotty7
vezokpiraka (4) Tasky, KageLord, Super Smash Bros. Fan, quadz08
Sotty7 (0)
Super Smash Bros. Fan (0)

Not voting:

With 12 alive, it takes 7 votes to lynch.

Deadline is July 26, 10:30 AM (GMT + 10:00).

Tasky has requested a replacement as he is unable to post during his v/la.

jayfl3383 is being prodded.

[vezokpiraka]

Sorry for you scum. No claim from me.

[xvart]

@xvart: Going deeper into "what if quadz08 flips town scenario":

We can deal with that tomorrow in the unlikely event that the sun rises in the west. In the meantime, I'll not have you try and undermine my credibility or derail this wagon by making me look like I'm second guessing myself. The only thing I do know is that if quadz flips town I will certainly be alive tomorrow.

xvart.

[Sotty7]

If you want a larger summerization of vezokpiraka's scumminess, I'll provide it.

Then provide it. You seem to think that there is still time to lynch vezo, so why wouldn't you post this case to convince people to come onto your preferred lynch?

@xvart: Going deeper into "what if quadz08 flips town scenario"

How likely do you think it is quadz will flip scum?

[Super Smash Bros. Fan]

I disagree with this. I think townies are very much concerned with avoiding suspicion, because if they play scummily, then they get mislynched, wasting time and helping the scum. I have very clearly failed in this regard.

Avoiding suspicion should be town's least of worry. If they cannot take down the scums, scums will win the game. Only scums have to be concerned about avoiding suspicion.

How likely do you think it is quadz will flip scum?

Based off evidence supporting that he's scum, I'd say it's pretty unlikely. I'm 70% sure that he'll flip scum. While with vezokpiraka, I'm 85% sure, since he has more evidence supporting his scumminess.

[Oso]

Don't want to get accused of trying to rush things but:

From totallynotmafia's lats votal: Deadline is July 26, 10:30 AM (GMT + 10:00).

Unless I have completely hosed up the time conversion, that is just about 24 hours from now.

[KageLord]

Don't want to get accused of trying to rush things but:

From totallynotmafia's lats votal: Deadline is July 26, 10:30 AM (GMT + 10:00).

Unless I have completely hosed up the time conversion, that is just about 24 hours from now.

If it gets within an hour or two of deadline and it looks like things will stay like this, I'll hammer quadz to avoid no lynch.

[Super Smash Bros. Fan]

Some things I've found that I didn't like about vezokpiraka:

ISO 0: While Tasky did ask some questions that I was concerned about in #23 (I was talking about #2 and #3), the rest of his questions are actually pretty good. However, vezokpiraka refuses to answer any questions but #6. He also said that asking questions were things that scums do, which I found absurb, as liking RQS is a preference, not a scum tell.

ISO 1: Here, he claims that we could gain a lot of information out of a quick lynch. This is a very faulty statement. I saw a game that quick lynched a scum 3 1/2 of a page Day 1 and still got little information out of it. I wouldn't be surprised if his example was in RVS.

ISO 2: While I do agree with not liking Tasky's #2 and #3, I'm not sure why he would dismiss the potential usefulness for #1. He also said that the play style question was useless because it gives players the oppertunity to self-meta and that it wouldn't help scum hunt. I'm not sure how the play style question was malicious at all and letting people know each other play styles is actually not that bad. ISO: 3 attack on the same subject does not help at all.

ISO 5: He complains about people giving Tasky a noob pass, yet receiving votes himself for sheeping, which should not be excused, regardless of experience and alignments.

ISO 9: He claims that he his scum hunting, yet after thirty-six posts, he has done almost nothing for the town. I also don't like how he tries to excuse the six minutes ordeal KageLord made by saying "My phone rang in a middle of a post", which IMO, is not a decent explanation and feels like a form of AtE.

ISO 28: Absolutely disliked how he claims that his vote is still in KageLord, yet he moves his vote to quadz08. This is definently bandwagoning without legit reasons, as he has not expressed previous suspicion on quadz08, plus that he still considered KageLord his top suspect.

These are just things that I could find myself. Other things that have been brought up against him is that he has done almost nothing for the town, he is guilty of sheeping, he's made hypocritical statements, other bandwagoning instances, OMGUS votes, etc. His play is very scummy and it does not look like he will improve. The sooner his lynch come, the better.

[diddin]

If Quadz flips scum, SSBF is even likelier scum than I thought with his recent attempts to deflect attention away from Quadz.

[Sotty7]

I will hammer in the morning if no one else has anything else to say. The mod is in Australia isn't he? We really need a deadline timer going here.

[Humble Poirot]

In my opinion. Just hammer, it won't make any difference and it saves us from an ugly (although) unlikely surprise.

I haven't carefully read all those SSBF's/xvarts back and forths but I'd like to know what SSBF's purpose is. Why is he only going after xvart and not the rest of the guys who voted him? The amount of things that can be discussed prior to a flip are wifomic to a certain degree and subject to scum manipulation. Scum might try, knowing a flip, to arrange things in such a way they can do what's best for them (excused by their prior preparation).

Anyway. I encourage you to do some vote analysis during the night and try to see if motives for each players actions make sense in context. Try to put yourself in their shoes as best as you can. That's my only advice to get the best out of a game.

Farewell.

PS: One more thing. Displaying confidence might be good to gather support, but (there's always one) one shouldn't become fanatized by it's own case to the point that you forget to stand back and think about all the possibilities.

Mod: As the replacements will probably come at night. I'd like you to check the candidates to ensure they will stay fairly active. Thanks

[totallynotmafia]

Tazaro replaces Tasky.

You can find my time used for the deadline here: http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/city.html?n=57

[diddin]

Approximately 16 hours until deadline. Hammer please.

[Tazaro]

I'm the replacement for Tasky. As much as I'd hope we'd be lucky enough to avoid a mislynch, I'll want to know what information transpires after quadz08 is lynched.
Here's the hammer. It's coming...
...

VOTE: quadz08

[Tazaro]

I'm the replacement for Tasky. As much as I'd hope we'd be lucky enough to avoid a mislynch, I'll want to know what information transpires after quadz08 is lynched.
Here's the hammer. It's coming...
...

VOTE: quadz08

I should also contribute something. Is anyone else suspicious of jay? He somehow reminds me of a player I've played with in my last game who was scum, it's basically gut feeling though . And vezo, you're a enigma in every game lol. I've seen your work. Keep up the scumhunting; I'll be sure to cooperate and give my thoughts in plenty of posts--I posted frequently in my last game, people even complained .

[Tazaro]

Oh, should of checked who Tasky voted for before I voted.

Unvote

quadz08

[Tazaro]

I meant

Vote: quadz08